The Wildcat name has been decided upon - 223 Short! Thanks. Done.

[briannmilewis]

Folks:

Some of us GBO folks are working on developing a 223 Remington Short, see the attached drawing.

Considered opinion is that WE DO NOT use Remington in the name.

The ultimate goal is to also have .172, .204 and .243 versions, all using a 223 Rem Short parent.

So I need a name that fits the cartridge.

This is where you come in.

I need suggestions for the name BEFORE I can run a poll to get as close as possible to the best cartridge name.

There are some obvious ones like 223 Short, 223 Express, 223 Midget, 223 GBO, you get the idea.

I don't want to run an unofficial poll in this thread, so if you see your name already submitted, don't add an entry like, "Yes, what Larry said." Just think up another name and submit it.

So let's see how it goes.

[Catfish]

That round would be just about the same as a .221 Fireball. Make it a few thousands longer and just form fireball case.

[briannmilewis]

Catfish: The Fireball is on my personal short list for rechambering a 22 Hornet but it didn't meet my goals.

The case length is .400" shorter than the 221 Fireball.

One of the design goals was to use about 1cc of powder, which is 25% more than a 22 Hornet and 33% less than the Fireball - 500+/- rounds per pound of powder.

We are ultimately trying to fill a gap in performance between the Hornet and Fireball, using a modern and popular parent case design.

Thx.

[Ladobe]

I've always filled that gap just fine with the 218 Bee and 22 Rem Jet.     

[Scibaer]

how about the .233 superlight

[Skunk]

How about the .223 Lewis.

[briannmilewis]

I've always filled that gap just fine with the 218 Bee and 22 Rem Jet.     

Ladobe: A design criteria was "using a modern and popular parent case design". I am going to do my own Bee and Jet down the road, just for nostalgia and help keep them alive.

One of the design goals was the wildcat has to be easy for everyone to make themselves with their existing equipment or with only a modest extra cost for non-custom dies, all from cheap and plentiful brass.

[briannmilewis]

How about the .223 Lewis.

Was this the ego vote?

[briannmilewis]

how about the .233 superlight

Did you mean .223 Superlight?

[Skunk]

Well, you're designing it. Why shouldn't you get the credit in the name?

[briannmilewis]

Well, you're designing it. Why shouldn't you get the credit in the name?

Skunk: Historically, using the designer's name is really par for the course when it comes to wildcats. If that is what a poll determines, then I will go with it.

What I think may be out there floating around in the wildcat ether is a name that really captures what I tried to design.

There is a 22 Reed Express, which uses a Tokarov 7.62x25 cartridge and necks it down to .224. Reed is the designers name and I sort of like Express, even though in the past I think "Express" has been associated with large caliber cartridges.

Thanks for weighing in, this is one fun thing!

[Skunk]

It is fun and I can feel your excitement in designing your new wildcat. I wish you the best of luck and success. 

[TribReady]

Maybe combine 2 of the above suggestions to get the .223 Lewis Lite  (.223 LL)

Then when you add other calibers, you just add Lewis Lite or LL the end, similar to Ackley Improved (AI)

[briannmilewis]

Maybe combine 2 of the above suggestions to get the .223 Lewis Lite  (.223 LL)

Then when you add other calibers, you just add Lewis Lite or LL the end, similar to Ackley Improved (AI)

TribReady: That was so obvious I overlooked it. I would like to have some flexibility, because if it is popular, other calibers would be interesting to explore.

Keep them coming...

[jedman]

  Brian,  Heres a couple off the top of my head   

22 X 1.00
5.6 X 26
22 SC    short cat ?
223 BF   Brians first ?

Kinda silly but who knows, maybe it will give you a idea.    Jed

[wackmaster]

I have done a few wild cats and the biggest problem is naming the new round. Most people only do 1-2 and just name them ther last name. Iv'e done over a dozen so coming up with a name is tough.
           

                 You have masterbaters in fishing.
           
           

            IN SHOOTING YOU HAVE ME THE WACKMASTER!
 
 
         SO WHY NOT CALL THEM THE 223 ANGRY INCH - THE 243 ANGRY INCH

[Graybeard]

Never have figured out why a person who wants to name something (anything) wants someone else to come up with a name for them. Personally I've never been much on naming things like my guns for instance so the problem of deciding such names just isn't an issue I tend to face. But then there are lots of things out there in the world today I fail to understand. I think as I get older perhaps I understand less about our modern world each day. 

[Badnews Bob]

Never have figured out why a person who wants to name something (anything) wants someone else to come up with a name for them. Personally I've never been much on naming things like my guns for instance so the problem of deciding such names just isn't an issue I tend to face. But then there are lots of things out there in the world today I fail to understand. I think as I get older perhaps I understand less about our modern world each day. 

And I really don't give a Rats @$%, But don't let us old farts stop a guy from haveing fun.

[briannmilewis]

Folks - I am grateful for your suggestions and the effort that went into them. What all your suggestions did was get my mind in overdrive thinking about a name.

So I have decided to call it the 223 Graybeard................................................................................just kidding! While someone worthy of the honor, it doesn't quite have that ring to it I was looking for.

I have come up with the 223 Stryker, and here is what is behind it...

I wanted a name that is catchy and has a good ring to it, that cannot be confused with any other cartridge name (there is an obscure 30 Streaker), and if possible, look far beyond the self-effacing last name of the creator team, and honor someone.

The U.S. military has already used the name Stryker for a combat vehicle. The vehicle is named for two American servicemen who posthumously received the Medal of Honor: Pfc Stuart S. Stryker, who died in World War II and Spc4 Robert F. Stryker, who died in the Vietnam War. I thought it could not hurt if their names were honored with a wildcat too.

Also Stryker has a great homonym.

In soccer, a Striker, is a player who plays nearest to the opposing team's goal, and is principally responsible for scoring goals.
In the world of shooting, we “score goals” when we consistently take our game, pests and varmints, and when we make high scores while target shooting.

Now it is a bit of a poll, what do you think?

[jeepmann1948]

Stryker is as fine name for your cat! Great choice and thanks for honoring two great men .

[Graybeard]

It's your baby so if the name makes you happy that's all that matters.

If you honestly believe you're gonna make it a commercial venture and have it catch on then you are just one more of a million other wildcatters with such dreams that failed to come to fruition.

[searlock]

there is nothing new worth comming up with wilcat wise unless you neck down a 2 bore to a .22 and you can call it a 2222 2much

[briannmilewis]

there is nothing new worth comming up with wilcat wise unless you neck down a 2 bore to a .22 and you can call it a 2222 2much

The only measure of success for me will be a good implementation of the round, and folks being able to make their own ammo with minimal investment, staying clear of forming dies and all the other expensive stuff that typically goes along with a wildcat.

The idea for the round came about by me being on the lack of cash end of the shooting game. The round is not designed to out shoot any of the barn burners, but the goal is to do a good job, using as little powder as possible, and being able to make the brass for it really cheap. I don't think these are the typical design goals for wildcats.

[Ladobe]

I've always filled that gap just fine with the 218 Bee and 22 Rem Jet.     

Ladobe: A design criteria was "using a modern and popular parent case design". I am going to do my own Bee and Jet down the road, just for nostalgia and help keep them alive.

One of the design goals was the wildcat has to be easy for everyone to make themselves with their existing equipment or with only a modest extra cost for non-custom dies, all from cheap and plentiful brass.

Point was, new cartridges are usually designed to fill a niche that is not filled.   This one is filled by several cartridges, both commercial and wildcat.   Brass is readily available as are dies for all of them.   So you are trying to reinvent a wheel that doesn’t need reinventing.   The hordes nowdays just seem to want to tack a name on a proprietary cartridge.     

As GB said, the commercial end is not anything you'll need to worry about.

[briannmilewis]

I've always filled that gap just fine with the 218 Bee and 22 Rem Jet.     

Ladobe: A design criteria was "using a modern and popular parent case design". I am going to do my own Bee and Jet down the road, just for nostalgia and help keep them alive.

One of the design goals was the wildcat has to be easy for everyone to make themselves with their existing equipment or with only a modest extra cost for non-custom dies, all from cheap and plentiful brass.

Point was, new cartridges are usually designed to fill a niche that is not filled.   This one is filled by several cartridges, both commercial and wildcat.   Brass is readily available as are dies for all of them.   So you are trying to reinvent a wheel that doesn’t need reinventing.   The hordes nowadays just seem to want to tack a name on a proprietary cartridge.     

As GB said, the commercial end is not anything you'll need to worry about.

Commercial is not one of the design criteria. I want people to be able to make their own cases with little or no further investment and really cheap parent brass.

The overriding idea is to fill a niche that may be filled by others, but do it dirt cheap, both to setup and feed over tiem, to get a 200 yard coyote gun, as I don't think a lot of shooters want to pay $65+ for one or more forming dies, then new FL Sizers etc., when their exisiting equipment will do the job just fine.

There is a big difference between "available" and "cheap" or no additional reloading hardware required. Same is for brass, 218 Bee and 22 Rem Jet brass may be "available" but it is not $9-$20 per 100.

If there is one or more commercial and wildcat cartridges that adhere to all three requirements - 1cc powder, modern and very cheap parent brass, and little or no extra investment in dies for anyone who reloads for the parent, I must have missed them in my research. Please share.

[mcwoodduck]

223 Wasp? Then 204 Wasp, 257 Wasp.......
It is just a little hotter than the Hornet.   

[Scibaer]

the .223 Lewis Lite is the best name for the round i have heard so far.

[wackmaster]

Wid cating has nothing to do with making money, Hell most of the time it doesn't fill a nitch! WE DO WILDCATS BECOUSE WE CAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Graybeard]

Wid cating has nothing to do with making money, Hell most of the time it doesn't fill a nitch! WE DO WILDCATS BECOUSE WE CAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yup iffen yer doing it for some other reason chances are ya just really don't understand what's out there already.

[mcwoodduck]

My question is are you trying to make it short so it will fit in a certain action.
And if so why?  most 22 Mag actions are not strong enough for what you want to do and anything that will fit a Hornet will fit a 221.
What will it do that 221 loaded slower will not be able to do?