Author Topic: Mosin Nagant carbine? (Read 7133 times)

S.B. · « **on:** July 18, 2009, 03:00:44 AM »

I've bought one of these with the foldout bayonet and have read they are meant to be shot with the bayonet extended. Will it hurt accuarcy if I take the bayonet completely off the rifle? These are a very robust rifle and I haven't shot it yet, would prefer to get some non corrosive ammo tor it? Any reloading componets around ie: boxer primed brass, suitable powders, bullets of proper diameter?
TIA, Steve

trotterlg · « **Reply #1 on:** July 18, 2009, 07:28:25 AM »

You have a M-44, it will not hurt the accuracy if you take off the bayonett, but it will probably shoot to a different point of aim so you will have to adjust the sights some. There are lots of proper sized bullets out there, mostly for British 303's or the 7.62X39. Don't worry about shooting corrosive ammo, your rifle has been shooting it for 50 years so the few you put through it just won't matter any at all. Just clean it after you shoot it. There is reloadable brass out there if you really need to find some. Larry

84Jim · « **Reply #2 on:** July 18, 2009, 03:08:36 PM »

If you haven't shot any surplus ammo through it yet, you're in for a treat. A kid shot one at a CMP match I attended a few years back, and his threw a ball of flame at least 2 feet long, I swear! In broad daylight!! The report was more like a big naval gun than a rifle crack. What a hoot

GRIMJIM · « **Reply #3 on:** July 18, 2009, 04:22:18 PM »

I have both a 39/51 and a 44. I was expecting the carbine to kick a lot more than it does.

Mikey · « **Reply #4 on:** July 19, 2009, 02:26:57 AM »

Steve: my brother and I worked on one of those and found it was one heck of a lot more accurate without the bayonet. We removed the bayonet and ground the mounting lug off and it shot better. When we bedded the stock it shot very, very well indeed whether we used 180 gn S&B ammo or 200 gn Wolf (?) or Silver Bear or whatever. If you are going to reload you may wish to slug the barrel to see if you should use .311 or .312 slugs.

Vhita Vuori Oy uses their N140 and N160 powders with 200 gn bullets for 2440-2460'/sec - excellent NA loads. HTH.

rio grande · « **Reply #5 on:** July 19, 2009, 02:44:27 AM »

I've shot a couple w/ bayonet lug ground off, and several w/o bayonet attached.
Shot fine for me.
Last one I shot the previous owner had ground off the lug, a very nice job, I don't know if he had adjusted the sights or not, but it was spot-on and the last 4 shots into the bullseye at 50 yards.
If I was at Stalingrad, I'd keep the bayonet. But I'm not at Stalingrad.

blackpowderbill · « **Reply #6 on:** July 20, 2009, 10:07:09 AM »

My Polish M44 shoots to POA with the bayonet extended. If I fold it back the POI movesabout 6 inches to the side. Also, the bayonet makes a very effective flash supressor.

TribReady · « **Reply #7 on:** July 20, 2009, 10:35:12 AM »

I've just about always shot with the bayo removed. In each case I had to adjust the front site.
Fun little rifles to shoot definitely!

Think of how hot those bayos must have gotten being fired while extended....double ouch

blackpowderbill · « **Reply #8 on:** July 21, 2009, 11:12:23 AM »

Perhaps they would have cauterized "Fritz's" wounds as they made them.

gandog56 · « **Reply #9 on:** July 31, 2009, 02:23:30 PM »

My M44 shoots about two inches to the right when the bayonet is not extended. Guess you can adjust your front sight for that much if you take the bayonet off.

pslshooter · « **Reply #10 on:** August 30, 2009, 05:02:11 AM »

Quote from: 84Jim on July 18, 2009, 03:08:36 PM

If you haven't shot any surplus ammo through it yet, you're in for a treat. A kid shot one at a CMP match I attended a few years back, and his threw a ball of flame at least 2 feet long, I swear! In broad daylight!! The report was more like a big naval gun than a rifle crack. What a hoot

You should see the muzzle blast at dusk.

gandog56 · « **Reply #11 on:** September 02, 2009, 01:20:12 PM »

Yep, my carbines have a much more pronounced muzzle flash than my non carbine Mosin Nagants.

NickSS · « **Reply #12 on:** September 02, 2009, 10:56:46 PM »

If you like flame and loud bangs there is nothing like a carbine length Moison to provide the fireworks with surplus ammo. They are particularly impressive at dusk. 5 feet of flame and lots of noise. They shoot good too. The bayonet on the M44 will affect where it shoots. Mine will shoot on with it fixed Shoots right and much larger groups with it folded and it shoots best of all with it off. I have not made up my mind to grind off the lugs yet as some day I may want to put it on the wall with the bayonet fixed.

JASmith · « **Reply #13 on:** September 03, 2009, 05:47:57 AM »

My youngest son has one -- he's had a lot of fun with it too. I think the Wolf brand loads give similar muzzle flash and impressive booms. (Now I understand why we could see the muzzle flashes from tree lines in 'Nam!)

Per the web research we did, we have been using .308 diameter bullets in our reloads and the seem to work well. Haven't attempted serious bench work -- value our shoulders too much!

jmayton · « **Reply #14 on:** September 03, 2009, 06:12:39 AM »

Here's mine. Bayonet removed, scope and mount purchased off Ebay (lot's of locktite keeps it dialed in), and I can return everything to original if I want. It shoots about 2-2.5moa with Silver Bear.

blackpowderbill · « **Reply #15 on:** September 09, 2009, 05:51:51 AM »

I have found the bayonet to be a good flash supressor. On my Pole there is a very noticable difference between a folded and unfolder bayonet when firing. Also, as mentioned on this thread it makes a difference in point of impact. I shoot mine with the blade extended, looks funny but it works.

Brithunter · « **Reply #16 on:** October 01, 2009, 11:21:27 PM »

I no longer have my Radom made (Polish) M44 but when i acquired it was new unissued, we btought 1000 rounds of dark green laquered Light Ball ammo and it was very accurate however once the ammo was gone we could only get the tadpole squiggle Arabian rubbish ammo. So I finally sold it to amke room for something else. That good ammo had .308 bullets in it by the way

.

gandog56 · « **Reply #17 on:** October 02, 2009, 10:38:09 AM »

I was going to say it sounds like you were feeding your Polish Czech.

But Czech is not 0.308".

Brithunter · « **Reply #18 on:** October 02, 2009, 01:56:56 PM »

I don't know where it came from, someone said it was Russian but I don't know ans it was quite a few years back now so I don't have an empty case to check the headstamp................. sorry. I do have a wood box/crate but I don't know for sure it's the one this ammo belonged too.

T.R. · « **Reply #19 on:** December 01, 2009, 02:32:42 PM »

This recent photo shows the deadly efficiency of a patient hunter and well aimed bullet from Mosin Nagant carbine.

The photo was sent to me by a friend in western Nebraska. Truthfully, I've never met this happy hunter.

TR

slayer · « **Reply #20 on:** December 09, 2009, 04:30:28 PM »

I wish I could still find the M44 for under $100 like they use to sell them at Dunhams all the time. It`s basically M91/30`s now. They must have ran out of 44`s? The 44`s use to be cheaper than the 91/30`s.

gandog56 · « **Reply #21 on:** December 23, 2009, 03:41:06 PM »

Quote from: slayer on December 09, 2009, 04:30:28 PM

I wish I could still find the M44 for under $100 like they use to sell them at Dunhams all the time. It`s basically M91/30`s now. They must have ran out of 44`s? The 44`s use to be cheaper than the 91/30`s.

They made a heck of a lot less M38's and M44's than 91/30's.

But my favorite carbine is my 91/59.

blackdirt beagles · « **Reply #22 on:** December 23, 2009, 04:35:13 PM »

just bought a "mint" m44 and 60 rounds of ammo for $75... and the guy delivered it to me!! ive shot a few before but this is the first one i ever owned.

gandog56 · « **Reply #23 on:** January 15, 2010, 09:01:11 AM »

Reminds me when my Gunsmith said he would sell me a 780 round spam can of 7.62X54R for 100 bucks, and then brought it inside my house for me.

1911crazy · « **Reply #24 on:** January 20, 2010, 04:21:11 AM »

I found a russian mosin 91/59 sporter sitting in dust on a rack in a gun shop that i passed by for 17 to 20 years on the way to and from my job when i finally stopped in. At first i thought it was a M44 but the log rear site is milled off. It also had a modern front site too. I got a new stock from SPG for it but i haven't done anything with it yet. The barreled action appears to be in new condition or rearsenalled condition. At first i was lucky enough to find a brand new russian m44 still in the box at my dealer next to the new russian/chinese sks's that was long ago. Then i heard this talk of the russian mosin M38's and M91/59 but there were none to be seen. But they have popped up time to time and i managed to get a few. I been hoping someday to rework my sporter 91/59 to pass on to my kids or grandkids to hunt with. I purchased many boxes of the russian barnaul 203gr ammo when it was just $4 a box.

Now keep in mind some of the rearsenaled mosins need to be sighted in again. Since they were rearsenaled and never been out of the box since then. So don't judge the accuracy by the first few shots. My new m44 was way off when we first shot it. But it grouped at the next target about 2' high to the left 12". I had 5 shots that looked like a M1 garand shot it.

slayer · « **Reply #25 on:** January 23, 2010, 06:46:33 AM »

Quote from: 1911crazy on January 20, 2010, 04:21:11 AM

I found a russian mosin 91/59 sporter sitting in dust on a rack in a gun shop that i passed by for 17 to 20 years on the way to and from my job when i finally stopped in. At first i thought it was a M44 but the log rear site is milled off. It also had a modern front site too. I got a new stock from SPG for it but i haven't done anything with it yet. The barreled action appears to be in new condition or rearsenalled condition. At first i was lucky enough to find a brand new russian m44 still in the box at my dealer next to the new russian/chinese sks's that was long ago. Then i heard this talk of the russian mosin M38's and M91/59 but there were none to be seen. But they have popped up time to time and i managed to get a few. I been hoping someday to rework my sporter 91/59 to pass on to my kids or grandkids to hunt with. I purchased many boxes of the russian barnaul 203gr ammo when it was just $4 a box.

Now keep in mind some of the rearsenaled mosins need to be sighted in again. Since they were rearsenaled and never been out of the box since then. So don't judge the accuracy by the first few shots. My new m44 was way off when we first shot it. But it grouped at the next target about 2' high to the left 12". I had 5 shots that looked like a M1 garand shot it.

Man, I would love to find a newe M44 new in the box

Lot`s of great deals on the M91/30 but not the M44 anymore.

wvjoetc · « **Reply #26 on:** February 07, 2010, 03:07:45 AM »

I have a 44 I bought it a few years ago for about hunderd bucks. It is a hoot to shoot, loud and plenty of fireworks. There is a book you may want to pickup written by Terence W. Lapin, The Mosin-Nagant Rifle. I think I bought mine off Ebay for less than twenty bucks. If your into the Nagant you need this book, its about 260 pages with everything you need to know.
Joe

Three44s · « **Reply #27 on:** February 28, 2010, 07:48:10 PM »

+1 on the 91/59!

I don't own any but do have an M38 ....... I have two M44's but like my M38 better as it's lighter ... yes kicks harder but I like the trimer version.

I have no trouble with my M44's and having the bayo removed .... I keep threatening to grind off the lug but have not built up the nerve to yet.

My 91/30 are real shooters ....... but as long as they are ..... they are not good truck rifles.

The only Russian I have handloaded for is my M38 and it shoots very well with Varget pushing the Winchester 150 gr. Power Point (inspite of a .308" bullet diameter) ...... regular hits at 45 yds with original sights on ........ golf balls.

Any old rifle that looks like a fence post shooting the wrong size bullet that hits golf balls ......... is a KEEPER! Wait til I figure out a peep sight and update the trigger!

Three 44s

shot1 · « **Reply #28 on:** March 01, 2010, 02:16:32 AM »

Slug the bore first to see which diameter bullet you need before reloading. If the slug comes out .310 to .3105 use . 311 bullets. If it comes out .3105 to .3115 use .312 bullets. These rifles seem to like heavy bullets best 174 to 180 gr. . I have a bunch of rifle in 7.62X54R and they all really shoot well with this load.
45 grs Accurate Arms 4350, Graf/Prvi/Wolf Gold case (They are all made my Prvi), CCI 200 primer, for rifle that need .311 bullets 174 Sierra Match King for target and Sierra 180 SP for hunting, OAL 3.000. For those that need .312 bullets use the Horandy 174 gr RNSP OAL 2.790 and use a Lee Factory Crimp Die on all loads. It makes them more accurate.

Many of the M-44 rifles will shoot to the left a few inches with the bayonet folded to the side. You will need to adjust the front sight in the direction that your point of impacts is. The one on my M-44 almost looks like it is ready to fall off the mount it is so far to the left. I staked it down really well and have never had a problem. I have to leave the bayonet on mine because I use it in military rifle matches in the carbine division and all rifles have to be stock military. With the above load I can place a string of 20 shots on average into 1 1/2" at 50 yards off sandbags in the matches I shoot. This rifle will shoot 5 shot groups under 2 inches at 100 yards. I have found the most military surplus ammo does not shoot all that accurate in any of my rifles. Mine all need at least .311 diameter bullets and most of the military ammo only has .310 diameter bullets.

blackpowderbill · « **Reply #29 on:** March 01, 2010, 06:48:06 AM »

Yesterday I tried some cast loads in my polish m44. Norma brass, 16.5 gr Unique and a GC'd 173 gr cast bullet sized to .308 (because that is what I had) It shot about 2.5 to 3 inches at 50 yards and with the sights set at 400 meters was dead on.
I have found that putting the bayonet in the fixxed possition takes care of the windage issues. Folks just look at me funny when I am at the range with my bayonet fixxed. Hey you never know when a rouge paper target may attack.