Author Topic: Searching for "The" elk rifle.... opinions...? (Read 16762 times)

Redneckguy77 · « **Reply #120 on:** March 18, 2010, 03:26:16 PM »

get a 300 H&H mag or 300 win mag they are both perfect elk rounds i like 300 H&H because there is a little more powder behind it but 300 win mag is just as good.

Wyo. Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #121 on:** March 18, 2010, 04:48:09 PM »

Red, I have them both and the Win. takes more powder than the H & H given the same bullet wt. and powder...but as you said both are perfect....close range or far elk are in big trouble with either one if the shooter can do his part......

tdn · « **Reply #122 on:** March 30, 2010, 04:34:07 PM »

A little update on the elk rifle search...

In doing more thinking and nearly finishing the build on my lightweight M700 '06 and feeling the financial strain a bit... this led me to do some rearranging of the hunting rifle collection.

I sold my XS7 .308 to a good friend.
Traded the 1895G in and got a new 1895GBL 45/70 (love it)
Sold off the 7mm M70 (never used it much anyway)
Sold my Ruger International .308
Traded my M700 '06 project for a Rem. 700 semi custom build in .308win. Wears a Rem Ti stock, SS #1 barrel, trued action, and just had the bold skeletonized and lightweight speedlock pin assembly put in by local smith (Bijou Creek - highly recommended).
I'll have to post a pic as soon as I get one.
But I am now down to 2 CF rifles, in two great cartridges w/ more money in the bank/hunting fund that I had before and I couldn't be happier.
Thanks for all the insight and support.
The ultralight .308 and stubby 45/70 feel like a winning combo for me.

Sweetwater · « **Reply #123 on:** March 30, 2010, 07:46:55 PM »

Sounds like you are making it happen - good for you! I have a pal who used a 308 for eveything from prairie dog to moose, quite effectively!

burntmuch · « **Reply #124 on:** March 30, 2010, 11:07:07 PM »

Ultra light 308 covers a lot of bases. My ultra light is a rem model 7 in 7mm-08. Sounds like you got a plan & will be able to pay for the hunt. Thats half the battle

Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #125 on:** March 31, 2010, 02:54:31 PM »

Quote from: tdn on March 30, 2010, 04:34:07 PM

A little update on the elk rifle search...
...
I sold ...
Traded ...
Sold off...
Sold ...
Traded ...

But I am now down to 2 CF rifles...
The ultralight .308 and stubby 45/70 feel like a winning combo for me.

Damn, I hope whatever you have isn’t catching...

Two great cartridges, though. My .308 is a BDL and a tack driver, a keeper for sure, but I’d be very happy if it was a compact. My 1895 (22” bbl) is way too much fun, too accurate and very effective on elk and deer. It’s a keeper as well.

See your PMs – I responded to your question about a place to shoot. You can always check with the Forest Service and BLM regarding open/restricted areas.

Swampman · « **Reply #126 on:** April 01, 2010, 03:48:57 AM »

Yesterday at Dick's Sporting Goods they had laminated stocked Remington Model 700s with the floorplate like a CDL and a mounted scope for $619.00 in .30-06. Seemed like the perfect elk rifle to me.

mrbigtexan · « **Reply #127 on:** April 01, 2010, 04:22:28 PM »

i am really, really liking my rem. model 7 7mm saum. it is stainless and i beleive it would make a great elk rifle. maybe one of these days!

burntmuch · « **Reply #128 on:** April 02, 2010, 02:20:44 AM »

Quote from: mrbigtexan on April 01, 2010, 04:22:28 PM

i am really, really liking my rem. model 7 7mm saum. it is stainless and i beleive it would make a great elk rifle. maybe one of these days!

Hows the recoil with that light little gun.

Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #129 on:** April 02, 2010, 04:32:03 AM »

Quote from: mrbigtexan on April 01, 2010, 04:22:28 PM

i am really, really liking my rem. model 7 7mm saum. it is stainless and i beleive it would make a great elk rifle. maybe one of these days!

After 28 years of field testing 7mm's against elk, 20 of those using a 7mm RM exclusively, I can attest that a good 7mm bullet launched at SAUM velocities is very effective on elk.

The furthest I've seen one go was one my hunting buddy shot in the neck (against my advice). It went about 100-120 yards. Many have gone straight down or taken only a few steps. A small number have made it as far as 20 yards. The long distance champ for elk shot in the body went 40 yards and it was the champ by a considerable margin.

Cup and core bullets will work but I advise a better bullet. Choose a bullet like a Partition, North Fork, A-Frame, AccuBond, TTSX, MRX, GMX, etc. and you will be good to go from muzzle contact distance to at 500-600 yards if you do your part.

nomosendero · « **Reply #130 on:** April 03, 2010, 05:56:02 AM »

Quote from: tdn on March 30, 2010, 04:34:07 PM

A little update on the elk rifle search...

In doing more thinking and nearly finishing the build on my lightweight M700 '06 and feeling the financial strain a bit... this led me to do some rearranging of the hunting rifle collection.

I sold my XS7 .308 to a good friend.
Traded the 1895G in and got a new 1895GBL 45/70 (love it)
Sold off the 7mm M70 (never used it much anyway)
Sold my Ruger International .308
Traded my M700 '06 project for a Rem. 700 semi custom build in .308win. Wears a Rem Ti stock, SS #1 barrel, trued action, and just had the bold skeletonized and lightweight speedlock pin assembly put in by local smith (Bijou Creek - highly recommended).
I'll have to post a pic as soon as I get one.
But I am now down to 2 CF rifles, in two great cartridges w/ more money in the bank/hunting fund that I had before and I couldn't be happier.
Thanks for all the insight and support.
The ultralight .308 and stubby 45/70 feel like a winning combo for me.

It is good that you made a choice & they will work well at the approprate yardages. I like the 300WM myself, but shot placement with the right bullets is the main thing.

mrbigtexan · « **Reply #131 on:** April 12, 2010, 06:15:40 PM »

Quote from: burntmuch on April 02, 2010, 02:20:44 AM

Quote from: mrbigtexan on April 01, 2010, 04:22:28 PM
i am really, really liking my rem. model 7 7mm saum. it is stainless and i beleive it would make a great elk rifle. maybe one of these days!

Hows the recoil with that light little gun.

it is about the same as my 308, not as much recoil as my old 270

Brithunter · « **Reply #132 on:** April 13, 2010, 12:03:41 AM »

Quote from: mrbigtexan on April 12, 2010, 06:15:40 PM

Quote from: burntmuch on April 02, 2010, 02:20:44 AM
Quote from: mrbigtexan on April 01, 2010, 04:22:28 PM
i am really, really liking my rem. model 7 7mm saum. it is stainless and i beleive it would make a great elk rifle. maybe one of these days!

Hows the recoil with that light little gun.
it is about the same as my 308, not as much recoil as my old 270

Hmmm so what your saying is that your new rifle has a better stock desing than your old .270?

That is unless you have managed to re-write the laws of Physics

mrbigtexan · « **Reply #133 on:** April 13, 2010, 07:15:11 AM »

no physics law here, just noticeable, perceived recoil i guess. but it is alot more pleasureable to shoot then my 270 thats for sure. btw, laws of physics means a 130gr. .270 pill should recoil less than 150gr. 308 pill. explain that professor!

dukkillr · « **Reply #134 on:** April 13, 2010, 07:26:39 AM »

Quote from: mrbigtexan on April 13, 2010, 07:15:11 AM

no physics law here, just noticeable, perceived recoil i guess. but it is alot more pleasureable to shoot then my 270 thats for sure. btw, laws of physics means a 130gr. .270 pill should recoil less than 150gr. 308 pill. explain that professor!

That is NOT what Newton's third law says. Force is not the same as mass.

Dogshooter · « **Reply #135 on:** April 14, 2010, 08:11:12 PM »

I have several elk rifles but I always end up carrying the same one every year to actually hunt with. It is a Kimber 8400 on 300 WSM. It is lightweight so it's nice to carry and I have taken an elk ever year for the last 12 years with it (2 last year) and all were one shot kills. Even in a lightweight rifle the recoil isn't bad and the accuracy is better than in most of my heavier sporters.

Sweetwater · « **Reply #136 on:** April 15, 2010, 09:45:29 AM »

Stock design and fit have a lot to do with perceived recoil (used to be called felt recoil) not to be confused with calculated recoil. Totally different "numbers". My pal says my 8x57Persian Carbine kicks him as much as his 338 Win Mag. I totally disagree, but then again, that Persian Carbine is custom stocked for me and I've been shooting it since 1963. I don't think it kicks at all and his 338 jars me to the bone.

Not sure how Newton would feel about it......

Brithunter · « **Reply #137 on:** April 15, 2010, 01:15:30 PM »

Quote from: Sweetwater on April 15, 2010, 09:45:29 AM

Stock design and fit have a lot to do with perceived recoil (used to be called felt recoil) not to be confused with calculated recoil. Totally different "numbers". My pal says my 8x57Persian Carbine kicks him as much as his 338 Win Mag. I totally disagree, but then again, that Persian Carbine is custom stocked for me and I've been shooting it since 1963. I don't think it kicks at all and his 338 jars me to the bone.

Not sure how Newton would feel about it......

Well said

. This morning at 07:30 I used my 59 vintage BSA Featherweight rifle, scoped weight with sling is 7lbs 11oz, using Federal Fusion 150 grain ammunition to drop a nice 6 pt Roe Buck. I didn't feel the recoil at all and even prone this rifle is very comfortable to shoot

but then it has a good stock design. A lot of the military stocks are actually quite poor in this respect. I find the P-14/ US Model 1917 quite uncomfortable to shoot.

Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #138 on:** April 24, 2010, 06:38:24 AM »

Quote from: mrbigtexan on April 13, 2010, 07:15:11 AM

no physics law here, just noticeable, perceived recoil i guess. but it is alot more pleasureable to shoot then my 270 thats for sure. btw, laws of physics means a 130gr. .270 pill should recoil less than 150gr. 308 pill. explain that professor!

Actually, that is not necessarily the case at all and the “laws of physics” say something entirely different. Bullet weight is only one component of recoil – velocity, powder weight and total firearm weight are the other major components.

Using load data from Hornady’s 7th, (average powder charges per velocity) and “Point Blank” to calculate recoil:

20.40 foot-pounds recoil @ 12.58 fps = .270 Win, 130g, 3200fps, 67.0g powder, 8.3 lb rifle/scope (MAX listed velocity)
18.66 foot-pounds recoil @ 12.03 fps = .270 Win, 130g, 3100fps, 63.0g powder, 8.3 lb rifle/scope
17.48 foot-pounds recoil @ 11.65 fps = .270 Win, 130g, 3000fps, 61.0g powder, 8.3 lb rifle/scope
16.11 foot-pounds recoil @ 11.18 fps = .270 Win, 130g, 2900fps, 58.0g powder, 8.3 lb rifle/scope
15.02 foot-pounds recoil @ 10.80 fps = .270 Win, 130g, 2800fps, 58.0g powder, 8.3 lb rifle/scope

15.45 foot-pounds recoil @ 10.95 fps = .308 Win, 150g, 2800fps, 46.0g powder, 8.3 lb rifle/scope (MAX listed velocity)

As you can see, the .270 Win with a 130g bullet often has considerably more recoil than a .308 Win/150g when using similar weight rifle/scope combinations.

Just one reason why a .308 win/150g is a often good choice for the recoil sensitive.

Swampman · « **Reply #139 on:** April 24, 2010, 05:16:30 PM »

And then there's the .30-06. The .308 & .270 are too light for game larger than deer.

Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #140 on:** April 24, 2010, 07:04:07 PM »

Quote from: Swampman on April 24, 2010, 05:16:30 PM

And then there's the .30-06. The .308 & .270 are too light for game larger than deer.

Last fall I saw a big bull elk, a cow elk and a very nice mulie buck all taken with a .25-06. Two shots on the bull but the second shot was just insurance and not needed. One shot on the cow and mulie.

All shots by a twelve-year old girl. No one told her a .25-06 with 117g bullets wasn't up to the job.

Bought my third .30-06 today, a Ruger MKII stainless/laminate. There is absolutely nothing I would shoot with them that I wouldn't shoot with my .308 Win with equal confidence. Elk and mulies are not hard to kill - the only trick is putting the bullet in the right place. My .257 Roberts would have easily taken every elk I've shot since I got started in 1982. As would a .308 Win, .270 Win, .25-06, 7mm-08 and a bunch of others. You don't need a .30-06 for elk, but they are not bad choices. That said, I much prefer my 7mm RM.

tdn · « **Reply #141 on:** April 30, 2010, 04:40:09 AM »

Congrats on a the new Ruger!

About a week ago got that itch to really go after the "elk rifle" with tax refund in hand.
After more careful research and knowing that I have my great (and very elk capable) .308 in the stable, I decided to go with a 338-06AI.
Its coming in the form of a Rem 700 ADL rebored and done up by Z-Hat. Really looking forward to slinging 200 - 225gr. bullets come this fall. I'll be sure to post some pics when I finish it up in a few weeks.

Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #142 on:** April 30, 2010, 04:32:37 PM »

Quote from: tdn on April 30, 2010, 04:40:09 AM

Congrats on a the new Ruger!

About a week ago got that itch to really go after the "elk rifle" with tax refund in hand.
After more careful research and knowing that I have my great (and very elk capable) .308 in the stable, I decided to go with a 338-06AI.
Its coming in the form of a Rem 700 ADL rebored and done up by Z-Hat. Really looking forward to slinging 200 - 225gr. bullets come this fall. I'll be sure to post some pics when I finish it up in a few weeks.

tdn -

Now that the weather is noce, we need to get together and hit my range. I hope to get out ther the weekend of the 8th-9th. Let me know.

Sweetwater · « **Reply #143 on:** May 01, 2010, 12:39:53 AM »

Quote from: tdn on April 30, 2010, 04:40:09 AM

After more careful research and knowing that I have my great (and very elk capable) .308 in the stable, I decided to go with a 338-06AI.
Its coming in the form of a Rem 700 ADL rebored and done up by Z-Hat. Really looking forward to slinging 200 - 225gr. bullets come this fall. I'll be sure to post some pics when I finish it up in a few weeks.

Great choice! I have a 35Whelen barrel getting screwed into a 1976 Rem 700ADL, which will leave me with a 30-06 barrel in the spare parts bin. Maybe I should have this turned into a "switch-barrel" rifle....always something to think about.

Jeff
NRA Life

diggler1833 · « **Reply #144 on:** May 03, 2010, 03:50:15 AM »

Quote from: Swampman on April 24, 2010, 05:16:30 PM

And then there's the .30-06. The .308 & .270 are too light for game larger than deer.

Once you learn how to shoot accurately it makes up for a little less powder volume/bullet weight. Bullet construction and shot placement will always be > a larger caliber that is on the threshold of being intolerable for the shooter to handle.

Unless of course you were being facetious in your comment.

Sweetwater · « **Reply #145 on:** May 03, 2010, 08:06:04 PM »

Quote from: Swampman on April 24, 2010, 05:16:30 PM

And then there's the .30-06. The .308 & .270 are too light for game larger than deer.

I guess I won't tell my buddy his moose isn't dead and he'll have to take it out of the freezer and put it back on the mountain! Or the multitude of hunters I know who use 270's every season to nicely harvest trophy elk...

These calibers are used too often by too many too successfully to consider them too light for game larger than deer.

Brithunter · « **Reply #146 on:** May 03, 2010, 11:15:22 PM »

Hmmmmm A few years ago we made enquiries about what was required for me to hunt Elk as a friend invited me over to do so. So I spoke with the game department about the Hunter safety certificate that was required and asked about calibres and they mentioned the 270 Winchester as entirely suitable. I then spoke to several outfitters and got the same and nearly all said use what your used to

I mentioned the rifles that I have and their chamberings and NONE said that the .270 Winchester is too small.

Several did say that a 30-06 would probably be better and I did acquire one but then things changed here and I could no longer afford the trip. A funny thing is that I have a sporting rifle in 8mm Mauser and only one said fine use that, most then mentioned the 06

, but none said the .270 Winchester is too small or not suitable

.

anweis · « **Reply #147 on:** May 04, 2010, 02:46:50 AM »

Quote from: Swampman on April 24, 2010, 05:16:30 PM

And then there's the .30-06. The .308 & .270 are too light for game larger than deer.

The 06 is OK, but by far the best for elk is the .30-.35 Whelen, a wildcat made of the .35 Whelen necked down to .30 with the shoulder blown out to 35 deg.

diggler1833 · « **Reply #148 on:** May 04, 2010, 05:37:57 AM »

We'll let that be your little secret.

Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #149 on:** May 07, 2010, 07:15:08 PM »

Here's my latest "Perfect elk rifle", a used Ruger MKII .30-06 I picked up a couple weeks ago. I mounted a Leupold M8 4x I had laying around and will get to shoot it for the first time tomorrow. Bought some Remington 165g Core-Lokt and Winchester 180g Power Points to sight it in with.

If I get time I'll take it down stairs to my man cave and measure the chamber. It it looks OK I have some handloads I use in my other .30-06 rifles (Ruger M77 and Remington M700).