New SAMCC barrel

[RocklockI]

While measuring by volume is probably OK, the instructions gave the proportions by weight.

It sure is yellow.  Let's see something painted with it.

I wonder if that is why it is so watery!

Tomatoes , Tomateos , paint something already !

[GGaskill]

I wonder if that is why it is so watery!

Well, measure by volume again and then weigh the portions.  Then add more whatever to adjust to measure by weight.  For example, if 72 teaspoons of oil weigh 72 grams and 28 teaspoons of ochre weigh 18 grams, then add another 15.5 teaspoons of ochre.

Besides, the old formula was just a starting point.  This is an experiment.

[Double D]

While measuring by volume is probably OK, the instructions gave the proportions by weight.

It sure is yellow.  Let's see something painted with it.

I wonder if that is why it is so watery!

Tomatoes , Tomateos , paint something already !

I did!!

I wonder if that is why it is so watery!

George, grams won't work, this isn't a French gun, it's British...

[GGaskill]

Grams was a typo; it was supposed to be drams.   

And just add more pigment if you want more pigment.  Don't add Japan dryer until you are ready to paint as it will cause the paint to set up in the container if there is too much.

Let's see it after the second coat.

[RocklockI]

27. something grains ehhh ?

Doug It looks alot better on the wood than it did in that bowel . I'll say no more .

That IS yellow Orcher if I ever saw it  ! it looks like the right color .

Can you thicken the paint for the next layer ?

I'm not altogether sure I ever actually saw yellow orcher B4 but it looks good to me . i am pondering carriages tonight too .     

[GGaskill]

If you want to join the custom paint mixing club, I'm sure DD can send you some yellow ochre pigment; if not, I can.  Plus I have a number of other pigments that can be sent for postage.

[carronader]

looks like custard..I'll say it if no one else will...I have an idea what Nelson would say   something like cat.. with 9 tails     or  keel and something to do with haul    it's YELLOW !

[dan610324]

if its very watery thats just good for the first layer of paint on wood
remember that yellow is a difficult color to have it to cover good
I remember from my young days that I had problems with yellow when I painted a car
later a professional car painter told me that yellow always need a few more layers then other colors to cover perfect

it will be very interesting to get more info on this and see the result

[carronader]

Dan , it's not supposed to be yellow..........it should be a very famous Ochre.    Yard arm is too good for him.

[dan610324]

ochre is in a lot of different colors from yellow to brown

[carronader]

Big soft Scandinavian   stop defending the Moderator   the Montana Mauler ain't slow when he's laying into some poor newbie    and Canary Yellow ain't Ochre   

[dan610324]

noooo , its a bird , and they have feathers   

[Double D]

Gundeck HMS Victory.

[Double D]

It's the lighting.

Lights in shop are warm white color, lights on my photo table are cool white color.

Shop                         Studio

[Double D]

I wonder if that is why it is so watery!

Well, measure by volume again and then weigh the portions.  Then add more whatever to adjust to measure by weight.  For example, if 72 teaspoons of oil weigh 72 grams and 28 teaspoons of ochre weigh 18 grams, then add another 15.5 teaspoons of ochre.

Besides, the old formula was just a starting point.  This is an experiment.

 The paint formula

Lamp black  28
Litharge  1
Japan Varnish 1
Linseed Oil, boiled  72
Spirits turpentine  1

Heres the numbers for my pigment

pigment 28 tsp weigh 142 gram or 5.1 grams per tsp.
Japan dryer   1 tsp weighs 4 gram or 4.0 frams per tsp
BLO   72 tsp weighs 334 gram or 4.6 grams per TSP
Turpentine   1 tsp weighs 4 gram or 4.0 frams per tsp

Since the pigment is the heaviest so it has to be the multiplier.

If I did the math right I needed:

Pigment  142 grams
Japan Varnish 5.1 grams
Linseed Oil, boiled  365 grams
Turpentine 5.1 grams.

So get this batch right I need to add:

Japan Varnish 1.1 grams
Linseed Oil, boiled  33.2 grams
Turpentine 1.1 grams.

Does that look right?

I'm still in a quandry about the use or need of litharge.
 

[dan610324]

maybe you should test with a few drops of the paint and mix in some brownish or some more black to come closer to the picture
maybe a tiny bit of red also

[Double D]

Dan,

The color is right, it's the consistency that I have issues with.  Every thing is still tacky this morning.

[dan610324]

save that as the main batch and from that you take just 2-3 table spoons and mix that with a little more japan dryer
just as an experiment

it aint sure that those old recepies dry as fast as we are used to with modern paints as they dont contain any of todays easy evaporating thinners

I know an artist and he told me that an oil painting could need up to 3 years before its completely dry

[Double D]

save that as the main batch and from that you take just 2-3 table spoons and mix that with a little more japan dryer
just as an experiment

Dan, I can't do that, it makes to much sense!!!

[dan610324]

   ok

[Double D]

The label on the dryer says 6 to 8 ounces of dryer per gallon of paint, so it sounds like three Teaspoons might work.

Dogs need a nap....

[Cannoneer]

It looks like you've been working them hard; are there a lot of those "burrowing type rats" that they've been bred to hunt down, that reside in Montana? 

[brokenpole]

save that as the main batch and from that you take just 2-3 table spoons and mix that with a little more japan dryer
just as an experiment

Dan, I can't do that, it makes to much sense!!!

First, I ahve enjoyed reading the posts as this project by DD continues.  I look forward to watching the whole thing take shape and can't wait for the B-O-O-M.

But I must warn ya'll that if we are going to start "making sense" we are all going to be in a heap of trouble. 

My wife constantly nags...oooops...excuse me...she constantly tells me that I am not allowed to make sense.  Nope.  Not at all.   

[gulfcoastblackpowder]

Looks like it will need some more sanding between paint layers.  I know how much you like sanding!  

I think some of the color being off to some people's eyes is related to the viscosity of the paint.  Once it thickens up, you'll be able to see the true color better, since right now the wood is affecting the final color, and once the paint is thick enough you'll only see the color of the paint.  I think adding a little more BLO along with the drier may help with that (would also tint it a little more orange - possibly closer still to the right color, though I do think it's pretty close already).  

According to what I've read (haven't worked with Japan Driers), they thin paint, so it may have the adverse effect if you want it thicker, which is why I suggest adding a bit more BLO, which is the binding component of the paint recipe.

I just ran across this which breaks down the components rather well:
http://www.woodworking.com/wwtimes_oilstain.cfm

[GGaskill]

Every thing is still tacky this morning.

What was the overnight temperature?  It can't be really warm up there yet.  Overnight seems too soon to worry.  But I suppose you could dip out enough for a second coat and add a little more Japan drier.  But not much.  It might even accelerate the drying of the paint already on the parts.

[Double D]

The shop furnace is still running and it is in the 60's in the shop.

A added another TSP  of dryer to the mix and applied the second coat earlier this after noon.  The finish is less tacky right now.  I still have runny paint.  I had to blot the runs at the bottom hanging pieces, but I can deal with that. Even thought I applied a coat of BLO before painting, the wood is still soaking up the finish. 

I am tempted to let this paint get hard and sand it back to the filled pores, then apply the more!

 

[GGaskill]

I am tempted to let this paint get hard and sand it back to the filled pores, then apply the more!

Sounds like a good idea if you are looking for a finish like those on the Victory.

[Double D]

I'm not looking for the modern museum smooth machine made finish seen on the repro guns and carriages.  I want some texture and character like seen on the original restorations. I left some tool marks and sanded each board separate to do away with that sterile dead flat CNC type stock work that is a hallmark of museums and the Custom Gunmakers Guild.

So my own bias says don't sand back...thanks George for opening my eyes!

 

[RocklockI]

That is a good idea I would wet sand the paint and wood because the dust will help fill the pores .

You are getting 'good penetration' with this paint job Doug .  That will make it easier for some Jarhead in the distant future to keep it shinny like the admiral likes it .

Humm ?     Private jarhead ! Present your body to polish this gun untill I am tired of watching you polish it PRIVATE  ! 15 -14 -13 - 12- 11- 10 -9 -. ........3, 2, 1, LOCK IT UP PRIVATE !

At the POSITION of ATTENTION YOU WILL POLISH THIS GUN UNTILL IT IS GONE   . I WANT TO SEE THE BORE FROM THE OUTSIDE YOU  #):"$ ^* maggot smellin>^!~*!$sick licker #@+-=:,? ....more bad words .

so on and so on ...........and so on       till private Doug dies at the postion of attention , standing in front of a gun that no longer exists because private Doug did his duty . He is far too scared to fall down dead for many days        .......       untill his Senior Drill Instructor Gives him perrmission to fall down dead  .

Yep it has happened , and is happening right now at the Marine Corps Recruit Training Depots (MCRD)
San Diego CA . and Parris Island S.C.  

God Bless the Marines


Gary

OK sometimes The Corps gets the better of me .....! Semper Fi.

So that ! private Doug is all a good thing because some future PVT Doug will not have to polish your gun untill it is gone  .  So lay that paint on thick and sand accordingly .

I'm talking Navy Paint it ! Globb that paint on till it is at least as strong as the wood or steel it is surrounding ! Keeping all corners and sides square too .

I watched two Navy guts paint 5 or 6 bolts in rotation untill one bolt dried , then they would time the next one to dry so that an entire ...'shift' (I guess) was taken up painting maybe 30 bolts .

I think the Navy would be hard pressed to ever get a wrench on any of them . The joke was "OH GOD NO ! DONT EVER TAKE THE PAINT OFF THE BOLTS OR WE ARE DONE ,FOR SURE !"

It must have worked OK the LPD-12 is now awaiting her fate as scrap or a target ship .
 

[Cannoneer]

I'm not looking for the modern museum smooth machine made finish seen on the repro guns and carriages.  I want some texture and character like seen on the original restorations. I left some tool marks and sanded each board separate to do away with that sterile dead flat CNC type stock work that is a hallmark of museums and the Custom Gunmakers Guild.

So my own bias says don't sand back...thanks George for opening my eyes!

DD,
Not for the purpose of giving it smooth finish, but just for the sake of better adhehesion of the fresh coat (with oil based paint) to the one already applied, if the piece of wood I"m painting is of a reasonable size to make it practicable, I always lightly "rough up" the layer that's about to get another coat with sand paper or unoiled steel wool. Yes Douglas, I do have some experience in painting wood, although you are correct in assuming that I've not yet applied any opaque substances to an artillery carriage.   I also do the same before applying fresh layers of any clear coat finish that I happen to be using.