Total noob question

[Yak Angler]

Hi all,

I have extremely limted knowledge when it comes to muzzleloaders but am considering one for next years deer season as I am limited to a shotgun or muzzleloader where I live and I feel modern inlines have a ballistic advantage over shotgun slugs when it comes to long range accuracy and a hunting buddy of mine has a TC Triumph which shoots real nice 100 yard groups with Barnes Expander sabots, not to mention the fun factor of shooting something old school. My question is I know you can buy the sabots by themselves for about 15-20 cents a piece, but can you buy centerfire bullets that a handloader would use to put inside the sabots from say a 45-70 or whatever measures the same outside diameter as the bullets that come inside the factory rounds.I think you could probably go that route for less than 50 cents per bullet if it works. The 20 pack of high end sabot loads in my area goes for about $ 20.00+ . I like to shoot my gun alot and between the sabot loads and power charges i think it costs my buddy about 2 bucks per shot roughly. Just wondering if this is a viable way to save some coin.

Please disregard my ignorance if this has been asked before.

Thanks

[azyogi]

yup I've done that, do that. Don't know about how well they would work in a hunting situation, but for practice go for it.

[simonkenton]

Yes you can buy a box of Hornady 250 XTP. They are in the reloading section at Cabelas.com, they are for the .44 mag.
Then you can contact mmp and get sabots to match.
That is the cheapest way to go, and a well proven and lethal deer load.

[Yak Angler]

Thanks Guys

I figured there had to be a way to save some money over those sabot loads. What i will probably do is measure the outside diameter of one of my buddy's barnes expander bullets and buy some centrefire bullets of the same size to fill the sabot jackets with. if i can get my cost per round down to .50c or so i could live with that and it would be alot cheaper to shoot then a sabot slug shotgun and probably alot more accurate too.

Now it appears i have some reading to do on which entry level gun to buy. I am leaning towards a traditions xlt or entry level TC.

[pozoutdoors]

For sst bullet/sabots you might want to look a sportsmans guide. I bought 10 boxs!!!!!

[mirage1988]

You can buy the hornady ftx 250 grain for 26.99 for fifty, they measure .452 and shoot well with a harvester e-z load (short black) sabot over 100-110 grains blackhorn in my encore. I use the 325 grain ftx .458 dia. with the harvester crush rib sabot over 120 grains blackhorn now, get about 1-2" groups at 100, and hit like a ton and a half of bricks.

[Cheesehead]

I have used .430 cast 240 grain for practice with good results. Very cheap since i cast them myself. TC sabots were used. Also used Remington .429 jacketed 240 hollow points with good accuracy and cheap in bulk, probably work for deer also.

Cheese

[Keith Lewis]

Basically any bullet that has the right diameter for the sabot selected will work just fine. Hand cast bullets from even scrap wheelweight metal will shoot fine in a sabot. I cannot see shooting expensive bullets just to push holes in paper. I use the junk stuff for everything other than final set-up before a hunt.

[DennyRoark]

I don't think the rifle bullets will fly well, they're longer and need a faster twist.  Go with the Hornady FTX and Harvestor or MMP sabots and you'll do well, cheaper.  I target shoot with 240 gr XTP's and Harvestor sabots at less than half price per 100, but hunt with Shockwaves and Jacketed Hydra-cons.

[Yak Angler]

Basically any bullet that has the right diameter for the sabot selected will work just fine. Hand cast bullets from even scrap wheelweight metal will shoot fine in a sabot. I cannot see shooting expensive bullets just to push holes in paper. I use the junk stuff for everything other than final set-up before a hunt.

Thats what i was thinking, if i can shoot targets cheap enough and save the expensive sabots for final set up before hunting. This shooting game is just getting so expensive lately anyway to save money and still get worthwhile practice in is a very good thing IMHO.

[panman]

No matter what you use for target practice,if it shoots real good and is very accurate, use it then for hunting!!.Deer are not hard to kill.What good is a billion dollar bullet,sabot,or whatever,if it dosnt shoot as good as the slugs you pratice with???.Hitting where you aim,is the name of the game.pan.

[wreckhog]

Am going through the same. Now that ml season is done, you can get leftover TC Omegas for relatively little. Just got a used SS one with a Nikon scope for $325. Sabots are 15 cents, primers 4 cents, cast bullets maybe 11 cents, leaving 20 cents for 60 grains by weight (80 grains volume) of loose 777 powder.

[Anonym]

If you want to shoot really cheap, get a sidelock with a slow-twist barrel and shoot patched round ball.  Get 100 balls for $12, use some "pillow ticking" from a fabric store for next to nothing, and get a tin of 100 #11 primers for $6 and go shoot.  Only way to go cheaper is to buy a mould and start casting your own lead. 

Unless you're looking for a 200 yard rifle, they'll do just fine out to 100 yards and put a deer down just fine with good shot placement, and you can't beat how fun they are to shoot.

Otherwise, get yourself a decent inline and some Hornady XTPs.  The Hornady's are fairly cheap and very effective.

By the way, a modern inline muzzleloader is not "old school".     Regardless of what you shoot, just have fun shooting it!

[anweis]

You can get the 50 pcs. packs of Harvester crush rib sabots - excellent stuff, and find some 200-300 grain bullets in the .452 size. They even make sabots for other bullet sizes, down to .357 type.
Hornady 250 grain XTP bullets are accurate and cost $25 per hundred. Sabots cost about $12-14/100.
You can shoot all sorts of lead bullets, some better than others, but for hunting you want a soft lead bullet that expands (hollow point). There are many out there.
TC Cheap Shot bullets + sabots sell in 20 pcs. bags for $8, are accurate, and are soft lead, good for hunting.

[BIG Dog454]

You should be able to get some crush rib sabots for about $12, and then get some cast 45 colt bullets for about $30 for 500, or if you know some one that reloads for the 45 colt or shoots cowboy events get about 50 250 or 255 gr bullets from them.  I found that the XTP's shot from a muzzle loader break apart on deer; lead cast bullets stay together better and expand.  On a deer that I shot that was facing me, the lead bullet entered the chest, took out the heart, lungs liver and ended up under the rear quarter skin expanding to a little over 3/4 inch. on a side shot, the bullet entered the chest area taking out the lungs and left a 1 inch hole on the opposite side.  Lead 250 grain to 300 grain bullets are deadly on deer and they get my vote.

[Yak Angler]

It's definetly nice to see there are several ways of getting around the over priced factory sabot loads, it just takes a bit of trial and error from the sounds of it to get the right bullet/sabot combination for the best performance/price.

I just got a new 1911 pistol in 45 acp and plan on reloading rounds for it so i'm sure i can probably use the same bullets in the muzzleloader with the right sabot to go with them once the time comes.

[Cheesehead]

You should be able to get some crush rib sabots for about $12, and then get some cast 45 colt bullets for about $30 for 500, or if you know some one that reloads for the 45 colt or shoots cowboy events get about 50 250 or 255 gr bullets from them.  I found that the XTP's shot from a muzzle loader break apart on deer; lead cast bullets stay together better and expand.  On a deer that I shot that was facing me, the lead bullet entered the chest, took out the heart, lungs liver and ended up under the rear quarter skin expanding to a little over 3/4 inch. on a side shot, the bullet entered the chest area taking out the lungs and left a 1 inch hole on the opposite side.  Lead 250 grain to 300 grain bullets are deadly on deer and they get my vote.

Are these pure lead bullets?

Cheese

[anweis]

I found that the XTP's shot from a muzzle loader break apart on deer;

They are designed to expand at velocities between 600 and 1700 fps. If you use more than 80 grains of loose powder (about 1700 fps.) it is too much too fast. Slow them down a bit, and will work better.