Author Topic: Lonesome Dove Revisited  (Read 1715 times)

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Offline Capt Hamp Cox

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« on: October 02, 2003, 06:16:08 AM »
I'm sure most of you remember the episode of the original TV series version of Lonesome Dove in which Gus and Peaeye run into an Indian party, Gus is wounded in the leg by an arrow, they take refuge in a dry creek bed, a rain storm causes the creek to rise, and Peaeye is able to slip away in an effort to bring help for Gus.  It is pretty much common knowledge that that scene was based loosely on an actual event involving Oliver Loving.  Just wondering if any of you know (or care) who the real life cowboy was who was with Loving and was able to slip away from the Indians, just like Peaeye did.
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Offline Cheyenne

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2003, 06:54:11 AM »
I should know this, but brain ain't working too good today....who was it?
Duelist may be coolist, but it takes BALLS to shoot Frontiersman!

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Offline Capt Hamp Cox

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2003, 01:03:32 PM »
Cheyenne,

Let's give it a couple of days.  I want to see if anyone can come up with the right answer.  Promise I'll post the name if no one else can.  Only reason I know is because I recently bought a book published in 1935 about Charles Goodnight, and the incident in question was covered in what appears to be pretty good detail.

Hamp
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Offline williamlayton

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2003, 01:59:01 PM »
cg
TEXAS, by GOD

Offline J.W.Neely

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2003, 04:00:47 PM »
One-Armed Bill" Wilson,

Offline J.W.Neely

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2003, 04:07:33 PM »
Loving and Wilson hot-tailed it about 4 miles to the banks of the Pecos and dove into a wash that provided a small defense. Several hundred Indians piled onto the site, took the horses and then surrounded them on both sides of the river. The two cowmen had landed in a lucky spot - they were protected by the bank overhang from above and by a rising sand dune on the river side. There was no easy access for the Comanches, and Loving shot the first of them trying to enter the ditch, putting a stop to that approach and creating a stand-off.

Offline J.W.Neely

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2003, 04:09:33 PM »
That evening the Indians began calling out in Spanish for a parley. The pair saw their situation as nearly hopeless but knew the Indians couldn't be trusted. Oliver had a rifle that had just been developed - one of the first repeating Henry rifles, with waterproof cartridges - the forerunner of the Winchester. The Comanche had nothing that could compare to this rapid-fire weapon.
Loving covered for Wilson from the rear as he stood to talk, and they stepped onto the dune. The moment they got up there a shot flew, shattering Loving's wrist and entering his torso at the side. The men fell back into the ditch where Wilson did his best to attend to Loving's wounds. The intense danger continued through the evening and night. The Indians fired volleys of arrows at high angle attempting to strike the cowmen from above, but they snuggled tight into the overhang.

A rattlesnake came into the ditch and lay right on the motionless pair for a time before slithering off. Loving was bad off that night, feverish and weak. He felt he was dying, and he begged Wilson to escape down the river in the dark to get word back to the drive and to his family of his fate.

When darkness fell, after some argument, Wilson agreed, leaving Loving with 5 pistols and a rifle to defend himself. Oliver said he would not be taken alive. The one-armed man shed his boots and clothes, slipped into the river and made it out.

Offline williamlayton

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #7 on: October 03, 2003, 12:09:39 AM »
wzee-my wag was way off the mark. this was a good post-thanks hamp fer tha thoughts and thanks fer that ans. and the story wwg. it woulda taken us days ta get it outta hamp--he likes the drama.
when ya gonna give us a review of tha book hamp?
blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

Offline williamlayton

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #8 on: October 03, 2003, 12:11:53 AM »
oops  :oops:  :oops:  :oops: sorry i meant ffg---really i did.
blessings
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Offline Mikey

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Lonesome Dove
« Reply #9 on: October 03, 2003, 09:04:17 AM »
OK, so what you had left there was a nekked one-armed man swimming down a river, and a twice wounded man with 5 pistols, one rifle and a whole buncha very upset native Americans clamoring for his scalp.  So, what happened...........?  Mikey.

Offline Capt Hamp Cox

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #10 on: October 03, 2003, 11:27:10 AM »
Gonna have to promote FFG to FFFG.  I have Loving's traveling partner as J.W. Wilson, and assume the W. was for William, long for "Bill".  Soon as I transcribe a couple of pages from my book, I'll post here, since it appears FFG's source and mine are different.  

Thanks FFG for your participation.

Hamp
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Offline J.W.Neely

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #11 on: October 03, 2003, 01:18:52 PM »
and more of the story...
Toward dawn of the next day Loving, deciding that he was going to die from the wound in his side, begged Wilson to leave him and go to me, so that if I made the trip home his family would know what had become of him. He had no desire to die and leave them in ignorance of his fate. He wished his family to know that rather than be captured and tortured by the Indians, he would kill himself. But in case he survived and was able to stand them off we would find him two miles down the river. He gave him his Henry rifle which had metallic or waterproof cartridges, since in swimming the river any other kind would be useless. Wilson turned over to Loving all of the pistols-five-and his six-shooting rifle, and taking the Henry rifle departed. How he expected to cross the river with the gun I have never comprehended for Wilson was a one armed man. But it shows what lengths a person will attempt in extreme emergencies.

It happened that some one hundred feet from their place of concealment down the river there was a shoal, the only one I know of within 100 miles of the place. On this shoal an Indian sentinel on horseback was on guard and Wilson knew this. The water was about four feet deep. When Wilson decided to start he divested himself of clothing except underwear and hat. He hid his trousers in one place, his boots in another and his knife in another all under water. Then taking his gun he attempted to cross the river. This he found to be impossible, so be floated downstream about seventy-five feet where he struck bottom. He stuck down the muzzle of the gun in the sand until the breech came under water and then floated noiselessly down the river. Though the Indians were all around him he fearlessly began his "get-a-way." He climbed up a bank and crawled out through a cane brake which fringed the bank, and started out to find me, bare-footed and over ground that was covered with prickly pear, mesquite and other thorny plants. Of course he was obliged to travel by night at first, but fearing starvation used the day some, when he was out of sight of the Indians.

Offline J.W.Neely

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #12 on: October 03, 2003, 01:22:46 PM »
One Armed Bill's Trek Back to the Outfit
Now Loving and Wilson had ridden ahead of the herd for two nights and the greater part of one day, and since the herd had lain over one day the gap between us must have been something like one hundred miles.

The Pecos River passes down a country that might be termed a plain, and from one to two hundred miles there is not a tributary or break of any kind to mark its course until it reaches the mouth of the Concho, which comes up from the west, where the foothills begin to jut in toward the river. Our trail passed just around one of these hills. In the first of these hills there is a cave which Wilson had located on a prior trip. This cave extended back into the hill some fifteen or twenty feet and in this cave Wilson took refuge from the scorching sun to rest. Then he came out of the cave and looked for the herd and saw it coming up the valley. His brother, who was "pointing" the herd with me, and I saw him at the same time. At sight both of us thought it was an Indian as we didn't suppose that any white man could be in that part of the country. I ordered Wilson to shape the herd for a fight, while I rode toward the man to reconnoiter, believing the Indians to be hidden behind the hills and planning to surprise us. I left the trail and jogged toward the hills as though I did not suspect anything. I figured I could run to the top of the hill to look things over before they would have time to cut me off from the herd. When I came within a quarter of a mile of the cave Wilson gave me the frontier sign to come to him. He was between me and the declining sun and since his underwear was saturated with red sediment from the river he made a queer looking object. But even when some distance away I recognized him. How I did it, under his changed appearance I do not know. When I reached him I asked him many questions, too many in fact, for he was so broken and starved and shocked by knowing he was saved, I could get nothing satisfactory from him. I put him on the horse and took him to the herd at once. We immediately wrapped his feet in wet blankets. They were swollen out of all reason, and how he could walk on them is more than I can comprehend. Since he had starved for three days and nights I could give him nothing but gruel. After he had rested and gotten himself together I said:

Offline J.W.Neely

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #13 on: October 03, 2003, 01:24:48 PM »
Now tell me about this matter."

"I think Mr. Loving has died from his wounds, he sent me to deliver a message to you. It was to the effect that he had received a mortal wound, but before he would allow the Indians to take him and torture him he would kill himself, but in case he lived he would go two miles down the river from where we were and there we would find him."

"Now tell me where I may find this place," I said.

Then he proceeded to relate the story I have just give, of how they left the Rio Sule or Blue River, cutting across to the Pecos, how the Indians discovered them and how they sought shelter from them by hiding in the sand dunes on the Pecos banks; how Loving was shot and begged Wilson to save himself and to tell his (Loving's) family of his end; how Wilson took the Henry rifle and attempted to swim but gave it up, as the splashing he made would attract the Indian sentinel stationed on the shoal.

Then Wilson instructed me how to find his things. He told me to go down where the bank is perpendicular and the water appeared to be swimming but was not.

"Your legs will strike the rifle" he said. I searched for his things as he directed and found them every one, even to the pocket knife. His remarkable coolness in deliberately hiding these things, when the loss of a moment might mean his life, is to me the most wonderful occurrence I have ever known, and I have experienced many unusual phases of frontier life.

This is as I get it from memory and I think I am correct, for though it all happened fifty years ago, it is printed indelibly in my mind.

- Charles Goodnight
Goodnight, Texas

Offline J.W.Neely

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #14 on: October 03, 2003, 01:27:40 PM »
Searching for Loving:
Charles Goodnight took a party of about fourteen men and pulled out to see about Mr. Loving. After riding about twenty-four hours they came to the spot where I had left him, but he was not there. They supposed the Indians bad killed him and thrown his body into the river. They found the gun I had concealed in the water, and came back to camp.

About two weeks after this we met a party coming from Ft. Sumner and they told us Loving was at Ft. Sumner. The bullet which had penetrated his side did not prove fatal and the next night after I had left him he got into the river and drifted by the Indians as I had done, crawled out and lay in the weeds all the next day. The following night he made his way to the road where it struck the river, hoping to find somebody traveling that way. He remained there for five days, being without anything to eat for seven days. Finally some Mexicans came along and be hired them to take him to Ft. Sumner and I believe he would have fully recovered if the doctor at that point had been a competent surgeon. But that doctor had never amputated any limbs and did not want to undertake such work. When we heard Mr. Loving was at Ft. Sumner, Mr. Goodnight and I hastened there. As soon as we beheld his condition we realized the arm 'would have to be amputated. The doctor was trying to cure it without cutting it off. Goodnight started a man to Santa Fe after a surgeon, but before he could get back mortification set in, and we were satisfied something had to be done at once and we prevailed upon the doctor to cut off the affected limb. But too late. Mortification went into his body and killed him. Thus ended the career of one of the best men I ever 'knew. Mr. Goodnight had the body of Mr. Loving prepared for the long journey and carried it to Weatherford, Texas, where interment was made with Masonic honors.

- "One-armed Bill" Wilson

Offline williamlayton

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #15 on: October 03, 2003, 02:20:25 PM »
hamp--does this square with yourn ?
blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

Offline Capt Hamp Cox

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #16 on: October 04, 2003, 04:06:18 AM »
Squares pretty much with my source.  Will Post some of mine soon.  Have had some computer glitches I need to resolve first.
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Offline J.W.Neely

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #17 on: October 04, 2003, 06:06:24 AM »
Capt, is the Gun Shop named Gratiot"s still open in Johnson City?
I was just pondering.
FFG ( alias JW Neely)

Offline Capt Hamp Cox

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #18 on: October 04, 2003, 10:12:57 AM »
I hope Gratiot's is still open.  My wife says she's working there three afternoons each week.

Hamp
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Offline J.W.Neely

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #19 on: October 04, 2003, 11:33:58 AM »
:eek:
Oops.

Offline williamlayton

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #20 on: October 05, 2003, 01:12:42 AM »
my kinda man--he plays and she pays---well ceptin fer tha rents.
blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

Offline Capt Hamp Cox

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #21 on: October 09, 2003, 01:56:06 PM »
The following excerpt is from the 1935 book by Laura V. Hamner about the life of Charles Goodnight, titled:

                                             The
                              NO-GUN MAN OF TEXAS
                            A Century of Achievement
                                        1835-1929

                                         CHAPTER X
              OLIVER LOVING FINDS THE END OF THE TRAIL

“…Loving had made a verbal contract for the herd and fearing that the agreement might not hold if too long a time elapsed between deal and delivery he wanted to forge ahead and clinch the bargain.  J. W. Wilson, one of the cowboys, a daring adventurous fellow, asked to go with Loving.
     Goodnight opposed the move but after two days of argument the two men rode away with their leader’s advice ringing in their ears; stay in hiding all day long; travel only in the night; watch, watch constantly for Indians.
     Loving did not like night riding; besides he did not believe there was danger from Indians; he was impatient to arrive at Fort Sumner.  The second morning the two men rode on in the daylight, planning to duck out of sight at any sign of Indians.  Crossing a little prairie they saw at some distance Indians shooting at prairie dogs.  They turned abruptly aside and dashed for the river hoping that they had been unnoted.
     They slid their horses down a steep cliff and entrenched themselves in a clump of bushes.  On one side of their hiding place was a high cliff.  It would be easy to pick off the foes as they appeared from that side.  On the other was the river.  Danger there arose from the motte of polecat bushes that hid the river bank for a distance of about 100 yards.
     Wilson suggested that Loving station himself among those to guard the river, while Wilson watched the mountain exposure.  While they were engaged, the Indians appeared on the top of the bluff.  Wilson felt sure that he could get any who tried to rush them from that point.  The Indians disappeared but Wilson knew that they would come again from some direction.  While he was trying to anticipate their tactics, Loving appeared at his side.
     “Loving!  Loving!”  “Go back and watch that river,” urged Wilson.
     “There’s not a bit of danger,” said Loving with assurance.  “They have too much sense to try to slip up on us from that side.”
     Before Wilson could answer an ominous crack came from the polecat bushes.  Loving turned hastily to go bsck to his post but it was too late.  Before he was half-way across the intervening space a savage rose from the thicket, fired at him, dying in turn from a shot from Wilson’s gun.
     “No use to try to go back now,” Loving said.  “He got me.  I’m done for.  But you must escape.”
     Wilson responded to the pleading in Loving’s eyes with a refusal.
     “We’ll stick together, Loving,” he replied.
     “But I was the cause of your being in this hole,” Loving urged in tones of anguish.  “If I had not insisted on day-riding we’d both be safe now.  You can’t save me by staying.  It will make me happy to know that you got away.  Wilson, don’t argue this.  Take your chance for my sake.”
     The men planned the details of the escape: Loving’s gun could stand immersion in the water so that Wilson must take it, slip into the stream, make his way down the river on to the herd.
     The Indians had gathered numbers and confidence.  They now swarmed over the hills making a Roman holiday of the event, seeming to feel that the men were trapped without any possibility of escape.
     Loving’s fever rose; he was parched with thirst; his thoughts wandered; he grew flighty at intervals.  The two men waited for the next terror that might come.
     Long hours crept away.  Indians crawled on their bellies through low bushes and fired on the two men but Wilson’s aim was unfailing.  Indian after Indian fell and a lull came in hostilities.
     Wilson decided that the Indians had been repulsed until it was safe for him and Loving to make their way to the river where he could get water for Loving.  He dragged the wounded man into the sandy bed of the stream, found a sinkhole where weeds grew two feet tall, brought water in his shoe to cool the fever of his friend and lay down beside him, pistol in hand, to await developments.
     Wilson, wide-eyed, saw a disturbance in the bushes; evidently a savage was creeping toward them on his belly, using his spear to part the bushes in advance of him.  Wilson’s eyes were glued to the spot, noting the progress of the forward movement of the reeds and growth that located the invader.  Disturbed by the motion of the growth a rattlesnake came out of the patch of weeds, gliding towards the two prisoners across the open strip of sand.
     Loving, moaning in pain, paid no attention to the two-fold menace but Wilson was terrified.  He determined that if the snake did not reach them before the savage drew near he would kill the savage though his shot precipitate an attack from the entire band.
     The Indian came closer and closer to the near-edge of the bushes.  Suddenly the snake stopped, coiled and with darting tongue looked backward and sent his warning rattle to the savage.  Either caution or superstition turned the man back and the motion receded toward the opposite side of the low clump while the snake glided away, leaving the men safe for a little while.
     As the long hours passed the savages amused themselves by tossing chunks of sod into the air to fall in the bushes where their captives lay.  When night came Loving rallied and renewed his arguments with Wilson, declaring that he would die happier if he did not have Wilson’s death on his conscience.
     With a silent handclasp the men parted at last and Wilson slipped down into the river where the weight of his clothes pulled him down.  Taking off all his outer garments, his guns, even his knife, he buried them under a shelving bank beneath the water so that the Indians could not find them.  Then, handicapped by the gleaming whiteness of underwear and body he hugged the bank and started down stream.
     Out in the river, near the farther bank, sat an Indian on horseback, his feet idly patting the stream while his eyes ranged distant hill.  Wilson screened himself behind pink-blossomed smart-weeds that hung in mats from bank to water.  Starting as few ripples as possible he silently passed by the savage.
     He wandered over miles of territory where nature arms every little plant in order that it may win in the struggle for existence.  Those cruel thorns tore the flesh on the bare-foot, near-naked man.  Wolves followed him.  He found the broken end of a tepee pole and used it as a walking stick.  Stumbling until too weary to go farther, he fell into troubled sleep.
     He awakened to find a pack of wolves snapping and snarling about him.  Driving them back with his tepee-pole, he struggled on, the hungry pack close behind.  His body blistered from the pitiless sun.  His feet were swollen and bleeding.  He sank down again and again, only to be roused by the nearness of the wolves.  At last he found a cave that he had noted on his way northward, took refuge there and waited.  If he lived long enough the herd might come this way.  If not, the wolves.
     Two days of this and then he saw a horseman coming—Goodnight riding in advance of his herd.  Wilson made the frontiersman’s sigh, “Come here”.
     The sun was setting.  A curve in the trail showed Goodnight that between him and the setting sun was an object, a man, strangely clad, wild looking.  Only on drawing near did he recognize the stalwart young fellow who had left the herd so recently.
     Goodnight fired question after question; but no answer came from the swollen sun-baked lips, Wilson was too weak to tell his story.  Goodnight took the man behind him on his horse and returned to the herd.  Wrapping the tortured feet in wet blankets, feeding the sufferer gruel in small quantities, encouraging him to sleep until he was refreshed, they got the story at last.
     Goodnight listened eagerly to every detail that located the scene of the engagement and determined in his heart to find Loving, dead or alive, or to die with him if necessary.  Six men volunteered to go with him in the search of the lost man; night did not stop them; a storm of the desert type, torrential, blinding, raged, but Goodnight did not pause nor deviate from his course.  In spite of inky blackness and beating storm, his uncanny instinct for direction made his path to the spot described by Wilson straight as a gunbarrel.
     But Loving was gone and the rain had washed away all signs of the engagement.  Wilson’s gun, clothes, watch, everything were found just as he had told them but they could not determine if Loving had been taken prisoner or had escaped.  Odds were against him.
     Continuing with eyes taking in every small detail of the way, the searchers met a man who told them that Loving still lived.  Rallying after his companion had gone, Loving had evaded his captors by slipping off to the north instead of southward as expected by the Indians who had centered their vigilance on that avenue of escape.  Loving had wandered about for days, chewing on an old leather glove for food, finding water in occasional pools.  He had paid the Mexican traders who found him two hundred and fifty dollars to take him to Fort Sumner, one hundred and fifty miles north, and there he was now, still suffering from his wounds.
     Goodnight and his men hurried on to the fort only to find Loving in precarious condition.  Gangrene had set in and though the arm was amputated the operation had come too late to save him and thus ended the life of one of Charles Goodnight’s heroes, a man of honor and simple virtues.”
Careful is a naked man climbin' a bobwire fence.  

Offline williamlayton

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Lonesome Dove Revisited
« Reply #22 on: October 10, 2003, 04:25:47 AM »
i knowed ya was here yesterday--heard ya slippin around.
that was a good post and shows how saga and history do not blend sometimes so ya have to remove the saga and insert only the bare bones of the history leaving the saga to the story tellers.
blessings
TEXAS, by GOD