Author Topic: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.  (Read 4250 times)

0 Members and 6 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline ms

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2442
canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« on: September 19, 2009, 02:17:13 AM »
nadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S. (Update1)
Share | Email | Print | A A A

By Pat Wechsler

Sept. 18 (Bloomberg) -- Opponents of overhauling U.S. health care argue that Canada shows what happens when government gets involved in medicine, saying the country is plagued by inferior treatment, rationing and months-long queues.

The allegations are wrong by almost every measure, according to research by the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development and other independent studies published during the past five years. While delays do occur for non-emergency procedures, data indicate that Canada’s system of universal health coverage provides care as good as in the U.S., at a cost 47 percent less for each person.

“There is an image of Canadians flooding across the border to get care,” said Donald Berwick, a Harvard University health- policy specialist and pediatrician who heads the Boston-based nonprofit Institute for Healthcare Improvement. “That’s just not the case. The public in Canada is far more satisfied with the system than they are in the U.S. and health care is at least as good, with much more contained costs.”

Canadians live two to three years longer than Americans and are as likely to survive heart attacks, childhood leukemia, and breast and cervical cancer, according to the OECD, the Paris- based coalition of 30 industrialized nations.

Deaths considered preventable through health care are less frequent in Canada than in the U.S., according to a January 2008 report in the journal Health Affairs. In the study by British researchers, Canada placed sixth among 19 countries surveyed, with 77 deaths for every 100,000 people. That compared with the last-place finish of the U.S., with 110 deaths.

Infant Mortality

The Canadian mortality rate from asthma is one quarter of the U.S.’s, and the infant mortality rate is 34 percent lower, OECD data show. People in Canada are also 21 percent more apt to survive five years after a liver transplant.

Yet the Canadian “bogeyman,” as U.S. President Barack Obama called it at an Aug. 11 gathering in Portsmouth, New Hampshire, may have “all but defeated” the idea of a public option in the U.S., said Uwe Reinhardt, a health-care economist at Princeton University in Princeton, New Jersey.

Senate Finance Committee Chairman Max Baucus, Democrat from Montana, introduced on Sept. 16 compromise health-care legislation that, unlike other House and Senate bills, omits a government-backed choice for the uninsured living in the U.S. who can’t afford private coverage.

Insurance Mandate

Private insurers, the pharmaceutical industry and the medical profession fear the “market power” of a public plan, Reinhardt said. They “deployed certain think tanks to find horror stories around the world that can be used to persuade Americans a public health plan in the U.S. would bring rationing.”

Given that Congress is likely to pass a mandate to cover the uninsured, Americans forced to buy policies will be left with no alternative to coping with “double-digit rate increases” on commercial premiums, Reinhardt said.

“Both systems ration medical care,” he said. “In Canada, they make people wait. In the U.S., we make people pay.”

Fifty-four percent of chronically ill Americans reported skipping a test or treatment, neglecting to go to a doctor when sick, or failing to fill a prescription because of the cost, according to a 2008 survey by the Commonwealth Fund, a foundation that focuses on health care, and pollster Harris Interactive. That was more than twice the number in Canada, data from those New York-based groups showed.

Payment Worries

As the price of health care in the U.S. has risen three to four times faster than the rate of inflation, surveys show that Americans have become concerned they won’t be able to pay medical bills. Forty-three percent of consumers in a June poll by the University of Michigan in Ann Arbor said they worried they might not be able to afford care, even with insurance.

“Canadians value fairness, and they cannot conceive of a system in which someone can’t get health care,” said Wendy Levinson, a Canadian who runs the department of medicine at the University of Toronto and worked in the U.S. from 1979 to 2001.

The U.S. spent $7,290 on health care for each person in 2007, 87 percent more than Canada’s $3,895, according to the latest OECD data. The U.S. also devoted the highest percentage of gross domestic product to health care, 16 percent, OECD numbers show. Canada’s expenditure was 10.1 percent.

Canada’s system consists of 10 provincial and three territorial nonprofit insurance plans that cover all citizens, including those with pre-existing conditions. It operates like Medicare, the U.S. program for the elderly and disabled. In Canada, the government uses taxpayer funds to pay claims by doctors, who mostly work in private practice or for a hospital and are paid fees for their services.

Effect of Technology

Care is free where it’s provided, as in a doctor’s office, except for dentistry, nursing home stays, prescription drugs outside hospitals, and rehabilitation services. The elderly and low-income residents get help with pharmaceutical purchases.

Technology partly explains the cost discrepancy between the two nations. There are 67 percent more coronary-bypass procedures in the U.S. than in Canada and 18 percent more Caesarean sections, OECD data show. In 2006, the U.S. had more than four times the number of magnetic resonance imaging units - - 26.5 for every million residents compared with 6.2 for every million in Canada -- making Americans three times more likely than Canadians to get a scan, according to the OECD.

In the U.S., technology is “overused” because doctors have to justify equipment purchases with revenue, according to Gerard Anderson, a professor of public health and medicine at Johns Hopkins University in Baltimore. Canada in the 1960s was about as expensive as the U.S., he said.

No. 1 in Cost

“The real difference has been their ability to control technology costs,” said Anderson, who directed reviews of health systems for the World Bank and developed U.S. Medicare payment guidelines for the Health and Human Services Department. “The only thing the U.S. is consistently No. 1 in when it comes to international comparisons with Canada and other OECD countries is cost.”

Less technology and, according to a 2007 report from the World Health Organization, 20 percent fewer doctors in Canada than in the U.S. have led to longer lines north of the border.

In 2008, 20 percent of chronically ill Canadians surveyed by the Commonwealth Fund reported waiting three months or more to see a specialist. Five percent of Americans polled said they had to wait that long.

Television Commercial

Washington-based lobbying groups including Americans for Prosperity and FreedomWorks have seized upon the delays, arguing that Obama’s proposal for a public option would eventually put private insurers out of business and force everyone to live with government-paid coverage and substandard care. FreedomWorks is led by Dick Armey, a former Republican congressman from Texas.

An educational foundation affiliated with Americans for Prosperity paid $3.3 million to run a 60-second television commercial on U.S. stations in which Shona Holmes, a 45-year-old native of Waterdown, Ontario, accused the Canadian health-care system of almost causing her to die by delaying critical treatment, according to Amy Menefee, a spokeswoman for the foundation. The ad ran for three weeks and was repeated on Sept. 9 after the president’s speech.

The TV spot first aired in May. Holmes, a mother of two and a self-employed family mediator, said in the ad that she went to the U.S. for care. She traveled 2,237 miles (3,599 kilometers) to the Mayo Clinic in Scottsdale, Arizona, and spent $97,000 for treatment of a benign brain tumor rather than wait for insurance-paid care in Canada, she said in a telephone interview.

Bridge to Canada

“I felt strongly I could speak out because I’ve seen both systems,” Holmes said. “I have seen how government involvement plays very negatively.”

Obama administration officials are trying to use the public option as “a bridge” to a system like Canada’s since “they realize it isn’t politically acceptable to go directly to that,” said Phil Kerpen, the director of policy for Americans for Prosperity.

In Ontario, where Holmes lives, the average waiting time for surgery to remove a tumor was 99 days in the second quarter, according to the Ontario Health Insurance Plan’s Web site. If a patient was willing to go closer to Ottawa, the wait was 36 days at Pembroke Regional Hospital Inc. in Pembroke, 460 miles from Waterdown and 93 miles northwest of the Canadian capital. Closer to Waterdown, a patient could go to St. Joseph’s Healthcare Hamilton, less than 10 miles away, with a 56-day wait.

Ontario Appeal

Holmes began speaking out publicly, she said, after she couldn’t get Ontario in July 2005 to speed removal of her craniopharyngioma, a type of slow-growing cystic tumor that can put pressure on the brain or optic nerve. She is now pushing for the province’s insurance plan to reimburse her for the money she spent on surgery, tests and follow-up, she said in the interview.

Andrew Morrison, a spokesman for the Ontario plan, said Canadians need approval before getting care outside the country if they want to be reimbursed. He declined to comment on the Holmes case. Lori Coleman, registrar for the Toronto-based Health Services Appeal and Review Board, which handles complaints about the Ontario plan’s eligibility and payment decisions, also declined to comment.

Even with the waits, a majority of Canadians balk at the idea of turning government insurance over to private hands. In a July Harris/Decima poll, 55 percent of respondents said improvement should be made through the public plan, while 12 percent favored a private solution.

Doctor Visits

In both the U.S. and Canada, 26 percent of people interviewed told the Commonwealth Fund survey of chronically ill adults they got a same-day appointment with a doctor when they were sick -- the lowest number in any of the eight countries polled by the foundation. Thirty-four percent of the Canadians said they had to wait six days or more, compared with 23 percent of the Americans.

Canadians visited their doctors more frequently: 5.9 visits per person compared with four for those in the U.S., according to 2005 OECD data.

The U.S. leads industrial countries in the portion of the health-care dollar devoted to processing claims and paying providers, the Commonwealth Fund said.

Private-insurance administrative costs in the U.S. are 12.7 cents of a dollar, and as high as 18 cents for some companies, said Karen Davis, president of the Commonwealth Fund. Government plans, including Medicare and Medicaid, spend 5.8 cents excluding costs of private drug plans, she said. In Canada 4.2 cents is spent on administration.

“If we lowered our administrative costs to that of the lowest three countries with mixed public-private health-care systems, we could save $50 billion a year,” Davis said. “This would go a long way toward financing coverage for the uninsured.”

TM7 WAS RIGHT AGAIN!

Offline Questor

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7075
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #1 on: September 19, 2009, 02:21:59 AM »
Care to the elderly is limited, and old people in Canada get to die before they get treatment. That's a much more concise, accurate, and precise way of describing the system.
Safety first

Offline ms

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2442
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #2 on: September 19, 2009, 02:24:59 AM »
Care to the elderly is limited, and old people in Canada get to die before they get treatment. That's a much more concise, accurate, and precise way of describing the system.
I think it's better then are everyone has health care there.

Offline Questor

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7075
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #3 on: September 19, 2009, 02:38:11 AM »
Everyone except old people.

And I don't know who wrote the piece you posted, but there is plenty of evidence to the contrary. I have personally been to an urban Ontario hospital, and the conditions were appalling. For one thing, the place was filthy and the same big spot of blood was on the floor for at least a week. If you like the Canadian system, I urge you to try it out. My friend with the compound fracture had a very bad experience there. My other friend says that his Canadian family members have had uniformly bad experiences. The statistical evidence that the Canadian system is inferior to ours is widely available: Much higher death rates for preventable ailments.

Ignore the facts and live in a fantasy world if you want to, but don't try to shove a crappy system like that down my throat.
Safety first

Offline beerbelly

  • Trade Count: (6)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1625
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #4 on: September 19, 2009, 03:54:38 AM »
MS and anyone that prefers Canadian health-care to that of the USA are free to immigrate to that country. No one is making you stay here in this inferior place.
                       Beerbelly

Offline magooch

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6644
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #5 on: September 19, 2009, 05:43:11 AM »
In general it is possible that our system could be improved, but if anyone is expecting it to be improved by government--good luck.  All I'm hoping for is that the coverage and care that I am enjoying doesn't get screwed up.  To this point, my wife and I have had exceptional care at a cost that is more than reasonable.

In this country, the health-care one receives is very dependent on where one resides and which type of plan you have, if any.  Nothing the government does can make our particular situation any better, so I'm saying, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

If any improvements are to be accomplished, the first thing is to remove the politics and politicians from the mix.  Since that isn't going to happen--we're screwed.
Swingem

Offline Matt

  • .:{º.º}:.
  • Administrator
  • Trade Count: (1)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2119
  • Gender: Male
    • Inkredible Image
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #6 on: September 19, 2009, 07:21:37 AM »
MS and anyone that prefers Canadian health-care to that of the USA are free to immigrate to that country. No one is making you stay here in this inferior place.
                       Beerbelly

+1 to that


Matt
Any fool can know. The point is to understand.”
― Albert Einstein

Offline ms

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2442
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #7 on: September 19, 2009, 07:41:50 AM »
The health care system in the Usa is great as long as you don't get sicken with a long term illness.

Offline nomosendero

  • Trade Count: (6)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5760
  • Gender: Male
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2009, 10:14:10 AM »
MS and anyone that prefers Canadian health-care to that of the USA are free to immigrate to that country. No one is making you stay here in this inferior place.
                       Beerbelly

Amen to that, Canada embraces ragheads with really checking them out, so I don't think MS & TM will need much paperwork.
You will not make peace with the Bluecoats, you are free to go.

Offline jhm

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3169
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2009, 10:25:35 AM »
MS leave it to YOU to find a article to, CUT AND PAST to downplay our system here in the good old USA, as far as getting sick here I have had a STROKE, am a DIABETIC, had THROAT CANCER, and had a heart attack that resulted in a QUAD BYPASS to correct, PNEUMONIA several times and still am able to do as I please, all of it taken care of by my own insurance not the government, except my 20% I had to pay but that is the deductible like you have on your car if you wreck it, or your house if it is damaged, the whole problem here is SOME want insurance for FREE and that is just being SELFISH on their part and on the part of the elected offical no matter what COLOR they are!!!   Jim  and no Apologizes will be coming

Offline ms

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2442
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2009, 10:50:02 AM »
MS leave it to YOU to find a article to, CUT AND PAST to downplay our system here in the good old USA, as far as getting sick here I have had a STROKE, am a DIABETIC, had THROAT CANCER, and had a heart attack that resulted in a QUAD BYPASS to correct, PNEUMONIA several times and still am able to do as I please, all of it taken care of by my own insurance not the government, except my 20% I had to pay but that is the deductible like you have on your car if you wreck it, or your house if it is damaged, the whole problem here is SOME want insurance for FREE and that is just being SELFISH on their part and on the part of the elected offical no matter what COLOR they are!!!   Jim  and no Apologizes will be coming
Glad things are working for you but I can't get insurance in this country. medicare doesn't cover the drugs I take And I'm not being selfish.

Offline ms

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2442
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #11 on: September 19, 2009, 10:51:47 AM »
MS and anyone that prefers Canadian health-care to that of the USA are free to immigrate to that country. No one is making you stay here in this inferior place.
                       Beerbelly

Amen to that, Canada embraces ragheads with really checking them out, so I don't think MS & TM will need much paperwork.
Are you a racist? Speak for yourself.

Offline Graybeard

  • Administrator
  • Trade Count: (69)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26941
  • Gender: Male
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #12 on: September 19, 2009, 11:08:31 AM »
What has race got to do with it? Islam is a false religion it most certainly is not a race and has nothing to do with race. Some folks want to piss and moan about race every time anything is said even things having nothing to do with race.


Bill aka the Graybeard
President, Graybeard Outdoor Enterprises
256-435-1125

I am not a lawyer and do not give legal advice.

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life anyone who believes in Him will have everlasting life!

Offline ms

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2442
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #13 on: September 19, 2009, 12:13:12 PM »
What has race got to do with it? Islam is a false religion it most certainly is not a race and has nothing to do with race. Some folks want to piss and moan about race every time anything is said even things having nothing to do with race.
Rag heads is a racist term to describe Arabs not islam.

Offline oldandslow

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3962
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #14 on: September 19, 2009, 12:15:52 PM »
MS leave it to YOU to find a article to, CUT AND PAST to downplay our system here in the good old USA, as far as getting sick here I have had a STROKE, am a DIABETIC, had THROAT CANCER, and had a heart attack that resulted in a QUAD BYPASS to correct, PNEUMONIA several times and still am able to do as I please, all of it taken care of by my own insurance not the government, except my 20% I had to pay but that is the deductible like you have on your car if you wreck it, or your house if it is damaged, the whole problem here is SOME want insurance for FREE and that is just being SELFISH on their part and on the part of the elected offical no matter what COLOR they are!!!   Jim  and no Apologizes will be coming
Glad things are working for you but I can't get insurance in this country. medicare doesn't cover the drugs I take And I'm not being selfish.

Unitedhealthcare will sell you a Medicare supplement policy that includes drug coverage.

Offline DDZ

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6166
  • Gender: Male
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #15 on: September 19, 2009, 12:24:33 PM »
It amazes me that some people think that government can provide a service better and more efficient than the private sector. Maybe it’s the word “Free” that makes their thought process cease.     
Those people who will not be governed by God will be ruled by tyrants.    Wm. Penn

Offline ms

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2442
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #16 on: September 19, 2009, 01:29:14 PM »
MS leave it to YOU to find a article to, CUT AND PAST to downplay our system here in the good old USA, as far as getting sick here I have had a STROKE, am a DIABETIC, had THROAT CANCER, and had a heart attack that resulted in a QUAD BYPASS to correct, PNEUMONIA several times and still am able to do as I please, all of it taken care of by my own insurance not the government, except my 20% I had to pay but that is the deductible like you have on your car if you wreck it, or your house if it is damaged, the whole problem here is SOME want insurance for FREE and that is just being SELFISH on their part and on the part of the elected offical no matter what COLOR they are!!!   Jim  and no Apologizes will be coming
Glad things are working for you but I can't get insurance in this country. medicare doesn't cover the drugs I take And I'm not being selfish.

Unitedhealthcare will sell you a Medicare supplement policy that includes drug coverage.
Had blue cross the drug coverage is 2,500 for a year I take more then 2,500 in one month. My doctor told me that is junk insurance but thats the only insurance that I could get because of my health condition. I don't have medicare neither I have had jobs that gave me insurance. But after getting let go I ask my doctor what gives. He told me we see a lot of are patients that cost the insurance company money they tell your employer to let you go. I told my doctor thats against the law he said you won't proof it in court.

Offline SM Bob

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (1)
  • A Real Regular
  • *****
  • Posts: 848
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #17 on: September 19, 2009, 03:07:47 PM »
MS,
I can assure you that the vast majority of people who have first hand experience dealing with
Canada's health system hate it! My friend's Dad, who lived in Ontario, had a heart condition. In
the last 3 years of his life the most time he ever spent in a doctor's office was 20 minutes!
Their health care system sucks!
 
MS Wrote:
"The health care system in the Usa is great as long as you don't get sicken with a long term illness."

When you make statements like that it becomes obvious to everyone that you don't know what
you are talking about. Tell that to my friend who lost his Dad.
You can cut and paste all the dopey articles you want. Don't expect anyone with more than half
a brain to believe any of that nonsense though. We have the best health care system in the world.
If you or anyone else thinks dismantling it and setting up a big government bureaucracy to run and administer a new system will work, then you guys are a fools. The government can't even run itself
right now. I'm sorry for your medical condition. There has to be some type of supplemental coverage
that you can get to help you cover your meds. Keep looking and don't give up. You will find it.

                                               Robert


 

Offline nomosendero

  • Trade Count: (6)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5760
  • Gender: Male
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #18 on: September 19, 2009, 04:30:59 PM »
What has race got to do with it? Islam is a false religion it most certainly is not a race and has nothing to do with race. Some folks want to piss and moan about race every time anything is said even things having nothing to do with race.
Rag heads is a racist term to describe Arabs not islam.

OK, cloth heads of Arab desent, group hug?  ::)

Can't figure out a good comcback, so time to pull the old racist card, no problem as I don't care either way.
I do remember you using the N word a year or 2 ago, I figured well, his problem.
You will not make peace with the Bluecoats, you are free to go.

Offline billy_56081

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (5)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8575
  • Gender: Male
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #19 on: September 19, 2009, 04:36:04 PM »
Hey Nomo, I remember that too. Only the ones who want things givin to them without doing anything to earn it want this HHH care.

99% of all Lawyers give the other 1% a bad name. What I find hilarious about this is they are such an arrogant bunch, that they all think they are in the 1%.

Offline Graybeard

  • Administrator
  • Trade Count: (69)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26941
  • Gender: Male
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #20 on: September 19, 2009, 04:37:00 PM »
I kinda like the term ragheads.  ;D


Bill aka the Graybeard
President, Graybeard Outdoor Enterprises
256-435-1125

I am not a lawyer and do not give legal advice.

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life anyone who believes in Him will have everlasting life!

Offline Graybeard

  • Administrator
  • Trade Count: (69)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26941
  • Gender: Male
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #21 on: September 19, 2009, 04:42:01 PM »
MS is just bitter because he didn't plan better earlier in life for the poor health he now finds himself in. I can sypathize really I can as my medical costs are quite high as well. I have Blue Cross and have no such limits as you mention. A 90 day supply of any generic drug costs me $10 and a brand name costs $65 up this year from $35 in the past.

I have a deductible each year to meet and once that's met other medical expenses than the drugs are covered at 85% with me paying 15% which is up from 90-10 last year. Still it's pretty darn good coverage over all and without it I too would be unable to afford the health care I need.


Bill aka the Graybeard
President, Graybeard Outdoor Enterprises
256-435-1125

I am not a lawyer and do not give legal advice.

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life anyone who believes in Him will have everlasting life!

Offline billy_56081

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (5)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8575
  • Gender: Male
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #22 on: September 19, 2009, 04:44:08 PM »
Haji is the term used in Irag now. You have to dehumanise your enemy to make killing them more palatable. In the gulf war we refered to them as ragheads or sand niggers. The last term was not used as widley as it offended a few of the more sensative soldiers in our unit.


I had a heated discussion with a friends about HHH care the ither night, he was hollering about how his health care costs went up so much from 40 years ago when he went into buisiness for himself. My answer to him was "but Rich, you just were treated for lymphoma last year and have been givin a clean bill of health. I said 40 years ago you probably would have died from it. Your health care is paying for more.
99% of all Lawyers give the other 1% a bad name. What I find hilarious about this is they are such an arrogant bunch, that they all think they are in the 1%.

Offline ms

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2442
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #23 on: September 20, 2009, 01:03:55 AM »
MS is just bitter because he didn't plan better earlier in life for the poor health he now finds himself in.
I became sick after high school. I'm still a young man Planning has nothing to do with it.

Offline ms

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2442
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #24 on: September 20, 2009, 01:46:34 AM »
What has race got to do with it? Islam is a false religion it most certainly is not a race and has nothing to do with race. Some folks want to piss and moan about race every time anything is said even things having nothing to do with race.
Rag heads is a racist term to describe Arabs not islam.

OK, cloth heads of Arab desent, group hug?  ::)

Can't figure out a good comcback, so time to pull the old racist card, no problem as I don't care either way.
I do remember you using the N word a year or 2 ago, I figured well, his problem.
I never called a member a nigger here. I'm sorry I didn't know you were Black and I shouldn't have said that. If you are ever in Dearborn michigan   email me I'll show you a good time.

Offline nomosendero

  • Trade Count: (6)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5760
  • Gender: Male
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #25 on: September 20, 2009, 03:57:54 AM »
What has race got to do with it? Islam is a false religion it most certainly is not a race and has nothing to do with race. Some folks want to piss and moan about race every time anything is said even things having nothing to do with race.
Rag heads is a racist term to describe Arabs not islam.

OK, cloth heads of Arab desent, group hug?  ::)

Can't figure out a good comcback, so time to pull the old racist card, no problem as I don't care either way.
I do remember you using the N word a year or 2 ago, I figured well, his problem.
I never called a member a nigger here. I'm sorry I didn't know you were Black and I shouldn't have said that. If you are ever in Dearborn michigan   email me I'll show you a good time.

I am not black & when you used the word it was in reference to someone who is not a member, but someone we all know. I'm sure I could find it but why? Makes everyone happier to forget the race crap.
You will not make peace with the Bluecoats, you are free to go.

Offline Graybeard

  • Administrator
  • Trade Count: (69)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26941
  • Gender: Male
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #26 on: September 20, 2009, 04:14:23 AM »
MS is just bitter because he didn't plan better earlier in life for the poor health he now finds himself in.
I became sick after high school. I'm still a young man Planning has nothing to do with it.

OK my error. What BC plan do you have that is so limited? It might just be that the federal BC has the kinda benefits I have dunno. I have a friend who's son became handicapped and wheelchair bound at an early age due to an accident. BC has been taking care of all his medical bills for a lot of years now. I think they spend hundreds of thousands of dollars a year caring for his needs.


Bill aka the Graybeard
President, Graybeard Outdoor Enterprises
256-435-1125

I am not a lawyer and do not give legal advice.

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life anyone who believes in Him will have everlasting life!

Offline Questor

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7075
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #27 on: September 20, 2009, 04:26:53 AM »
MS:

Have you considered moving to a welfare magnet state like Minnesota? There's no  reason for you to suffer with inadequate health care when about 25 percent of the states in this country will be happy to support your needs through state welfare. Minnesota even funds sex change operations, just to give one example of the scope of the welfare system here. There used to be one Greyhound bus a week to Minnesota from Gary Indiana. Now there are at least a couple per day. Mexicans and blacks are moving here in unprecedented numbers.
Safety first

Offline powderman

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 32823
  • Gender: Male
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #28 on: September 20, 2009, 04:29:38 AM »
I kinda like the term ragheads.  ;D

HEH, me too, a good description of them for sure. As far as islam goes, there are several descriptive terms that come to mind. Godless, cancer, death cult, to name just a few. POWDERMAN.  :o :o
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

Only half the people leave an abortion clinic alive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAiOEV0v2RM
What part of ILLEGAL is so hard to understand???
I learned everything about islam I need to know on 9-11-01.
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDqmy1cSqgo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_u9kieqGppE&feature=related
http://www.illinois.gov/gov/contactthegovernor.cfm

Offline eye shot

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • A Real Regular
  • ****
  • Posts: 665
    • Mike's Obituary
Re: canadian Health Care, Even With Queues, Bests U.S.
« Reply #29 on: September 20, 2009, 05:52:40 AM »
MS
You could move to Canada, close for you just across the river. Try there health care out and still visit the states every day. Your drugs that aren't covered here is because they aren't FDA approved. I've worked 42yrs good and bad times and always saved to keep my health ins. going and now the gov. wants to take it away and make me pay more for there way----NO! The key word here is WORKED!
RIP Mike. Died on July 14th, around 2am, with his family at his side, he went peacefully to be with god.

http://www.sent-trib.com/obituaries/michael-l-schulte