Author Topic: Fluted barrels,,,function or sales gimmic??? (Read 1446 times)

fox fire · « **on:** October 28, 2009, 04:30:24 PM »

I figured I'd ask the pro's, (you guy's are such a resource) Qestion is, are fluted barreles the real deal or just a sales gimmic?? I assume since thers more surface area ther has to be the benifit of a little better cooling,(as claimed) but some of the barrels are kinda thin, from what I'm to understand it's supposed to be more rigid than a regular barrel, ( not a bull barrel)
I figured that you gents have played this game long enuff to know one way or the other,so...

torpedoman · « **Reply #1 on:** October 28, 2009, 04:36:57 PM »

as rigid as bull barrel with less weight and faster cooling

Rangr44 · « **Reply #2 on:** October 28, 2009, 04:40:11 PM »

And..... they look neat, too.

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fox fire · « **Reply #3 on:** October 28, 2009, 04:52:06 PM »

I was just wunderin, I looked at one of the new remington varmit guns with a fluted barrel and it looked awful thin, I dont remember the model but basicly a 700 in 22-250 that was done up in green brush camo and a fluted barrel, looked great but seems lotta people are down on remington these days, I've heard quality issues, I just was curious if if was just to get your attention or to try and make a sale or it realy would function as claimed.

Brithunter · « **Reply #4 on:** October 28, 2009, 11:02:02 PM »

Hmmm well fluted barrels are nothing new in fact Hammereli (Spelling) the Swiss arms maker offered them in several fluting styles way back before WW1. The idea of flutign barrels may have been rediscovered but it ain't new

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As to being a sale gimmick

.................. probably now just like cammo everything

yep I fail to see the need for a cammo knife, rifle, phone scope etc in the sporting/hunting field. Certain types of shooting may be helped by breaking up a persons shape. Like Pigeon shooting over decoys

yep legal here as we have millions of Wood Pigeons which are an agricultural pest, they are larger than the US doves and good eating too

and if you want to shoot more than one or two (no bag limits either) then you need a good hide, usually netting in a hedgerow of a stack of bales, and some deeks set out right! then you should shoot plenty. Bags of 100 birds are not uncommon if conditions are right but Woodies can spot a pink human face from a long way off and will veer off if they do so cammo is required but honestly the blued barrels don't seem to make one hapence of difference

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drdougrx · « **Reply #5 on:** October 29, 2009, 01:44:33 AM »

Just got my Ruger M77MKII back from ER Shaw. Had it rebarreled in .243 and had straight flutes cut in. The fellows there told me that the flutes are a negligible reduction in weight but will stiffen the barrel and may promote cooling, but, uless you are shooting quick strings with many shots, that benefit will be negligible as well. So..in reality...for another $100 to the price of the new barrel... I suppose they really look cool.

Nobade · « **Reply #6 on:** October 29, 2009, 03:30:45 AM »

A fluted barrel will be stiffer than an unfluted barrel FOR THE SAME WEIGHT because the fluted barrel has a larger OD. If you flute a barrel, it will get lighter and less stiff. If you do it wrong and induce a lot of stress into it, it will also shoot less accurately. I will flute customer's barrels if they insist on it, but try not to. If you want a lighter rifle, just use a smaller diameter barrel.

fox fire · « **Reply #7 on:** October 29, 2009, 05:57:38 PM »

Thanx for the input ya'll, So from what I gather it actualy serves a purpose, good to know, I'm nearly dead for a decent varmit gun, now...which gun, remington, savage, or a

drdougrx · « **Reply #8 on:** October 30, 2009, 03:04:27 AM »

I have a Rem 700 Lite Varmint Stainless Fluted in 223. I like it very much. I had a Rem VLS in 243 and found it to be too big and bulky to handle for me so I sold it. I also went the AR 15 route and had a Bushy Varminter....very cool looking but sold the upper for the same reason. Lot's of guys like Savage...never had one in a varminter, though I just bought one in .17HMR (93R17 BV) and I like it so far. Ruger makes a great gun....but of all the guns I own..I rebuild/rebarrel Ruger more than any other.

GL...lots of good choices...let us know how what you decide.

fox fire · « **Reply #9 on:** October 30, 2009, 04:51:46 AM »

Are you rebuilding/rebarreling because it needs it or you just tinkering with it?

gunnut69 · « **Reply #10 on:** October 31, 2009, 01:19:22 PM »

Fluting adds stifffness to a barrel as a function of form..much like the corregations in a piece of roof tin increase the stiffness of the sheet. Does it make them shoot better??? Maybe.. heavy barrels shoot better because they are stiffer and the stiffer the higher the vibratory response..the frequency of the vibrations.. This means that the bullet is more likely to exit the barrel at the same point each shot..that's accuracy.. Machining can induce stress and stress can cause major problems in the vibrations and in warping as the barrel heats. It's easier to make a bull barrel that shoots well than to make a fluted barrel that shoots well. another advantage is better cooling,,really import if high volumes of fire are in you future, as is sometimes the case in prairie dag towns.. Would I ever sprint for one..not likely. But then I'm pretty cheap..

45-70.gov · « **Reply #11 on:** October 31, 2009, 01:59:55 PM »

and then along comes the triangular remington barrels

i like those but would cut off that blasting muzzle brake

gunnut69 · « **Reply #12 on:** October 31, 2009, 02:11:25 PM »

I too find brakes detestable and the triangular cross section is a question mark. It peovides a larger surface area for a given weight than a tubular barrel but I don't know the consequences of the shape on harmonics.. I would assume it would provide some benefit as a angle iron form is stiffer than a round cross section but?? Just don't know yet. I haven't done any calculations but would be the flutes provide more surface area for a given weight.

fox fire · « **Reply #13 on:** October 31, 2009, 04:58:18 PM »

I've seen the triangle barrels and they look cool, I read somwher that a triangle is one of the strongest designs known, mite be a good thing but time will tell, also seen sevral of these guns traded back in that looked almost new and cant help but wunder why ya know.
You mentioned harmonics, a buddy of mine had the barrel of a old muaser machined down to a taper from the stepped down design( I dont know what else to call it, if you seen one you know ) and it ruined it, it destroyed the harmonics they told him. interesting stuff.

drdougrx · « **Reply #14 on:** November 01, 2009, 03:15:10 AM »

Hey Fox...I assume your question, " Are you rebuilding/rebarreling because it needs it or you just tinkering with it?" was directed at me...so..my answer is that they needed them. The Ruger MkII in 243 was an ultralite and I love those guns..this one was the most inaccurate rifle I've ever owned. I tried everything from loading to glass bedding...just couldn't stand it any more. My M77 ultralite in 270 got really inaccurate after about 15 or so years of heavy shooting and I burnt the throat...new shilen premium barrel...no problem and a lesson about letting it cool between shots. My M77 300 win...had a very heavy barrel on it...had it turned down...it warped...had it rebarreled w a shilen premium. That's the story.

Oh and would I flute another barrel or buy a fluted barrel...sure...but because it looks pleasing to me at the time..I would NOT do it with any practical reason in mind other than asthetics....

charles p · « **Reply #15 on:** November 01, 2009, 10:31:29 AM »

Fluting removes some barrel metal. No way to strengthen a barrel my removing some of it.

fox fire · « **Reply #16 on:** November 01, 2009, 12:48:01 PM »

DR doug rx, I'm fond of a .243 myself but have had people tell me ther barrel burners, I hadent heard of a barrel burner till recently, the guy told me as long as I shot factory loads or hand loads that were loaded for acuracy instead of speed it should be ok for about 4000 rounds( I think the numbers rite) But to me thats a lot of rounds, If I shot it every weekend I'd probably have some thing to worry about but as a gun that only get shot 50/75 times a year I figured it would last quite a while. But I'm just go'n by what he said, I realy dont know.

RaySendero · « **Reply #17 on:** November 01, 2009, 01:20:15 PM »

OK - I think I get it!

Fluting an existing barrel WILL reduce it's weight and may look better to some.

Fluting an existing barrel will NOT make it stiffer nor will it improve accuracy.

Right?

drdougrx · « **Reply #18 on:** November 01, 2009, 03:53:01 PM »

Hi All,

Ray...confusing...like I said...for me...flutes if I think they look good on that particular rifle...none if I don't, no functionality in the least as far as I'm concerned....

Fox..I haven't heard that the .243 was a barrel burner....I did burn the throat of my 270. I figure I fired better than 3000 rounds through it over 12 or so years...I know I did as a matter of fact. I would shoot it every week, 40 rounds, for months at a time....why? I just liked it and used it as my primary rifle and used it on all kinds of game. Around the early 1990's (bought it in 82 as I remember), the groups began to open up to 2" or better...and I was originally getting 3/4" groups with 130gr bullets and IMR4831 powder...couldn't understand it...I sent to Garland Galbraith of Triple G Gunsmithing in Stephenville Tx (http://www.tripleggunsmithing.com/)and he asked how many rounds cause the throat was eroded..bad...so he replaced the barrel and told me to let the damn thing cool down some between shots! Expensive lesson yet again...

The .243 was just innaccurate from the start and I was pig headed and kept messing with it until I ran out of options and rebarreled...shoulda sold it though...I expected the job to be about $350 and it was nearly $600...dink that I am....

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #19 on:** November 01, 2009, 04:29:29 PM »

Being a boiler guy.
I can tell you that the finned copper tube is 9X more efficient at tranfering heat than strait walled tube.
so the fins / Flutes add surface area that allows heat transfer.
I see it functional for varmint shooting, where you are shooting a lot and as the arrel heats it changes your POI.
The down side is you have more surface area to maintain. And that F'n guy Rust is always looking for a place to set up shop.
Coating ( Paint) the flutes insulates and limits the heat loss.