Author Topic: Blame the GPS!  (Read 1468 times)

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Offline Siskiyou

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Blame the GPS!
« on: December 30, 2009, 07:26:26 AM »
Dah!  People need to use good sense when using technology.  There are many models that have different features.  If I subscribe to a road condition feature for my unit I must pay a monthly fee.  I have chosen not to.   The folks in this incident turned off on to a Forest Service road.  Will the Forest Service, Bureau of Land Management, and the National Park Service do very limited snow plowing.  Congress does not budget them funds to plow snow.

I am glad these folks made it home safely and others can learn from their experience.



The U.S. Air Force wants to set the record straight: Neither aging GPS satellites nor a weak GPS signal were responsible for an elderly couple getting stranded in the woods for several days after following directions in their GPS-enabled SUV.

On Christmas day, John Rhoads, 65, and his wife, Starry Bush-Rhoads, 67, drove their vehicle down a remote road in eastern Oregon, where it became stuck in 1-1/2 feet of snow. The couple was stranded for three days before authorities located them using a faint signal emitted by the couple's GPS-enabled phone.

Some news reports of the couple's adventure were accompanied by headlines such as "GPS Strands Couple and Then Saves Them: Aging Satellites?"

On Tuesday, the Air Force Space Command (AFSPC), which operates the suite of satellites that make up the GPS system, used Twitter to clear up the misconception.

Writing under the Twitter username @AFSpace, AFSPC said: "While we do not want to speculate on what caused the couple to get stuck in the snow; the cause was not due to the GPS signal."
AFSPC spokesperson Toni Tones said the current GPS constellation is the most capable in the history of the program.

"Since the inception of us putting it up in 1995, it has exceeded our performance requirements, and we are very proud to offer this service to the general public," Tones told LiveScience.

Tones declined to speculate about why the Rhoads were stranded, but expressed confidence that it wasn't due to the satellites. "All I can say is that the signals that are coming down are very strong and healthy," she said, "so I would have to defer those kinds of questions to [manufacturers] such as Garmin and others that are providing the GPS devices."

That's because even though AFSPC operates the GPS satellites that emit the signal that consumer GPS devices use, they do not create or update the maps that run on the devices, and they are not involved in calculating the routes between destinations.

Tones added that the GPS constellation is designed to be redundant: There are 30 GPS currently in space, but only 24 of them are active at any one time.

The remainder serve as backups in case one of the other satellites malfunctions or if one of them is being upgraded, which happens every few months.
"In the event that one of our satellites fails, we can immediately have another one up to have the full coverage that we need," Tones said

http://news.yahoo.com/s/space/20091230/sc_space/lostcouplecantblamegpsairforcesays

In Oregon you can use this website 
http://www.tripcheck.com/Mobile/pages/SearchSelect.aspx?section=rc

Or By phone
Travelers in Oregon can dial 511 to access the same immediate road and weather information available on TripCheck.

•   Users can select updated reports about driving conditions by highway, mountain pass or major city from easy-to-use menus. The 511 system responds to both voice and touch-tone commands.
•   Calls to 511 are local calls when dialed from a pay phone or wire line phone. Wireless (cell) phone users are responsible for airtime and roaming charges according to their wireless service contracts, but ODOT does not impose any additional charges.
•   Most wireless companies in Oregon provide 511 service. If you cannot use 511, call toll-free (800) 977-ODOT (6368) for road and weather information. Outside Oregon, dial (503) 588-2941. Oregon offers the feature of forwarding users to the Washington state 511 system for road conditions in that state.
•   TripCheck is available for mobile phones. Visit www.tripcheck.com/mobile for a handy menu of TripCheck features, all formatted for the smaller screen size of mobile devices. It even provides links to directly dial hotels and restaurants along Oregon highways.
•   Remember, in Oregon, drivers are allowed to use hands-free devices, but not texting devices or touch cell phones. ODOT encourages motorists to pull off the road and park in a safe area before using cell phones.

In California you can call 1-800.427.7623 or check this website http://www.dot.ca.gov/cgi-bin/roads.cgi

This morning’s report for Highway 89 in California.
This highway information is the latest reported as of Wednesday, December 30, 2009 at 10:03 .

SR 89
    [IN THE CENTRAL CALIFORNIA AREA & SIERRA NEVADA]
    IS CLOSED FROM THE JCT OF US 395 (MONO CO) TO THE JCT OF SR 4 
/MONITOR PASS/ (ALPINE CO) - FOR THE WINTER - MOTORISTS ARE ADVISED TO USE AN 
ALTERNATE ROUTE 

    CHAINS ARE REQUIRED ON ALL VEHICLES EXCEPT 4-WHEEL-DRIVE VEHICLES WITH SNOW
TIRES ON ALL 4 WHEELS FROM PICKETTS JCT (ALPINE CO) TO 2.7 MI SOUTH OF THE 
JCT OF US 50 (EL DORADO CO) /LUTHER PASS/

    [IN THE NORTHERN CALIFORNIA AREA]
    IS CLOSED FROM THE SOUTH PARK BDRY TO THE JCT OF SR 44 /LASSEN LOOP/ 
(TEHAMA, SHASTA CO) - FOR THE WINTER - MOTORISTS ARE ADVISED TO USE AN 
ALTERNATE ROUTE 

    CHAINS ARE REQUIRED ON ALL VEHICLES EXCEPT 4-WHEEL-DRIVE VEHICLES WITH SNOW
TIRES ON ALL 4 WHEELS FROM PICKETTS JCT (ALPINE CO) TO 2.7 MI SOUTH OF THE 
JCT OF US 50 (EL DORADO CO) /LUTHER PASS/

    CHAINS OR SNOW TIRES ARE REQUIRED FROM 5 MI NORTH OF THE JCT OF US 50
TO BLISS STATE PARK (EL DORADO CO)

    CHAINS ARE REQUIRED ON ALL VEHICLES EXCEPT 4-WHEEL-DRIVE VEHICLES WITH SNOW
TIRES ON ALL 4 WHEELS FROM BLISS STATE PARK (EL DORADO CO) TO TOHOMA 
(PLACER CO)

    CHAINS OR SNOW TIRES ARE REQUIRED FROM TAHOMA (PLACER CO) TO THE 
JCT OF I 80 (NEVADA CO)

    CHAINS OR SNOW TIRES ARE REQUIRED FROM 4 MI NORTH OF TRUCKEE (NEVADA CO)
TO THE SIERRA/PLUMAS CO LINE
   
    CHAINS ARE REQUIRED ON SINGLE AXLE DRIVE VEHICLES TOWING TRAILERS FROM
13 MI NORTH OF THE JCT OF SR 299 (SHASTA CO) TO 1.5 MI SOUTH OF BARTLE 
(SISKIYOU CO) /DEAD HORSE SUMMIT/

 
There is a learning process to effectively using a gps.  Do not throw your compass and map away!

Boycott: San Francisco, L.A., Oakland, and City of Sacramento, CA.

Offline Dave in WV

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #1 on: December 30, 2009, 12:44:10 PM »
Good write up. Going into an unknown area in the winter without having a map or other directions is asking for problems. Many people I know that have a GPS in their autos or trucks tell me how their GPS directs them on another route than they normally use that many times is faster. Following a GPS blindly with no idea where you are is a bad idea. Out in your area of the country it can be stupid. Roads that are useable in the summer may be a bad idea in the winter. Going into remote areas without survival gear and the knowlage of how to use it AND making sure someone knows where you are going is a plan for disaster. I know a jackass that went out after a 12" + snow with his girl friend and her kids to look at the snow in a state park. He got hung up in a snow drift and had no way to dig it out. Hey, he had a 4x4 SUV so why worry? He had a long walk wearing athletic shoes and a thin coat to get help.
Setting an example is not the main means of influencing others; it is the only means
--Albert Einstein

Offline Siskiyou

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2010, 06:51:51 AM »

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20100101/D9CUTBK81.html

Come on people there is a learning process to properly using a gps.  Start out by reading the instructions and exploring the menu item.  Without a doubt I drove my wife nuts when I started using the automotive gps.  I would use it to go to my daughter’s house; I think they have lived there for fourteen years.  I would use to go to work, and I would use it to go to our son’s home. 

The manual was not a lot of help but I went into each menu and checked it out.  Under the Navigation screen I found the following options:
ROUTE PREFERENCE:  It offers two options Faster Time, and Shorter Distance
Sometimes the shortest route is not the fastest route.  I the area I was raised there is a dirt logging road that cuts across a mountain pass.  In the late 1800’s it was used by cattlemen to drive there herd to summer pasture, and drive them back out of the high country when the snow started falling.  Later the same route was used to haul logs out of the country.  When I was a kid my Dad and his buddies would take me up there deer hunting.  The old 1950 Chevy pickup did not have an extended cab.  I rode on an old car seat in the bed of the pickup with the dog.  The dog was my best buddy. 

Once we got off the paved County roads and hit the dirt road over the pass Dad had to go slow, because the road was deeply rutted, and where it was not rutted it was wash board.  Subtracting travel time from hunting time it was hours before we popped out on a well maintained State highway.  At that time we did not back track on the return trip home.  We took the State highway to a paved county road home.  It was after dark and I could not see anything, I would rap myself in a tarp and fall asleep.  The drive home might take an hour and which was hours shorter than back tracking and it was about eight miles shorter.

I just checked the highway conditions for that State Highway and there are none.  A check of the Cal Trans Camera on the highway shows snow on the side of the roadway.  There is not road report for the old cow trail but it is normally impassable this time of year.  The road is not patrolled so if you get stuck and by yourself you better be equipped.  People might over extend themselves because there are those who went ahead of them with 4-wheel drive, lockers, and buddy vehicles.

Another issue that gets the new jeep is temperature.  Early in the morning they go out on a road covered with snow.  The snow is frozen and they travel for miles on top of the frozen snow.    Late in the day as the temperature has gone up the snow has thawed and the jeep drops down into the snow a couple feet.  They burn up their fuel fighting the snow and tearing up the road.  If there are miles of snow there is no digging yourself out.  The best way is to create a snow ramp to get back on top after it freezes up during the night.  Once it is frozen one can normally get out about daylight the next morning.    Do not expect your gps to tell you this.  A tow truck will not go after you, and they will not plow the road to get your vehicle out. 

The Fastest route normally keeps you on paved State Highways.

VEHICLE TYPE:  It offers five options, Car/Motorcycle, Truck, Bus, Emergency, and Taxi.  I have Car/Motorcycle selected.

AVOIDANCES:  It offers the following options:  U-Turns, Highways, Toll Roads, Traffic, Ferries, Carpool Lanes, and Unpaved roads.  My gps only uses Avoidances if an alternative route takes me too far out of the way of my primary route.  If I used the optional at a cost FM Traffic receiver the unit would help me avoid traffic incidents.  Okay there are some paved Forest Service, and BLM roads but the majority are dirt.  Unless you are heading for the backcountry this might be one to check.  I have not checked mine because it is part of my life, but I am checking it to see what happens.  Might be a while before I report on this because those roads are covered with snow now and I am staying off them to avoid road damage.

ATTENTION TONE:  Turn it off or on.  As a driver I like it, as a passenger my wife does not like.  I have it on.

The mapping software on my unit is considered out of date.  Do I pay for a new map or buy another automotive gps and give this one to a family member.  I am doing find with the current map, the biggest changes are the listed businesses.  A lot of business have failed since my mapping software was loaded, but the failure rate is so high the most current software is months behind.

A key feature that my unit is missing is the ability to create a Route and not use the route the unit creates for me.  This would be handy on a long trip.  Right now the unit generates the most direct right, on what is considered the fastest roads.    I would like to be able to build side trips into my trip before leaving home.

The lowest price unit most likely is not the best deal, and the highest price one may be loaded with features you will not use.  Whatever unit you have learn to use it, and carry a good map.  I can create routes on my handheld gps, and have it running at times as a check.  I kind of overdo it at times.  Winter travel can be dangerous and go prepared.  One March the weather turned nice, and I took my family to a high country lake operated by a water agency.  They plow the road some years and it was the case that year.  On the return trip I pulled into a wide area and let the kids out to play in the snow.  I had the Land Cruiser in 4x and when we started out I cut across a flat and the rig sunk.  Covered with snow was a deep pile of ash from where a very large pile of logging slash had been burnt. 

It quickly had the consistency of watery pancake batter.  I would jack up the vehicle with my Handy-man jack, and put limbs and large chunks of bark under the tires.  When I tried to go the vehicle sunk deeper.    We built a fire and prepared to spend the night. 

I kept thinking who had we told that we were going up to the lake?

Luck had it that a fisherman with a winch came by and I paid him $20 to pull me out.

Could it happen again, Yep, I just hope to be prepared.
There is a learning process to effectively using a gps.  Do not throw your compass and map away!

Boycott: San Francisco, L.A., Oakland, and City of Sacramento, CA.

Offline Dave in WV

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2010, 08:23:17 AM »
If you have a auto GPS and leave it in your car/truck do not leave "home" programed in your GPS.  A guy I work with was telling me the other day about a couple that attended a football game. The thieves took their garage door remote and GPS and programed it to take them "home". They called the police and filled out a report about their car bronken into and then get home to find their house was cleaned out. The thieves drove their vehicle in the garage, closed the door, and loaded up.
Setting an example is not the main means of influencing others; it is the only means
--Albert Einstein

Offline Siskiyou

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2010, 09:16:51 AM »
Dave:

Very good information, I like the HOME feature because it has great benefits.  

Having been made aware of the RISK I will change my home location today.  For Garmin users go to the “Menu Page, touch Where to>Favorites.  Touch Home>Edit>Delete>Yes.  You can reset the unit to use another location for HOME.

I want a HOME location so I need to take a look at a location within a mile that does not lead others to my home.  I am thinking of the home of the meanest, nasty, guy around.

Justice must be served!
 ;D ;) 8) :o


REMEMBER SELECT THE FAVORITES BUTTON AND THEN GO TO HOME IN THE DROP DOWN.
There is a learning process to effectively using a gps.  Do not throw your compass and map away!

Boycott: San Francisco, L.A., Oakland, and City of Sacramento, CA.

Offline Dave in WV

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2010, 10:44:42 AM »
That's a plan I like.  ;D
Setting an example is not the main means of influencing others; it is the only means
--Albert Einstein

Offline victorcharlie

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #6 on: January 03, 2010, 03:17:37 AM »
I've got a volunteer fire station a mile or less from my home.....maybe I'll set it for that......usually a deputy there too.
"Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. Tolerance in the face of tyranny is no virtue."
Barry Goldwater

Offline Siskiyou

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #7 on: January 03, 2010, 04:14:58 AM »
I picked a place where they have a couple of large dogs, and they seem to have a real interest in firearms.
 ;D
There is a learning process to effectively using a gps.  Do not throw your compass and map away!

Boycott: San Francisco, L.A., Oakland, and City of Sacramento, CA.

Offline Siskiyou

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #8 on: January 03, 2010, 06:12:04 AM »
Dave you have triggered all kinds of actions. 

My son drives a lot of miles and uses a TomTom automotive gps.  He likes the Home option on his unit.  He might be in an area he has not worked before and it time to head for home.  At that time he selects the home option and it he takes the recommended route.  I believe he is plugging in a local fire or police station.

I am not sure what I am going to do with my handheld gps units.  On the Start-up page I have my name, address, HM phone, and cellphone.  I can easily rename my Waypoint HOME, to MEAN DOG or the default number.   At this point I will leave the start-up page as is.  Normally the unit is on me when I am away from home.   The information could prove helpful if I lose it out on a hiking trail, or I pass out somewhere.   
There is a learning process to effectively using a gps.  Do not throw your compass and map away!

Boycott: San Francisco, L.A., Oakland, and City of Sacramento, CA.

Offline Dave in WV

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #9 on: January 03, 2010, 07:59:06 AM »
I have nothing against the auto GPS units but have no need for one. I use a map, the internet, the Weather channel, and have no interest in "exploring" an area especially in the winter. If traveling out west an auto compass would be a must. I work with  guy that worked in the oil and gas fields here. Several guys he worked with were from out west and they all had a compass in their vehicles. He inquired as to why they did and they said to a man "when a blizzard hits out west you can't tell a direction without a compass". After my time in the ANG and flying over the geat west I can see why. Miles and miles of nothing. Beautiful country but no help in sight. They may all use a GPS now BUT a compass will work without electricity or satellites.

That's not to say I don't have/use a GPS. I carried mine today on my walk in the woods. I also had my cell phone, SIG P220,  and folding fighting knife. A little paranoia is a healthy thing.  ;) If I get hurt or have an emergency I can call help to my location.

I thought the "home" thing would be of interest. I didn't think of posting it until you posted about the couple getting lost.
Setting an example is not the main means of influencing others; it is the only means
--Albert Einstein

Offline Siskiyou

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #10 on: January 03, 2010, 05:14:34 PM »
I think the nature of one’s driving will determined if an automotive gps is an asset.  At the end of the week I have to go to the City for some medical test.  I have never been to the location.  They sent me the address and it is programmed into my automotive gps.

When I travelled all over the country an automotive gps would have been nice.  I use to go down to my Mother-in-laws vacation/retire place six hundred miles below the Mexican border in Baja.  Mexico is a night time society.  On a return trip we hit Tijuana at midnight.  I made a wrong turn and went in to downtown Tijuana.  I have never seen so much activity in a U.S. City that late at night. 

I am a country boy and I had never encounter one of those International Intersection where everybody goes around and around at high speed until they are lined for with the road they want to take.  Then off you go.  I happen to spot a sign for the U.S. Freeway with an arrow.  I was rather stressed at that point.  An automotive gps with San Ysidro programmed in it would have saved a lot of stress time in Tijuana.

Once you get to the lanes leading to the International Border they are packed with cars and vendors.  There are women with little kids at their feet coming up against the car wanting sell goods, and have the kids wash the windshield.  It took more than an hour to get to the Customs Officer.  The trip from there to Chula Vista and a motel was easy. 

In those days one of things I would do in the motel was open up the local yellow pages and check out gunshops.  Now days I type in Gun in the Shopping Menu of my gps unit and everything with gun it pops up.

Over the years in my real job, and in my retirement job I would be assigned to a fire.  You have watch those big blazes on television how could anybody miss the fire.  Normally the Incident Command Post is setup back from the fire at a school, regional Park or some other location which can handle a couple thousand fire fighters.  Finding these locations can be difficult at times. 

Typically assignments come in the late afternoon or night which put me driving in the dark.  A hand printed sign on cardboard is hard to see at night while dealing with traffic.  But having the location in an automotive gps makes life easier.

A lot of times events control our action.  Recently a friend pass away 150 miles away and the memorial was held at a place I had never been.  I plugged the address in my gps and made it without a problem.

A number of times I have used the gps to find a motel where I was going, and in City Navigator the phone number is listed.  While I drove my wife called and made a reservation.  A lot of times we are not in control of events, when a family member or close friend comes down ill or passes we end up on the road.  My wife thinks the automotive gps is only okay, and she is right.  When we get in the car and hit the road she has her map out.  When we were married over forty-four years ago she became the navigator.  She is very good at reading a map and keeping me informed.  But there are a lot of things offered by the automotive gps that when I am travelling alone makes life easier. 

When we hit the road we have maps and AAA tour book for our trip.  We even had the AAA map for Baja, and the Baja tour book which is good.  But they did us no good late at night in Tijuana.  Of course part to the problem was we did not want to stop in that maze.

The next thing we need in California is a gps in which I can speak English and it will be translated into Spanish and reverse.

When travelling a laptop is a nice supplement.  Every motel I have stayed at the last few years has free high speed internet.  Road a weather condition can quickly be checked.  While we have spoken of snow of later; road contruction and detours can create a change in plans. 
There is a learning process to effectively using a gps.  Do not throw your compass and map away!

Boycott: San Francisco, L.A., Oakland, and City of Sacramento, CA.

Offline bilmac

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #11 on: January 03, 2010, 06:49:33 PM »
The GPS technology almost always works, but the base maps that the auto machines use is flawed. New roads are seldom updated. My daughters place is in the middle of an open field according to my Magellen. Then somehow there are places where the map is just wrong. There is a place we drive by frequently where Magellen insists you turn off a perfectly good highway. There isn't a road or any sign that there used to be a road there. We thought that it was just our machine, but lately there was an article in the paper about how lots of people are getting fooled at this same place.

GPS is great, but you need to be smarter than the machine.

Offline INresponse

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2010, 07:05:28 PM »
If you are driving down a road and the GPS program tells you to turn down the launch ramp at the local marina you would probably not follow that route.  (unless you blame others when you spill hot coffee in your lap)  It is the users responsibility to decide when and where they are going to turn while they are driving.  If the forest is on fire and you are looking for your favorite camp ground you may not want to take your normal turn off.  ::)

A few years back, while on attending a huge gathering with people from all over the country we were caravaning to all of our destinations.  Over half of us had varous types of GPS systems, and they all gave us different directions.  On one outting we all typed in the same destination address, and we all selected "shortest driving time".  We still had conflictig information and mine had a tendancy to turn me down 100 year old farm roads leading to an old barn or other abandonned location.  (I only had that problem in the area south of Rapid City, South Dakota though.  Everywhere else I used that during cross country vacations it was accurate, aside from trying to find the front driveway to a couple of hotels.

A GPS system is only a divice, a map is only a device, both of them take a knowledge, an ability, and a bit of inteligence to get you where you are destined.
Police Officers support the 2nd Amendment!
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Offline INresponse

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #13 on: January 03, 2010, 07:12:34 PM »
I have nothing against the auto GPS units but have no need for one.

I could say that as well, but it is a great marital aid while traveling.  If my wife is awake she can read the highway or exit information to me but she can't predict if the exit for the freeway is on the left or the right.  It is difficult jumping from the right lane to the left lane in heavy traffic, but the GPS systems give you notice 2 miles in advance.  I bet this is even more helpful when pulling a trailer.
Police Officers support the 2nd Amendment!
-Retired-

Offline Graybeard

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #14 on: January 04, 2010, 02:22:15 AM »
Mine wouldn't get anyone to my house using the Home feature anyway. Well up the road from my house it tells me I'm there and to navigate off road to reach home. It might take them to one of the neighbor's places but it would be pure luck for them to actually figure which home was mine from the GPS.

Since we're all required to have registration and insurance info in the vehicle I figure if they break into it and steal it or just break in and look thru they'll find all the info needed to find our homes really. They likely could get here better from what's in the glove box than from the Home feature of my GPS not that I use it around here locally much anyway. I did when I first got it in preparation for our trip to OK but haven't taken it out of the house since I got back home from that trip. Besides I messed up the home feature trying to set a waypoint for Walgreen's and now it thinks Walgreens is home. :o


Bill aka the Graybeard
President, Graybeard Outdoor Enterprises
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I am not a lawyer and do not give legal advice.

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Offline bilmac

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #15 on: January 04, 2010, 04:16:25 AM »
I agree with Response, the great value of the auto GPS is on these spagetti highways through major cities. They had me so scared that before I got a GPS I had just about sworn off driving through big cities. Since we acquired one, I can make it through these spiderwebs without having a nervious breakdown.

Offline SURVEYOR

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #16 on: January 04, 2010, 02:08:12 PM »
I being a surveyor haven't had a auto navigating gps unit until Black Friday this year. I love that darn thing! The first thing I noticed was how my wife and survey hand acted while riding with it on. Seems they both had experiences with over talking, demanding route talking gps units. Both of them started mocking the voice commands before the unit had time to even do it. My unit never starts yelling "TURN LEFT! MAKE A U TURN! TURN AROUND NOW! YOU DARN DUMMY!" My Garmin just says re-calculating, and moves on to a new route. It's been very helpful getting me through and around Memphis. I've started using it to hunt and find NGS gps control monuments. Just key in the published Lat and Lon, let it calculate route, get close, then take the hand held the rest of the way. I have found some 1927 monuments. Works good.
I''m A Dirty White Boy and I''m Proud Of It!

Offline Siskiyou

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Re: Blame the GPS!
« Reply #17 on: January 04, 2010, 06:03:48 PM »
It dawn on me this morning that I have failed to mention a feature on my automotive gps that I use even when I am travelling around an area I know well.  I went off the hill today to do some of our first of the month shopping.  Along with that I want to pick up some powder for my son-in-law.

When I went out to load ice chest and tubs in the PU I also setup the automotive gps, and plugged it in.  Next I open my cell phone and said yes to allowing the gps and phone to communicate.  The phone and the model gps I have are Bluetooth compatible

I understand that more States have passed legislation outlawing none emergency uses of cellphones while driving, most allow hands free devices.   Before the start of the New Year the fine for using a cellphone was $25, and the officer was happy to tell you that.  The shock came when you appeared in court and they added over $200 in court cost. 

It is something to consider when looking at features offered by an automotive gps unit.
There is a learning process to effectively using a gps.  Do not throw your compass and map away!

Boycott: San Francisco, L.A., Oakland, and City of Sacramento, CA.