Author Topic: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules  (Read 1726 times)

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Offline Fotto

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Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« on: January 06, 2010, 02:33:43 AM »
What the?

"Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
Judge: Racial discrimination claims have merit
By LEVI PULKKINEN
SEATTLEPI.COM STAFF

In a move that could see Washington inmates voting from prison, a federal appeals court has thrown out the state's restrictions on felon voting.

Under state law, residents convicted of a felony currently lose the right to vote until they are released from custody and off of Department of Corrections supervision. Tuesday's split ruling by a 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals panel puts those restrictions in doubt, as two of three judges reviewing the voting rights lawsuit found that the state restrictions unfairly penalize minorities.

Attorneys for six Washington state prisoners, Circuit Court Judge A. Wallace Tashima wrote, "have demonstrated that police practices, searches, arrests, detention practices, and plea bargaining practices lead to a greater burden on minorities that cannot be explained in race-neutral ways."

Joined by Judge Stephen Reinhardt in the majority opinion, Tashima found that black and Latino Washingtonians faced arrest and prosecution at rates far higher than could be explained simply by increased criminal activity. Finding no "race neutral" explanation for the higher incarceration rates, the majority reversed a U.S. District Court decision and ruled in favor of the inmates.

"Although (the state) criticized the experts' studies and the conclusions, the (plaintiffs') reports, when objectively viewed, support a finding of racial discrimination in Washington's criminal justice system," Tashima said in the ruling.

"Given that uncontroverted showing," he added, "in the words of the district court, there can be 'no doubt that members of racial minorities have experienced discrimination in Washington's criminal justice system.'"

Speaking on the ruling, Washington Secretary of State Sam Reed said the court's decision came as a surprise, in part because three circuit court panels elsewhere in the country came to opposite conclusions while reviewing similar cases.

Reed said he believes the state prohibition against prisoner voting remains appropriate.

"That's part of the penalty," Reed said. "A person loses their rights when they violate the rights of others by perpetrating a felony. … As long as when they get out they get a chance to rejoin society, that's the important part."

Reed said he supported a recent change in state law aimed at enabling felons returning to society to regain the vote. Under the new rules, felons no longer have to pay off their court-mandated fines before registering to vote.

Filed 14 years ago, the suit named Reed's office as a defendant as well as the Attorney General's Office and the governor's office. Reed said he expects to appeal the decision either to the U.S. Supreme Court or an 11-judge panel of the 9th Circuit."

Offline magooch

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2010, 03:33:39 AM »
This just proves that you can find a judge, or judges to rule any way you like.  Why not just put the inmates in charge of the prisons while they're at it?  Frankly, I'm surprised that our Dumbycrat officials are fighting this.  They have dead people and non-citizens voting for them, so why not inmates?
Swingem

Offline victorcharlie

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2010, 03:57:33 AM »
It's the 9th Circuit, the most over ridden court in the land.

They ruled with the plaintiffs regarding unequal or disproportionate numbers of minorities being incarcerated. 

One could also make the argument that there are more men in prison than women and that's sexist.

Look for this ruling to be over turned IMO.
"Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. Tolerance in the face of tyranny is no virtue."
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Offline Dee

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #3 on: January 06, 2010, 04:40:27 AM »
I'm sure the LAWYERS that filed this case are only interested in the fair treatment of these convicted felons, and want to HELP ADD POSTIVE PARTICIPANTS to the voting process.
You guys are just sore heads. It takes a LAWYER to determine what's right. You guys just don't have the proper education or mental faculties to make such a decision, as felons voting from prison. Just step back and let "them" figure it out. ;)
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Offline m-g Willy

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2010, 08:06:51 AM »
Do they get to keep thier 2A rights too?

Offline fr3db3ar

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2010, 08:10:19 AM »
Do they get to keep thier 2A rights too?

No...we have to give ours up so that we're all equal.
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Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2010, 08:13:37 AM »
In Va some felons can hunt with and own a shotgun using fine shot for small game in the county they reside in if the judge of the county court allows it . This system works here . Then also most felons don't follow laws to start with .
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline Dee

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #7 on: January 06, 2010, 08:18:39 AM »
Ya know, there are some felons out there that are a damn site more honest than the clowns in D.C., and if he ain't a child molester, rapist or murderer, how long do you punish him after he's done his time? I personally know some folks that are convicted felons and have completely changed their life for the better. I think all that should be taken into account.
Voting though while still in prison. Well, I've said enough.
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Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #8 on: January 06, 2010, 08:21:11 AM »
Dee after they pay for their crime they should be allowed their rights back to a point , why else would the try to go bach into normal life
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline Dee

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #9 on: January 06, 2010, 08:28:57 AM »
Dee after they pay for their crime they should be allowed their rights back to a point , why else would the try to go bach into normal life

That's the way I see it too. But this other, is one of my problems with the system, and it's legal interpreters. While their servin time, they shouldn't be rewarded, with all kinds of perks and recreational tools or voting rights. It should be bad enough in the pen that they don't want to come back.
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Offline Oldshooter

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #10 on: January 06, 2010, 08:41:27 AM »
Quote
It should be bad enough in the pen that they don't want to come back.

Sooooooooooo right! It seems that the left has forgotten why they were sent there in the first place!
Honestly!.... there are a couple of fellas walking the earth right now only cause i dont wanna go to prison for obvious reasons, but Lord help em if I get two weeks notice about my departure date !
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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #11 on: January 06, 2010, 08:59:40 AM »
In Va some felons can hunt with and own a shotgun using fine shot for small game in the county they reside in if the judge of the county court allows it . This system works here . Then also most felons don't follow laws to start with .

      I am a firearms safety instructor here in  NY State...and as stupidly "blue" as this state normally is, here are the rules we teach to.

  1) A felon may attend a firearms safety class, but he/she MUST inform the instructors that they are a felon.

  2) If they are a felon, they may not even TOUCH any firearm. So why bother allowing them to attend ?
   ..you'll have to ask our brilliant state legislature.
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline Oldshooter

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #12 on: January 06, 2010, 09:08:15 AM »
OMG IG thats out there!  ::)
“Owning a handgun doesn’t make you armed any more than owning a guitar makes you a musician.”

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery."

Offline Sourdough

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #13 on: January 06, 2010, 09:14:49 AM »
Read that this morning in the paper, ready to throw up.
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Offline torpedoman

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #14 on: January 06, 2010, 09:46:11 AM »
maybe if the minorities quit committing the majority of the crimes they would not be the majority of the prison population and therefore less likely to be discriminated against. I view of the recent decision lets close the rec rooms and fitness rooms until they pay for membership, and turn off the cable T.V. until they pay for the service because i am tired of being discriminated against by having to pay for my memberships and services while they get theirs free.
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Offline myronman3

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #15 on: January 06, 2010, 09:54:43 AM »
  while it is on one hand nuts; if you entertain it for a few seconds, it starts becoming more appealing.  think of the headhunter d.a.'s out there, if the people they went after were able to vote them out.  and who really knows the d.a.'s better than the people that have had to deal with them?     i am of the opinion, that one of the BIGGEST problems we have in this country is out of control district attorneys. 
    i will grant you, i see alot of problems with this, but there could be an upside to it.  and like dee said, some of the people in prison are alot more honest than the people in washington that are running this country into the ground. 

Offline Casull

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #16 on: January 06, 2010, 10:01:18 AM »
Yeah, well remember the 9th circuit also ruled against the pledge of allegiance a year or two ago.  I think VictorCharlie nailed this one.
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Offline nw_hunter

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #17 on: January 06, 2010, 10:46:13 AM »
Dee after they pay for their crime they should be allowed their rights back to a point , why else would the try to go bach into normal life



I think, while in prison, their rights as free citizens should be suspended. (including the right to vote.)
They should have the right to work hard at a job in prison to pay for their incarceration. No need for tax payers to foot the bill. Prisons in the past have not only paid for themselves, but actually made money for the state.Today the average cost to keep an inmate is around 40,000.00.

After they have paid their debt to society, I think all rights of a citizen should be restored.
Including a right to defend themselves, and hunt with a firearm.

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Offline yellowtail3

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #18 on: January 06, 2010, 11:03:46 AM »
After they have paid their debt to society, I think all rights of a citizen should be restored.
Including a right to defend themselves, and hunt with a firearm.

I agree.
Jesus said we should treat other as we'd want to be treated... and he didn't qualify that by their party affiliation, race, or even if they're of diff religion.

Offline gypsyman

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #19 on: January 06, 2010, 12:05:16 PM »
I think it should be on a case by case decision. If it's a non violent crime, more so, than a person convicted of armed robbery. gypsyman
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Offline Swampman

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #20 on: January 06, 2010, 12:54:19 PM »
I don't think prior felons should have any rights.
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Online ironglow

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #21 on: January 06, 2010, 01:47:10 PM »
Dee after they pay for their crime they should be allowed their rights back to a point , why else would the try to go bach into normal life



I think, while in prison, their rights as free citizens should be suspended. (including the right to vote.)
They should have the right to work hard at a job in prison to pay for their incarceration. No need for tax payers to foot the bill. Prisons in the past have not only paid for themselves, but actually made money for the state.Today the average cost to keep an inmate is around 40,000.00.

After they have paid their debt to society, I think all rights of a citizen should be restored.
Including a right to defend themselves, and hunt with a firearm.




   An example;
     
  1) A felon has robbed a quick-mart..during which he shot and killed a mother of 3.

 2) Another felon snatched a 10 year old girl off the street..rapes and mutilates her.

 3) Another felon sets a house on fire and murders an entire family.

    A wimpy court  sentences them 20 years to life..they are let out shortly after 20...

   ...In what way do you think they have "paid their debt" ? I submit that there is no way on God's green earth they can EVER ..."pay their debt" !
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline Oldshooter

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #22 on: January 06, 2010, 02:18:25 PM »
After they have paid their debt to society, I think all rights of a citizen should be restored.
Including a right to defend themselves, and hunt with a firearm.

I agree.

Nope! not for a violent felon!
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Offline beerbelly

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #23 on: January 06, 2010, 04:48:54 PM »
Ironglow , The examples you used should have gotten the death penalty, no need to worry about their rights.
  I how ever agree that most all felons should get all their rights back after they have payed their debt. If they don't then they were never rights in the first place, but privileges. I don't think a right can be suspended or taken away.
   Which is why I don't believe that we Americans still have rights! We have slowly let the government take our rights and replace them with privileges, which they suspend at will!
                                        Beerbelly








Offline Casull

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #24 on: January 06, 2010, 07:24:58 PM »
Quote
I don't think a right can be suspended or taken away.


Beerbelly, if that were true, we wouldn't be able to suspend those rights while in prison, or even put them in prison in the first place.
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Online ironglow

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #25 on: January 06, 2010, 11:41:25 PM »
Ironglow , The examples you used should have gotten the death penalty, no need to worry about their rights.
  I how ever agree that most all felons should get all their rights back after they have payed their debt. If they don't then they were never rights in the first place, but privileges. I don't think a right can be suspended or taken away.
   Which is why I don't believe that we Americans still have rights! We have slowly let the government take our rights and replace them with privileges, which they suspend at will!
                                        Beerbelly



    BB;
   While I agree, those cases should have been "death penalty" cases, they take place every day. ...But we do not see these perps being fried every day, so we have to deal realistically with what we actually have.
  Other than ugly, violent crimes...after perole and after showing 10-12 years of exemplary lives, i might even consider their re-instatement..but here is where wimpy, lib courts are helping to keep the less violent felons from regaining theirs.... Ironic; No ?
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline PartsMan

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #26 on: January 07, 2010, 08:25:44 AM »
What about the guy that is convected for a crime he didn't do?

What about the father that is in prison for killing his family's murderer/rapist?

Shouldn't they have the right to vote out the officials that let it happen?

If your debt is payed it is payed in my book.

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #27 on: January 07, 2010, 08:57:01 AM »
  Partsman;

   How does a child rapist pay..how does he restore that child's psyche and innocence ?

  How does the murderer of the Quick-mart clerk repay... does he make her to live again ? How can he restore her children's years without a mother ?

  How does the arsonist/murderer repay..does he bring a family back to life and build them a new house ?



   Would someone spending 20 years in jail..PAY IN FULL.. for the loss of one of your loved ones ?
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline thxmrgarand

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #28 on: January 07, 2010, 09:28:22 AM »
If the news report is accurate then clearly the 9th Court is saying that not enough white people are being arrested and prosecuted and therefore a disproportionate number of white people are being allowed to vote.  Maybe President Obama has a plan for that.  I hope he is too busy to get to that and that he remains so.

One barely related point is that when I go door-to-door for candidates for public office I often have a printout of information provided by government that shows whether the people at each residence voted in each of the past several elections - municipal, state and federal.  According to that information many people do not vote.  For all that however, I am happy to say that I believe that gun owners in my town do vote.  I am also happy to remark that many of fellow gun rights advocates go door-to-door exactly as I do - supporting pro-gun candidates of course.

Offline nw_hunter

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Re: Convicted felons entitled to vote, court rules
« Reply #29 on: January 07, 2010, 11:00:56 AM »
[

Nope! not for a violent felon!
[/quote]



Then, your saying a person cannot pay their debt to society?

Most of us on this forum could be capable of shooting someone breaking into our home, and a power hungry prosecutor could twist this self defense action around to be manslaughter in the first or second degree.

It has and does happen you know! Could be me, could be you.If it happened to you, would you still feel the same? (I doubt it)

A child molester, or cold blooded murderer should never be released back into society. In my opinion they should pay their debt with their lives.This type of felon, will never be rehabilitated.
This type of criminal is the exception, not the rule.

I know if I were ever convicted of a crime, and sent to prison, paid my debt and released , I would find a way to arm myself to defend my home and loved ones.



Freedom Of Speech.....Once we lose it, every other freedom will follow.