Author Topic: italian pumas (Read 3257 times)

hesco · « **on:** August 16, 2009, 08:29:55 AM »

has anyone seen the pumas that are made in italy now, if so are they better quality,wonder if the emf, and uberti are still coming from brazil.

Graybeard · « **Reply #1 on:** August 16, 2009, 11:07:36 AM »

EMF has always imported the Rossi from Brazil for their M92. The Uberti has always been made in Italy.

Rangr44 · « **Reply #2 on:** August 16, 2009, 01:29:11 PM »

Bill, "Pumas" are Model 92's and AFAIK Uberti doesn't make any.

Hesco, There are currently NO Model 92's being made in Brazil by Rossi - the only maker there.
Rossi used to make the Puma Model 92's, imported by companies like LSI, EMF, etc.

It can get confusing, because Model 92's are now being made in Italy by the company that was once named Armi San MArco, and is now called Chiappa - and IIRC, LSI is calling their Chiappas "Pumas".

The Chiappa Model 92's are fancier than the Rossi's, but are made under early Rossi-type methods, which has caused several problems.

An eminent US Model 92 gunsmith, Nate "Kiowa" Jones, has been in communication with Chiappa about upgrading out of those mistakes, but has so far not gotten any response back from them, so the jury's still out, as to the quality.

It's definite on price, though - the Italian guns are MUCH more costly.

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Graybeard · « **Reply #3 on:** August 16, 2009, 05:39:37 PM »

Quote

Bill, "Pumas" are Model 92's and AFAIK Uberti doesn't make any.

Yes I'm aware. Puma is a trade mark of LSI and ONLY LSI guns are properly called Puma even tho some use that term generically for all Rossi made M92s which is an error. Uberti to the best of my knowledge has never made any M92s but they do make the M66 and M73 and at times EMF has imported them and sold them under their label.

Are you sure that Rossi is no longer making the M92 or is it that LSI is no longer importing them? I've not heard anything official to say that anyone but LSI has stopped importing the Rossi made guns. As big of sellers as they are I find it hard to believe Rossi would stop. But then perhaps I'm just late getting the word. Still I've not seen that anywhere but here. I am aware that LSI and them parted company.

Rangr44 · « **Reply #4 on:** August 17, 2009, 03:42:06 AM »

Rossi no longer lists any leverguns on their website, and when on an importer/partner's website (like Taurus), a click on the leverguns link bring you back to the cleansed Rossi website.

It looks like Miroku (Browning/Winchester) and Chiappa/Armi Sport are the only two currently active Model 92 makers.

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Graybeard · « **Reply #5 on:** August 17, 2009, 10:50:12 AM »

That's a crying shame. Rossi made an excellent lever rifle. I've enjoyed all of mine and sure wish I'd have held onto one of the .45 Colt rifles I've had and would love to pick up one in .44 magnum to go along with my .357. I'd really like one of the Japanese made ones if I ever find one at a decent price in .44 mag of course.

Casull · « **Reply #6 on:** August 17, 2009, 12:08:47 PM »

GB, if you want one, just get it now. Bud's Gun Shop still has plenty (as do probably many others).

buck460XVR · « **Reply #7 on:** August 17, 2009, 12:24:03 PM »

I believe they are being distributed under the name Braztech-Rossi.....check them out here. http://www.braztech-rossi.com/category/1468-Rossi_Rifles.aspx

Graybeard · « **Reply #8 on:** August 17, 2009, 12:57:14 PM »

Finances will not allow one at this time.

Times are tough all over and the site income took a huge hit this year. There just isn't enough money in the budget right now for any guns. In fact I've not bought or traded for a single new gun this entire year and have only been in a gun store twice all year long. Normally I'd have done that by the end of the first week of January and would have brought home at least a half dozen guns or more by now but not so this year. I over did it last year and there will be no money for guns this year.

Casull · « **Reply #9 on:** August 17, 2009, 01:52:15 PM »

GB, I know EXACTLY what you mean. I'm getting the shakes from not buying any new guns for over a year now.

Rangr44 · « **Reply #10 on:** August 17, 2009, 02:03:28 PM »

All those sources mentioned are simply depots in the pipeline, currently supplied (since production evidently stoppeed only recenty), and once the pipeline is empty - I would think........no more new Rossi Model 92's.

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Blackhawk44 · « **Reply #11 on:** August 17, 2009, 07:11:47 PM »

By appearances, someone forgot to tell Rossi that they were out of business, especially since they just spent so much time printing new for 2009 catalogs. Check it out http://www.rossiusa.com/product-list.cfm?category=8

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Rossi USA is still a division of Taurus USA, but it seems that the Braztech name got washed away in the deal.

Graybeard · « **Reply #12 on:** August 17, 2009, 11:27:12 PM »

Maybe only cuz I want to believe it in the worst way but I kinda think Blackhawk44 is right I just don't believe Rossi/Taurus is gonna end such a profitable venture just cuz LSI stopped buying from them.

Jacko · « **Reply #13 on:** August 18, 2009, 09:01:32 AM »

I don't know anything of what Rossi are doing in the US but in Australia new made in Brazil Rossi leverguns are readily available , there has been a bit of chopping and changing with the company's that import them - wonder if this has something to do with the confusion re Rossi with a change in ownership or boardroom deals affecting contracts to import etc . The Puma by Chiappa are 1/2 again the cost to buy and only folks impressed with glitzy guns are buying them , give me my reliable homely Rossi anyday .

regards Jacko

jimster · « **Reply #14 on:** August 18, 2009, 11:34:05 AM »

I found this on the EMF web sight...which has been redesigned lately.

Note: In December 2008, Rossi Firearms sold their 1892 rifle manufacuring to Taurus International. Taurus has declined to continue manufacturing the Hartford 1892's for EMF; therefore, as the current inventory of EMF Hartford Model 1892's is depleted, various models will no longer be available.

I'm glad I got an EMF Rossi a while back, seem to be pretty tough guns. But if this note from EMF is correct "Rossi Firearms sold their 1892 rifle manufacuring to Taurus International. Taurus has declined to continue manufacturing the Hartford 1892's for EMF"...maybe just EMF will run out...? Maybe they still manufacture them and go through someone else? Don't know.

The 92 specialist still has this on his sight
http://stevesgunz.com/SalesSG.htm

The EMF Hartfords were a tad better looking than the Puma in my opinion, but all were Rossi.

But price is on request now...didn't used to be that way, so maybe something is up with inventory?
I bet Steve could give your the scoop if you called him up.

Rangr44 · « **Reply #15 on:** August 18, 2009, 02:48:15 PM »

[By appearances, someone forgot to tell Rossi that they were out of business, especially since they just spent so much time printing new for 2009 catalogs.]

Yep - And..........I've got a stack of red 2006 Winchester catalogs, showing all the "new" Model 94's and Model 70's being introduced - that were all discontinued on 3/31/06 when New Haven closed it's doors.

.

Rangr44 · « **Reply #16 on:** August 28, 2009, 02:26:02 PM »

NEWS RELEASE:

Rossi (now owned by Taurus, and a division of BrazTech) has added 34 different Model 92 leverguns to their website - ALL branded as "NEW".

Will wonders never cease ?

.

hesco · « **Reply #17 on:** September 07, 2009, 12:39:26 PM »

any difference in the rossi baztech taurus, than the legacy puma.

jimster · « **Reply #18 on:** September 08, 2009, 02:07:10 PM »

I don't know what the difference is in these rifles on the Rossi sight and the Puma's, but I do know there was a difference between the Rossi Puma's and the Rossi EMF Hartford models, mainly the wood on the Hartfords looked better and did not have that real dark stain, although still hardwood, much lighter and you could see the grain much better and kind of an oil finish. The sights were also better in my opinion on the Hartford models. Importers often have some special requirements from the main factory when they decide to import and sell.
It appears from the pics on the Rossi sight that these rifles look a lot like the Hartford models, hard to tell from the pics though. I notice they advertise the 24" barrels as 12 plus 1 capacity...nice to see they took the plugs out of the magazine tube. I had to take the plug out of my 24" Hartford to change it from 10 to 12. Maybe they did that to sell to some States? Brazil always made a pretty good usable 92 any way you look at it. The Italian guns are real pretty with both wood and metal finish and are fitted real well, and will cost you more. Depends on what you want, but a 92 replica is always fun to shoot and they sure look good leaning up against or on the wall in your "cave".

hesco · « **Reply #19 on:** September 09, 2009, 12:46:13 PM »

jimster ive got a 24inch puma holds 12 wonder why they put the plug in the hartford model.

jimster · « **Reply #20 on:** September 10, 2009, 07:27:17 AM »

Don't know why they stuck a plug in mine...but it was solid plastic, and screwed right into the magazine cap, easy enough to take out. For some reason they only wanted mine to hold ten rounds, I can only imagine it was so they could ship to States that may have 10 round limits, but this State does not have that. It's a mystery to me...but this Hartford model also came with instructions that said it held ten rounds as well. First thing I did was put a steel magazine follower in it, soon as I took off the mag cap to do this, I found the big plug, threw it away. Holds 12 now.

Chas. · « **Reply #21 on:** September 21, 2009, 10:37:03 AM »

I just ordered a Puma, .44mag, model PUM50003 from Buds, but now I don't know what I'm getting - EMF, Rossi, Taurus, Chiappa, LSI. Could somebody advise. My head hurts.

Graybeard · « **Reply #22 on:** September 21, 2009, 12:31:15 PM »

Puma is an LSI trade mark name so for sure not an EMF which is like wise a trade mark name but of a different company. Rossi is and was at one time the soul supplier but now LSI has gone to a new supplier.

Depending on how old it is it will be made by Rossi or the new outfit in Italy.

Chas. · « **Reply #23 on:** September 21, 2009, 12:41:43 PM »

Quote from: Graybeard on September 21, 2009, 12:31:15 PM

Depending on how old it is it will be made by Rossi or the new outfit in Italy.

The one I ordered was a new one from Bud's. Do we know which flavor they're selling now?

retmech · « **Reply #24 on:** September 21, 2009, 03:42:50 PM »

Quote from: hesco on September 07, 2009, 12:39:26 PM

any difference in the rossi baztech taurus, than the legacy puma.

Two minor differences that I've seen between the Braztech Puma and LSI/EMF Pumas. The LSI and EMF have the receiver tang tapped for a tang sight the Brraztech does not. Thr Braztech has the barrel D&T'd for a scout scope mount(holes are under the rear sight) the EMF and LSI do not. Also the EMF has a Buckhorn rear sight the Rossi BT has a basic rear sight. The Italian LSI's have a 1 in 16" twist in the .357, the Rossi EMF and BT have a 1 in 30" twist in the .357.

Hank08 · « **Reply #25 on:** September 28, 2009, 06:54:31 AM »

There's still some Rossis available. If your paying around $500-$550 it's a Rossi. If your paying around a $1000 it's the Italian one LSI is selling now.
H08

teddy12b · « **Reply #26 on:** October 21, 2009, 08:05:37 PM »

Quote from: Casull on August 17, 2009, 12:08:47 PM

GB, if you want one, just get it now. Bud's Gun Shop still has plenty (as do probably many others).

I'm quickly becoming a bigger fan of budsgunshop everyday. Under $350 shipped to your FFL is amazing for a new Puma 92. I think once the inventory runs out they will be gone forever. I hope to be able to buy another or couple more because I like the first one I bought so much. I had bought a second one an XP, but my uncle liked it so much he talked me out of it because he liked it so much.

I'm not convinced the new Italian 92's are going to be worth the extra $$. I'd rather just have a Rossi/LSI/Puma 92.

teamnelson · « **Reply #27 on:** October 21, 2009, 09:47:46 PM »

I've got an older rossi with flat blade rear, metal mag follower, no safety and the prettiest wood. Also have a newer EMF Hartford case frame saddle ring, buck horn rear, plastic mag follower, and silly safety. Wood is good but not fitted as well. Both are more accurate than me and slick to shoot although not broken in. I'd hate to see the '92 wind up in the overpriced boutique cas market!

Bullseye · « **Reply #28 on:** October 22, 2009, 07:23:32 AM »

The 3 Puma's I looked at recently that were made in Italy were rough. There was a 1/16" gap between the buttplate and stock on all three. They were different barrel lengths and were priced from $450-500. Rest of gun looked pretty good but the wood to metal fit was terrible. Sights were really crude looking.

Also have been looking at a Brazetec/Rossi and it is a better looking gun overall other than the wood leaves a lot to be desired.

My main reason is I have been wanting a 45 colt to go with my 44 and 41. The only 45 colt Marlin makes is the cowboy and it is way overpriced for what it is at $700. Wish Winchester was still in business and making guns, the Trails End model would fit what I want at what used to be a reasonable price.

jimster · « **Reply #29 on:** October 23, 2009, 03:21:12 AM »

The 3 Puma's I looked at recently that were made in Italy were rough. There was a 1/16" gap between the buttplate and stock on all three. They were different barrel lengths and were priced from $450-500. Rest of gun looked pretty good but the wood to metal fit was terrible. Sights were really crude looking.

This is odd, I have yet to see a 92 from Italy for less than $900/1000 bucks....wonder what the deal is here? Usually the Italian models are a sight to behold too.

I sure hope these new ones don't give the Italians a bad name.

Jim