Author Topic: I can not make up my mind???? (Read 2103 times)

Ethan · « **on:** December 29, 2009, 03:55:40 PM »

I have been saving up my money for a exotic hunt.I can not make up my mind between a Fallow deer or a Wild Hog. I would love to kill a brown Fallow but some guys say it is a gamey taste to it and I want to eat what I kill. A Hog would be nice because I can have a mount and good meat.But I am leaning towards a Brown Fallow because I think I could get the meat to taste better and I would have the Mount to put next to my Euro. mount buck ( My first buck a 4 point).

halfbreed · « **Reply #1 on:** December 29, 2009, 05:09:47 PM »

Ethan, Hunt which ever would make you happier. The fallow is just another deer. The flavor depends much more on where it has been grazing and how well it is cared for after the shot. I use to know a fella that killed a big ole piebald buck, then carried it around in the back of his truck showing it off to everybody till the hide let loose of the hair. Yep the meat spoiled too. a real shame all the way around!
A real good way to deal with "gamey" meat is to put the meat in a cooler with a thick ice water slurry, with about 1/2 cup of apple cider vinegar per gallon of water, then change it out as often as needed till the water stays clear. It is pulling the blood out of the meat.
John

Graybeard · « **Reply #2 on:** December 29, 2009, 06:04:57 PM »

Some body is either pulling your leg or just plain don't know what they are talking about. Fallow and axis meat both are widely sold in restaurants and stores especially in Europe but here as well.

I hate the taste of white tail deer and will not eat it but both fallow and axis meat are great as far as I'm concerned. I'd take it over white tail deer any day. But proper and fast meat care is essential for any meat to taste right.

I like pork and enjoy hunting hogs but for me it would be a no brainer to go after another fallow rather than a hog.

BKS · « **Reply #3 on:** December 30, 2009, 10:27:00 AM »

Fallow deer is um, um good. Pork, especially a boar, can't hold a candle to it, at least in my humble opinion.

drdougrx · « **Reply #4 on:** December 30, 2009, 11:31:10 AM »

Ethan....

I've shot quite a few of each. Most times fallow tastes just wonderful...so doesn't boar. IF a deer or a hog has a poor diet or is rutting or very old, it will taste just aweful...but...you'll generally never know that unless the ranch owner is truthful and tells you how old the animals are.

Having said that...big..as in rack for deer or size for hog generally means mature. That doesn't necessarily mean they won't be good to eat...I only had one hog that was inedible (he was rutting). So...if you are really worried about taste...shoot a small buck or doe fallow or a small (around 100lb) pig.

Now...which one??? Hogs are way cheaper unless you want to shoot a bruiser and are at a preserve. Free range....you kinda take what you can. Fallow does can run $400 and up...just kinda depends on where you are and how many the owner has. Not many free range fallow in the states that I know of. Trophy fallow can run $1,200 right up to 3 or 4k. Not saying it's worth it, it's just the range. A trophy TX fallow will cost you $1,800 -$2,500. Elsewhere...kinda depends...just ask and see if the ranch owner will dicker...anyone can pay full price.

I'd recommend that you shoot hogs first...that'll get your feet wet and allow you to see what's what on that particular ranch. You could shoot a hog and a fallow if you want as well...that's kinda what I do and never really tire of it!!!

May we ask where you are fix'n to do this hunt?

?

Oldshooter · « **Reply #5 on:** December 30, 2009, 11:54:13 AM »

+1 on the fallow deer and Axis deer! I would just as soon have axis as beef(other than a good beef steak)

Where I hunt in West Texas, its a funny thing, one rancher will want to charge $500 for axis doe, and $1000 for a big racked buck. Heres the funny part, I hunt on a ranch where the owner asks that i shoot hogs first then Axis deer due to the fact that they(axis) reproduce quickly and are eating his white tail out of house and home. He makes a good income leasing his place to white tail hunters and wants the axis thinned, but insists on me killing as many hogs as I can!

drdougrx · « **Reply #6 on:** December 30, 2009, 12:46:13 PM »

Old.....You don't live in Texas....you live in Heaven!!!

Oldshooter · « **Reply #7 on:** December 30, 2009, 03:41:46 PM »

I am Blessed!

Ethan · « **Reply #8 on:** December 30, 2009, 05:01:36 PM »

I am hunting at a lodge called Whispering hallows

drdougrx · « **Reply #9 on:** December 31, 2009, 04:41:06 AM »

Hi Ethan,

Typical Pennsi game preserve. I suspect a few hundred acres in size (usually a big preserve will advertize their acrage). Here's my recommendation FWIW:

1. I'd plan on a 2 animal hunt, boar and fallow.
2. The best time for boar is November/December when their coats are at their fullest and their weight is highest. If you want one to mount, I'd say shoot a trpphy sized boar in the mid-200lbs range and you'll get a big mount and remember, all mounted tusks are generally fake as the real ones tend to break after a few years. If he charges based on tusk size and you are not into SCI record book measuring, don't go for it...go for body size for the reason I mentioned.
3. Fallow are in velvet in August and in hard antler in September through March. I'd look and see what he has. He advertizes $750 and up, so I expect a $750 fallow has a poor rack. I'd put more $$ on getting a better fallow rack than into a longer boar tusk for the reasons I mentioned.
3. I'd be very clear with myself and with the preserve about my budget...sometimes..if they know what your budget is they'll let you shoot a better trophy. In this economy, they'd rather take a few hundred less for an animal than have to feed it all winter.

Good luck and let us know what you decide and post pics!!!

Oldshooter · « **Reply #10 on:** December 31, 2009, 04:54:24 AM »

Excellent info Doug, i've never hunted a stocked preserve like that but if it comes up I would have knowledge to deal with the management.

Stuff like this is why i like GBO. Thanks for the post!

drdougrx · « **Reply #11 on:** December 31, 2009, 05:33:25 AM »

Thanks Old. Free range anything is tough where I live unless I can travel. Whitetail up here can be good, but, I don't have the time to spend doing it right and going to western MA and dealing with the orange army is...been there done that...also...I've never been enamoured with long walks or sits in the woods hoping for game to happen by....that's just me. My vacation time is limited and I travel alot so to take another week or two to hunt whitetails is kinda not in the plans. I do periodically go black bear hunting in Maine or Canada..but..again...after the bear is down, there's not much to do, so I head home. Could take 1 night or a week. I've done alot of other hunts in alot of states and Canadian provences and will again as my life settles down...and 2 of our 3 kids are outta College (serious strain on my hunt'n and gun money)!

So...I do the preserve thing because I can go, focus, relax some and get it done fairly quick...3 days or so. I also want to know what I'm dealing with when I see what I see. That's why I became a certified measurer for SCI...so I'd know what I was looking at for the price quoted. A preserve owner hates guys like me. They quote a price, give some BS about trophy size and I pass and tell them, "No thanks...that animal is an SCI Bronze medal at best for Gold medal prices". Had a guy try to charge me $1000 for a sheep that had 22" horns at best...he said the horns had curls...really...don't all sheep have curls!!! I challanged him and told him that I'd make a deal...if that sheep had either horn longer than 24" on either side, I'd pay him double his asking price, if not, I'd get the sheep for free....seemed uninterested in that proposition. My worst sheep has 24" horns and cost a few hundred dollars....he got pi$$ed and told me I wasn't a real hunter...I told him that this wasn't real hunting and this was a business deal. He didn't like that either....tough crap. Some other guy in camp showed us the sheep as we were leaving and was bragging about the price. Seems he got it at a discount, $850.

Preserve hunting is not for everyone...but...for now...it'll do.

Graybeard · « **Reply #12 on:** December 31, 2009, 10:44:53 AM »

Quote

all mounted tusks are generally fake as the real ones tend to break after a few years.

Dunno about that Doug. I've only had one mounted and insisted on the tusks it had not fakes. They are still fine and it's been around 15 years now. I doubt I'll ever have another mounted for me but if Faye ever gets that "big black one" she wants I'll get it mounted for her. I do regret not mounting the "Gray Ghost Whumpus Hog" as it was kinda famous in its day tho I guess by now most have forgotten the story. That was Faye's hunt really not mine but she backed out on hunting that night so I went alone and that's naturally when the big hogs were out.

Still I do agree with your advice most do have fake tusks on their mounts so tusk size is really unimportant and body size is the criteria to judge on. Same on the deer and other animals ya best know what a critter scores roughly on the hoof or they'll give you a run around on price. They will very often try to convince you they are bigger than they really are. An $850 fallow these days is unlikely to have the palmation the species is noted for. I'd not shoot one without the palmation as a trophy.

markc · « **Reply #13 on:** December 31, 2009, 01:54:16 PM »

Not sure I agree with the fake tusks either, although I do agree that they tend to break, or more likely from the ones i've seen and shot over the years, they tend to be uneven from one side to the next, sometimes chipped, or cracked, which just adds to the character of the mount to me. GB, I do recall the gray ghost whompus hog! I believe that was at BHO I, or maybe BHO II at the Reed Ranch. What a great time that was. Do you still have a picture of that?

Graybeard · « **Reply #14 on:** December 31, 2009, 06:30:41 PM »

Yeah I'm sure I do Mark but it would be on my old computer not this one I currently use. I might try to see if I can figure away to move it to this one.

Neither me nor Faye can remember for sure but she says it was when we came with Rick Brown and if so that was BHO II as I rented a minivan to come to BHO I.

Yup we had a good time at both. Those were fun days.

Graybeard · « **Reply #15 on:** December 31, 2009, 07:02:18 PM »

Here ya go Mark, me and Kevin with the Gray Ghost Whumpus Hog down there where we recovered him. You can see the blood running out from the hole near the eye where I finally got a killing shot into him. The eye is kinda buldged out from the expansion inside.

drdougrx · « **Reply #16 on:** January 01, 2010, 05:20:56 AM »

Happt New Year All!

Whatta nice pig GB!!

The tusk issue in mounts can very well be taxidermist specific...though it's quite a bit easier for them to just put in the jaw pieces. The last pig I had mounted earlier this...er...last year had composite tusks that were as close to original as any I've seen. I got the chance to examine them up close and personal because I had to remove and reset them into the mount....seems the taxidermist thought the pig should look like Pumba...but that's another story.

markc · « **Reply #17 on:** January 03, 2010, 03:41:56 AM »

Doug, I hope you got a bit of a refund if you had to repair what the taxidermist did to your hog mount.

drdougrx · « **Reply #18 on:** January 03, 2010, 05:02:07 AM »

I didn't...in the last 3 years I've brought him, 1 bison, 4 boars, 1 sheep, 3 fallow and a bear for a rug and a skull. He's lost kind of a good customer......

whelen36 · « **Reply #19 on:** January 04, 2010, 02:05:03 PM »

now that's a really nice boar greybeard , really a shame you didn't mount him.

and i just realized the resemblance you have to my one friend tom r. , he's really big into hunting and fishing too.

i've often thought of going to the tioga boar hunting preserve here in pennsylvania for a fallow deer or a boar , just how many hunting preserves are there in pa that are some what decent ?? does whispering hollows have a website to check out??

i also don't have a lot of free time to hunt and really can't afford to go on a western hunt , and also agree on the wall to wall blaze orange in the woods on the opening day of deer , at least around here anyway as we don't have a lot of open private land anymore.

drdougrx · « **Reply #20 on:** January 04, 2010, 03:46:07 PM »

Hey Whelen,

I really don't know what's available in Pennsi....anyone???

Graybeard · « **Reply #21 on:** January 04, 2010, 06:14:19 PM »

Nope I really don't either tho my friend Barry has mentioned a high fenced operation not too far from his house. He doesn't seem to have much info on it tho and isn't even sure if they allow hunting or just raise animals to sell. Tioga is a really old outfit so I suspect should be OK or it likely wouldn't have stayed in business as long as it has. I might be wrong but I think the acreage is kinda small there tho.

theoldarcher · « **Reply #22 on:** January 05, 2010, 04:17:46 AM »

GB: you 'hate' deer meat?? Boy, I need to get you up here in MI to eat some tasty corn-, soy bean-, and alfalfa-fed deer! I promise I will make slow cooked butterfly chops in maple syrup that will convince anyone with a bad deer meat experience a fan!

Lay them over wild rice, bring along side some baby carrots cooked in a brown sugar sauce, a big salad, then throw some of mama's home made corn bread muffins on the plate, and I could care less what the king is eating!!

Of course I am meticulous about cleanliness of my deer meat, starting with how and where I shoot it, how quickly I field dress it and cool it down, and how fast the meat is processed. I've been called a bit nerdy about my handling of deer, but the meat is so wonderful, I don't mind!

Let me know if y'all gonna be in the neighborhood. The house is always open for folks travelin' through, and the meal is on me!

Arch

Oldshooter · « **Reply #23 on:** January 05, 2010, 07:29:47 AM »

Quote

slow cooked butterfly chops in maple syrup

Quote

baby carrots cooked in a brown sugar sauce

Quote

mama's home made corn bread muffins

WELL REMIND ME TO BRING A FIVE GALLON BUCKET OF INSULIN !

Sounds good and sweet !

Graybeard · « **Reply #24 on:** January 05, 2010, 01:06:37 PM »

I've tried it "their way" at least 50 times when other folks told me same story as you that the only reason I don't like it is cuz I ain't had it "their way".

Wal dang it I have had it all the ways I'm gonna have it. I'm not trying white tail deer again. I just don't like it.

Mule deer is OK, elk is very tasty, fallow deer and axis deer are very good. White tail meat is HORRIBLE tasing to me.

JimFromTN · « **Reply #25 on:** January 06, 2010, 04:31:04 AM »

What was it about the taste that you did not like? Was it gamey? I have had it where it was just awful and I could not eat it. Some people actually like the gameyness. I actually cooked some for a guy and he said he was disappointed because it was not gamey at all. He was from New Mexico and he had eaten wild horse meat and liked it. I hate gamey taste and its taken me decades to get to the point where there is never any gameness to the white tail that I cook regardless of what cut of meat it is as long as I am the one who butchers it and I don't soak it in anything like salt water or milk or any kind of marinade. Something about having a deer processed makes the meat taste bad. You also don't get all the meat and allot of times its not even your deer. I shot a doe one day and then shot a buck the next. I did not have time to do both myself so I butchered the doe and took the buck to the processor. The buck out weighed the doe by at least 20lbs and yet I got more meat out of the doe.

I think the worst tasting meat I ever ate was goat that came from a grocer, the next worst was carribou. I know if I had more meat to work with, I could eventually figure out methods to make it taste good. I have since eaten goat cooked in a resturaunt and it was quite good. The best tasting meat I have ever had was moose but it was like chewing filet mignon flavored leather. Thats another one I would like to have meat to work with.

bobg · « **Reply #26 on:** January 06, 2010, 06:32:02 AM »

I have been to Tioga four times. Very well run operation. I always requested Rodney as my guide. He made it a very interesting hunt. On one of my hunts Rod wasn't available and i got stuck with someone else. I wanted a Rocky Mountain Ram with decent horns. We found one laying by a pond. It wouldn't run and he wanted me to shoot it while it laid there at 25' away. I would not shoot it. He was very upset. We found one later that did make an attempt to get away. I shot that one. I tried the meat. I thought it was terrible. The boar i shot was very good. The boar hunt was fun. Those things are mean.
bobg

Graybeard · « **Reply #27 on:** January 06, 2010, 10:37:51 AM »

Since you've been there several times Bob you might know, what's the acreage there or at least some general idea of the size of their enclosure.

Skunk · « **Reply #28 on:** January 06, 2010, 10:47:12 AM »

Quote from: theoldarcher on January 05, 2010, 04:17:46 AM

Boy, I need to get you up here in MI to eat some tasty corn-, soy bean-, and alfalfa-fed deer! I promise I will make slow cooked butterfly chops in maple syrup... Lay them over wild rice, bring along side some baby carrots cooked in a brown sugar sauce, a big salad, then throw some of mama's home made corn bread muffins on the plate, and I could care less what the king is eating!!

Note to myself: Next time while in Michigan, go to Arch's house - beg for dinner...

Sounds good Arch.

bobg · « **Reply #29 on:** January 06, 2010, 12:08:55 PM »

Bill, Tioga's web site says 1500 acees. That sounds about right to me.
bobg