41 Mag and unique

[cbourbeau32]

I just paid for and should receive my 41 mag in Ruger blackhawk 4 5/8" barrel next week. I have been looking for load data for a few weeks since I knew what I was getting. I have the Alliant Powder Manual but it only has a few bullet weights listed and all of them are jacketed in my book. What I want to shoot is a 210 grain cast bullet. The powder manual list 10.1 grains of Unique as a max load for a jacketed 210 grain. Am I safe with that load data for cast bullets of the same weight? Any replies appreciated. Thanks, Charlie

[Luckyducker]

I have loaded the 210 bullets with Unique and kept the load down to 8 grains and frankly 10+ grains sounds really top end.  I don't think the pressure would bother the Blackhawk but I think bore leading would be horrible.  I don't know how familiar you are with shooting cast bullets but bore leading can be a real bitch, and top end loads can really be a contributing factor unless the bullet hardness, style, and size is just right for the load.

[cbourbeau32]

Thanks Duck. Do you know what velocities you are getting with 8.0 of Unique?

[Larry Gibson]

I use 8.5 gr Unique under a Lee 410-210-SWC for excellent accuracy at 1150 fps out of my 7 1/2" ruger Bisley.  I expect you will get 950 - 1000 fps from your shorter barrel. It was also an excellent load in a 4" M58 I had once and regret the "had". Velocity was 960 from the S&W. 

Larry Gibson

[Sweetwater]

Congrats on the buy!! Long live the 41 mag!!

As a matter of procedure; if you are not given a starting load, the max load minus 10percent is where you probably should start your work up. Approach max with judicious caution. Some of our comfort loads are closer to max - 20% ie max = 10.4gr and we like 8gr or 8.5gr as a working load. Special purpose loads can approach max, but you'll shoot a lot more and enjoy it more with a tad milder load. You may find a heavier bullet is more to your liking. My preference has always been a 220gr - 235gr in a Keith type or what is known as a WFN (wide flat nose). I know 950fps will punch the lights out of antelope and deer out to further than I can see anymore without a scope. Wyoming was a great training ground!

2008 Alliant manual shows max 9.7gr Unique CCI 300 primer and 210gr Gold Dot jacketed bullets.
Speer #12 manual shows max 8.5gr Unique CCI 300 primer and 210gr TMJ-Sil jacketed bullets.
Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook (3rd ed) shows max 10.7gr Unique Rem 2 1/2 primer and 212gr cast bullet.
Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook (3rd ed) shows max 10.4gr Unique Rem 2 1/2 primer and 215gr cast bullet.

Velocities are about 1200fps from 4" vented barrel.

FWIW - My records show 7.4gr Green Dot (slightly faster than Unique) CCI 300 primer and 215gr cast bullet. Nice mild load in my 5 1/2 Bisley Blackhawk and 1050fps at an air temp of 45Fdegrees. Same load in my Blackhawk 45/8" barrel is 950fps, 1100fps in my Marlin rifle.

Make sure your barrel is smooth, lap if necessary and probably is, and you should have no problem with cast bullets that are correct for your gun. One size does not fit all.
Take your time and reap the benefits. It's a great ride!

Regards,
Sweetwater

[securitysix]

If you're shooting lead bullets, go buy the Lyman and/or Lee manuals.  They have more lead bullet data than any of the other manuals I'm familiar with. 

[cbourbeau32]

Congrats on the buy!! Long live the 41 mag!!
Regards, Sweetwater

Thanks Sweetwater (and everyone else) I bought the 41 because I like to be a little different than most everyone else. I looked at 45 colt, 44 mag and 41 mag all in blackhawk. I decided on the 41 for the reason I listed above. Please keep the replies coming as I haven't purchased reloading components yet except for the fact that I have unique powder already but doesn't everyone.

As to heavier bullet weights I would like to use a heavier bullet but want to cast and really want to use Lee molds but they only show to offer the 210 (or lighter). Any suggestions as to where to buy a heavier mold would be appreciated.

Charlie

[Luckyducker]

I haven't started casting-my-own bullets so far but have been considering it for a while.  With that said, I do know what kind of bullets I prefer and those are the true Keith style bullets.  The Keith bullet has a flat base and wide deep grease groove with square walls and a wide driving band as well as a wide meplate.  The casters tell me the bevel base bullets are easier to make but I just don't like them, as for me the bevel seems to funnel hot combustion gases up the sides of the bullet causing melt off on the bore of my gun.  Also most commercial casters make their bullets too hard (20 BHN?) and bullets cast to around 12BHN will generally leave little or no lead in the bore.  A harder bullet can be shot well in certain loads with enough pressure to cause the bullet to obturate the bore and fill the grooves with lead so that the gases don't blow past the sides of the bullet but that is more trial and error than communal information.   I will advise you to be picky about the style of moulds you select because all moulds are not created equal.

[tobster]

I don't remember the load off the top of my head, but I also have  had good luck with Green Dot and cast bullets for  mild loads in the .41 Mag.

[spinafish]

for something heavier check out these..http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=126006..the 265 grainers from Cast Performance..

[Autorim]

I think you will find 7.0 to 8.0 grains of Unique to be a good working load. UPS delivered today my order of 500 Starline .41 mag cases - gotta like that. I have two .41 mag Rugers and both are now with Alan Harton for more work. I have .44 mags and .45 Colts, but the .41 mag is going to be the revolver round that I will work with all year and hunt with next fall.


Ken

[Sweetwater]

Not sure why you want to use Lee molds. I expect price has a bit to do with it. My pal found a Saeco mold for the 41mag. 215gr with a nice meplet and driving band. Casts easy and is accurate. $15.00 at a local gun show. I've had two Lee molds, one I still have and I try not to use it. It doesn't work easy.

The 265gr from Cast Performance is a good bullet. I prefer their 250grWFN. The 265gr I bought was a WLN and it was a hammer, more than I wanted. Though I do cast, I try a lot of bullets others make and have found some great ones and made some friends around the country.

Molds, to a degree, are like cars. Some Fords, some Chevys, even some junkers. Different folks have different requirements. Get what works for you and make it happen. You'll want to find some mil-surp WC820, H110, W296, AA#9 or some such slower powder when you venture into bullets above 210gr - or even to use with full power loads with the 210's.

Keep us up with your adventure.

Regards,
Sweetwater

[Dand]

A long time ago Lee made a 238 gr round nose mold and a 240 SWC mold for the 41 mag. I have one each.  Haven't cast much with them but they worked well when I did. I think the swc would be more effective.  I think the RN might be a little too pointy to use in my Marlin 41 mag so I haven't been in a rush to cast with it lately.

Shop gun shows, maybe post on GB classifieds and you might locate one of those old molds. Or check out the SAECO listings. They have some heavier 41 cal molds tho they aren't cheap. Keep a look out for the occassional LBT or NEI heavy 41 molds.  Lyman even made a mold that would drop a 235 gr SWC but I don't recall the mold number.

Oregon Trail's  Tru Shot line of cast bullets also has some heavy (250-265) bullets for the 41 mag. I've had good performance with their conventional 41 cast bullets but haven't got round to trying TruShots as I have a good supply of Cast Performance 250-255-265 bullets. For these heavy bullets I use 2400, 4227, H110. I think they are too heavy to use with Unique powder.

edits added 1-17-10
I too have used Green Dot and Unique for moderate level cast loads and they work very well. I think I used about 7 gr Green Dot and 8-9 gr of Unique for 200 - 235 gr cast bullets  - but check some manuals. I mostly use Unique now. Yes get the Lyman manual. Or shop for the old Lyman Cast Bullets book [don't recall exact title] a small pocket book size manual with a black cover. It  lists about 4 or 5 molds for the 41 mag with loads, plus all their molds and numbers available at the time it was printed (70's or 80's??). Great little reference if you can find one.

Also, to the best of my knowledge you are generally safe to use a jacketed powder load for a cast bullet as the cast bullet is softer and presents less resistance. But you may get leading if the lead bullet is driven too fast.  Usually you can get a cast bullet going faster with less powder (and usually a little faster burning powder) than it takes for a jacketed bullet.