Author Topic: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender  (Read 1667 times)

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Offline Lager

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20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« on: August 28, 2009, 03:47:41 PM »
Im pretty darn happy! Years ago, I used to shoot a friends Contender. Loved it, darn accurate and the choice of different barrels really appealed to me.
But IPSC and Military rifle comps always sucked up the ready cash available after household bills.
Quit the comps and the TC fell into my lap with a conversation with a co worker. I mentioned wanting a TC,, come to find out,he had his Dads old stuff.
He wasn't a dummy, did some research. hit me up with a price, $500. I agreed,, here is what I bought.
Original Contender frame with Pach grip
10 inch 22lr match barrel with a Leupold 2x scope, pach forward.
10 inch 44 mag barrel with a matching scope from above.
10 inch 357 mag barrel with the iron rear sight attached and same forward.
I think I did alright, it was the best deal I could find recently .
Im gonna have a bunch of questions here in the near future, I just wanted to say "Hey" to a current TC forum, you guys are hard to find. :-\

Offline JW/OK

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2009, 04:13:14 PM »
Everybody needs friends like that!!

Offline hunterspistol

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2009, 04:14:57 PM »
Welcome Home, Lager.  There's the Cast Bullet Association, Cast Boolits on Gunloads.com, and Specialty Pistols for forums online. We're out here, pouring lead bullets and feeding TC's!
      The bottleneck rifle cartridge is the thing in Contender.  Picture is a 7mmTCU.  223 case necked up to 7mm, 135 grain bullet to 200 yards. But, I started on the 22 Hornet, reloading and bullet casting. You may find those big magnum pistol rounds sting a fellows hand a bit. They're worth it though. I had a 357 to start with, bought the 22 lr "practice barrel". I still have that 22lr barrel even though the 357 mag is long gone.
      Happy Shooting! :D
"It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."
Henry Ford

Offline Lager

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2009, 02:45:26 PM »
Thanks for the replys, ;D
HuntersPistol, you brought up an interesting subject to me.
Felt recoil.
You mentioned the "sting" from the pistol mag rounds but advised on the 7mm TCU?
I would have thought a rifle cartridge would have more recoil then a pistol round?
My only experience with rifle/pistol was between the 44 mag and the 223.
I noticed that the 44 mag felt sharper then the 223,that made more noise, but was very similar.
Since Im not a hunter any more, and I bought the TC for target only?Im more interested in accuracy then anything.
No can do on reloading,, the budget cant handle that cost. Stupidly I sold my Dillon last year thinking I wasnt going to shoot any more pistol . :o
Since I still have lots of 7.62x39 ammo left over from my comp days, and it seems like I cant find 357/44 mag ammo available locally and internet prices are still too high?
Im considering getting a barrel made in the 7.62 unless someone tells me" Hell No, dont do it,dont shoot worth squat"
Your thoughts?

Offline hunterspistol

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2009, 03:58:37 PM »
     Rifle cartridge kick more? Not necessarily! A rifle cartridge is bottle-necked and pressure comes from the shoulder, not the base like a magnum straight walled.
The 7.62x39, that would make a good 100 meter barrel, about it.
    There were two divisons for TCs, Hunter's Pistol Silhouette was from 40 meters to 100.  Unlimited was shot to 250 meters, aka 7mmTCU- which is a wildcatted .223.  It has about the kick of factory 357, not quite as hot.
     My favorite low recoil round is 22 Hornet, but I reload for that, nobody wants to spend $45/box!
     Another is the 32-20 WCF that TC made tons of barrels for, it goes 100 meters real good and, of course I have a 32 Magnum. Also, a 9mm, that's my current pet project along with the TCU. A lot of the TC Chamberings are a lot of fun if you pour lead and reload. If not, the cowboy calibers will do the job.
     For target shooting, we use 22 lr barrels, usually a 10" with a rifle scope mounted on top, I have both open sights and scopes.  Hence, the 22 Hornet, smallest centerfire big bore.  I have a 48th Edition Lyman Reloading manual that gives the formula for recoil, you can figure it in pounds down to decimal places.  Nothing I've mentioned actually kicks as hard as a factory 357 when loaded right.  And, I happen to like 357 Magnums!
    The real accuracy is in the old silhouette classics, the 7mmTCU, the 6mm TCU, the 6mmPPC, the 256 Win Mag, the 221 Fireball, 218 bee, and others.  I shot a 357 Mag in wood grips, hurts some. Factory ammo is going to limit what you do but don't be afraid of the overlooked rifle round, it's what TCs do best.
     PS: check out Ed's TC at the top of the page here, he's a friend from the guns shows in this area.  Were it me, 38 Special in the 357 mag and a rifle scope for 100 meters would be the way I'd target shoot that. Maybe use some 38 lead bullet cowboy ammo to save wear and tear on my barrel. It can be done.    
"It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."
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Offline blhof

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2009, 04:22:02 PM »
Don't overlook the lowly 30/30.  That round can be had at Wally world just after rifle season for a bargain, or at least it used to before Obama world.  I've taken deer out to 150yds with factory Federal 150's.  I usually have it sighted in at 100yds, but on occasion have successfully taken deer past that.  I target with them at an outdoor range that has a gong at 200yds and I've been able to ring it enough to feel comfortable with 150yd shots.  Mine is a 14" with a muzzle tamer and isn't too bad on the hand.  Unfortunately the 30/30 seems to work best in a 14" or longer barrel.

Offline kynardsj

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2009, 04:30:01 PM »
The 7.62 x 39 barrels were around for a while but have not seen one in a few years. You probably wouldn't get good accuracy with one anyway as they were bored to .308 instead of .311. Same reason the Ruger mini 30's aren't that accurate. A .223 barrel is a lot of fun on a Contender if you're not going to reload.
When you were born, you cried and the world rejoiced. Live your life so that when you die the world cries and you rejoice.

Offline Lager

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #7 on: August 30, 2009, 11:03:09 AM »
This thread has been an incredible learning experience for me. My Many thanks to everyone that took the time to explain some basics to a newcomer.
Ive learned that rifle cartridges can actually have less felt recoil then magnum pistol. Im betting its due to its slower burning powder rate and would actually make some sort of muzzle break more efficient.Especially in the shorter barrel lengths. Feel free to tell me Im way off base there. 8)

Info about the 7.62 and the barrels being bored incorrectly for that round was interesting.
I know I mentioned that that I was interested in accuracy but Im really not that picky.
For example, Ive competed for some time in Military steel matches useing an SKS rifle. I have a nice one that will print 2 MOA 3 out of 5 shots useing iron sights out of these old 50 year eyes.
So, IF I were to use the 7.62 and add a scope,Im sure the TC would shoot a bit better then that. I think I would be happy, But I know  Lager. ;D
Once he had  a taste of 1MOA, he will be buying another barrel and getting back to reloading.Maybe he can afford a single stage ?


Offline hunterspistol

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #8 on: August 30, 2009, 11:58:46 AM »
The 30 caliber bore on TC's really isn't incorrect, the 32-20 and 32 Mag are .309 bores-you just neck size to it, or full length resize. The idea is to tap into the biggest selection of bullet selection. It works, I have 3 of the 32 caliber molds that are really small .309s.  In 9mm, the bore is 357! TC found that they could combine 9mm, 38, & 357 into one category.  The Contender has it's intracacies, it's little 'good' side of things. After all, you ARE shooting the Ultimate Hunting Handgun!
      Maybe a lot of guys would disagree and say it isn't right to do that sort of customizing but, some of us will go a looooong way to shoot that handgun.  Loving every minute of it.
                                           Ron
    PS: You're right about the difference in rifle cartridges, magnum powder and primers make for LOTS of pressure right now.  The slow burning rifle powder is okay in faster versions, not good for short barrels in the slower versions. For Instance, the 32-20 shoots with 2400 magnum powder and a standard primer to 1350 fps with lead. That's about tops for it's capability and thin brass.
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Offline rawhidekid

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #9 on: August 30, 2009, 01:16:11 PM »
You might want to go through these back pages looking for info on the 7.62.  I seem to remember a dicussion that stated in contender barrels it is a 7.62 X 39 american.  Using faster powders for the shorter barrel and the .308 bullet.  Definatly not the 7.62 X 39 Russion rifle ammo!  Good luck and remember muzzle brakes and magna-porting can tame some of those stiff recoilers.  I once had a 10 inch 30-30 magna-ported that recoiled like a .357 Mag with rifle ammo.
NRA Life Member, Retired Air Force, Grandfather:   RIA 38 Super, , Vaquaro .357, Golden Boy 39A .22,  54cal GPR, 54 cal Lyman plains pistol, 45 cal Kentucky Rifle perc, 50 cal traditions Hawken Woodsman

Offline Dezynco

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2009, 04:15:12 PM »
Sounds like you got a great deal!  Have lots of fun with you "new" prize.

I have a 12" Bullberry 7.62x39.  It is .308 bore, so it is strictly a handloader's barrel, but WOW, what a tack driver!  Most of the time when folks think of the 7.62x39, they associate it with the AK-47's and SKS's, as well as CHEAP ammunition.  However, one of the most accurate cartridges in the world (6mm PPC) is built around the 7.62x39 case.  It's a very efficient design, but unfortunately mostly overlooked for it's accuracy and hunting potential.

Technically, when you load a 7.62x39 with .308 bullets, you've created a wildcat, call it the "30x39" if you will.  I've loaded mine with anything from 90 gr JHP's all the way up to 175 gr. Sierra Match Kings and several cast lead bullet loads.  It's a very capable little cartridge, even out to 150-200 yards or so.

Offline kynardsj

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #11 on: August 31, 2009, 01:12:35 PM »
A handloaded or American manufactured 7.62x39  would be a 308 and would shoot good in a Contender. Russian or Chinese made ammo would be .311. SKS's and AK47's are .311 bore and yes I have had some scoped SKS's that shot the cheap Russian stuff to 2 moa at 100 yards. If I could get a .311 bore Contender barrel I would jump all over one as I have a good supply of Russian ammo and it would be a hoot to play with.
When you were born, you cried and the world rejoiced. Live your life so that when you die the world cries and you rejoice.

Offline hunterspistol

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #12 on: August 31, 2009, 04:25:11 PM »
     I found you some 357s, LBT (Lead Bullet Technologies) Wide Flat Nose lead hunting bullets (158 grain) loaded to 1350 fps, fairly slow.
http://www.grizzlycartridge.com/-strse-Grizzly-Cartridge/Categories.bok

They are also on sale at http://www.midwayusa.com/
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Offline Dezynco

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #13 on: September 01, 2009, 05:09:27 AM »
Quote
If I could get a .311 bore Contender barrel I would jump all over one as I have a good supply of Russian ammo and it would be a hoot to play with

I think that Match Grade Machine will build you a Contender barrel in 7.62x39 with a .310 bore, but I think that they recommend NOT using any of the cheap military surplus ammo or any factory loads.  I believe that they recommend handloading only because the 7.62x39 is almost too much for the frame.  I really don't see how, but if you look up pressure measurements for the little cartridge, they do run pretty high.

I don't know for sure, but you can email them and ask, they respond to email fairly quickly.

Offline Dezynco

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #14 on: September 01, 2009, 05:13:11 AM »
Here's what Match Grade Machine posted on their forum:


Quote
We can build it on the .308 or .311 bore. We are only about 4-5 weeks out right now. The reason factory ammo is too much is the .308 bore size. Pressure increases because your pushing a .311 bullet down a .308 bore.


Interesting huh!

Offline rawhidekid

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2009, 12:45:02 PM »
Sounds like they do not think you are smart enough to just use .308 bullets in your .308 bore. :(
NRA Life Member, Retired Air Force, Grandfather:   RIA 38 Super, , Vaquaro .357, Golden Boy 39A .22,  54cal GPR, 54 cal Lyman plains pistol, 45 cal Kentucky Rifle perc, 50 cal traditions Hawken Woodsman

Offline Lager

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #16 on: September 01, 2009, 01:35:39 PM »
1St range day with my TC was yesterday, Gezzz, that was fun.I will be writing another thread about that here tonight.
But, I sure have been learning a lot.Everyone here has been so helpful, with either direct info or links and I've been reading everything.

Seems like everyone here is a handloader of some sort for good reason.
Useing the stock rifle cartridges can be a bit too much for the Contender so  you download them a bit to ease up on the recoil or increase accuracy.

Im still thinking about the 7.62x39 because I a have boat load of that Russian ammo and I sure would like to reduce to cost of shooting factory 357/44 mag.Its either hard to find or expensive.

Member Dezynco was kind enough to share that Match Grade machine can bore it to the correct size,thus eliminating the nasty pressure spike.  Now Im really interested, especially for $250 minus the scope mount.
So I'm thinking?
Buy one of the correct 311 barrels and try the factory load. If its too recoilish,then buy a used single stage press with the correct dies. The use a bullet puller, measure the powder charge that I want,then reinstall the factory bullet.
I know a few AK and SKS shooters that do this to get the load they want and it's inexpensive to shoot.

That same friend of mine that let me use his Contender, also let me try his 44-70 Govt barrel.
After 2 shots, put it down,, never gonna shoot that round ever again.
So if TC offers that? They think the frame can handle it. The x39 has got to be a pussy cat after that. ???

Offline kynardsj

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Re: 20 years later, Bought my own Contender
« Reply #17 on: September 02, 2009, 02:16:30 PM »
If MGM can make the right bore size for a 7.62 x 39 and I can shoot Russian ammo in it then I will be giving them a call. Thanks.
When you were born, you cried and the world rejoiced. Live your life so that when you die the world cries and you rejoice.