Searching for "The" elk rifle.... opinions...?

[tdn]

So, I have recently decided that Colorado will be home for at least the next few years, and that means that Elk are now a permanent fixture in hunting season. I was able to my trusty .308 win to get a nice bull this past year, but am now looking for an elk (any maybe other big stuff) rifle.  I'll always have my .308s for deer and backups (and just all-around hunting) but am looking for something with a bit more power and/or range.
Something in stainless steel, relatively light weight, good recoil pad, nice stock (laminate or nice synthetic (not cheap injection molded)).

I really like Remington's 700 Alaskan Ti, but the price is about double my budget.
Leading candidates now are:

Rem 700 SPS Stainless (300WSM), and to get a Bell+Carl. ultralight medalist black web stock, flute the barrel, total: $1000-ish
Kimber Montana or Stainless w/ wood (338 Fed. or 300 WSM): $1100 ish
Ruger Hawkeye All-weather 388 Federal: $650 ish

I am open to other suggestions, rifle and caliber-wise.
I like the idea of  300 WSM balistically and power and bullet selection (especially already reloading the .308)
I also am intrigued by the 338 Fed., I like short actions and barrels, it doesn't have the range of the 3wsm, but I am not looking to take much over 300yards either.

Having shot some friends rifles, recoil on the 300 wsm is about the max I would like. So, I am looking for a long-term reliable rifle and cartridge to compliment my .308 win.

Any thoughts would be much appreciated.
Thanks

[Graybeard]

A few years back I picked up a Remington 700 LSS with the gray laminated stock I love so well with a really thick soft pad. Metal is stainless. My plan at the time was to rechamber or rebarrel to either .35 Whelen or better yet 9,3x62 for just what you are talking of. It's now .30-06 and since it's unlikely I'll ever make an elk hunt it likely will stay a .30-06.

The same exact rifle was also made in both 7 mm Remington Magnum and .300 Winchester Magnum as I've seen and held them. I'm not a magnum kinda guy so I passed on both.

I'm of the opinion going to a .35 or 9,3 is a better plan than pushing a smaller bullet faster. For a pure elk rifle tho a .338 Win Mag makes some sense.

[kynardsj]

I'm kind of old school and would say a 300 Winchester Mag would do the job. Power and distance. An old Lyman reloading manual I used years ago says the 300 Win Mag is the closest thing on earth to a thunderbolt. I can't think of anything on this continent that I would be afraid to hunt with it.

[Arizona Jake]

tdn,

While you don't like rifles with injection molded stocks - I know... they look cheesy, etc. I own a Winchester model 70 stainless (BOSS) in .338 Winchester Magnum and absolutely love the way it puts things down.

While I have yet to kill a bull elk with it (you will have an easier time winning the Powerball Lotto in AZ than getting drawn for early rifle elk- had to do it with archery gear), I have killed a black bear, a zebra, a black wildebeest, and a nyala with it. All have been 1-shot kills. It is one of 2 rifles I promised my self I will never get rid-of. The Win. M-70 stainless rifles are not very heavy and with the BOSS, my rifle kicks less than a 30-06 without a muzzle brake. On the bad side, it is REALLY loud.

Just my $0.02-worth.

[One Eye]

tdn,

While you don't like rifles with injection molded stocks - I know... they look cheesy, etc. I own a Winchester model 70 stainless (BOSS) in .338 Winchester Magnum and absolutely love the way it puts things down.

While I have yet to kill a bull elk with it (you will have an easier time winning the Powerball Lotto in AZ than getting drawn for early rifle elk- had to do it with archery gear), I have killed a black bear, a zebra, a black wildebeest, and a nyala with it. All have been 1-shot kills. It is one of 2 rifles I promised my self I will never get rid-of. The Win. M-70 stainless rifles are not very heavy and with the BOSS, my rifle kicks less than a 30-06 without a muzzle brake. On the bad side, it is REALLY loud.

Just my $0.02-worth.

I have the same rifle in 300 Winchester Mag.  I agree with all of the above, except the weight on my is HEAVY!  It is a great beanfield rifle and hits hard at incredible distances.  With that said, I would not lug that thing around in the mountains.

Of those you listed, I would buy the Ruger Hawkeye, but I would not choose the plastic stock or stainless metal.  Again, just personal preference.  With all of this said, I would have no problem using you .308 for anything in CO.

Good luck in your search.
Dan

[cwlongshot]

How are you hunting them? Timber, open spaces, long range, close range?

The 308 you already own is a fine elk rifle if you pick and keep your shots inside 300 yards. The plus side is you already own it, wont cost you a penny this way. You know how it shoots. Your familiar with all aspects of the firearm.

If its just an excuse for another firearm. (I COMPLETELY UNDERSTAND) then personally I would look for more gun. Because as already established, the 308 will do the job. Its been said the the 8MM Rem mag was the perfect elk caliber. This one is not readily available. Also we need to establish the kind of hunting your looking at. In the timber that big mag is troublesome with its mag length barrel and cumbersome weight. A big bore lever really shines here as does the bigger eastern deer calibers. In the middle range wise is where the vast majority of good calibers reign. Your afore mentioned 308 is a great choice. Also the 30-06, 7MM mag, my personal choice 35 Whelen, your choice of the various magnum 300's. Then we step into the long range category. This is where the big magnums come into play as they offer a larger margin for error in bullet placement. IMHO the 300's make the bottom of this list, mostly cause bullets over 200 begin to tax them. (Remember I belong to the heavy for caliber bullet club.)The 338 and 340 Weatherby are good choices. The 8MM rem mag if you can find one. Don't under estimate the grand old 375 H&H, its got a trajectory better then the 30-06 and packs a real wallop on wapiti.

Good luck,
 CW

[tdn]

Thanks for everything thus far guys - it's not that I really doubt the .308, I know that I'll tote that again on elk hunts as well, but kinda got the itch and would like to fill the gaps in my rifle battery.

I think I am looking for the catch all elk rifle.
I have a Win. M70 7mm RM 26"  for the long, open stuff, and not a lot of hiking, and use my handy Ruger RSI International .308, 18.5" for the timber. Marlin XS7 .308 for all around, and  1895GS, 45/70 for the big bruisers/bruins/brush.

So, in all actuality there is no real "need" but something elk and mountain specific seems to fit the order. Hence my thoughts on 338 Fed. or 300wsm.

Still thinking and saving....   

[beadlescomb]

i would also look at the tikka line of rifles i know the magazine feels cheap but they are great rifles

[cwlongshot]

WELL, that changes things!!

Personally, I now feel even stronger in my argument for bigger then a 300 mag. Along with your 308, you have a 7MM mag. There is a ton of overlap here.

The 338WM is a good choice if big recoil is a concern. If not the 340 Weatherby is a good choice. I'm a bigger fan of a 35 than a 33, but there isn't a readily available 35mag. the 358 STW is a good choice, but again, it a custom chambering. If your really satisfied with the 7MM for longer ranges, than my favorite 35 Whelen again becomes a good choice...

CW

[Foggy]

I'am with  C W  a good 35Whelen, Mine's a Remington 700Classic with a 4X Leupold. Your 308win will do the job.  I've been blessed and never suffered from a Magnumitis Wel ther is that 375 H&H Dream I have. just use the KISS method and you will do well. Wa\hat ever rifle you get  shaot it as much as you can. And not just from the bench.

[lgm270]

The .338 Win Mag is absolutely  the top notch elk rifle.  With 250 Grain Nosler Partitions at 2650-2800 fps, it is effective from any angle on just about any shot.  

I have read that the 225 Grain Barnes TSX is superior to the heavier partition bullets, but Barnes X bullets produce shotgun patters in my .338 and I was never able to use them.  Nosler  Partitions have always worked for me and the .338 was no exception.  

I've also used the .300 Win Mag with 200 grain Nosler Partitions, but the .338 Win is superior.

Of course every one will write about how their great grandfather shot elk with a .250-2000, blah, blah blah.  Today's hunting is different. Few animals and longer more difficult shots.  I also am impressed with the .35 Whelen and to a lesser extent the 338-06.  

If you're meat hunting for cows, it's one thing. But if you're trophy hunting and your shot of a lifetime is a quartering shot at 300 yards, the .338  Win Mag is the thing in my view.  If you can handle the recoil of the 8mm Rem Mag, the .340 Wby or the 338 RUM, so much the better, but the pounding from the   .338 win mag is enough for me.  

[Wyo. Coyote Hunter]

  Much of my elk hunting is in very open country...Of the 40 or so I have shot, most have been killed with the .300 win. mag.. but I have used the 7mm Rem. Mag., 7mm Wea. Mag. .300 Wea., 338 Win., and 340 Wea. All are elk killers delux.. A govt. trapper that does a lot of guiding in open canyon country likes a .300 win. He sees many elk killed compared to our experience... The .300 WSM is ok. But you cannot drive the very heavy bullets as fast with it...My old .300 will kick along a 200 grain Nosler Part. at just under 3000 fps. The recoil is manageable..My rifle is fairly heavy. I have no use for feather weight rifles.. While many like the 33's, so far I have not been able to see they drop elk one bit faster than the .300's, and the.300's do it with a less recoil if that is a problem..I would look at one of the grey laminated 700's Graybeard likes in .300 Win. / a 26 inch barrel..You have close range guns...So this would be a open country elk rifle I would guess. The other thing I would use a good premium bullet..I like Nosler Part. but others work.  For the last few years I have not used them due to a unique elk spot I have been able to hunt, but for normal elk hunting they are the ticket...If I were going up from the 300's I would step to the .375 H & H. I have one, but the open country has not made it a top selection for me...

[beadlescomb]

i saw an article about a guy using a  416 rigby for elk thats where my moneys at got a 416 barrel for my tc encore still havent shot it had to order ammo man are you talking about expensive but we are planning a do it yourself elk hunt next year and thats what i plan on taking

[Skunk]

I'am with [the rottweiler dude,] a good 35Whelen, Mine's a Remington 700Classic with a 4X Leupold.

I'm with Foggy, a good 35 Whelen. Mines a Remington 700 CDL with a 3 x 9 Burris.

[tdn]

...should have mentioned that I am not all that tied to the 7mmRM,  I'd be very ok with letting it go to finance the new rifle if need be.
yes, there is a lot of over-lap with the .308 and 7mm but they serve different purposes for at this time.
thanks again.

[Swampman]

Remington 700 Boone & Crockett or CDL in .30-06.

[bearman49709]

Browning X Bolt SS with dura touch stock don't have that cheep feeling. Avalible in short action, all the wsm are chambered in it as are many other cal's.I bought one last week in .308Win for $870.00

[roper]

About 5yrs ago what Co did was split out the deer season before if you want to hunt deer you had to do it in the same season as elk.  Since I like to hunt deer I always hunted those combination seasons so I never did have a elk only rifle the 300mag/300Wby/30-338mag all worked later I added a 300RUM/300WSM when they split out the deer season I added the 270WSM/270 and 30-06. 

When I first moved to Co in the 70's we only had two season and the unit I hunted in you could take a buck the first 5 day of the 9 day elk season other units had the deer season starting 5 days before elk season.

When my nephew from Calif decide to start hunting here I gave him a 300mag and he done pretty good on bulls here with that rifle.  I like the 300WSM but mine is a custom otherwise I won't be shooting one hard to beat the 30mag/300Wby.

[One Eye]

Now that we see your current "battery", I would go for the 375 H&H.  I would look at a CZ in this caliber.
Dan

[Coyote Hunter]

...
I really like Remington's 700 Alaskan Ti, but the price is about double my budget.
Leading candidates now are:

Rem 700 SPS Stainless (300WSM), and to get a Bell+Carl. ultralight medalist black web stock, flute the barrel, total: $1000-ish
Kimber Montana or Stainless w/ wood (338 Fed. or 300 WSM): $1100 ish
Ruger Hawkeye All-weather 388 Federal: $650 ish

I am open to other suggestions, rifle and caliber-wise.
I like the idea of  300 WSM balistically and power and bullet selection (especially already reloading the .308)
I also am intrigued by the 338 Fed., I like short actions and barrels, it doesn't have the range of the 3wsm, but I am not looking to take much over 300yards either.

Having shot some friends rifles, recoil on the 300 wsm is about the max I would like. So, I am looking for a long-term reliable rifle and cartridge to compliment my .308 win.
...

I have a Win. M70 7mm RM 26"  for the long, open stuff, and not a lot of hiking, and use my handy Ruger RSI International .308, 18.5" for the timber. Marlin XS7 .308 for all around, and  1895GS, 45/70 for the big bruisers/bruins/brush.

So, in all actuality there is no real "need" but something elk and mountain specific seems to fit the order. Hence my thoughts on 338 Fed. or 300wsm.

tdn –

As far as I’m concerned, you don’t gain much by going from a .308 Win to a .338 Federal – except a new rifle which is always OK.  Both are very acceptable 300 yard elk cartridges.  I’d use my .308 Win at 400 without concern.

I’ve been busting elk with my 7mm RM with boring reliability and dependability since 1982.  The only thing wrong with yours is the barrel is 2” too long for my taste, but having it lopped off and recrowned would be a darn sight cheaper than a new rifle.  With the right loads the 7mm RM is good to 600 yards.  These days I alternate between my 7mm RM and .300 WM when I am planning hunts where shot opportunities will be longish.

Half of my rifles were “gently used” when I got them.  You would never guess which were used or new by their accuracy or looks.  As a result I’m a big fan of used firearms, which can save a lot of money.  A good used rifle and a Burris Fullfield II 3-9x with Ballistic Plex reticle (~$150 on ebay for new) will set you back about $600.  The current economy has a lot of people hurting so you can pick up some bargains and help people uot in the process.  If you haven’t looked into the used market I suggest you do so.

Good luck!

[dukkillr]

tdn,

While you don't like rifles with injection molded stocks - I know... they look cheesy, etc. I own a Winchester model 70 stainless (BOSS) in .338 Winchester Magnum and absolutely love the way it puts things down.

While I have yet to kill a bull elk with it (you will have an easier time winning the Powerball Lotto in AZ than getting drawn for early rifle elk- had to do it with archery gear), I have killed a black bear, a zebra, a black wildebeest, and a nyala with it. All have been 1-shot kills. It is one of 2 rifles I promised my self I will never get rid-of. The Win. M-70 stainless rifles are not very heavy and with the BOSS, my rifle kicks less than a 30-06 without a muzzle brake. On the bad side, it is REALLY loud.

Just my $0.02-worth.

I have the same rifle in 300 Winchester Mag.  I agree with all of the above, except the weight on my is HEAVY!  It is a great beanfield rifle and hits hard at incredible distances.  With that said, I would not lug that thing around in the mountains.

Of those you listed, I would buy the Ruger Hawkeye, but I would not choose the plastic stock or stainless metal.  Again, just personal preference.  With all of this said, I would have no problem using you .308 for anything in CO.

Good luck in your search.
Dan

Here is the third bull I've killed with this rifle in 300 Win Mag.  It's not prohibitively heavy if you're in elk hunting shape... I like the rifle because it's a proven killer, reasonable recoil, easy to find ammo, and absolutely indestructable.  I took the rifle on a caribou hunt years ago when all it did was rain or snow.  Nice to know that you wont have rust on your barrel when you finally get to dry out.  

I used to believe the Kimber Montanas would be the best elk rifle due to the light weight, now that i've shot plenty of light rifles I realize the value of an extra bit of weight and a better barrel.

[jcn59]

My .35 Whelen gets heavier every year but it clobbers them well in the doghair we hunt.  I got an awakening this year when my grandson clobbered the bejabbers out of a 600# cow with a .270 Win. loaded with failsafes.  It thoroughly discombooberated her.  Next year I'll carry my .300 WSM Browning Micro-Hunter.  It has a barrel around 22" & weighs somewhere around 7# loaded.  I'm only 5'8" X 185# and the gun fits me well.

I'll probably use Woodleigh 180 bonded bullets or Barnes bullets.

[Oldshooter]

thoroughly discombooberated

One i'll have to remember! 

[tdn]

Nice elk! and thanks for the continued insight.

In taking another look in the safe and thinking a bit, I am planning to sell the 7mm RM (PM me if interested in a nice M70) and probably going to go with the 300 WSM (or WIN, we'll see).  Recoil up there on the .338 WM doesn't seem to pleasant for what my purposes are, but sounds like it lays a hurtin'.

Now, I just need to decide on the rifle.  I am not sold on simply buying new, and like the thought of a previously loved rifle (thanks for the reminder Coyote Hunter).

I would like to keep the weight btwn. 7 and 8 lbs. w/ scope and mounts, and now need to decide on the model.  
23' or 24" stainless barrel seems about right with a nice composite/synthetic stock.

Win. 70 Extreme Weather  ?
Rem 700 SPS SS w/ a new stock?
Browning ?  Kimber?

Any thoughts on reliable WSM feeding in any of these?

Thanks a ton-

tdn

[Ultra25-06]

I will also put my opinion in. I live in Idaho so the shots on elk can vary from up close to across the canyon just as in CO. MY wife uses her .308 for every thing from rock chucks to bear and elk. Myself on the other hand, like my toys. When deciding I "needed" a deticated elk rifle to add to the safe I looked at many of the cal. mentioned already compared ballistics, reloading data, etc... The 8mm rem really got my intrest so i shot one, older rem with wood stock (kicks pretty good) IMHO. Tried my buddies 300wsm in a win m70 syn, ok but had a sharp kick (not unpleasent however) Shot ruger 338winmag along with 300win mag in m70, Ill pass on the 338 and the 8mm rem. A guy my wife works with had just purchased a 325wsm and i was able to try that, well that sold me. I then kept my eye open for one and picked up a nib for $450 model in sig. Havent looked back scince extreamly accurate IMHO. Ihave taken to the bench many times and afield many times, to include shooting whistle pigs and rock chucks and cyotes to be accoustmed to field shots. I can not confirm big game performance as I am currently overseas but have no doubt it will fill my "want" for a large game rifle. Uses less powder than the 8mm rem when it comes to reloading. If I had acces to some of my data, target pics, and field pics I would post. Sorry for the long post just thought Id throw out a diffrent option. 

[Brithunter]

Now this may shock some of you but my advice, for what it's worth  , would be to get one of the Remington 700 Classics in either 35 Whelan or 8x57 Mauser both will do the number on large criters like Elk without knocking the snot out of you 

Other than that it would be a nice 9.3x62mm rifle 

I must admit though of the new fangle Short, short magnums, the 325WSM is THE ONLY ONE I would have any interest in at all 

Any of the above would not onyl be happy in the brush but also on longer shots. Have fun deciding 

[wackmaster]

Between my self my boys wife doughter in laws we have shot 60 ish elk. I am a ferm beliver in 338!!!
If I was shoping a factory round it would be hands down 338 wby or 338 rem ultra!!!!!!
UP CLOSE OR FARAWAY THESE TWO WILL GET IT DONE!
SHOOT SHOULDER AND SHUT THEM DOWN!

CHASIN WOUNDED ELK IS BULL SHI-T!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Wyo. Coyote Hunter]

   This morning I made one more trip for elk..we have a late cow season north of town..there is lots of snow, rough country, and many elk...but they are in big herds and difficult to approach...I have seen elk every day, but those close enough to shoot have all been bulls. Tomorrow is the last day in this unit and with the weather change that looks like  might hit this could have been the last day of hunting...I got to the top of the pass this morning, in 4 wheel drive, but the wind was blowing so hard, when I got turned around and headed back out, I just made it though a drift I drove though one time already... Things were getting nasty fast...as I eased back down the mountain, I hoped I would get around the next two drifts ok, Just then I looked to my left and saw 6 bulls standing on a ridge to the south of me...They were in a closed area, but neat to see....I had just decided to get the heck out while I could when I happened to look in my mirror, there were elk in the pass just behind me!!!!!!!!! I got out and got the scope of the .300 Wea. on the first, my heart sank, I knew what was probably coming...A nice six point stood on the sky line...I watched as 33 bull elk crossed the pass into a closed area...Not a single cow in the bunch!!!!But it was a sight worth seeing....I waited a bit more and drove down the road maybe four hundred yards to a wide stop and looked over on the mt...The six bulls that had been with in maybe 375 yards when I first saw them were now tiny specks on the mt. feeding...I would guess they had traveled  two to three miles in snow and fairly rough country...While I watched them feed, soon the other 33 bulls came around the mountian intent on heading to the same area their pals were hanging out...While I did not fire a shot, I couldn't help but marvel at the power, grace, and stamina of the magnificant animals..I guess it made me realize how tough they are...Hit with a small caliber, would certainly cause their death, but for those who plan to hunt the elk, a good stout bullet, and adequate caliber should be required...Elk can be killed on ranches with light weapons, but to these mt. elk, I think one should pack the biggest caliber you can handle...I wondered what would have happened to all the arm chair experts who favor minimum calibers had they been faced with any of these great bulls moving toward safey....As Bob Hagel said, most would try a shot and hope for the best, especially after hunting for 8-10 days..He felt the core of elk rifles were 7mm's up and with premium bullets...Bob's advice should be headed by everyone who hunts elk....They are an awesome animal...

[mcwoodduck]

The 308 is great.
30-06 is not much of a step up.  even a step down if you shoot 165 grain ullets.
the 300 Win or 300 WSM still shoots the same bullets as your 308 Win only 200 - 300 FPS faster.  All it does is extend your range and moves your killing power (carring 2,000 foot pounds of energy) out past the 150 yards of your 308 to 300 yards.  The 7mm Mag is about the same as 30-06 or 300 Win and does not give you that much more over your 308 win.
I am a great fan of the 308 and own three.
When I got an elk rifle it was a 338 Win Mag.  I like mine.  i shoot 225 grain I look at it as not a small step up but a bigger step up from the and moving from 2600 Foot pounds at the muzzel to 3800 foot pounds.  and will carry that magic 2000 foot pounds well past 500 yards.  I like the idea of a large slug that will shoot to 500 yards as well as stay together at 50 with out bone jaring recoil.  I think mine recoils similar to my 30-06 with 180 grain bullets and is confortable from the bench.  My 375 H&H is NOT confortable from the bench and I will only let people shoot it standing.   But not knowing what kind of a shot I would get on an elk 50 to 500 yards I wanted a round that could do it, be easy to find in local stores in Elk country, and would not break the bank for ammo to practice and get good with the rifle.
I once read  something about elk rifles that said the 2,000 foot pounds at the distance is key for elk sized animals and 1,000 foot pounds is key for deer sized animals.  I think it was Craig Boddingtons American hunting rifles.
With that said.  30-40 Krag is still holding the world record elk and 30-40 is very similar to 308.  30-30 win is what killed my friends 5X5 elk in 2005 at under 100 yard and 44 mag that is no where near 1,000 foot pounds at 50 yards with 240 grain bullets, accounts for a number of elk every year out of handguns.
A new Rem 700 XCR or Kimber 8400 montana in 338 WM are on my list to replace the way too pretty Win M70 Classic Super grade I own.

[Wyo. Coyote Hunter]

mc,, I read your post on the 338, while it is ok, and a good round the comments on the 308 puzzle me..How is the 06 a step down from the 308? Given the same bullet wts. and 06 shoots faster, and as for the 300 only being a 200-300 fps faster than a 308 wow!!!!My .300 win. will shoot a 150 at over 3400, a 165 at almost 3400, a 180 at 3200fps, and a 200 at 3000fps..The last time I looked over the 308 it wasn't even close...