Author Topic: Near completed project (Read 2933 times)

guardsgunner · « **on:** July 30, 2009, 10:45:11 AM »

Confederate Breech-loading Hughes gun. AS yet unfired. (someone put the vent in to far.) Manufactured in 1861 to fire a miniball type projectile by bag charge with musket cap ignition.

The ammo boxes that go on the axle are not yet complete.

Barrell 48.5 long, 1.5 * bore.

I know breechloaders are not liked here so feel free to remove this post.

Bob.

GGaskill · « **Reply #1 on:** July 30, 2009, 11:13:21 AM »

I know breechloaders are not liked here so feel free to remove this post.

I think they're OK if they are pre- 1898.

KABAR2 · « **Reply #2 on:** July 30, 2009, 11:37:56 AM »

Looks good! I hope you took some production photos and plan on shareing.........
the copper is a water jacket if I remember, right? If so it was probably the first water cooled
gun until the Gardener came along, as far as breech loaders on this board any pre 1898 are fine.
and civil war breech loaders don't fit ATF parameters so post more on this gun.
I would like to see close ups of the breech, and how the breech locks up.

Allen <><

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #3 on:** July 30, 2009, 11:54:03 AM »

Quote from: GGaskill on July 30, 2009, 11:13:21 AM

I know breechloaders are not liked here so feel free to remove this post.

I think they're OK if they are pre- 1898.

BINGO!

cannonmn · « **Reply #4 on:** July 30, 2009, 12:19:28 PM »

What kind of barrel did you start with?

(I think I know but just want to confirm it-sometimes I lose track of who's who in the username vs. real name thing.)

Double D · « **Reply #5 on:** July 30, 2009, 12:25:30 PM »

Quote from: guardsgunner on July 30, 2009, 10:45:11 AM

I know breechloaders are not liked here so feel free to remove this post.

Bob.

Absolutely wrong!!!!

Would like to see more pre 1899 breech loaders

guardsgunner · « **Reply #6 on:** July 30, 2009, 01:54:35 PM »

I'd be afraid that if I posted production photo's, osha would find us and I would have no place to play.

Sorry ,I don't have a single picture of making them. My son has some that I may be able to post on his return.

Copper water jacket is right. You can see the fill hole about 2" in front of the trunnion ring on top of the barrel.

Since my computer was eaten by the google virus, I have not ben able to size photos or I would post some of the original bolt. It has 2 lock lugs which rotate behind stops in the reciever.
The e-screw operates from under the trail by a wheel that ties to the barrel by long straps.

Photo of the original gun. Sorry, the only one that will fit.

Bob

leesecw · « **Reply #7 on:** July 30, 2009, 04:54:51 PM »

See ya at the Bluewater Sportsmens for the shoot on August 15th.You guys stillare planning on breaking it in there right?

Don Krag · « **Reply #8 on:** July 30, 2009, 09:18:39 PM »

That's pretty cool looking! Nice job. It's always interesting to see how many different types of cannons there were!

carronader · « **Reply #9 on:** July 30, 2009, 09:26:10 PM »

Have never come across on of those...........thanks for posting.

Victor3 · « **Reply #10 on:** July 30, 2009, 09:43:45 PM »

Quote from: KABAR2 on July 30, 2009, 11:37:56 AM

I would like to see close ups of the breech, and how the breech locks up.

You can see here how it locks up similar to a bolt action rifle, with lugs that engage the receiver...

KABAR2 · « **Reply #11 on:** July 31, 2009, 02:32:39 PM »

Guardsgunner sent me these to post I think he was concerned they were too
big but I didn't want to shrink them too much and loose the detail.

O.K. here is a question is the percussion nipple supposed the be the thing on
the top right side of the trunnion? If so how was it fired? slap hammer?
big mallet Wile E. Coyote style?

guardsgunner · « **Reply #12 on:** July 31, 2009, 03:37:27 PM »

Kind of like a hidden lock. Hammer on a string like this ,kind of.

you can see what we used in the top photo.

Thanks for posting the pictures.

Bob

Artilleryman · « **Reply #13 on:** July 31, 2009, 04:23:02 PM »

Quote from: leesecw on July 30, 2009, 04:54:51 PM

See ya at the Bluewater Sportsmens for the shoot on August 15th.You guys stillare planning on breaking it in there right?

That's my understanding.

Victor3 · « **Reply #14 on:** July 31, 2009, 09:27:51 PM »

guardsgunner,

I hope you'll post some closeup pics of your Hughes. Neat gun.

Can you share details of how your breech was constructed? I'm curious as to how the cutouts for the bolt lugs were accomplished.

I assume they originally used a breech seal of leather washers or similar material at the front of the bolt? What did you use for a seal?

I'd like to make one of those someday. I think I might be able to handle a 50 cal one

cannonmn · « **Reply #15 on:** August 01, 2009, 01:16:19 AM »

Quote

I'm curious as to how the cutouts for the bolt lugs were accomplished.

Looking at the original, I can clearly see separate iron or steel blocks forming the locking lug recess. I suspect they were forge-welded onto the "receiver" but you can still see the lines where the separate blocks meet the rest.

guardsgunner · « **Reply #16 on:** August 01, 2009, 01:05:08 PM »

cannonmn,
Actualy what you see as seperate blocks is where the upper portion of the barrel has been milled away making the breech end of the barrel U shape. The very back of the barrel forms the front of the slot for the lugs. The main part of the reciver is bored square to the point at the rear of the area for the lugs. Dont know what the hole is the bottom of the slot but assume it is for a safty of some so that the lugs cannot rotate; Or at least it is on ours now.
Fired today, breech does not leak. Sorry , camera sitting safely on my computer desk.

Victor3 · « **Reply #17 on:** August 01, 2009, 07:44:47 PM »

Quote from: guardsgunner on August 01, 2009, 01:05:08 PM

cannonmn,
The very back of the barrel forms the front of the slot for the lugs. The main part of the reciver is bored square to the point at the rear of the area for the lugs.

That makes life for the machinist much easier. I figured it was something along the lines of what cannonmn described, with the receiver made from two halves welded together after the cutouts were milled.

guardsgunner · « **Reply #18 on:** August 01, 2009, 11:14:47 PM »

The seperation line 3" from the rear is a screw on cap for removal of the breech pin.

SLEEPY BEEPER · « **Reply #19 on:** August 07, 2009, 04:22:01 AM »

Wow, one of the best cannon builds posted. Great to see one of the unusual designed cannons being built and shot. I understand how much work it must have been. My hat's of to you Guardsgunner. Does anybody know if they made any of these Hughes guns rifled? Seems to me if you did a little careful engineering. You could split the barrel from the back. Like a bolt action rifle. With a barrel and reciever. Then the barrel could be made on a short 36 inch lathe. Sounds like a good winter project to me. Are there any pictures of the leather seal and bolt face? Any drawings available? Do the ammo boxs lift off. Or where they bolted on? I beg of you. More information and pictures please.

guardsgunner · « **Reply #20 on:** August 07, 2009, 10:19:02 PM »

I found a article in a 1861 Memphis newspaer describing the the Hughes guns as being rifled. The bore is so bad on this original that you could not say for sure if it was; however, there appears to be 3 light grooves in the top near the middle.
We rifled this one. Will picture the rubber seal today. (our verison of the gum disk)The barrel is 36.5 " long and inserted into the receiver before milling the slot.
I would be embarassed to show people what I work off of as plans. Nobody else would understand.

Bob

KABAR2 · « **Reply #21 on:** August 08, 2009, 03:30:04 AM »

Quote from: guardsgunner on August 07, 2009, 10:19:02 PM

I found a article in a 1861 Memphis newspaer describing the the Hughes guns as being rifled. The bore is so bad on this original that you could not say for sure if it was; however, there appears to be 3 light grooves in the top near the middle.
We rifled this one. Will picture the rubber seal today. (our verison of the gum disk)The barrel is 36.5 " long and inserted into the receiver before milling the slot.
I would be embarassed to show people what I work off of as plans. Nobody else would understand.

Bob

Plans? most plans scribbled on a sheet of paper are the best!

I think more inventions were created without engineering blue prints in the 1800's than all the stuff with millions of dollars of
R&D today!

most of my work is scribbled or just done out of my head by eye on the lathe or mill a little slower that way but it seems to work.

Yeah when I need a drawing with dimensions for a machine shop I'll create something using My word program I don't have CAD yet.

SLEEPY BEEPER · « **Reply #22 on:** August 23, 2009, 03:10:13 AM »

Hi Guardsgunner, Please humor me with a couple more questions. What is the width of the barrel at the front and back? What is the width of the axle (or outside to outside of the wheels)? Looking forward to seeing your pictures of the breach seal. Thanks

SLEEPY BEEPER · « **Reply #23 on:** September 02, 2009, 12:33:29 PM »

From my experience with rubber seals and black powder fouling. I would be willing to bet they where putting some water on the seals to lubricate and keep them clean. So the seals don't catch and get damaged when closing the bolt (during rapid fire). Excess water would have to go somewhere. So a drain in the bottom of the groove would be logical.

SLEEPY BEEPER · « **Reply #24 on:** September 05, 2009, 06:39:45 AM »

Hi guardsgunner, I assume the copper jacket has a solder seam along the bottom. But how does the jacket seal at the front and back? Are they soldered also? Or do they seal some other way?

armorer77 · « **Reply #25 on:** September 05, 2009, 03:01:37 PM »

Do you mean "plans" not drawn on a bar napkin with a marker smudged with rum & coke ? Armorer77

guardsgunner · « **Reply #26 on:** September 06, 2009, 05:10:47 AM »

SLEEPY BEEPER
The main part of the reciever is 4.650 and the dia. at the muzzle is 4.0.
the original barrel used a gum disk to seal. We used a Derlin which makes it kind of self lubin. The copper is seamed along the bottom. It is just force fit against the trunnion ring and hooked under the front ring to retain it in position. We are going to have to improve on this method in the future.

armorer77
Thats exactly how most of my "plans" are done. I find rum and coke to sticky and just hang with the Bushmills.

Bob

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #27 on:** September 06, 2009, 06:40:35 AM »

Quote from: armorer77 on September 05, 2009, 03:01:37 PM

Do you mean "plans" not drawn on a bar napkin with a marker smudged with rum & coke ? Armorer77

I knew an engineer who kept a stack of paper plates (in his office) just for sketching out designs/ideas.

SLEEPY BEEPER · « **Reply #28 on:** September 06, 2009, 10:18:07 AM »

Thanks for the come back Guardsgunner. I got out a ruler and drew this from the pictures posted here (yes, I'm old school). I know it's not perfect. But do you see anything way off with it?

KABAR2 · « **Reply #29 on:** September 07, 2009, 04:02:11 AM »

Guardsgunner,

Since it fires a Minnie ball I am making the assumption that it is rifled, did you rifle the tube yourself as as you did with the Ellsworth Gun?
And will you be posting this build on the NTW site as you did with the Ellsworth Gun?