Author Topic: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?  (Read 1560 times)

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Offline vanbuzen9

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Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« on: January 05, 2010, 12:40:15 PM »
Hey guys,

I recently purchased a used (1975) ruger blackhawk in 41 mag.  I have not been getting good accuracy, and am wondering if the gun needs to be rebuilt.  Given it's age, and the fact that most parts on the gun have a lot of play in them, such as the cylinder and hammer, I am stuck in making a descision to rebuild. I guess it could also be a timing issue, as I get a small amount of lead shavings when I shoot cast bullets.  Any insite or suggestians as to what I should do would be greatly appreciated!

Offline Lloyd Smale

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #1 on: January 05, 2010, 03:24:39 PM »
box it up and send it to ruger and tell them whats wrong with it and they will check it out and if it needs work will probably do it for nothing.
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Offline Swampman

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #2 on: January 05, 2010, 03:27:36 PM »
It will probably have to be shipped FedEx overnight.  That will cost about $50.00.  Read the regs before you ship.
"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

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Offline williamlayton

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #3 on: January 05, 2010, 10:09:21 PM »
Sure sounds like this is a good project. It is recycling.
There are a lot of things/ways you could go with this--maybe make it into a completely new caliber, spiff it up into a BBQ gun--but it does sound like a fun project for the mind.
Work on the angle that it is fun and that when tru with it that it can be a special piece.
Keep us informed----I like project guns.
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Offline vanbuzen9

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2010, 02:06:59 AM »
Thanks for all the replies!  I will probably end up just sending it to ruger for a complete overhaul.  Hopefully they won't charge to much, as I didn't pay a whole lot for it!  Has anybody else sent a pistol in to ruger for an overhaul similar to this one?  Just curious about how much it might cost.  And yes, shipping will be expensive, I just shipped a single six on trade through ups, and it cost around 55 bucks.  Oh well, got to pay to play, I guess.

Thanks,
vanbuzen9

Offline Brett

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2010, 03:10:58 AM »
Why are you shipping via Fed Ex?   What's wrong with USPS?
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Offline vanbuzen9

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2010, 07:05:25 AM »
It is illegal to ship handguns via fedex or usps.  That's why I used UPS.

Offline rawhidekid

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #7 on: January 07, 2010, 12:55:10 AM »
vanbuzen9:  It is perfectly legal to ship a handgun to the factory via Fedex or Ups. Ruger has long had a policy if you buy a used gun you can send it to them for checkout no charge.  Remember you will be sending it back east as only semi autos are done in Arizona. 8)
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Offline Flash

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2010, 01:17:11 AM »
vanbuzen9:  It is perfectly legal to ship a handgun to the factory via Fedex or Ups. Ruger has long had a policy if you buy a used gun you can send it to them for checkout no charge.  Remember you will be sending it back east as only semi autos are done in Arizona. 8)
Don't believe it's legal to ship a handgun via usps but a dealer can. My dealer is about a block from the post office and he charges me around $20 if I supply the box. He has to check to see if it's unloaded before he ships it but always wraps it nicely.
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Offline rawhidekid

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #9 on: January 07, 2010, 01:40:05 AM »
It has always been legal to ship a handgun from owner to factory.  Now that you mention it, I beleive UPS on their own may have decided not to let you, but legality had nothing to do with it. 8)  
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Offline Brett

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #10 on: January 07, 2010, 06:26:31 AM »
It is illegal to ship handguns via fedex or usps.  That's why I used UPS.

Yup, You are correct.  I had only shipped long guns via USPS and assumed (you know what that does) that you could also ship handguns.

(last updated on 1/3/2010)
Firearms Shipping Guide

Overview
This page provides information about Federal Laws, step that must be followed, and notes on using specific shippers when shipping firearms. This page is oriented toward the seller of an item. If you need information about how to buy a firearm through GunBroker.com, please refer to our Buyer's Tutorial.

This page contains information oriented toward persons shipping firearms within the United States. For sellers located outside the United States, please see our Import / Export page.

Shipping Legalities
Federal Law requires that all modern firearms be shipped to a holder of a valid Federal Firearms License (FFL) only. The recipient must have an FFL; however the sender is not required to have one. Any person who is legally allowed to own a firearm is legally allowed to ship it to an FFL holder for any legal purpose (including sale or resale).

Here is exactly what the ATF 'Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide' (ATF P 5300.4) says:
(B9) May a nonlicensee ship a firearm by carrier?
A nonlicensee may ship a firearm by carrier to a resident of his or her own state or to a licensee in any state. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. In addition, Federal law requires that the carrier be notified that the shipment contains a firearm and prohibits common or contract carriers from requiring or causing any label to be placed on any package indicating that it contains a firearm. [18 U. S. C. 922( a)( 2)( A) and 922( e), 27 CFR 178.31]

B8) May a nonlicensee ship a firearm through the U. S. Postal Service?
A nonlicensee may mail a shotgun or rifle to a resident of his or her own state or to a licensee in any state. Handguns are not mailable. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. A nonlicensee may not transfer any firearm to a nonlicensed resident of another state. The Postal Service recommends that longguns be sent by registered mail and that no marking of any kind which would indicate the nature of the contents be placed on the outside of any parcel containing firearms.

'Antique' firearms need not be shipped to a licensed dealer. These can be shipped directly to the buyer. An antique firearm is a firearm built in or before 1898, or a replica thereof. The exact ATF definition of an antique firearm is:
Antique firearm. (a) Any firearm (including any firearm with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system) manufactured in or before 1898; and (b) any replica of any firearm described in paragraph (a) of this definition if such replica (1) is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition, or (2) uses rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition which is no longer manufactured in the United States and which is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade.

Knives, air guns, accessories, and most gun parts need not be shipped to an FFL holder. We say most gun parts because each firearm contains at least one part that the ATF considers a firearm. This part is typically the part that contains the serial number. This part must be treated as a complete firearm when shipping the item.

Ammunition must be clearly identified as 'Small Arms Ammunition' on the outside of the box. Some shippers treat ammunition as dangerous or hazardous materials.

The section of the US Code that governs modern firearms is called Commerce in Firearms and Ammunition (CFA). This code is available online at: http://www.atf.gov/pub/fire-explo_pub/2005/p53004/27cfr_part478.pdf

When in doubt, we suggest arranging for transfer through a licensed dealer. Violation of the CFA is a felony and penalties for violation of it are severe.

Federal and State Law Resources
The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms (ATF) has a very comprehensive site containing information about the various Federal and state laws regulating firearms. Please refer to the ATF information for legal questions regarding firearms.
ATF Home page: http://www.atf.gov
ATF Compilation of the various state laws: http://www.atf.gov/publications/download/p/atf-p-5300-5.pdf
ATF Firearms Division Main Page: http://www.atf.gov/firearms/index.htm

Shipment by Unlicensed Persons
Any shipper who does not have a Federal Firearms License (FFL) is considered to be an 'unlicensed person'. This section contains information on how unlicensed persons can ship firearms. If you have an FFL, please skip to the next section for shipping suggestions.

The most important thing to know is that you must only ship guns to a licensed dealer. If the buyer is not a licensed dealer, he will have to make arrangements to ship the item to a dealer in his state.

Before you ship a gun, the buyer must fax or mail you a copy of the dealer's signed FFL license. You can only ship the gun to the address on the license. You must inform the carrier that the package contains a firearm. Of course, the firearm cannot be shipped loaded; ammunition may not be shipped in the same box. You should take the copy of the signed FFL with you when you take the item to be shipped in case the shipper wishes to see it.

Notes on specific shippers:

US Mail: An unlicensed person can ship a rifle or shotgun by US Mail. Unlicensed persons cannot ship a handgun by US Mail. Postal regulations allow the Post Office to open your package for inspection. Ammunition cannot be shipped by US Mail. You can search the US Post Office Postal Explorer site for specific USPS regulations regarding firearms and ammunition.

FedEx: FedEx will only ship firearms via their Priority Overnight service. Ammunition must be shipped as dangerous goods.

FedEx Ground: FedEx Ground will transport and deliver firearms (excluding handguns) as defined by the United States Gun Control Act of 1968, between areas served in the U.S. Ammunition must be shipped as dangerous goods.

UPS: UPS will accept handgun shipments by Next Day Air only. Rifles and shotguns can be shipped by UPS ground service. UPS will accept shipments of ammunition. Most other shippers will no longer accept firearm shipments. Airborne and Roadway have specifically prohibited firearm shipments.

Shipment by Licensed Persons
Any shipper who has a Federal Firearms License (FFL) is considered to be a 'licensed person'. This section contains information on how licensed persons can ship firearms. If you do not have an FFL, please see the previous section of this page for shipping instructions.

Since licensed persons are responsible for knowing the law, we are going to assume that you already understand the CGA and know the applicable Federal, state, and local laws.

Notes on specific shippers:

US Mail: Licensed persons can ship a rifle, shotguns, or handguns by US Mail. In fact, we suggest that you use the USPS as it is now the most cost-effective way to ship a handgun. To ship a rifle or shotgun, you need only inform the Post Office that the package contains a firearm. A licensed manufacturer, dealer, or importer can ship a handgun via the US Post Office if the licensed dealer fills out a US Post Office Form PS 1508 and files it with the local Post Office branch where the handgun is to be shipped. You can search the US Post Office Postal Explorer site for specific USPS regulations regarding firearms and ammunition.

FedEx: FedEx will only ship firearms via their Priority Overnight service. Ammunition must be shipped as dangerous goods. NSSF members can sign up for a discount of up to 26% on FedEx shipments.

UPS: UPS will accept handgun shipments by Next Day Air only. Rifles and shotguns can be shipped by UPS ground service. UPS will accept shipments of ammunition.

Most other shippers will no longer accept firearm shipments. Airborne and Roadway have specifically prohibited firearm shipments.

Notes on USPS Firearm Regulations
We recommend that you read the Post Office regulations on Other Restricted or Nonmailable Matter before shipping a firearm through the US Mail.

The following info comes from the USPS Regulation DMM Issue 54, January 10, 1999, section C-024

Page C-39, section 3.0, Rifles and Shotguns: "Although unloaded rifles and shotguns not precluded by 1.1e and 1.2 are mailable, mailers must comply with the Gun Control Act or 1968, Public Law 90-618, 18 USC 921, et seq., and the rules and regulations promulgated there under, 27 CFR 178, as well as state and local laws. The mailer may be required by the USPS to establish, by opening the parcel or by written certification, that the gun is unloaded and not precluded by 1.1e."

Page C-39, section 6.0, PROHIBITED PARCEL MARKING: "For any parcel containing a firearm or a ballistic or switchblade knife, any marking that indicates the contents is not permitted on the outside wrapper or container."

The following pertains only to licensed dealers shipping handguns:

Page C-37, section 1.3, Authorized Persons: "Subject to 1.4, handguns may be mailed by a licensed manufacturer of firearms, a licensed dealer of firearms, or an authorized agent of the federal government......."

Page C-38, section 1.5, Manufacturers and Dealers: "Handguns may also be mailed between licensed manufacturers of firearms and licensed dealers of firearms in customary trade shipments, or for repairing or replacing parts."

Page C-38, section 1.6, Certificate of Manufacturers and Dealers: "A licensed manufacturer or dealer need not file the affidavit under 1.4, but must file with the postmaster a statement on Form 1508 signed by the mailer that he or she is a licensed manufacturer or dealer of firearms, that the parcels containing handguns (or major components thereof) are customary trade shipments or contain such articles for repairing or replacing parts, and that to the best of his or her knowledge or belief the addressees are licensed manufacturers or dealers of firearms."
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Offline rawhidekid

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #11 on: January 07, 2010, 06:54:33 AM »
So are you saying that an individual can not ship a handgun via FedEx or Ups overnight to a manufacturer?  When I went to your ATF reg sight it specified a manufacturer is able to send directly to the address the item was shipped from and that an individual could ship directly to the manufacturer.  Gun dealers love for you to use them at an additional charge. 8)  Again I am not refering to buying and shipping, just repair. 8)
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Offline Brett

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #12 on: January 07, 2010, 09:16:54 AM »
So are you saying that an individual can not ship a handgun via FedEx or Ups overnight to a manufacturer?  When I went to your ATF reg sight it specified a manufacturer is able to send directly to the address the item was shipped from and that an individual could ship directly to the manufacturer.  Gun dealers love for you to use them at an additional charge. 8)  Again I am not refering to buying and shipping, just repair. 8)

No, the US Post Office and I guess Federal Express are saying they will not let an individual ship a handgun to anybody. 
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Offline rawhidekid

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2010, 02:26:50 PM »
I keep wondering, what part of "shall not be infringed" don't these people understand? :( :-\
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Offline Graybeard

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #14 on: January 07, 2010, 06:23:56 PM »
UPS, FEDEX and DHL all three will ship guns I believe to include handguns. They just force you to use next day air. UPS started this cuz their employees were stealing too many guns in transit. Rather than fix THEIR problem they force gun owners to pay thru the nose to ship next day air.


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Offline Blackhawker

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #15 on: January 07, 2010, 08:44:07 PM »
If that's a 1975, then it's an old model Blackhawk.  If you send it to Ruger they will do a nice job of "ruining" the action for you by installing a transfer bar system.  You may consider sending the revolver to a qualified gunsmith if you wish the action to be the same, otherwise it may be better to just sell it as is and buy a brand new new model Blackhawk with the transfer bar already installed. 

Offline vanbuzen9

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #16 on: January 08, 2010, 02:29:33 AM »
Blackhawker,

It is a 1975, as the first two numbers in the serial number are "41", but this is the first year they started to put the transfer bar in, as that is what mine has.  I will probably just send it to a local gunsmith, because it will cost over 50 bucks right off the bat just to ship it to ruger.

Offline Swampman

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #17 on: January 08, 2010, 02:34:25 AM »
I can't even get UPS to ship a flintlock and I wouldn't let them anyway.  USPS will not ship a handgun.  FedEx will do it no problem.  Based on my personal experience.  With any of them you have to tell them in writing it's a gun.

There are 2 things you have to deal with.  Federal/State laws & company policy.

Been there and done that dozens of times.

Quote
FedEx Express will transport and deliver firearms as defined by the United States Gun Control Act of 1968, between areas served in the U.S., but only between:
Licensed importers; licensed manufacturers; licensed dealers; licensed collectors; law enforcement agencies of the U.S. or any department or agency thereof; and law enforcement agencies of any state or any department, agency or political subdivisions thereof; or
Where not prohibited by local, state and federal law, from individuals to licensed importers, licensed manufacturers or licensed dealers (and return of same).
If your shipment contains firearms, select the Direct Signature Required or Adult Signature Required Delivery Signature Option, depending on the requirements of your shipment. See the Delivery Signature Options section for details. Firearms shipments are not eligible for signature release or indirect delivery.
Firearms must be shipped via FedEx Priority Overnight service. FedEx Express cannot ship or deliver firearms C.O.D. Firearms shipments cannot be placed in a FedEx Express Drop Box.
Upon presenting the package for shipment, the person tendering the shipment to FedEx Express is required to notify FedEx Express that the package contains a firearm. The outside of the package must not be marked, labeled or otherwise identify that the package contains a firearm.
The shipper and recipient must be of legal age as identified by applicable law.
The shipper and recipient are required to comply with all applicable government regulations and laws, including those pertaining to labeling. The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives can provide assistance.
FedEx Express will transport ammunition when packed and labeled in compliance with local, state and federal law, and the Dangerous Goods section of this Service Guide. Ammunition is an explosive and must be shipped separately as dangerous goods. You agree not to ship loaded firearms or firearms with ammunition in the same package.
"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

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Offline kynardsj

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #18 on: January 08, 2010, 02:37:47 AM »
A couple of years ago I was given a Security Six that was pretty much a POS. I sent it to Ruger and what I got back was the equivilent to a new gun. It's worth the bucks to send one to them IMO.
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Offline Swampman

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #19 on: January 08, 2010, 02:39:08 AM »
I agree they will make it like new.
"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

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Offline rawhidekid

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #20 on: January 08, 2010, 04:36:51 AM »
Although if a three screw as blackhawker said they may do the conversion, they will return al the parts so you can always convert it back if you so choose. 8)
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Offline jcn59

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #21 on: January 08, 2010, 04:56:47 PM »
This has probably been said six times already, but your dealer can use the post office to ship your handgun for repair. 

This is not a transfer.   

If he will let you package it, he may well mail it for you for the cost of the shipment if you are a good customer, or maybe just to secure your business.

I believe this is compliant with all laws.
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Offline Tommyt

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #22 on: January 11, 2010, 04:22:15 AM »
Hey guys,

I recently purchased a used (1975) ruger blackhawk in 41 mag.  I have not been getting good accuracy, and am wondering if the gun needs to be rebuilt.  Given it's age, and the fact that most parts on the gun have a lot of play in them, such as the cylinder and hammer, I am stuck in making a descision to rebuild. I guess it could also be a timing issue, as I get a small amount of lead shavings when I shoot cast bullets.  Any insite or suggestians as to what I should do would be greatly appreciated!

 Go to their web Site and watch the Video Break Down and Reassemble do this until you understand
Set the Gun in front of the monitor with tools in hand and "getter dun"
Order what you need from Ruger either before the Break down or after
I just started fooling with Six guns so far I haven't walked into one that can be taken down and put back up
JMHO

Here I went to the site
 http://www.ruger.com/resources/videos
Hit the Tec Button on this page and pick your gun its straight Forward

Tommyt

Offline Ole Man Dan

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #23 on: January 12, 2010, 04:58:13 AM »
My favorite gun shop charges me a good deal less to ship my gun than what it would cost me.
(They know they will make it back off of me in other purchases. Guns, Powder, hunting clothes ect...)
 
The main reason I ship thru a dealer is convenience.  I don't have to be home when UPS deliverers.

Offline drdougrx

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Re: Blackhawk: Time to rebuild?
« Reply #24 on: January 13, 2010, 05:44:59 AM »
Sending my BH. 41mag back to Ruger this week for a factory refurb.  Bought is used and it's hav'n some probs.  Seems the cylinder pin moves forward under recoil and there some minor rust.  Also, I think there's been some tinkering from the previous owner.

Rather have Ruger get it back to spec..and THEN I'll screw it up!!!
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