Author Topic: Decorated Veteran, 90, Fights to Raise Flag in His Yard (Read 4661 times)

powderman · « **Reply #30 on:** December 07, 2009, 04:13:13 PM »

I read elsewhere that this wonderful vet is being backed by the American legion and several law firms have offered their services for free. I couldn't live in a place like that. I used to live in Lou Ky, hated it there. In Jan of my last year there the city cited me for weeds in the back yard. I called them and told them that I thought even city folks would know what tomato vines and corn stalks looked like, it had been my garden. They dropped the charges. POWDERMAN.

1marty · « **Reply #31 on:** December 07, 2009, 04:25:10 PM »

The full story is that the home owners association permits people to fly the american flag outside their house. Many of the people there do fly the flag. This guy moved in and put up a pole which he knew before he bought in was not permited. He should know that a "good soldier" follows the rules.

myronman3 · « **Reply #32 on:** December 08, 2009, 03:28:33 AM »

um, who are you to make drive by comments about a congressional medal of honor holder? this man is a NATIONAL HERO. that is the problem with this country, there is absolutely no respect.

Questor · « **Reply #33 on:** December 08, 2009, 03:31:58 AM »

If I were king of the housing association, I'd enforce the rules of the association vigorously, but make an exception for a man like that and let him fly his flag. If necessary, I would update the bylaws to specifically name him as the one and only exception so that there would be no legal recourse by others later on to get their own exceptions.

Cabin4 · « **Reply #34 on:** December 08, 2009, 04:06:34 AM »

There is no by-law against flying the flag. The only issue here is the flag pole on his front lawn. Its my understanding that in this case, the by-law against free standing flag poles was in place prior to this vet buying the house. This being the case, I'm confused why anyone would buy a house under these by-laws when your desire is the opposite.

Seems a bit fishy to me.

Questor · « **Reply #35 on:** December 08, 2009, 04:16:15 AM »

Cabin4:

I find it difficult to believe that he bought the house without understanding that he would be very limited in what he can do with the yard. That's something that's made very clear by these types of housing arrangements.

I know people with townhomes, usually older people and single women, or young guys without families. It works for them because they don't have much lawn maintenance. It's kind of like a horizontal condominium.

Cabin4 · « **Reply #36 on:** December 08, 2009, 04:45:48 AM »

For a time I lived in a single family house with a 1/2 acre in PA. It was part of a housing development and we were under a home owners by-law control. Before I purchased the home I was given a copy of the by-laws to read. There many things I noticed that I did not like but was willing to live with. I believed in balance the by-laws protected my home value by providing a consistent environment. We lived in that house from 1997 to 2005. It was new construction that I purchased at the time in 1997. In 2005 when I sold, it was considered one of the nicest neighborhoods in all of that area. My home value more than doubled in those 7 years which outpaced the area. It was a great looking neighborhood, lots of split rail fencing for back yards, lots of mature trees, well maintained homes and yards, great looking tool sheds in back yards. Really a great looking area that tried to maintain a semi rural look with traditional colonial style homes. Great looking common areas for the kids to play baseball, football, etc. Not over done and no yuppie feel/look. Just families trying to ensure their investment in a house paid off. It worked for me even know I did not like some of the by-laws. I did not have to buy there and yes, no flag poles, roof antennas, boat or campers on the front lawn. My goal was to protect my investment and be able to sell quick. It worked. My house sold on the first day at $30k over asking price, more than 2x what I purchased it for 7 years earlier.

My point, don't buy a place that’s under a home owners association if don't want to be told what to do in some areas of your life. In any case, this vet can likely ignore the association and get away with it because of all the hype. But unfortunately, he is in this predicament by his own making.

rex6666 · « **Reply #37 on:** December 08, 2009, 06:27:27 AM »

Their was a simular case a few years ago in FL. i believe, with a retired
Marine DI.
anyone remember what happen their?
It is a poor case of events when some folks think fling the America flag as it
should be flown will hurt their community.

Cabin4 · « **Reply #38 on:** December 08, 2009, 06:45:48 AM »

It amazes me how people love to completly mislead everyone on the issue at hand with this case. There is NO by-law that says he can't fly an American flag. The only by-law that's being violated is the vertical fixed flag pole cemented in his front yard. Many people in this guys neighborhood fly an American flag. They just simply have a flag pole mount affixed to the front of thier house which is acceptabel under the by-laws.

rex6666 · « **Reply #39 on:** December 08, 2009, 07:01:41 AM »

Quote from: Cabin4 on December 08, 2009, 06:45:48 AM

It amazes me how people love to completly mislead everyone on the issue at hand with this case. There is NO by-law that says he can't fly an American flag. The only by-law that's being violated is the vertical fixed flag pole cemented in his front yard. Many people in this guys neighborhood fly an American flag. They just simply have a flag pole mount affixed to the front of thier house which is acceptabel under the by-laws.

I don't know who you are speaking of . I said flying the flag as it SHOULD BE FLOWN. ei not like a winnie the poo flag hanging off your garage, but i forgot
some folks love the by-laws

Cabin4 · « **Reply #40 on:** December 08, 2009, 07:10:47 AM »

Quote from: rex6666 on December 08, 2009, 07:01:41 AM

Quote from: Cabin4 on December 08, 2009, 06:45:48 AM
It amazes me how people love to completly mislead everyone on the issue at hand with this case. There is NO by-law that says he can't fly an American flag. The only by-law that's being violated is the vertical fixed flag pole cemented in his front yard. Many people in this guys neighborhood fly an American flag. They just simply have a flag pole mount affixed to the front of thier house which is acceptabel under the by-laws.

I don't know who you are speaking of . I said flying the flag as it SHOULD BE FLOWN. ei not like a winnie the poo flag hanging off your garage, but i forgot
some folks love the by-laws

You don't have to love the by-laws but you better be willing to read them before you buy the house and you better be willing to live with them if you sign off on them! Otherwise, don't buy the damn house to begin with. This crape about buying the house when the by-law was already in place is allot of whining as I see it. It shows a lack of responsibility to live up to your end of the deal. While I get the point here, I simply don’t have much sympathy for this vet in this circumstance. He agreed to live under the by-laws. So…this is his bed.

beerbelly · « **Reply #41 on:** December 08, 2009, 08:41:12 AM »

As far as I am concerned that CMOH gives him the right to fly his flag any damm where he wants to. The yea hole that thinks he is god because he is president of the association needs his butt kicked!
beerbelly

Redtail1949 · « **Reply #42 on:** December 08, 2009, 09:17:46 AM »

obama white house spokesman robert gibbs chimed in this morning that.... obama saw nothing to be upset about the man should be allowed to fly the flag he earned it.

now do you believe he was sincere or just trying to suggest he was a real american concerned about one of her heros?

I think he is a hippocrite just trying to gain a point or two off the story.

Cabin4 · « **Reply #43 on:** December 08, 2009, 09:59:42 AM »

obama is not even a naturalized American. He was born in Indonesia. Who cares what the liar thinks. I'm sure he chose his words carfully enough to wiggle his way out. I won't wiggle at all on this one. The guy should be made to take down the flag pole if the association so deems and forces him to do it. He will have no legal recourse in this matter if the association sends someone to take the pole down.

myronman3 · « **Reply #44 on:** December 08, 2009, 11:43:05 AM »

now hold on there.....either you believe in law, or you dont. you cant have it both ways. do you have proof that he isnt a citizen? no, you dont.
i think everyone that opposes a c.m.h. holder flying his flag from a FLAGPOLE IN HIS YARD, ought to spend a day or two enduring what said c.m.h. holder has endured. or course, you know that cant happen, so have fun armchair quarterbacking all you want...FROM THE SAFETY AND FREEDOM HE PROVIDED. at his old age, i bet he has more will and honor in his pinky toe than some have their entire lives. people never cease to amaze me; or in this case, i should say "disappoint me".

Cabin4 · « **Reply #45 on:** December 08, 2009, 11:52:28 AM »

Quote from: myronman3 on December 08, 2009, 11:43:05 AM

so have fun armchair quarterbacking all you want...FROM THE SAFETY AND FREEDOM HE PROVIDED. at his old age, i bet he has more will and honor in his pinky toe than some have their entire lives. people never cease to amaze me; or in this case, i should say "disappoint me".

Exactly what "danger" are you referring to?

Since when does historical service to country give you special privilage to go back on your word? He signed an agreement to live under those stupid by-laws. Dosen't a persons word and signature of written agreement mean anything anymore? I suppose if he wanted to default on his home loan you would be okay with that too....Or maybe if he decided to default on a personal agreement between you & him, you would be just fine with that as well. Becasue after all, he served his country so that means his word mean nothing? Is that what I'm to take away from your comments?

teamnelson · « **Reply #46 on:** December 08, 2009, 11:58:32 AM »

On the one side you have those who are upset with a stupid policy, and see his actions as perhaps a form of civil disobedience against an inappropriate restriction placed by an HOA.

On the other side you have those who see it as a matter of abiding to the covenant he knew and agreed to upon entry.

Like two ships passing in the night ... you're not discussing two sides of the same issue. Your discussing two different issues as though they were one, and expecting the other side to see the light.

something as simple as this issue is good way of showing the two different schools of thought prevalent among conservatives, and why this country is going to slide right into 3rd world status.

Redtail1949 · « **Reply #47 on:** December 08, 2009, 12:08:32 PM »

cabin4

you got me confused..first you said for him to ignore the letter now you say he should pay attention..which is it?

think his age might have entered into what he understood about the bylaws.

it doe not matter to me as i firmly feel he earned the right to display the flag on any pole he wants egardlesw of any bylaws or anything else.

as mention earlier we owe him our respect.

Cabin4 · « **Reply #48 on:** December 08, 2009, 12:12:13 PM »

Quote from: TeamNelson on December 08, 2009, 11:58:32 AM

On the one side you have those who are upset with a stupid policy, and see his actions as perhaps a form of civil disobedience against an inappropriate restriction placed by an HOA.

On the other side you have those who see it as a matter of abiding to the covenant he knew and agreed to upon entry.

Like two ships passing in the night ... you're not discussing two sides of the same issue. Your discussing two different issues as though they were one, and expecting the other side to see the light.

something as simple as this issue is good way of showing the two different schools of thought prevalent among conservatives, and why this country is going to slide right into 3rd world status.

This would be a poor form a civil disobedience since he signed a freakin agreement that included a provision prohibiting him from putting up said flag pole!! And, there are no “civil rights” at stake here.

There is no by-law saying he can’t fly the American flag like others here have incorrectly tried to turn this into. A case for civil disobedience could be that the homeowners association revised the by-laws after he purchased the home and after the pole was erected and now they were forcing him to take it down. If this was the case, I would side with the guy. But, it’s not the case.

Some of tried to turn this into an exception because he served his country! I suppose serving your country allows you to violate your own word and written agreement now?? Interesting.

The only ships passing in the night are the poor excuses, poor behavior and people providing poor excuses for not living up to their own agreement.

Cabin4 · « **Reply #49 on:** December 08, 2009, 12:17:53 PM »

Quote from: Redtail1949 on December 08, 2009, 12:08:32 PM

cabin4

you got me confused..first you said for him to ignore the letter now you say he should pay attention..which is it?

think his age might have entered into what he understood about the bylaws.

it doe not matter to me as i firmly feel he earned the right to display the flag on any pole he wants egardlesw of any bylaws or anything else.

as mention earlier we owe him our respect.

If he decides he does not want to live up to the agreement, he could ignore them and they likly will not do much was my point. The later discussion is about the principals of living up to your word/agreement. What the guys does I could care less. What happens in this case I could care less. I'm already conviced he is simply not happy with what he agreed to under the by-laws. Who is right and who is wrong is simple, he is in the wrong.

Redtail1949 · « **Reply #50 on:** December 08, 2009, 12:22:11 PM »

i think it is not just because he served but the recognition of the very exceptional service.

but irregardless of that i believe that display of the american flag on a pole, within reason, should under no other circumstances be against any law or regulation.

proper display of the flag by anyone implies that they love this nation and they more than likely will be a citizen more in tune with whats going on in the government. to me its just that kind od crap that has taken this nation on a downward spiral for at least 35 years. the pledge of allegience out of the school no prayer little by little they have changed our society and not for the better. just my 2 cents

Cabin4 · « **Reply #51 on:** December 08, 2009, 12:32:18 PM »

Again, he can fly his flag if he wants. To show your love for country you do not need a 20 foot flag pole. I fly a flag at my house every day. It hangs on a 45 or so degree upward angle like most people fly a flag at thier home.

His exceptional service to country is just that, eceptional service to country. We can honor him for that but he has no special privilage over you or me for what we agree to live by. Exceptional service to country should never be an excuse for going back on your word. To me, it seems to cheapen the exceptional service to do so.

Datil · « **Reply #52 on:** December 08, 2009, 02:39:50 PM »

W ELL i JUST READ WHERE hoa BACK DOWN He can keep his flag pole and do as he has been doing.

Datil

Carl l. · « **Reply #53 on:** December 08, 2009, 03:16:12 PM »

Yes, it was on Fox new's tonight. I am glad he get's to keep his flagpole. There wasn't anything in the home owner's by-laws about a flag pole. Carl L.

mirage1988 · « **Reply #54 on:** December 08, 2009, 03:18:33 PM »

What has happened to this country when flying the colors has become offensive? If you don't like it- ride your camel back to your homeland! Whatever happened to individualism?

Cabin4 · « **Reply #55 on:** December 08, 2009, 03:20:10 PM »

Quote from: Carl l. on December 08, 2009, 03:16:12 PM

Yes, it was on Fox new's tonight. I am glad he get's to keep his flagpole. There wasn't anything in the home owner's by-laws about a flag pole. Carl L.

Read the article: "The homoeowners' association at Sussex Square community told Barfoot that the freestanding, 21-foot flagpole that he put up in September violates the neighborhood's aesthetic guidelines."

Cabin4 · « **Reply #56 on:** December 08, 2009, 03:22:34 PM »

Quote from: mirage1988 on December 08, 2009, 03:18:33 PM

What has happened to this country when flying the colors has become offensive? If you don't like it- ride your camel back to your homeland! Whatever happened to individualism?

You really need to read the article. There is no issue with flying the flag. Other home owners in the same neighborhood fly the flag. The issue is the 21 foot flag pole he erected in his front yard.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,579147,00.html

billy_56081 · « **Reply #57 on:** December 08, 2009, 03:24:05 PM »

If I were on a jury for someone who beat the snot out of the whiners I'd aquit the person.

mirage1988 · « **Reply #58 on:** December 08, 2009, 03:27:43 PM »

I read the article and it sounds like he was so proud to be an american that he shed his own blood for the right to fly the flag wherever he damm well pleases! Maybe if california had a few more flagpoles in the ground it won't slide into the ocean!

Cabin4 · « **Reply #59 on:** December 08, 2009, 03:49:34 PM »

Quote from: mirage1988 on December 08, 2009, 03:27:43 PM

Maybe if california had a few more flagpoles in the ground it won't slide into the ocean!

Then I would highly encourage californians not to put up flag poles.