Obama to defund space program...

[ironglow]

  He will defund space exploration and put NASA top work on more important things...like trying to "prove" global warming...

  
    http://www.spacepolitics.com/2007/11/20/obama-cut-constellation-to-pay-for-education/

[Dee]

Sounds good to me. Maybe the global warmin deal will be cheaper. It makes just as much sense, as paying to shoot other countries astronuts to a space station we paid, and pay for.

[mcwoodduck]

Will someone show this Idiot a graph of the solar (the sun- you know the big heat source in the sky) activity.
Then over lay the earth temperatures on that same graph.  WOW they match.
Now over lay the amount of time we have been uning fosil fuels and WOW look we had solar activity in the 1400's that cooled and warmed the earth and we did not have fosil fuels.
We have had volcanic eruptions that have spilled tens of millions of times the CO2 into the air as all the cars on the planet and that has not spiked the earth temp.
The E-mails showing this was all about extorting $ from governments, companies, and people to study the event was what this was all about and the anti American, anti capitalist, anti growth, people are the ones who have embrased this idea so we will not be the only Super Power left in the world.
OH not to mention OSAMA Bin Laden announced this Earth day he agrees with Al Gore and the whole global warming myth and wants us to go back to the 12th century.
Did you ever think the #1 terrorist and a Democrat VP would see eye to eye on an issue?

[Dee]

Did you ever think the #1 terrorist and a Democrat VP would see eye to eye on an issue?

Well, uh, yes, I did, or uh, do.
Honestly mcwoodduck, is ALGORE any one you would expect an honest and intelligent conversation from on ANY SUBJECT. His daddy is why he was in D.C., and there wasn't a bigger crook than ALGORE SR.

                             BENJAMIN FRANKLIN WAS RIGHT! "TRADERS" DON'T DESERVE FREEDOM

[myronman3]

name one important thing that has come from the space program.   i laughed my butt off when bush was talking about us going to mars, then i saw a sign on the news someone was holding that said, "send bush to mars."  i laughed for days on that one. 
   i think the space program is/has been a giant waste of money. 

[45-70.gov]

people  failed to see  the use  of  flight  in  combat

used  to be  who ever  ruled  the sea  ruled the land  [england  spain  ect.]

who ever  rules the sky now rules  the sea  and  the land.......aaaaaah   thats  us

soon a day  will  be  who ever  rules  space  rules  the sky  seas  and  land

I HOPE  THATS  US......NO MATTER  THE COST

people  are starving  becaus  they are too  lazy to plant  food..
who cares
people are  dieing  because they wont quit smoking
who cares

[Matt]

name one important thing that has come from the space program. 

http://techtran.msfc.nasa.gov/at_home.html

Have a look and see... Then do a google search for "Benefits of the Manned Space Program"

Matt

[ironglow]

 Myoroman;
    While I'm not greatly in favor of the space program itself, it is undeniable that many important things have come about by way of the space program..computers, corelle ware and many other high temp ceramics for industry & defense plus many other things.
  Here's a PARTIAL list;
   http://www.thespaceplace.com/nasa/spinoffs.html
    In any case, I see more sense funding the space program than handing more millions & billions to the ACLU, ACORN, trying terrorists in federal court, chasing the myth of "global warming" , funding The National Endowment for the Arts, funding research as to why cows have flatulence or why dogs bark at strangers (true cases), funding "midnight basketball"...or spending half a billion dollars for the Obamas and a bunch of politicians with their families & staffs to vacation in Copenhagen...and then get nothing done....(thank God) !

[Dee]

If it were not for the Space Program, we would not have WD40. Plain ole fish oil, in aerosol form. Ahhh yes! The space program.




          BENJAMIN FRANKLIN WAS RIGHT! "TRADERS" DON'T DESERVE FREEDOM!

[myronman3]

i still think that the space program has been/is a colosal waste.  none of the stuff listed affects my life much at all.  in fact, it looks like a list of stuff i could live just fine without and i doubt my quality of life would be any less than it is now. 

[Cabin4]

The federal government needs to cut spending. Any real spending cut is a good one at this time. Benefits or no benefits of the space program.

[scootrd]

name one important thing that has come from the space program.   i laughed my butt off when bush was talking about us going to mars, then i saw a sign on the news someone was holding that said, "send bush to mars."  i laughed for days on that one.  
   i think the space program is/has been a giant waste of money.  

I also think the manned flight missions are a waste of $$$ However NASA research has employed many and thanks to the space programs we have the following list of products to name a few derived from the space program research and development. (equates to a lot of private sector Jobs)
And lets not forget TANG!!!!
 
360 Degree Camera
3-D Synthetic Vision Flight Displays
Advanced Hydrogen Sensors
Advanced Lubricants
Advanced Welding Torch
Aerodynamic Bicycle Wheels
Air Catalysts for Carbon Monoxide Poisoning
Aircraft Collision Avoidance
Aircraft Design Analysis
Airline Wheelchairs
Airliner TV Transmission Via Satellite
AiroCide TiO2 Air Purifier
Anthrax Smoke Detector
Arteriosclerosis Detection
Artificial Heart
Astronaut Plant Bag
Athletic Shoes
Audiometric System for Hearing Assessment
Automated Urinalysis
Automatic Insulin Pump  -  Which has saved my wife's life
Automotive Design
Automotive Insulation
BAFCO Linear Actuators
Balance Evaluation System
Biomass Production System for Education
Bioreactor Demonstration System
Bioreactor Human Tissue Growth
Bone Analyzer
Breast Biopsy
Breast Cancer Screening
Bridge Safety Improvements
Cabin Pressure Altitude Monitor and Warning System
Camera on a Chip
Cardiac Pacemaker
Cataract Surgery Tools
Chemical Warfare Hood
Chromosome Analysis
Clean Room Apparel
Clean Water for Homes
Coastal Zone Color Scanner
Compact Blood Diagnostic Equipment
Compact Fire and Rescue Extraction Devices
Composite Forceps
Composite Materials Development - Golf Clubs
Computer Joysticks
Computer-Aided Tomography (CAT Scanner)
Computer Reader for the Blind
Convection Oven
Cool Vest Therapeutic Suits
Cordless Power Tools and Appliances
Corporate Jet Wing Designs
Corrosion Protection Coating
Crop Dusting Improvements
Crop Growing Improvements
DeBakey Heart Pump
Dental Arch Wire
Digital Mammography
Diving Optical Profiler
DMI Remote Sensing Fish-Finding Service
Doppler Radar
Ear Thermometer
Edible Toothpaste
Electric Car
Emission Testing
Emulsified Zero-Valent Iron Remediation
Energy Storage Systems
Engine Coatings
Engine Design
Engine Lubricant
Failsafe Flashlight
Fetal Heart Monitor
Fire Detection Systems
Firefighter Breathing System
Firefighter Radios
Firefighting Equipment
Fireman’s Air Tanks
Fitness Equipment
Flame Detector
Foam-In-Place Seating Technology
Freeze Drying Technologies
Gas Detector
Gasoline Vapor Recovery
Geosynchronous Orbiting
Golf Ball Aerodynamics
GPS Navigation
Helmet Padding
High Temperature Soldering Blocks
High-Pressure Waterstripping
Historical Document Condition Analysis
Home Insulation
Human Tissue Stimulator
Implantable Heart Aid
Improved Aircraft Engines
Inertial Motion-Tracking for Virtual Reality
Infrared Camera
Infrared Thermometer
Insulation
Insulin Pumps
Interactive Computer Training
InTime Agricultural Remote Sensing
Invisible Braces
Kidney Dialysis
Land Mine Removal Device
Laser Angioplasty
Laser Heart Surgery
Laser Wire Stripper
Lead Poison Detection
Lifeshears - Emergency Rescue Cutters
Lightning Protection
Low Vision Enhancement System (LVES)
Lubricant Coating Process
Machine Tool Software
Magnetic Bearing System
Magnetic Liquids
Magnetic Resonance Imaging
Medical Gas Analyzer
Methane-Powered Vehicles
Microelectromechanical Systems
Microlasers
Miniature Accelerometers
Modified Carbon Nanotube Materials
Ocean Fluorometer
Ocular Screening
Oil Spill Control
PackBot Tactical Mobile Robot
Palate Surgery Technology
Personal Storm Warning System
Pesticide-Free Mosquito Killing System
Phenotype MicroArray
Photodynamic Therapy
Physical Therapy
Pill Sized Transmitter
Plantronics Wireless Communications Devices
Portable X-Ray Device
Precision Lightning Strike Location System
Programmable Pacemaker
PRO-SAN Non-Toxic Microbicidal Santizer
Prosthesis Material
Protective Clothing
PureSense Water and Air Purification Systems
Quartz Clock
Radiant Barrier Technology
Radiation Hazard Detector
Real-Time Emergency Action Coordination Tool
Remote Controlled Light Switch
Remote Command and Control Appliances
Ribbed Swimsuit
Robotic Arms
Robotic Hands
Satellite Computer Data Transmission
Satellite Computer Image Transmission
Satellite Crop Growth & Monitoring
Satellite Fishing Technology
Satellite Stabilization
Satellite Telephone Signal Transmission
Satellite TV Transmission
School Bus Improvements
Secure Mobile Router System
Self-Locking Fasteners
Self-Righting Life Raft
Ski Boots
Skin Care Product Effectiveness Technology
Smoke Detector Improvements
Smoke Penetrating Forest Fire Analysis
Solar Power Technologies
Solid State High-Power Transmitters
Space Pens
SpiraFlex Resistance Exercise Device
Stadium Roofing Fabric
Standing Wave Reflectometer Wire Analyzer
Studless Winter Tires
Sunglasses Blocking Harmful Rays
Surgical Brain Tumor Probe
Temper Foam Technology
Temperature Pill
Thermal Gloves and Boots
Thermal Protection Insulation
Three-dimensional Thermal Tomography in Radiation Oncology
Tire Deflating Devices - MagnumSpike
Tollbooth Air Purification
Ultrasound Scanners
Ultrasound Skin Damage Assesment
VEGGIE - Deployable Vegetable System
Vehicle Brake Improvements
Vehicle Tracking
Velcro
Video Stabilization
Virtual Reality
Vision Screening System
Voice Controlled Wheelchair
Warfighter Accelerated Recovery
Waste Heat Energy Conversion
Waste Water Purification
Water Purification
Weight Saving Composite Materials
Welding Sensor System
Whale Tracking Technologies
Windshear Prediction
WindTracer for Tracking Aircraft Wake Vortices
Wireless Communications
ZipNut

[skarke]

scootrd,

I grew up right next to the Johnson Space Center.  Many of my neighbors were, and are now, NASA scientists, engineers, technicians, etc.  Given that the US is defunding space exploration, why don't we just defund all of our science and research.  I mean, the $7 Trillion we've spent on welfare has certainly driven scientific innovation as well, such as:

How to cut the face out of a welfare card and replace it with another's
How to buy a 32c banana, pay for it with a $5 food stamp, get $4.68 back, walk to the liquor store and pick up a couple of Schlitz Malt Liquors
How to buy votes with other peoples money

Who needs to remain technologically superior to China anyway.  After all, they certainly "hope" we "change".

[Squib]

I think that flying around in space shuttles and feeling majestic seems goofy but that's the childhood dream kids have when they play with legos and buzz lightyear, I think those people with doctorate degrees up there probably have some business to conduct to necessitate coming back to earth emaciated and too weak to walk much, with osteoporosis.... I HOPE!  I'm all for funding science but I don't understand why they want to fly around to do it, but if it's working why fight it? 

I'm all for starving out the bums too Skarke, like octomom and her 14 kids!

[ironglow]

  Perhaps some here have missed the point. His highness is not going to SAVE those billions of dollars nor use those funds to cut taxes...
  No; by his own admission he is going to pay the NASA scientists to search for "proof" of global warming. That makes sense to him, since he has already done the same with the investigators of the CIA.
  The funds for these organizatioons have not been eliminated...just "redirected"..are you pleased with that ?

    Anybody with a bit of logic can see the advantage satellite platforms give us in a military, weather or exploration sense...If the boy wonder succeeds with his plans for pulling the teeth and blinding the eyes of the CIA and NASA, within just a few years Russia & China will have weapons in  space to a point where they can dictate terms to us.
  Perhaps Obama and his supporters in this endeavor, figure he/they will just "charm" the Russians & Chinese out of their global plans for domination.
    That list Scootrd presented; if you love anybody who would have died a few years ago, or perhaps have yourself been saved by a heart pacemaker, insulin pump, early breast cancer diagnosis, laser surgery or a myriad of other medical/surgical tools & procedures..may just appreciate the program.
  Economically, do not kid yourself into thinking the discoveries opf the space program do not "rub off" into and provide great advantages for our aircraft industry, natural resources exploration, forestry, weather prediction, and intelligence gathering.
  Shucks, one hurricane ..predicted early enough could save the cost of the space program for that year. And with the number of Al Queda evil ones planning attacks against us who were located by satellite and  eliminated by a space program produced drone..may well have saved us the cost of the whole program up until now. How much did 9/11 for instance, cost us overall?
  Added to this, we have the announced plans by his highness that he is also cancelling defensive missle systems which were well on their way to introduction.. geared to be placed in eastern Europe..and we have a recipe for surrender.


  Are the cries of "Mancuhrian Candidate" truly unfounded ?

[hunt-m-up]

If you have DISH or DIRECT TV or enjoy the use of your GPS I'd say the space program has been good to you. I'm sure there are more than a few here who enjoy this site due to satellite technology.
What about across the board cuts? I know it will never happen, but that's the way it should be approached.

Space aliens need to get better organized and suck at the welfare teat, it's obvious they don't represent as much voting potential as other illegal aliens...

[scootrd]

scootrd,
How to cut the face out of a welfare card and replace it with another's How to buy a 32c banana, pay for it with a $5 food stamp, get $4.68 back, walk to the liquor store and pick up a couple of Schlitz Malt Liquors
How to buy votes with other peoples money,

Big conversation in my house as well. My wife grew up in east Dallas area , her first job was at an  in-convenience store. She would tell me stories exactly as you wrote above. Pretty disgusting I agree.

I grew up Rural and semi middle class (my dad sold appliances for Sears and Roebuck. I said semi middle cause if he didnt make a sale , it was Kraft macaroni and Cheese and chicken again for dinner.  But we always had a roof over our head , and whatever we went without I didnt really miss anyways. Instead of a new Bike , I would find an old frame and build one , instead of a new rifle , I would inherent a hand me down etc.. We were still better off financially than some of the families I grew up next too.

I remember one family  whose dad died and the mother had to go on welfare for a while to take care of the Kids . It was very hard on them, The mom and Kids were always ashamed.  They never abused the system , and once She found a job she immediately got off the roles, and was thankful she could. My Uncles (most of them ) were blue collar and drove Bakery trucks , or wise potato chip trucks etc.. and once my dad let them know the situation , they would always make a point to drop the day old bread , donuts , cakes , chips etc by her door till she could get on her feet and fully support her family.  Neighbors helping neighbors seemed so simple back then.

I just don't understand how and when the welfare program became a generational hand out instead of temporary hand up during times of crisis.

But back on point  -  Thank GOD for NASA R&D. especially their contributions and breakthroughs that could be leveraged by private sector companies and throughout our medical communities.

[ms]

14 October 2000
NASA and Nazis - Origins of the US Space Program
In 1994, Carl Sagan wrote in his book, "Pale Blue Dot":

Sending people to orbit the Earth or robots to orbit the Sun requires rockets--big, reliable, powerful rockets. Those same rockets can be used for nuclear war. The same technology that transports a man to the Moon can carry nuclear warheads halfway around the world. The same technology that puts an astromonmer and a telescope in Earth orbit can also put up a laser "battle station." Even back then (in the 1960's), there was fanciful talk in military circles, East and West, about space as the new "high ground," about the nation that "controlled" space "controlling" the Earth. . . . Apollo was not mainly about science. It was not even mainly about space. Apollo was about ideological confrontation and nuclear war--often described by such euphemisms as world "leadership" and national "prestige.". . . When President Kennedy formulated the Apollo program, the Defense Department had a slew of space projects under development--ways of carrying military personnel up into space, means of conveying them around the Earth, robot weapons on orbiting platforms intended to shoot down satellites and ballistic missiles of other nations. . .
Not much has changed, has it?

Understanding that these rockets directly evolved from Nazi scientists, using slave labor from concentration camps, brings the tale of nuclear weapons full circle.

And as David Krieger once pointed out, nuclear weapons are the equivalent of the Nazi crematoriums, patiently waiting to be delivered to countless millions of new victims.

The legacy of Hitler is alive and well.

Steven Starr

[scootrd]

14 October 2000
NASA and Nazis - Origins of the US Space Program
In 1994, Carl Sagan wrote in his book, "Pale Blue Dot":

I was aware of that read , (and it is a very good read) There is no good nor bad in Pure R&D ,  It's how we as humans choose to exploit and implement new Tech breakthroughs and discoveries that makes such R&D good or evil. Prosthesis Material , Portable X-Ray Device, Digital Mammography, good , Human race hellbent on racing towards control of the stars and space to propel us all towards annihilation - Not so good. FYI , The Stars Wars program never really died in the Regan Admin. Today they still test what effects lasers shot from space have on our atmosphere.  Hmm .. wonder why they do that?

[45-70.gov]

if  we  don't already  have  NUKES  on  the dark side of the moon

we   need  to elect  some one  that will

do  we  know for  sure  some one  else  doesn't  have a nuke base in space?
if so  do we  have the technology  to take it  out?

aren't  our  tomahawk  missiles  guided  by satalites??
how  about  artillery  fire  and  troop  positioning?
gps i NICE  while on  the road....VITAL  to  our  troops

gps  on  a simi-truck  probly  slightly  lowers   your grocery bill


i  see  the point  of  the post  too
elections  have consequences
do what ever  it  takes to stop  democrats  [republicans...your next to go]

[briarpatch]

I can walk outside and look at the VAB. vehicle assemble building. I live here on the space coast and most people around me work there or have something to do with it. My daughter and son in law work there.
Not withstanding all that, it is a money pit.
Most of what has come from it, could have been been realized much cheaper through private industry.
The worst thing about shutting the space center down or its programs. The liar has said he would outsource the work to China and Russia.
Now, how does that work to the advantage of this Country?
For that reason I say, let the undocumented worker leave it alone.

[Questor]

I realize that there are some inventions and some research that we have benefitted from with the space program, but what value does it have today? It seems like they are just on auto pilot without a goal or objective. If all they are going to do is send up more shuttles and do experiments in space, then there are private companies that can do that.

I've seen a lot of lists of inventions attributed to the work on the space program, but the value of many of them is debatable. The inventions of the private sector are REALLY impressive. Way too long to list here, and the list is growing every day.

My question for the space program is "what have you done for me lately"?

It seems like most of its contributions to society were 30 to 60 years ago.

Please correct me with some facts if I'm wrong. I don't follow the space program (mostly because I don't see it as contributing much to society.)

Even cool stuff like the Hubble telescope leaves me wondering what value the resulting information has.

I'm willing to be persuaded, but please speak with recent facts.

[45-70.gov]

I realize that there are some inventions and some research that we have benefitted from with the space program, but what value does it have today? It seems like they are just on auto pilot without a goal or objective. If all they are going to do is send up more shuttles and do experiments in space, then there are private companies that can do that.

hopefully

they  can  continue to keep a secret

they  sub out to other countries  and  they  will have the secrets

i  keep hearing  all the same old  arguements  against space investments  i heard  in the 60s

sure  NASA  is a money  pitt
any  government  project is

wait till they take over health care

[Questor]

I need to remember that satellites such as GPS and communications, and spy satellites are very important. I don't know if that's part of what I think of as the space program, i.e., NASA. I'd really like to know some more about this.

[skarke]

NASAs budget is $17.7 Billion for FY2009.  The FY 2009 total Federal Budget is $3.1 Trillion.  So NASA's Budget is .6% of the entire Federal Budget.

We could completely shut NASA down, and save 60c out of $100.  The rate of growth in Federal spending would gobble that up in two months!!!!!

So, the only government agency in existence that has produced consistently measurable technological advances, and kept us ahead of the rest of the world in defense technology, is expendable under Osama.  That makes perfect sense to me .

[skarke]

BTW, entitlements including SS, Medicare/Medicaid, and the total of welfare spending totals $1.597 Trillion.  If we only indexed the growth of entitlement programs to base year growth over year to year growth (the real rate of inflation), we could double NASA's budget and have money left over.  FWIW, just a little perspective here.

It is commonly believed that NASA eats all this money.  It is really just a drop in the bucket of what we spend, with the vast majority of entitlement spending being nothing more that redistribution of wealth.

So doing provides almost no velocity of money (the effect that spending a dollar has on the economy downstream).  Every dollar spent on NASA generates about $7 in downstream economic activity.  It is about $2 for most social programs.

[45-70.gov]

skark

2 good post
excellent way to look at it

thanks for your reseach

[schutzen]

i still think that the space program has been/is a colosal waste.  none of the stuff listed affects my life much at all.  in fact, it looks like a list of stuff i could live just fine without and i doubt my quality of life would be any less than it is now.  

For those of you that really feel this way, turn off your electricity.  The companies that generate your electricity use numerous products and services pioneered/developed by NASA to provide you with reliable, economic electrical service.  Satellite weather forecasting/monitoring greatly increased the reliability of the weather forecasts that the power companies rely on for load scheduling.  NASA's lubrication research/development has greatly extended the service life and reliability of rotating equipment used for power generation.  NASA's research of fire retardant materials has reduced the likelihood of fire in power plants and, in the event of a fire, it has reduced the chances industrial firefighters are injured fighting fires.  Every fire and every injury drives the cost of power up.  NASA's research in computers and telemetry has greatly increased the accuracy and efficiency of metering/control systems in power plants thereby increasing efficiency.

Many of these same items apply to your automobiles; so to say that NASA's research advances do not affect you life is uninformed.

I am sure there are those among us who would say electricity is not reasonably priced, but you need to research this too.  The single largest variable cost in the generation of power is the fuel cost.  For fossil fuel plants this cost is driven by the cost of diesel fuel.  As the price of diesel increases so does the cost of fuel.  The next largest expense is pollution control.  All of this is controlled by governmental regulation.  A small portion of these regulations serve no purpose except to drive the cost of power up, the remainder of the regulations do help the environment.  If you really want a shock, compare the cost of your electricity in 1970 to today’s cost and then compare the cost of an automobile in 1970 to the cost of a similar automobile today.  The percentage change of both items will shock you.

[mirage1988]

The shuttle is a representative of NASA as the Blue Angels are to the Navy and the T-Birds are to the Air Force. They are a demonstration of the best of the best that each agency (or arm) has to offer.
  A successful shuttle launch and landing has been a source of national pride for Americans, as we are the only country to have a vehicle that launches and lands, now 'o' wants to take that away too?

[45-70.gov]

OBAMA  JUST NOT WANT  US  TO BE  # 1  ANY MORE

EVERY THING HE DOES  REFLECTS  THAT

  that is clear  no matter how you feel about the space program