Cannon in St. Osyth UK restored

[cannonmn]

Almost makes me wanna scream, you see a modest-income parish like this taking great care to restore what must have been a rusty hitching post, then you think about them b_____ds down in the Washington Navy Yard, laughing at my letters and letting multi-million dollar national treasures dissolve into the dirt.  They want to p__ss me off all the more by strictly forbidding anyone to help take care of the things.  Criminal negligence, no question about it.  I don't see how they've gotten away with it this long, and I'll keep up whatever pressure I can bring on them in various ways.  I did get a media inquiry which I answered with facts and photos, and we should hear something about that before too long.

AAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHGH!

There I got my scream out.  Thanks, feel better now.

http://www.stosyth.gov.uk/default.asp?calltype=historiccannon

[Soot]

Criminal negligence, no question about it.

The National Historic Preservation Act (16 U.S.C. 470 as amended). Sections 110(a)(1) and (d) of the Act require that Federal agencies assume responsibility for the preservation of their historic properties, and carry out programs which further the purposes of this Act.

[GGaskill]

But who is going to bring the prosecutor's hand down upon the malefactors?  The same government that they are part of?  Not likely.

Besides, they can always claim "No budget."

[Soot]

My s.w.a.g. on the whole thing is like this. Sending letters to the Naval yard is not the way to make things happen, you need to talk to somebody who already does historic preservation and knows how get things started. Start by researching these links to National Historic Preservation groups that can take action.
Preservation Action
Advisory Council on Historic Preservation
Heritage Preservation
AASLH
National Trust for Historic Preservation
Legacy Resource Management Program
Preserve America
Federal Save America’s Treasures program
CACI
Save Our History
More Links
The first is a non-profit group that might be a good bet, most of the rest are government agencies.
Maybe start your own non-profit group and apply for a grant.
The District of Columbia has a State Historic Preservation Officer found here. Website is <a href="http://planning.dc.gov/planning/site/default.asp>here.[/url]
 

[cannonmn]

Thanks, I've been told that on this board before but I worked for the Navy, I have a pretty good idea of how they work, and how good they are at getting around all the tree-hugger kinda bureaucracies.  That's why in my opinion I can't waste one minute doing things I know will have no impact whatsoever.  If someone else has any hope that these agencies can even get the Navy to answer the phone, please be my guest, and get them spun up on this thing.  I simply can't go there, because, again, I know how the Navy does things and how they avoid doing what they don't want to do. 

The ONLY things they will comply with are things that will get Congress P.O.'s, which will hurt the Navy's annual budget.  The other things are regulatory matters that have enough teeth to put individual employees in jail, such as some portions of the Environmental Protection Act, and Equal Opportunity, stuff like that.  Look at it this way, if the Navy sweats some new regulation, they have a course developed to train their employees in it, and have that class taught at all Navy activities.  Such classes which I took for those reasons include Sexual Harassment, Environmantal Protection, Ethics (not taking bribes from contractors etc.), Information Security, Equal Opportunity, and maybe a few others.  Many of those resulted from major disasters like the Walker spy case.  The courses I mentioned were not voluntary, you attended and passed or you could be fired.

The Navy does not require its employees to take a course in historic preservation (except perhaps some museum folks.)  If there isn't a required course, the message is that you don't sweat it.

I don't know how I could make this any clearer, I worked for the Navy for 34 years before retiring in 2003.

[gulfcoastblackpowder]

What are the best steps the Navy could do to prevent further deterioration?  Do they all involve moving the guns into a controlled climate environment?  If not, I propose we sneak up to the guns and do a little "inverse vandalism".

Really, I'm curious about the answer to the first question.  Almost every type of preservation technique I can think of has it's own drawbacks, either by removing the item from it's display location, enshrouding it in some sort of protective case, coating it with something to reduce the effects of the weather, etc.  Some of these (like perhaps painting a barrel) would provide a display indicative of the way the item was originally, but it would do so at the sacrifice of the patina/wear that reveals it's history or the accessibility of the item. 

It seems to me that everything ages, and there is no hope of preserving anything forever, but I do think if there are ways of trying to prolong the degredation as long as possible that don't sacrifice an object's history or accessibility, they should be implemented if they don't have exhorbitant cost.

[Soot]

Several years back they preserved 1 gun. All it would take is 2 people with a truck and a hoist, a pressure washer, media blaster, a can of wax and a place to do it.
[img width= height=]http://www.history.navy.mil/cannons/No.08_01t.jpg[/img]
Like this

[GGaskill]

All it would take is 2 people with a truck and a hoist, a pressure washer, media blaster, a can of wax and a place to do it.

Yeah, but in Washington, D.C., that would cost $200,000 per year for the employees and $50,000 for the truck if they worked for the government and twice that if they were contractors.  And they would be permanent positions since the wax would have to be renewed every year.

[gulfcoastblackpowder]

All right.  Lets "acquire" a water truck, a bucket of walnuts, and a tub of wax, and go visit DC...

Considering the number of cannon that needs to be done, I agree that it would be a full time annual job for a few people and that they'd require a truck for it.  I'm not sure of the guesses on cost, but I'd say at least 3 people, so one could supervise the work of the other 2.

Edit: If it only cost $250k annually, I'd think it would be worth it to have a team that does all the cannon and sculpture in DC.

[cannonmn]

Here's the letter I sent to Gettysburg, at their invitation.  It has some of the answers to questions above.  IMHO ordinary paint is the answer, whatever color you want, including clear if you like.   It can last easily 20 years, like the Rustroleum-primed and painted one I've kept outside for that long.

17 December 2009
Gettysburg National Military Park
1195 Baltimore Pike, Suite 100
Gettysburg, PA 17325
Attn:  XXX

Dear XXX,
I’m a member of the Company of Military Historians and an artillery enthusiast.  Over the past few years I’ve studied the problem of the corrosion in bronze cannon displayed outdoors.  On a recent trip to Gettysburg I studied and photographed three 12-pounder Napoleons at the monument to the Third US Artillery, Batteries F and K, along Emmitsburg Road.  What struck me was the fact that the markings on the muzzle faces were growing faint, obviously due to acid-rain etching and acidic bird droppings.  I posted over 20 photographs in a slideshow on the Company of Military Historians Forum on 12 December 2009, and asked what should be done.  Mr. ZZZ, an NPS employee and Company member, suggested I write to you about this issue.

I’ve noticed that ordinary paint protects bronze from the outdoor environment.  Colored or clear coatings can be used so the “natural” or existing appearance of the bronze can be preserved as desired. I’ve studied and photographed a number of cannons, both painted and unpainted, at the Washington Navy Yard and Fort Leslie J. McNair, both in Washington DC, and have arrived at the conclusion that ordinary paint provides excellent, durable protection for bronze cannons.  One requirement for such a paint or coating is that it be easily removable, in keeping with the general rules for conservation, so epoxy paints should be avoided.  

I know you have a program to clean and wax the bronze plaques in the Park, and I saw the results on the plaque near the cannons.  Some would suggest extending the same treatment to the bronze cannons.  While that would be better than nothing, my concern with the technique is that it doesn’t give long-lasting protection.  Treating all of the bronze cannons in that way with the frequency required would be costly.

I suggest you include bronze cannon surface protection in your maintenance plan so the important markings on you bronze cannons are not lost to the elements over time.  Please let me know what you think of my assessment, and whether you feel you will be able to implement some type of bronze cannon surface protection into your maintenance plan.  

If funds aren’t available to include this in your regular maintenance plan, I can organize a volunteer effort to clean and protect at least the marked areas of the bronze cannons, if you have a means to allow volunteers to help.   With your permission and approval of my proposed process and materials, I’ll perform a trial cleaning and conservation of a bronze cannon, at no cost to the government.   I lack credentials as a conservator, so if required I’d be happy to work under the direction of a conservator of your choice.
 
Sincerely,

YYY