Marlin 45/70 Info Needed

[AK737FO]

Good Morning from Alaska.
I got a gently used Marlin 1895 GS in 45/70 for my 40th birthday a few weeks ago.  The M7 Leupold 3X "Post" (manufactured in 1960) is mounted.  The gun is ready to go - except I have to figure out what I want to feed it.

The purpose of the rifle is for close range deer hunting in Alaska.  I've spent most of my life filling the freezer with venison each fall and very very few deer have been taken at over 100 yards.  Most make their contribution to the freezer at 50 yards or less.  Where these tasty deer live is also where the big brown fuzzy lives.  He is usually not a problem, but you never know when you will run into a gumpy bear. 

With that background, my question for this forum is this.  I am leaning towards a hard cast lead gas checked in the 420 to 425 grain range.  Leadheads and Oregon Trails look like good bullets.  The problem is that I have been unable to find much data for loading this bullet weight.  Anybody have some favorite loads for the 425 grain WFNCG they would like to share?

Second, is there anybody out there who has a B.C. for these 425 grain bullets?  The Leadheads and Oregon Trails 425 Gr. bullets are 90% Meplat.  If I could find out the B.C. it would make it a little easer to figure out what the gun will do downrange.  I called Oregon Trails, they do not know the BC of their bullets.
Thanks everyone and good shootin!

[mattmillerrx]

Try the handload forum.  But would try Lyman's manual as a start, they have a lot of loads for lead bullets.

[swordfish]

Elmer Keith used 53 grains of 3031 with a 405 grain jacketed soft point bullet.
This developed 1850 fps and around 36,000 psi.
He recommended this load for the 1895 marlin

just sayin'

I know it works well on big hogs. Bang flop, mostly strait through. Should get into a Brown just fine and do a number on a deer, but I'd ask the Alaska boyz when it comes to Browns.

[mannyrock]

  Jeesh! Why make things so complicated?

  Buy a box of regular factory loaded Remington Core-Lokts, and they will certainly be fine for any deer out to 150 yards.

  Buy a box of the high-powered Buffalo Bore ammo (or perhaps Garrett ammo), and they will be fine for Grizzly.  I think that one of these companies even sells their ammo loaded with hard cast bullets.

  Order them over the phone, and you will probably have them at your place within 10 days.

Regards,
Mannyrock

 

[Old Grizz]

  Buy a box of the high-powered Buffalo Bore ammo (or perhaps Garrett ammo), and they will be fine for Grizzly.  I think that one of these companies even sells their ammo loaded with hard cast bullets.

  Order them over the phone, and you will probably have them at your place within 10 days.

Regards,
Mannyrock

 
I agree with Mannyrock.Give Garrett a call or order off his webiste. He has loads for deer and griz.[/b]

[mattmillerrx]

Loading your own is a lot cheaper.  Thats the reason I have not tried any of the Buffalo or Garrett ammo.  Something about loading your own, its just hard to beat.

[AK737FO]

I've been reloading all my life, or at least from the age that my Dad showed me how to pull the handle.  I'll put my reloads up against "factory" any day and for a fraction of the cost.  Friends don't let friends shoot factory ammo

[Coyote Hunter]

If you're interested, send me a PM with your email address and I'll send you my spreadsheet of .45-70 loads.  Over 200 factory laods for vullets of different types (with pointers to original data sources), plus 19 or so loads I've worked up, everything form 300g Oregon Trail LaserCast @ 1167fps to jacketed to 460g hardcast @ 1812fps.

I shoot 350g North Fork for hunting purposes but if starting over would try 350g Swift A-Frames, which were not available when I developed the North Fork loads.  I also would look at:

300g Nosler Partitions (have never tired them but reports are excellent)
300g Speer Uni-Cor (I shoot a lot of these and they hold together well)
300g Barnes TSX (have never tried them but they are a TSX, which I shoot a lot of)
350g Speer FP (requires special attention during handloading to maintain COL that will cycle, but works well)

Of course, with a .45-70 you're startuing out with a big hole.  A 420g hardcast running decent speeds will put a big hurt on whatever it hits.  A 460g Cast Performance WFNGC running 1812fps will destroy 9 water-filled “Family Size” Minute Maid Orange Juice jugs, blow a hole in the 3/8” plywood under the lead jug and break the crossmember of the synthetic sawhorse that is supporting the plywood.  Recoil is a bit ferocious (about 48 foot pounds), which is one reason I run 350g jacketed (about 35 foot-pounds, just 2-3 more than my .300 Win Mag).


My spreadsheets include chrono and target data acquired during load development and some from after.  I also have a spreadsheet from some water jug bullet testing, various .45-70 bullets.

[john keyes]

I've shot alot of .45/70, but only one bullet: the remington 405.  You can buy em in bulk, and your rifle likely will not be picky about what powder you choose.   You'll be set!  Go huntin!   

[AK737FO]

Coyote Hunter,
I just sent you a PM.  I would love to get a look at your data.  Much appreciated.

[Keith L]

Just be sure that the loads you try are appropriate in your rifle.  There are several levels of 45-70 loads.

[Davemuzz]

I was gonna give you my IMR-3031 load for the new Hornady FTX bullet, but quite frankly, after reading through these post, these guys got you covered for everything that walks up to about Bigfoot.....'n probably even more.

Just be cautious about shootin your deer on a quarter too angle. Those big 'ol lead's will take out a hind quarter faster than you can chronograph a 17 Fireball cartridge. And if I'm going to kill a deer, I just hate the idea of carvin out chunks of ragged meat 'n broken bone.

Make it a lung\heart shot....you know....broadside. It won't travel far....if it travels at all.

Dave

[v-man]

With the 405 JSP or HC I go for the shoulder. Through and through without enough velocity to "jellify" the meat. The deer goes down hard whether dead or not. Never had to track one shot that way.

[swordfish]

Jeesh! Why make things so complicated?

Mannyrock

To answer your question, it's fun, interesting, and time well spent.
Reloading is an addiction for perfection, and a satisfaction that can't be understood if you haven't done it.
Design your own ammo for the particular game you are hunting. On top of that, you can reload at half the cost of store bought ammo and have a better product. Your general knowlege of weapons and hunting will also increase just because of the information you read through for reloading.

[Davemuzz]

To answer your question, it's fun, interesting, and time well spent.
Reloading is an addiction for perfection, and a satisfaction that can't be understood if you haven't done it.
Design your own ammo for the particular game you are hunting. On top of that, you can reload at half the cost of store bought ammo and have a better product. Your general knowlege of weapons and hunting will also increase just because of the information you read through for reloading.

Yeah. No doubt about all of that. I started reloading about 5 years ago and I've learned more about ballistics, calibers, downrange energy and which bullet is better in what situation. I use to just think "shoot 'em in the shoulder and they will die."  While there is some truth in that, knowing a caliber, the average range of the game your hunting, and the cartridge you will be launching the bullet from makes hunting a lot more interesting and fun.

Dave