Survival Rifle from recent ammo shortage perspective

[Dixie Dude]

Based on ammo shortages in your area, what would be the best one rifle (center fire) for survival with ammo availibility.  I think it would be the 30-06.  It seemed to always be on store shelves, even with the shortages.  What do you guys think?  Military ammo like .308, .223, and 7.62x39 seemed to always be in short supply. 

[Questor]

Why not shop for ammo in the quantity you want to own, then find a rifle chambered for it?

[rex6666]

I would have to go with the 308 or 223 because they are military and seems to
always be military around when problems come up

[Dixie Dude]

I'm not shopping, have guns in all these calibers, and I reload.  I was just wondering, from store shelves in your area what was still available during the shortages.  Military rounds were NOT readily available in my area during shortages. 

[SHOOTALL]

I think it was a writer named Finn Abergard ( spelling may be poor ) that did an article back in the 80's with regard to finding ammo after a SHTF deal. He suggested having a unpopular cal. rifle . His thought was something such as a 303 or russian cart. or some odd ball sporting cal. He felt that there would be a run on stores and in the aftermath you would stand a better chance with finding odd stuff . He has a point really but another point is there is little excuse for not having say 250 rounds for a rifle and 50 for your handgun . These figures would be min. for on the go , like when trying to get out of harms way on foot . Survival means just that . Staying alive to live another day . Getting  in fight is a good way not to survive . I would also point out it may not be possible to avoid all trouble and a means to stop a fight quick would be welcome . So one if on the run on the foot how much can you carry ? A light weapon with ammo comes after food and water . It would appear that any weapon equal to a 30-30 would work . In a shtf deal one would have to realize that ammo and guns along with other needs can be liberated from those attacking you after the attack is eliminated . What that says is pick up what you need along the way , after a few days there should be a plenty stuff laying around if it was bad enough in the first few days that you really needed a weapon to protect yourself.

To ansewer your question though , stock up early on ammo for what you have to shoot it in . Maybe buy a case of ammo instead of a new gun .

[rex6666]

i was thinking of after a conflict their should be lots of 308 and 223 ammo
and rifles to be had. If we are on the run ahead of time, i have a single shot
223 and 204 ruger which are both very light and the 204 ruger ammo is light enough to carry 2-300 rounds. I could use the 204 for most game, but the 223
would be better for later on.

[Swampman]

Marlin 336 in .30-30 or a H&R Handi in .30-30 or .357 has always made the most sense.

[rex6666]

Marlin 336 in .30-30 or a H&R Handi in .30-30 or .357 has always made the most sense.

please enlighten me swampy, my sensibilities are fading

[bearmgc]

Its not a shortage if ammo has been stocked up already....but if not stocked, then 30-30 does seem to make sence as it still can be had reletively cheaper than most of the other stuff. Second choice would be .243, because it seems so many people are getting rid of their .243's, and lots of ammo are advertised.

[Swampman]

Any farm house or mom & pop may have .30-30 ammo.  Rimless cartridges are unreliable in the Handi.

[SHOOTALL]

How much game would be around ?

[Mxpe78a]

12 gauge, it is still available everywhere. I suppose there will be alot around to find after SHTF.

[SHOOTALL]

In the end of times a shotgun ( and maybe a flintlock ) will be the last weapon as it can be loaded with most anything from shot to rocks. Bird shot can be replaced with many things.

[Swampman]

I thought the question was about rifles?

[SHOOTALL]

Swampman , I'm waiting for the "what if you run into a bear ? "

[teamnelson]

Guessing I won't be going to stores for anything at all much less ammo in this scenario.
Guessing alot of milspec ball and 12 gauge will be consumed rapidly as we don't have machetes like they do in Haiti.
Guessing there won't be much manufacturing or distribution of ammo.
Guessing anything large enough to see will be inhumanely killed by starving folks forced to hunt their food.
So I'd say stock up now, shoot like each bullet will never be replaced, whichever caliber you prefer.

A good shot with a .22 might be able to upgrade fairly easily.

[Dee]

Anything edible will be. I wouldn't worry about running into a bear too much. The deer population has not recovered in this part of North Central Texas since the Great Depression ended.
No one in the lower 48 is going to realistically live off the land. They will be scrounging like every one else. 223, and 12 gauge will be the order of the day. The military uses both, and it will logically be the only caliber and gauge still supplied to the country.
One may cache but, if one has to become mobile, ammunition is heavy, and one must think of rush hour traffic only in this case, vehicle being abandoned on the roadways for one reason or another.
I doubt that the highway north of Dallas Texas would be passable after a week of chaos.JMOO

TeamNelson, I think we were typing at the same time. I agree, and 22lr, will be a bonus any where, and a boon all the time.

[SHOOTALL]

22 ammo will be used like money in bad times some predict

[Dee]

I would be very hesitant to trade ammo away. It may be used against you, to take the rest of what you have. Morals at times may have to be set aside for survival.

[swordfish]

Muzzle Loader. Ball.
Back to the basics.

[sagegrouse715]

"The Road" is coming?

[MGMorden]

Any farm house or mom & pop may have .30-30 ammo.  Rimless cartridges are unreliable in the Handi.

Don't know about the Handi (I've got a Pardner 20ga but no H&R rimless rifles), but the Rossi is of a pretty similar design and I've got a .308 in that that has never given me any trouble.  

As to the question at hand, I'd say a .30-06 because in my experience ammo for it is the most common (even moreso than .30-30; .30-30 is *cheaper*, but not more common).  That said, I think the question at hand might be the wrong one .  Truthfully, for a survival gun, if I could just have 1, it would be a 12ga shotgun hands down.  Nothing is more versatile.  From squirrel with small shot up to just about as big as you want to imagine with slugs, a 12ga can be used to hunt pretty much anything.  Ammo is usually pretty cheap too.  And if it had to be a rifle, it'd be .22LR.  A .22LR in a survival situation will take deer with a headshot, and ammo is plentiful and dirt cheap.  Not to mention small - you can store thousands of .22LR rounds in the space required to hold a few dozen centerfire rounds.  

[SHOOTALL]

Dee that was the idea the arthors had and why 22 LR . it was suited for small game but not attacks aginst better armed positions .

[Graybeard]

7.62x39 was never in short supply around here and prices on it never went up. When I paid a bit over $400 per thousand for .223 FMJ I could have picked up a thousand 7.62x39 either FMJ or HP for $250 or less out the door from any gun store I visited. They had multiple stacks of those thousand round cases in most stores.

I think the 7.62x39 and .223 are the two to have rifles for on hand. Anyone you are in a shooting war with is gonna be using one or the other so you can resupply from them once you have eliminated the threat. If they eliminate you instead then they can resupply from you. Nothing else will even be close in comparison to the available of those two.

Personally I prefer to have a variety of different chamberings and an adequate supply of ammo and components so I'll not need to worry about where I'm gonna pick up my ammo. I'd also say .22LR is a wise choice to have on hand. You can pick up 5000 rounds of that for less than 1000 of anything else.

[Dee]

Dee that was the idea the arthors had and why 22 LR . it was suited for small game but not attacks aginst better armed positions .

Oh I don't know about that. Law Enforcement played with the American 180 for a while and some debts still have them. In my 20 year L.E. career, I saw far more 22lr shootings and deaths than any other caliber or gauge. The right rifle in the hands of a capable fighter can do a lot of damage in a very short period of time. A 22lr armed sniper with reasonably good skills can make life miserable for an armed "position". The same sniper with excellent skills and a good 22lr can make life impossible for that same "position".
It is the caliber of choice for many assassins.

[SHOOTALL]

I have read about roit control where the leaders were to be shot in the knees with a 22mag.

[Dee]

My point is not to argue, but instead is NOT TO ARM SOMEONE that might end up shooting you own ammo back at you.

[bearmgc]

That makes sense.

[teamnelson]

Dee that was the idea the arthors had and why 22 LR . it was suited for small game but not attacks aginst better armed positions .

Oh I don't know about that. Law Enforcement played with the American 180 for a while and some debts still have them. In my 20 year L.E. career, I saw far more 22lr shootings and deaths than any other caliber or gauge. The right rifle in the hands of a capable fighter can do a lot of damage in a very short period of time. A 22lr armed sniper with reasonably good skills can make life miserable for an armed "position". The same sniper with excellent skills and a good 22lr can make life impossible for that same "position".
It is the caliber of choice for many assassins.

Picture wife and daughter laying down cover fire with their 10/22s, firing asynchronous controlled bursts in a pattern that allows the recipient the opportunity to pop his head up while they still have rounds in the magazine. Allows maneuver for son and I to gain a good position to put well aimed .22 shot into target who thought they were behind a defendable position.

If you can hit pdogs with a .17 or .22, you can hit a vital on an untrained unexperienced agressor with same weapon. I can't afford to prepare myself against an organized, trained, well armed and motivated agressor wearing SAAPI plates. Them I avoid; if cornered, a .22 will penetrate ballistic cloth anywhere the plates aren't. Get a nice ricochet off a spare magazine conveniently carried on the abdomen to redirect the round into the gap along the side, and you may not get bang flop, but it'll seriously retard forward movement.

Not that I think about these things often.

[jimster]

Nothing wrong with a good .22lr in bad times.  If for some reason you don't have access to your home and all your goodies for a long time, you can carry a whole lot more ammo on you. They are also quiet and in come cases might be harder to tell where the shot came from.