The new Barbie

[Squib]

ps, like I said in the post two prior, the liberals are giving them minority status to just walk right in and take over.  for the establishment this is a critical blow, and no I'm not saying to drop our guard but it WILL backfire on the liberals, that's what they don't understand.  everyone is so scared to even think about it happening, I don't know how we can stop it- until they get bold enough to get crazy over here (it does happen sometimes but it's usually not american born arab/muslims, it's immigrants).  and we've had the nation of islam/louis farrakhan here for a long time, longer than I've been alive.  jesse jackson and his if you're black do what I say religion, reverend wright and michael phleger too

you're all worried about FOREIGN MUSLIMS, don't you know about christian socialism of the twenties and thirties? that's older than the old guys here, it's been here for a long time and it WILL come back (all that turn the other cheek bs doesn't go away because it takes character to make a man but sissies aren't in short supply)

[Squib]

back to economics, it's not just welfare bums either, people filing for bankruptcy

sorry to all the people that applies to but once you make a commitment you're bound to it

that's got to REALLY hurt with the credit problems lately, just having a court sign someone off as untouchable after wracking up thousands

[powderman]

Squib you are so full of it I  don't know where to start! But I sure as hell don't believe you were ever a U S Marine and I was one! To me you seem to be another lib trying to put some BS over on us. I ain't buying it.
                           Beerbelly

YUP. Me either. Can anybody say SPAMMER??? Kinda like a yapping pup wanting attention.  POWDERMAN.  

[blind ear]

you can't go for people just like you, go for people with similiar ideals, it's actually attainable

Squib, I see that. Argueing forever and never reaching a compromise is what keeps us where we are, but you must be careful about getting in bed with someone to reach an end when they are the problem you are trying to fix to start with. eddiegjr

[Dee]

 While I believe your motives to be well meaning, I believe your youthful thought process on how to clean out the liberal corruption to be far more idealistic than realistic. As a youth of your age group I was quite positve that there was a simple solution to life's problems, and then it dawned with each new day of life's many experiences that can only be gained with age. Revolution and change cannot be exported, but must come from within. Another religion, or country even cannot force another country to change, only comply with force or threat of force. Change and revolution comes from within. It always has.
I see no value in the Muslim religion, and I do not agree with you AT ALL, on your analysis of God, Allah, and Yaweh being all the same. They are not. GW Bush made the same ignorant analogy on national TV. He made the remark on three different ocassions showing exactly what he knows about the Christian religion he also claims to be a part of, and the Muslim religion as well. He claims to, but actually understands neither.
Since Abraham sired Ishmael the arab has been, and was propheside by God Himself to be at odds with his fellow man ALWAYS. He the arab, is a fuedist, that cannot be pacified, EVER. He is a warrior constantly at war with himself, and any whom do not agree. They are in search of enemies, not allies. It is a historical fact some 7,000 years old. The Christian has made mistakes thru out history yes, but has attempted to rectifiey them. The Muslim never will. He cannot. It is his nature to war with everyone.

[williamlayton]

Are you sure your a conservative---perhaps closer to a Marxist---pretty sure you are just against whatever you don't like and call it conservative.
If you were a pure conservative you most probably be a Republican in the truest sense of the meaning and really fond of no goverment at all except on the buddy system.
If we had such a government control as this we would be told not asked, dispatched with orders and certainly no room for thinking.
Blessings

[Squib]

fine, have it your way guys: i don't agree with you so I'm the other guys/team/foreign.  just remember that not looking at the sociological game plan they are playing doesn't help you fight it off, I just wanted you to be aware of THE ONLY WAY I CAN THINK OF TO KEEP THEM FROM SUCCEEDING
for all the talk of hating muslims you don't throw out any solutions or offer any redemptive ideas.

and how does that make me a marxist will?  that made no sense so please explain that one to me because it's very abstract.... I'm anti-welfare state to the extreme, so unless you are interpreting my support of the working class being some sort of proletariat rallying cry then I don't get your interpretation

Dee they all claim jesus, they just argue about the meaning of his coming and sacrifice- to someone that isn't religious (me) it seems they worship different interpretations of the same god.  yes I know of the prophetic explanation of their warlike ways and believe it- that's why I think they'll be the one group the liberals let in that become not a straw but a sledgehammer breaking the camel's back (camel being liberal institutions)

eddirjr- I'm not saying get in bed with them, the liberal/anti-establishment already has and will continue to do so.  I never said that our politicians SHOULD let it happen but it will so I hope they take that opportunity to show their true intentions.  when the liberals cry out "foul" just let them deal with the backlash, blacklist all of them as the scum they are and their power will fade quickly.

to dee and everyone- idealism is the point of the argument right.  

all of you   if you just want to go on a hate rant about muslims, arabs, and white americans that don't want to go murder them in the Middle East (strange that most of you never went though) then go ahead and have your KKK talks all you want.... I'll back off if you don't want to discuss the strategy needed to bring them down.  I would have thought that with the patriot act being turned around on the white/christian man already that you would be very leary of attempting to promote more bigotry on a federal level... federal power is what has us in this political correctness mess and it's now turned on us too.  Don't you see that it's our own people that are the biggest threat, they can actually admit to being socialists again and most voters really don't care.  you're worried about a jihadist blowing up a church, I'm worried about hilary clinton, bill clinton, joe biden, obama, and pelosi more than a few crazy islamic extremists.  

just pm me now and reference a particular quote, I'm done posting for awhile on this board

[scootrd]

Where's the separation of church and state here.

They have also started to install them in Airports, Yet I cannot say Merry Christmas at work without getting in trouble with HR.
We also cannot display Christian "Paraphernalia in public places including these same college campuses. We have taken God out of the pledge of allegiance. Next we will have to remove the slogan in god we Trust on our money.  Yet by Gosh lets accommodate one religion or peoples by installing foot baths. But lets not accomodate others by allowing them a manger at CHRISTmas , or the right to say the pledge of Allegiance in our schools etc..


Last week, Kay Pepin, University of Michigan-Dearborn Director of Facilities Planning, and Terry Gallagher, a U of M-Dearborn spokesman, confirmed to me that plans are in the works to build Muslim footbaths (they refer to them as “foot-washing stations”) in both the University Center and Fairlane Center buildings at the university.
When I asked why the footbaths were being installed, Gallagher told me that this is “an accommodation to a significant portion of our student body and their friends and visitors in accordance with our mission.” He said that it is a growing trend with Boston University, Cal State-Fullerton, University of Wisconsin-Madison, and Washington University of St. Louis, all installing footbaths. “We wanted to be part of that trend in accommodating Muslim students.”

Here is Red Skelton from 1969 - TALK ABOUT SOMEONE WITH FORESIGHT.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPbIls0iOnI

[Dee]

Dee they all claim jesus, they just argue about the meaning of his coming and sacrifice- to someone that isn't religious (me) it seems they worship different interpretations of the same god.  yes I know of the prophetic explanation of their warlike ways and believe it- that's why I think they'll be the one group the liberals let in that become not a straw but a sledgehammer breaking the camel's back (camel being liberal institutions)

No Squib they do not recognize Christ in the same light. To the Muslim he is a man, not God. They have lowered his statis to mortal, and recognize him only as a prophet. The rewards in THEIR HEAVEN are 70 something whores, and all the 1st time sex they want, and the very best of booze. Christ's offer is Spiritual Perfection, and Righteousness, and No more pain or sorrow. Quite a difference huh?  Decadence instead of purity. That some god in Allah.

to dee and everyone- idealism is the point of the argument right.  

all of you   if you just want to go on a hate rant about muslims, arabs, and white americans that don't want to go murder them in the Middle East (strange that most of you never went though) then go ahead and have your KKK talks all you want.... I'll back off if you don't want to discuss the strategy needed to bring them down.  I would have thought that with the patriot act being turned around on the white/christian man already that you would be very leary of attempting to promote more bigotry on a federal level... federal power is what has us in this political correctness mess and it's now turned on us too.  Don't you see that it's our own people that are the biggest threat, they can actually admit to being socialists again and most voters really don't care.  you're worried about a jihadist blowing up a church, I'm worried about hilary clinton, bill clinton, joe biden, obama, and pelosi more than a few crazy islamic extremists.  

An interesting view that being well aware of the Muslim intent on destroying any that conflict with the Muslim, including other Muslims equates to hate.  It seems more like common sense to me.
An equally interesting analogy of the Patriot Act being turned agains the white/Christians., when actually it is a defromation of the Constitution and Bill of Rights which is for all Americans. You have accused most here of "centering" our "hate" on the Muslim, and you have actually capsuleized us as the enemy, when most agree it is our government which causes the most problems. You are telling most here that we are wrong but, you yourself are vacating the thread becasue you are getting equal treatment of being told the same as you are saying.
And by the way, idealism, many times is so remotely removed from reality, it can never become realism. Idealism is the liberal's greatest boon to foolishness. Your ideal of pouring gasoline (the Muslim) into an already hot fire makes no sense at all. The last thing we need is a Muslim controlled government.

[williamlayton]

My take on this is pretty simple.
If we are to compete in a one world economy there can be no middle class.
If you are not of the closed society then you are fodder to be used for the benifit of the ruling class.
Don't believe that? Look at history.
The middle class is a new concept in world history.
Middle class has no presence without social consciousness and this was forced upon the ruling class by revolt in the early 20's---see unions. they were labeled as Communist and I agree that they are a liberal idea--but they brought about equality that this nation was established for.
Blessings

[Squib]

for unions to work I think they have to actually OWN the means of production
once they start sitting in committees and calling the shots, they cease to be truly democratic and become a republican legislative body
so instead of an owner and president with consolidated interests/executive authority, it becomes a beauracracy.  I think that in the fight the little guy can win but the unions themselves complicate things (imagine if they actually own the company- executive authority is splintered)

for large industry unions are probably quite feasible but for a small business I can't see anything good coming from it

back to the first proclamation of this post

Dee, the gasoline analogy might be right.  the liberals are playing with it by letting them in at all, so if the right tried to turn it around on them then the right would be just as guilty.... it could be that young/ignorant thing that didn't let me see that earlier.  (you've been the first to explain it though)

[Dee]

Well it was a layman's simplistic explanation, but if it hit the mark with you, then the point is made. There is no real way to accomplish anything other than the right, or the wrong way. You can stop your dog from digging under the fence either by putting an electric fence wire down at the bottom, or you can simply "shoot the dog". Either way will accomplish the task, and stop the digging but, like your idea with the Muslim, the later solution is irreversible. You no longer have a dog, or with your solution, a government.
It is good that your mind is open, even if partially. We shall see. Everyone believes they can build a better wheel. Most can't, but there are some that actually can.

[Squib]

the problem is people don't want simple wheels but perfect societies if not a total NWO

I don't think anyone can make that happen, but if any party backs down then it's either destroyed or assimilated... I don't think humankind will ever reach the end of that struggle short of scorched earth or judgement day

[williamlayton]

The problem is people WANT. There is a want craze and satan is feeding this craze. It takes folks away from God but it is a setup on his part.
God knows and is prepared---well has been prepared from the creation.
Blessings

[Squib]

Dee- how can we deal with them without breaking the constitution

The liberals are going to use them as shock troops, and they don't care who they hurt because we are all infidels.. I realize this.  I THINK the liberals are easier and more disgusting targets though- the ones the muslims would tear into with reckless abandon.  There are muslims here, have been for awhile, and now they're reaching out to convert and corrupt.  How do we stop it without tearing out their base of support (liberals).

I don't know what to do but so far it seems that few do anything to stop it, the ones I see acting are the ones holding the door open for them.  We are watching their advances via kulturkampf but we are not fighting on that front- WHY?

How can we continue to walk the highroad while the mountain is eroding?

[blind ear]

This is a cycle. After the crash of the 20's laws were established that were to protect people against business and banking and corporate dealings not just concerning unions, just to protect the person with money in the bank or stock market. The cycle is historic of about a 50 years as Jr high ecconomics teaches. As the cycle grows older it leans more toward business until the crash then the correction covers property values, corporate power, individual rights and all aspects of the economy and civil rights. Peak, crash, a secound peak higher, then a bigger crash followed by a war of major scale then a long slow recovery back to inflation, peak and another correction.

Establising constant rules, like the constitution is designed, is needed to keep people first.  

A world community/world order isn't the inevitible end, it has been a reoccuring theam through the past. It's happening depends on people remaining to be sheep and a correction, depression, war not happening. (This sounds like the one world order it's self.) The crash/correction/war? brings people and values, social and ecconomic, back to reality.

A one world system is only one scenario of many possibilities as written about by Alvin Toffler in his book "Power Shift". An ecconomic crash, world plague, enviormental changes, biological overload a meteor or the standard cycle of history can all bring humans back to reality.

A one world system only involves ecconomic powers. Many of the problems of today are caused by players that will be in the same sphere ecconomically and politically that they are in today even if there is a one world government/economy/what ever. They will cause trouble because they are poor and are driven by thier same aincent beliefs,third world players even if they live in in rich countries.

We will see if we live long enough. My future is behind me. My grandchildren are my concern. eddiegjr

[powderman]

Footbaths for muslims? HEH, sounds like they'd make good urinals. POWDERMAN. 

[Squib]

I agree with the summer/winter up and down seasonal way of things... but no force really wants to step down.  oh sure, there are tea parties and fiscal conservatives.  they're saving money by not pushing for road development, healthcare, even defense while this nation is chewing up soldiers and gear-- but they are putting more money than ever into propaganda and corporatism (bailout/buyout bs)

I don't want to live through a world war (it reads like a real nightmare) so I personally would like to fight off the corrupt and weak- but how too?  What do we actually do about it?  

Powderman- to be pc enough to get away with it you could just drop a urinal cake in there before urinating, or drop the urinal cake in and let someone else actually believe that's what it is and do the dirty for you (don't name me when you get sued though-   )

[Dee]

Squib, eddie's view is pretty accurate, and it will take hardship to wake the "average American" up. When bellies are empty, when gas tanks rattle, when the electricity is off, THEN AND ONLY THEN, will they wake up.

As far as perpetual war, when soldiers quit joining what they know is, nation building campaigns and saying NO, then the power will change hands back to the people. Right now, the people are empowering the powerful. They are WILLINGLY, trading our freedoms off a little at a time, but voting the lessor of. They are not to the point of taking a stand yet, and may never be.
 
I have said this many times. Revolution comes from with in, and cannot be imported. Our government has never figured this out. They are not students of history, but rather grabbers of power.

As far as those whom talk constantly, and incessantly , about killing, it is because they most likely haven't actually seen any killing, and have no plans of doing any. They are perfectly content to beat their chests, give their Tarzan yell of: Kill'em All, and LET YOU DO THE KILLING.  I personally have seen all the dying and killing I want to see, and it would be my last resort. Talk is cheap.

[williamlayton]

Eddie and Dee ar pretty correct.
I disagree with Eddie on one point---that is the scriptures---Is this the time? Imano! But there will come a time.
Dee has a scenario that is pretty popular, and he could be correct.
I think it will take more than one plan though, and it will be pretty complex and require a consorsium of players until there is just one player.
It won't happen overnight, and it is obvious, that most people will be in favor of it--if for no other reason than to stop wars at any cost.
Good conversation on everybodies part.
Blessings

[blind ear]

As Dee said, I see no value in the Muslin religion nor a reaon for it to be allowed to exsist. It will create conflict as long as it exsists. eddiegjr

[Casull]

oh sure, there are tea parties and fiscal conservatives.  they're saving money by not pushing for road development, healthcare, even defense while this nation is chewing up soldiers and gear-- but they are putting more money than ever into propaganda and corporatism (bailout/buyout bs)

Are you really saying that the conservatives are putting money into propaganda and corporatism?  If so, you are way off the mark.

[Squib]

bush put money into bail-outs too, you think obama sat down in the throne, snapped his fingers/did some voodoo, and the bail-out legislation was written and ready to go?  bush did some on the sly, obama and a democratic congress just took it a lot further.... I don't think that the republican party is above corruption (even though I'm a republican).  if you can't look at your neighbors and friends first, you're never going to see all the people ready to stab you in the back

politicians that claim to be conservative don't always inspire such confidence in the voters-- especially the ones that look stuff up.  are you one to fact-check or do you just watch the campaign commercials?  no a conservative wouldn't do it but "conservative"-POLITICIANS will

[Squib]

propaganda has a very negative connotation but it just means influence

manipulation is much the same, it's just influence, but the connotation is almost evil.  there are three types of psychological manipulation: base manipulation (talking to someone to relay information, or to state an opinion), deceit (what you're probably thinking of, lying to pull the strings) and coercion (leverage, black-mail, bullying)

propaganda and manipulationg, we're both doing it, EVERYONE on here is doing it.  if you can't be honest about your own actions, don't complain about the politicians either.  if you cannot give honest critique from an honest viewpoint- you have no credibility. 

[williamlayton]

Squib--you are correct---I call it coffee talk.
It is good conversation and meat to chew on.
Blessings

[Squib]

coffee talk... never heard that one

I tried to get all philosophical on it but that doesn't work when people get emotional... maybe coffee talk won't rouse the emotions???

when someone tries to push an opinion by converting another to that same psychological viewpoint, that's coffee talk... I don't think that's gonna work for me will, I'm analytical and a glutton for punishment    I think you're gonna have to step up to bat for a bit or I'm gonna get people worked up (which won't help us foster awareness)

[williamlayton]

Take your feelings off your sleeve, say what you want to say in the manner you would say it over coffee at the cafe and let it go.
Blessings

[Casull]

bush put money into bail-outs too, you think obama sat down in the throne, snapped his fingers/did some voodoo, and the bail-out legislation was written and ready to go?  bush did some on the sly, obama and a democratic congress just took it a lot further.... I don't think that the republican party is above corruption (even though I'm a republican). 

You didn't (and I certainly didn't) talk about Bush, Obama and a bunch of democrap legislators.  You were referring to conservatives and teabaggers (try to keep your words straight).  Now, did you really mean conservatives?

[Squib]

Casull, everyone uses proganda and manipulation, EVERYONE so I did mean conservatives.  think of it like this; if said person or political party is putting out campaign literature and commercials- then said parties are engaged in propaganda.  propaganda is a means to manipulate- whether or not you agree with the manipulation should be your point of argument, not whether or not it's happening BECAUSE IT IS.

if you really think conservative american politics is perfect (with perfect politicians) then you must be blind to what is happening around you... that's where bush and obama got brought into the conversation, to stress how the dual-party leadership actually did some dirty deals during bush's final days as acting president and lame-duck president too.  money and favors are deep debts that must be paid to EVER get to the federal level in politics.  you're in denial if you can't see that.  I'm not making fun of you casull, I'm telling you to watch your back. 

the main reason obama got exposed so quick is because he has a short history relative to most in washington.  also he didn't act through proxies in the shadows either, he was a "face" for the progressives- their shining star

[Squib]

will,  you mean like I'd talk to a friend.. yeah I probably am getting too worked up (which gets other excitable people going too)

folger's, arabica beans... I'll try it some  

also I do tend to wander some due to punctuation/grammatical errors, so rein me in some on a specific point if I start to drift to another
that's casull or anyone else (dee tries)