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Author Topic: 223 Rem - Split Case  (Read 1010 times)

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Offline bikerbeans

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223 Rem - Split Case
« on: January 13, 2010, 08:07:08 AM »
Hi All,

Bought a box of "Custom Loaded" ammo from a local gun shop about a week ago.  This is 62 grn FMJBT 223 Rem that are loaded in this gun shop.  I believe the bullets are pulled military resized, brass is MS headstamp - military & civilian -.  Pretty sure the powder it TAC.  Fired 10 rounds, no problem easy extraction, primers fine.  Gun brand new so not concerned with the accurary that much.  Gun was clean, barrel inspected etc. when I shot round 11 this morning.  Hit 9"inches high @ 100 yards, left to right was fine.  Nothing lose on gun or scope and nothing abnormal noted when I shot.  Figured it must have been me since I was using a 1998 F150 for my "Rest".  Broke the gun open and out cam a 223 brass the length of a 9MM Luger case.  Not good.  I removed the remaining piece of brass very easily by inserting a wire bore brush into the brass from the breech end.  The primer on this round was not flattened.  The brass did look old.  The brass split as if it was cut in half with a knife.  I put the 2 pieces back together and measures 1.77"  I measured about ten of the unfired rounds and about half of them exceeded 1.76", with a couple just over 1.77".  The 39 remaining rounds will not be fired.

few questions:

1.  is 1.77" long enough to pinch the bullet an cause this separation?  Gun is a SB2 Handi.

2. should I have the gun inspected before I shoot it again?  Gun seems fine, locks up fine.  There were no powder burns between the receiver and barrel or under the barrel.

3.  Should I pull the bullets on the unfired rounds and measure the case lengths before I tell the Gun Shop owner?  When measuring case length of a loaded round I can barely catch the edge of the case mouth with my caliper so I want to make sure I am measuring these right.

thanks for your help.

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Offline Steve P

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Re: 223 Rem - Split Case
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2010, 09:25:24 AM »
Sounds like a case head separation from over sizing.  How many times has the brass been fired?  You might want to inquire into this.  I am not familiar with a "MS" head stamp.  You might confirm if ammo is loaded per 5.56 NATO spec or per .223 Remington SAAMI spec.  About 10k PSI pressure difference. 

Steve :)
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Offline bikerbeans

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Re: 223 Rem - Split Case
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2010, 10:51:56 AM »
Ammo is loaded per 223 Rem. specification.  I typed "MS" when I should have typed "mix-headed stamp".  I think the answer for how many reloads is unknown since he takes in used brass for reloading. 
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RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.

Offline jhalcott

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Re: 223 Rem - Split Case
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2010, 11:13:02 AM »
  Since the forward part of the case came out easily, I do not think your chamber was damaged by this case separation. This IS the problem when using some one else's reloads though! You will be far safer using YOUR reloads, starting with NEW brass and keeping track of the # of reloads on it.
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Offline Lloyd Smale

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Re: 223 Rem - Split Case
« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2010, 11:26:29 AM »
doubt you hurt anything. My cetme would do it about once a month! guy couldnt even go to the range without a brass extractor
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Offline bikerbeans

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Re: 223 Rem - Split Case
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2010, 12:27:33 PM »
I bought the reloaded ammo because my dies aren't in yet.  Hopefully Mr. Fedex will be here shortly.  Gotta get the 223 up and running for springtime Ground Pig hunting.

Lloyd your gun sounds like my Norinko SKS with Egyptian Military FMJ.  My gunsmith said it should be a law than if you buy the Egyptian 7.62x39 MM they should have to give you a free brass extractor.
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Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.

Offline stimpylu32

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Re: 223 Rem - Split Case
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2010, 12:40:08 PM »
BB

Sounds to me like a simple case of head seperation caused by the brass being loaded too many time and being shot in too many different chambers , and there a lot of companies that load Re-manufactured ammo ( hand loading on a grand scale ) , the fact that he used mixed brass would be a greater concern to me , as most cases have different case capacities causing pressure issues .

As for the COL , Handi's run long in the chamber , so I'd not be to concerned about the brass being slightly over 1.760 , some of mine run in the 1.790 range and still cause no issues .

stimpy
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Offline jrnevins

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Re: 223 Rem - Split Case
« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2010, 08:43:50 AM »
 ??? I loaded some .223 with Alliant Reloader 10 with a 65gr Sierra soft point bt bullet and used XXXX grains to start with. I was off the mark with that load, to much powder. Actually too hot of a load because it left marks on the casing from the bolt of my AR and blew the CCI primer back out of the casing. So I have been doing some research to see what the right powder charge would be for this powder load.
I do not have my reloader book/manual in yet so I went by the recommendations in the die set.
Would anybody recommend the right powder load for this round? I am still searching. I am down to XXXX grains of powder in this reload and it is still cratering the primer. :-\ Help anyone. Thanks
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Offline bikerbeans

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Re: 223 Rem - Split Case
« Reply #8 on: January 28, 2010, 09:01:04 AM »
This link is to alliant's load manual, rifle page.

http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/RecipeList.aspx?gtypeid=2

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RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.

Offline stimpylu32

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Re: 223 Rem - Split Case
« Reply #9 on: January 28, 2010, 10:42:27 AM »
Quote from: jrnevins on January 28, 2010, 08:43:50 AM
??? I loaded some .223 with Alliant Reloader 10 with a 65gr Sierra soft point bt bullet and used 25.6 grains to start with. I was off the mark with that load, to much powder. Actually too hot of a load because it left marks on the casing from the bolt of my AR and blew the CCI primer back out of the casing. So I have been doing some research to see what the right powder charge would be for this powder load.
I do not have my reloader book/manual in yet so I went by the recommendations in the die set.
Would anybody recommend the right powder load for this round? I am still searching. I am down to 24.5 grains of powder in this reload and it is still cratering the primer. :-\ Help anyone. Thanks

Are you using the data from a set of Lee dies ?

The reason I ask is that I find no data for that powder / bullet combo in 223 , I have checked the new Lyman - Hornady - Lee and even the Alliant Reloaders Guide with no luck .

You need to do a big step backwards till you have the proper data , hate to see you end up hurt or worse .

stimpy
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Offline jedman

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Re: 223 Rem - Split Case
« Reply #10 on: January 29, 2010, 02:50:07 AM »
  The Alliant powder reloaders guide that I have ( 2005 ) only lists bullets in the 50-55 grains being loaded with R 10 and with a max load with a 55 gr. bullet as 22.0 grs.
I would think you are way over max with a 65 gr. bullet. The giuide shows a loading of 25.5 grs. of R 15 as being max. with a 69 gr. HPBT bullet.   Jed
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