silly question ?

[tommy4toes]

I have a question for the board ..........after getting awesome groups at 50yds with my flinter (1" or thereabouts, still fine tuning), shooting at 100 yds the groups open up considerably.
Is this a symptom of a loose patch/ball combination, or weak powder charge, or both?

t4t

[WD45]

4toes,
What is considerably??
2 inches , 4 inches , 7 inches
what type of powder and what is the charge you are using ?
What is your ball patch combo and how tight is it?
Your ball patch combo needs to be tight and provide good seal / lurication, but you shouldn't need a pile driver to seat it either.

A little more info will help give a better suited answer.  :grin:

[Lee D.]

What kind of sights are you using?

[WD45]

very good point Lee... sights can make a, should I say....
considerable difference in accuracy :grin:

[HWooldridge]

Is your group at 100 strung vertically or horizontally?  Vertical stringing can be powder variation, inconsistent patch lube, bad sight picture, etc.  Horizontal stringing can be the wind, flinching, bad sight picture and so on. Let us know what the group looks like.

[tommy4toes]

OK OK - not enough information. Here's everything

50 cal flinter, 42" Getz round-grooved barrel, 4F in the pan, 2f Swiss 60grs, .495 ball, .018 pillow ticking, spit-lubed. Shoots awesome at 50yds, usually a 1" wide group or less, with some vertical stringing that I attribute to the spit lubed patches. Iron sights.
100yds - "considerably" is a nice word......groups open up to around 4-6" at best; on the paper is more like it.
I think it's the powder charge - some say one grain per caliber, others say one and a half. I'm going to try upping the charge to 75grs. Just in case I also got some .024 denim that I'm going to try if it stops raining this weekend, but I'd like to stay away from a patch/ball combo that  needs a steel ramrod to get it down the barrel.........

[Flatlander.54]

Try upping your powder charge, 60 grains may be a bit light at 100 yds. My .50 Hawken shoots tighter groups with a bit heavier charge. If I shoot at 50 yards with 70-75 grains im all over a paper plate. Boost that charge to 80 and the groups shrink to 1 1/2". I havent gone any higher yet with the powder charge but plan to when i can find the time. I highly recommend Dutch Shoulzt's system also if your trying to wring the utmost accuracy out of your rifle. His system works! All you have to do is listen to what he says and follow his uinstructions to the letter.

[pendennis]

Tommy, at 100 yds, you'll need about 70-75 grs of powder.  Whether you use fffg or ffg, your current charge sounds a little light.  I'd also think in terms of a slightly different ball and patch combination.  Your combination of .495" ball and a .018" ticking patch is great for target work, but I would think that a .490 ball, and the same patch would be better for hunting.  That extra .005" of diameter makes the rifle really tough to load, especially if you're hunting, and the weather is cold.

Any combination of patch and ball thickness which exceeds the bore plus groove diameter, doesn't really add anything for accuracy.  If your ball is .490" and your patch is .018, then the total (.490+.018+.018) of .516 shouldn't be greater than the bore and groove (2x).

[tommy4toes]

well i just got back from the range.........load was 75grs 2F Swiss, .495 ball and .018 pillow ticking patch - dry lubed per the system, three shot groups. In a moderate wind, I got a few 2" groups at 100yds before it started raining. Loading was a chore after the second shot; I'm trying to simulate a woods situation with no time to wipe between shots. Loading was far easier with a wet spit patch.......i did get in one group with .490 ball and .024 denim, but the results were inconclusive. The best so far has been the .495/pt, with a ragged vertical line at 50yds, 60 grs.
I'm going to get up early tomorrow to beat the wind, and try again with 70 grs 2F Swiss - I love this powder, it really gets em out there quick. I estimate its almost 1900FPS with the long barrel.
I'll try some more with the .490's - I agree dennis theyre much easier to load  :roll:

t4t
PS I tried the .495's with the denim - I got one halfway started then pried it out of the muzzle with a knife because it was so tight I thought I'd never get it down the bore :?