Author Topic: armed officer--snowball fight (Read 2561 times)

gypsyman · « **on:** December 22, 2009, 02:33:18 AM »

Anybody else read where a Washington,D.C. police officer had pulled his pistol, when he got out of the car, responding to a massive snowball fight. He's been reprimanded and his badge pulled while an investagation concerning the incident is being held. Not sure how to look at this. In a normal small city, doing something like this would be overboard, in my opinion. But, in Washington,D.C., if I was an officer, I wouldn't get out of the car unless I had my sidearm drawn. And that would be to walk a little old lady across the street. gypsyman

magooch · « **Reply #1 on:** December 22, 2009, 04:33:19 AM »

I don't know how the law is applied to snow ball fights, but I can see no difference between someone throwing a rock, or taking a pot shot at me if I didn't intend to be involved. The officer might have been a little quick to pull his gun, but then we don't know what kind of threat might have been issued. The officer was well within his rights to exit his car and to attempt to restore order to what he probably thought was a melee. He should be given recognition for doing his duty, but his chief has shown that he won't take the heat and stand up for his man.

Redtail1949 · « **Reply #2 on:** December 22, 2009, 05:39:04 AM »

dc is one of the most dangerous cities in the us. once the cop saw it was not a shootout or big time gang fight he should have put his gun away. there are murders and armed robbings/muggings on a regular basis just two blocks from the white house.

torpedoman · « **Reply #3 on:** December 22, 2009, 01:48:28 PM »

If he was in spokane and shot someone throwing a snowball he would have been cleared and the thrower charged with assault on an officer. One cop here shot a guy who slapped him and was running AWAY not a word said.

beerbelly · « **Reply #4 on:** December 22, 2009, 03:02:43 PM »

Just another over bearing thug cop! There's one on ever corner.
Beerbelly

Cabin4 · « **Reply #5 on:** December 22, 2009, 03:25:02 PM »

Picture this: A crowd of people throwing snow balls at each other all in fun. Most of the snow ballers a white and a black detective arrives and draws his gun on them. Why is the press not asking the racial question? Where is the racial outrage from Al Sharp Stick in the eye and the Reverand Jessie Jerkson?

Dee · « **Reply #6 on:** December 22, 2009, 03:28:28 PM »

Quote from: beerbelly on December 22, 2009, 03:02:43 PM

Just another over bearing thug cop! There's one on ever corner.
Beerbelly

That's funny.

Questor · « **Reply #7 on:** December 22, 2009, 03:33:08 PM »

Seems strange. If he was going to use a gun, why not call for reinforcements and get his shotgun instead of the peashooter?

Dee · « **Reply #8 on:** December 22, 2009, 03:36:44 PM »

It is near impossible to cuff a prisoner single handedly while holding a shotgun. Dangerous too. Especially if you lay it down and someone else picks it up. I think I would have sat in the patrol car until backup arrived, unless someone was obviously getting hurt.

Oldshooter · « **Reply #9 on:** December 22, 2009, 03:43:58 PM »

Seems i heard his car was hit by a snowball! then he got out and pulled the heater!

If things were getting outa hand and vandalism was going on I have no problem with it! especially if he was alone. But he may have just let his anger overcome his good sense! wouldnt wanna be in his shoes right now in this "atmosphere", he will take a hit here i think!

pmeisel · « **Reply #10 on:** December 22, 2009, 09:54:22 PM »

the video is on youtube for those who care to look it up.

"Don't bring a gun to a snowball fight" -- that's what the crowd chanted.

Graybeard · « **Reply #11 on:** December 23, 2009, 01:30:49 AM »

Why the hell was he messing with a bunch of kids throwing snowballs to begin with? Isn't that what kids are supposed to do when it snows? We sure did when I was a kid. What possible harm is gonna come of throwing snowballs? Geez what the hell is this country coming to?

Well TM7 your lack of knowledge of the things this site is really about is showing once again. Ya don't shoot a bullet into the air in a city. It has to come down again somewhere and in a city that somewhere might be where someone is standing. Firing a warning shot at kids throwing snowballs should get a cop fired in my opinion. Firing a shot into the air rather than ground in a large city should as well.

magooch · « **Reply #12 on:** December 23, 2009, 03:10:13 AM »

In the video I saw of the incident, the crowd didn't look like kids. In any case, no one has a right to throw snowballs, or anything else at a police car, or any other car. A snowball can put out an eye as easy as a rock. That said, I've participated in my share of snowball fights and some of them were fairly malicious. I think we as kids were pretty lucky that we didn't injure someone; it sure wasn't for lack of trying.

Anyway, I still think the cop was trying to do the right thing and maybe things just got a little heated. In retrospect, he probably should have kept his piece holstered and tried to calm things down the best he could. I think there were some wise asses in the crowd who were looking for trouble. It's quite possible that the intervention might have saved several injuries and possible property damage if the situation were allowed to escalate.

Again, the police chief it seems to me was too quick to throw his officer to the wolves.

Dee · « **Reply #13 on:** December 23, 2009, 04:20:59 AM »

magooch, throwing officers to the wolves is what police chiefs do. I have a few chew marks myself.
The truth of the matter is, we all are arm chair quarterbacking someone whom we know nothing about, and or the circumstances before and during the confrontation.
We can only hope for true justice. I have seen what looked innocent at first appearance, but something entirely different. Such as in this case, was the snowball throwing limited to the willing participants or was anyone walking or driving by fair game, regardless of age, size, or health? Something to think about when passing judgement.
All you say is a possibility.

Cabin4 · « **Reply #14 on:** December 23, 2009, 04:36:53 AM »

kids or nor kids it was a snowball fight all in fun. Yes, the cops personal Hummer he was driving got hit with a snowball(s). Big deal! The guy pulls a gun on a crowd becasue of this, that is stupid at any level. Why would anyone get out of thier car becasue it was hit with a snowball? Stupid, just a stupid cop in this case. Even the other cops that showed up are on tape questioning his actions. There were no threats to him unless you consider a crowd of people throwing snowballs at each other a threat. The guy is just a moron and he put himslef in more danger than any snowball could ever do. Pulling a gun on someone can provoke some serious response.....like getting shot yourself. He's a moron.

Oldshooter · « **Reply #15 on:** December 23, 2009, 04:49:02 AM »

Sadly there was a time when an officers arrival made a difference and people took note and the "throwers" stood back and walked away! Now they(police) incite bad behavior. could it be that the codling of punks on the streets have caused this, I dunno. We have come a long way here in ~~Rome~~ i mean the US. anybody smell anything burning?

Dee · « **Reply #16 on:** December 23, 2009, 04:50:36 AM »

Well, I found the video on youtube. Cabin4! He's a moron.

No guns needed. He should have called for backup and made several arrests for throwing them at cars.
By the way Cabin4, many a windshield has been broke by a snowball, and many a driver temporarily blinded by snowballs on windshields. ALSO! That was a very busy intersection. That is obvious.

gypsyman · « **Reply #17 on:** December 23, 2009, 05:15:36 AM »

I just got thru watching one of the video's. Made a comment about Fox news calling them war protestors. I went thru Fox news archives and couldn't find anything about any one of their reporters saying they were war protestors.Probably just a liberal hack trying to make some of the conservative news look bad. After watching the video, looks like the detective went overboard. I don't think he should lose his job over it, maybe just a good talking to. gypsyman

Graybeard · « **Reply #18 on:** December 23, 2009, 06:46:54 AM »

Well with no link for it I'm sure not going searching for the video. I agree Dan we're all commenting based on limited info. Still until I see evidence to the contrary I feel rather similarly to Cabin4 on this one.

Dunno what snowballs are like where you folks live but I've never yet seen anyone harmed by them here and yeah when I was a kid I was smack in the middle of a pile of snowball fights and loved it and no one ever got hurt. I just can't imagine any snowball I've ever seen thrown harming a car or blinding the driver's vision even momentarily from it but then I've not seen all snowballs just yet in my life.

Skunk · « **Reply #19 on:** December 23, 2009, 08:50:38 AM »

GB, here's the video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uAgQKJuriIo

Edit: I took the video down and replaced it with the link. Had some pretty rough language in it that does not correlate with our G rating.

Sourdough · « **Reply #20 on:** December 23, 2009, 09:09:10 AM »

This was an event that had been planned and advertised on line. Lots of people showed up just for this snowball fight. Kids everywhere throwing snowballs. Then DC cops shows up with a gun?

Snowball fight on the Mall, used to be organized by radio stations in the DC area. They set up a time and location, people showed up. DC Cops made the radio stations quite setting them up, or saying anything about them. So now it's done on the internet.

DalesCarpentry · « **Reply #21 on:** December 23, 2009, 09:10:13 AM »

That cop is a jerk. He is on a power some sort of a power trip. There was no need for him to pull his gun and then push people around. If it had been a regular guy with a consealed weapons permit that regular guy would have gone to jail. Dale

Casull · « **Reply #22 on:** December 23, 2009, 09:18:21 AM »

I'm with GB and Cabin on this one. I've participated in dozens of snowball fights (none in the last thirty years or so) and NEVER saw anyone "lose an eye", NEVER saw a windshield break, NEVER saw a driver get blinded by one, and NEVER saw anyone get hurt (other than a little stinging sensation from someone with a good arm). For Barney Fife to draw his weapon on this occasion seems WAY overboard. If the guy doesn't have the stones to address this situation without going Rambo, maybe he's in the wrong profession.

Graybeard · « **Reply #23 on:** December 23, 2009, 09:57:43 AM »

Link doesn't work so I still haven't seen the video but for now stand by my previous position on it. I have no clue how to get to it from the link since clicking it brings up nothing. I'm just not that familiar with how U-tube works.

Skunk · « **Reply #24 on:** December 23, 2009, 10:03:31 AM »

GB, Try the above link now.

gstewart44 · « **Reply #25 on:** December 23, 2009, 10:51:21 AM »

While I agree wholeheartedly that the cop in this case was an overreacting jerk, like Dee described I have seen windshields cracked and two kids injured with a snowball fight up in Vermont about 20 yrs ago...... Seems the kids were prankstering with cars from an overpass. They had made a bunch of snowballs ahead of time and were tossing them at oncoming cars. One of the balls had iced up and was in fact an ice ball....cracked the windshield on the passenger side.

The injured kids were having a snowball fight on one of the ski slopes and again the snowballs turned into iceballs - one kids got a 1"gash on his forehead....turned the snow a disgusting splotchy pink, the other kid took one to the eye and ended up with a big shiner.

Graybeard · « **Reply #26 on:** December 23, 2009, 11:16:22 AM »

Finally got to see it but clicking didn't work. I dropped the URL into an existing open window and got to see it. The kids were mostly if not all just teens having fun in the snow in a totally innocent manner in my opinion after watching it until the cop pulled a gun and started getting in their face and pushing them around. He was grossly out of line more especially so off duty and in his personal vehicle. He should be fired and would be if I were his supervisor.

He isn't likely to win the civil lawsuit he will get almost for certain over it so if he doesn't get the proper punishment on the job I'll bet he does in court. Folks like him are why cops are looked down on so much today as opposed to the way they were looked up to when I was the age of those boys and girls.

williamlayton · « **Reply #27 on:** December 24, 2009, 03:38:36 AM »

Here is my take on it.
It was on a public street and it included people in the street with traffic.
It did include throwing of snowballs at cars.
It did include throwing of snowballs indiscrimately at people and cars who may not have wanted to be involved.
It did include people NOT obeying a lawful order.
It did include argueing with a policeman and disobeying a lawful order.
It did involve name calling and heckling while officers were trying to gain control of a crowd that was acting innapropiately in public and endangering property and person.
IF--and it didn't--it was in a park, and not on a busy street that was dangerous from the snow, much less from being whacked by a snowball and loosing control of a vehicle--it may have been OK.
I think the officer/officers was/were correct to try and gain control of a very possible dangerous situation.
Those kids were not thinking very well and reacting in a uncontrolled manner.
The gun out was not a big deal. His arresting of one of the crowd was understandable under the circumstances.
OR
I disagree that it was just a casual snowball fight.
Blessings

magooch · « **Reply #28 on:** December 24, 2009, 04:14:42 AM »

Some people think it is funny and acceptable to throw things at people minding their own business riding a bicycle. It ain't funny when you are the target and I doubt that it is legal whether it is a coke bottle, a rock, or even a snowball.

As to the case in question, when the first snowball was thrown at an innocent passerby, or vehicle, the nature of the thing changed. When the police officer arrived and let it be known what he was, the nature of the thing changed. The officer might have been a little quick on the draw, but that doesn't give the crowd the right to give him a hard time.

As I stated before, when I was a kid, we used to do things with snow that would curl your toes and we got away with it, but we knew very well that if we got caught our butts would be in a sling for a long time. We were just lucky that no one to my knowledge ever suffered a lasting injury. It was all fun and a lot of giggles, but it was and is illegal to assault anyone who is an unwilling participant.

Dee · « **Reply #29 on:** December 24, 2009, 04:50:14 AM »

Quote from: magooch on December 24, 2009, 04:14:42 AM

Some people think it is funny and acceptable to throw things at people minding their own business riding a bicycle. It ain't funny when you are the target and I doubt that it is legal whether it is a coke bottle, a rock, or even a snowball.

As to the case in question, when the first snowball was thrown at an innocent passerby, or vehicle, the nature of the thing changed. When the police officer arrived and let it be known what he was, the nature of the thing changed. The officer might have been a little quick on the draw, but that doesn't give the crowd the right to give him a hard time.

As I stated before, when I was a kid, we used to do things with snow that would curl your toes and we got away with it, but we knew very well that if we got caught our butts would be in a sling for a long time. We were just lucky that no one to my knowledge ever suffered a lasting injury. It was all fun and a lot of giggles, but it was and is illegal to assault anyone who is an unwilling participant.

YEP!
And for those skeptical about snowballs blinding a driver in traffic? Next time it snows get in the street and let several folks throw snowballs at your windshield and see if you can see well enough to drive. This is common sense that you can't..