Author Topic: 45-70 in the contender (Read 3237 times)

delt167502 · « **on:** February 10, 2010, 12:40:51 PM »

I am looking for someone that has shot the 4570 in a 14 "bbl would like how it compares to say 444-44mag or one of the large bore cartridges. found a good buy on one ,maybe someone could shed some light on this. if you can..the recoil is probably pretty much an eye opener,like wow with the 405 grain bullet

thanks

weinperl · « **Reply #1 on:** February 10, 2010, 12:57:03 PM »

i have one ,love it , its a two hander, it barks and kicks, you don't shoot it with one hand,shot two maine bucks with mine, dressed out at 204 and 205. buy it you will love it. barry

delt167502 · « **Reply #2 on:** February 10, 2010, 01:03:30 PM »

thanks i've called him told him it would have a pretty heavy kick ,he offered it to me for 135.00 said ok again thanks

Dances with Geoducks · « **Reply #3 on:** February 10, 2010, 08:14:02 PM »

44 mag is a popgun compared to the 45/70 barrel. The one I shot was ported, and scoped, and still jumped.
But then my bud loads awfully hot rounds.

Hopalong7 · « **Reply #4 on:** February 11, 2010, 02:03:01 AM »

I think the 45-70 is one of the most versatile rounds in a Contender. We often use the phrase "mild to wild" here when discussing in and it's very fitting. Assuming you hand load, you can do all sorts of things with the 45-70. The recoil to me is OK....sure it's there...a big heavy push compared to a fast sharp snap in a 44. You can start with low end trap door loads and take it to where ever you chose. There are limitations to the top end loadings in a Contender, but My limitations stop far short of the Contenders. And then there's black powder and lead cast......
Go for it.....you'll love it!!!

Walt

reloading_rich · « **Reply #5 on:** February 11, 2010, 06:48:55 AM »

I have shot mine with both the 300 grain and the 405 grain bullet. Stick to the 300 grain bullet, the recoil with a 405 grain bullet and Marlin load levels is severe.

Keith L · « **Reply #6 on:** February 11, 2010, 07:26:58 AM »

And if you use Marlin load levels you will ruin your Contender frame. It was made for trap door levels.

Hopalong7 · « **Reply #7 on:** February 11, 2010, 07:57:31 AM »

I have actually loaded some 405's that were quite pleasant to shoot(now they weren't even close to Marlin loads), and, in fact, the Remington 405 load is not bad either. I'd take a sizeble bet that most loads shot in Marlins are not "Marlin loads". Keep in mind here that the Ruger loads are a short step down from a full house .458Win Mag, the next step down is the maximum load a Marlin can handle, then of course the trap door loads. There is still plenty of "pop" left at that level.
Another thing you'll find is a great deal of difference as to where one level stops and another begins as you peruse the different manuals.
The eaiest load to figure out....and the most fun, is just to fill the case full(well, leave enough room to start the bullet) of real black and stick a lead bullet in it, a magnum rifle primer and.....let'er rip!!!

Walt

delt167502 · « **Reply #8 on:** February 13, 2010, 04:14:07 PM »

thanks you all ,for the imput. I loaded some (10) using 350 gr.cast .wow they are a handfull ,but very accurate. thanks again. del

MePlat · « **Reply #9 on:** February 13, 2010, 07:28:15 PM »

JD Jones (of SSK) says the CONtender will easily take 28000 cup loads. Speer has a section on 28000 cup loads.
Now all on here that knows more about what a CONtender will stand than JD please stand up and be counted.
I will go by what ole JD says.

Dezynco · « **Reply #10 on:** February 14, 2010, 02:56:53 AM »

Quote

JD Jones (of SSK) says the CONtender will easily take 28000 cup loads.

This plus I think he (J.D.) was referring to the "old style" Contender. The G2 is a bit stronger. I've seen this argument a dozen times before. Thompson Center wouldn't offer it as a standard chamber if it would not handle standard factory ammo. A shooter will have to search for "factory" ammo that is too much for the Contender, and usually that ammo (the 45-70 +P) loads will have the box marked "suitable for strong modern firearms like the Ruger No.1, etc.". That ammo is only made (as far as I know) by specialty ammo companies, and will be relatively expensive.

If you don't load your own ammo, then a trip to WalMart or BassPro will net you a box of ammo that is safe to fire in the Contender.

kynardsj · « **Reply #11 on:** February 14, 2010, 03:24:56 AM »

I had a 14 inch that was ported and scoped. Factory 405 grain trapdoor ammo was a pleasure to shoot. It would bodyslam steel targets at 100 yards.

alan in ga · « **Reply #12 on:** February 20, 2010, 06:47:04 AM »

I would paper patch the Speer SWC swaged lead .452" bullets meant for the Colt. Only 250 grains and sweet out of 45/70 and .458 rifles.....should be nice in the Contender.

delt167502 · « **Reply #13 on:** February 21, 2010, 07:32:21 AM »

back to looking for a 45-70 14" barrel. I thought I had one but the deal fell through.

Lager · « **Reply #14 on:** February 22, 2010, 01:28:36 PM »

I shot one, ONE time many years ago in a friends Contender.
Have no idea what load he used, we took it off the shelf from the gunshop/indoor range we used to work at. Now, I was used to full power 44 mag loads in his TC, I used to use it for pig hunting. Nothing prepared me for the 45-70's recoil.
Call me a wimp if some of you want,but Im never going to squeeze that trigger again.
Felt like Mark McGuire took a full swing against my hands.
There is no fun in that sort of pain.
If your going to reload to reduce the umph, why not consider a different caliber ?

Dezynco · « **Reply #15 on:** February 22, 2010, 04:22:30 PM »

My old Pop has a 45-70 Contender barrel. Most folks have to shoot it 2 times just because they can't believe the recoil that it has!

His has a muzzle tamer!

It kicks, but it's a lot of fun too! I can't wait until my custom Bullberry barrel comes in....8" - with no muzzle tamer!

Hopalong7 · « **Reply #16 on:** February 23, 2010, 07:46:22 AM »

Recoil is a tough cat to skin....hard to put a handle on it. But here's my take and experience on recoil in a 45-70 Contender. I've got 2 45-70 Contender barrels. A S-16 unbraked and unscoped, and a SS 14" Hunter barrel, which of course is factory braked and has a 2X Leupy mounted in a Redfield 3-Ring rig. I think most would agree the 14" 'er would be more pleasant to shoot. Not to me. I'm gonna compare them to a single action revolver and a double action revolver in the same caliber. The single action rolls up in the hand and lifts more, while the double action comes straight back atcha'. Which one has the "most" recoil? I don't know! I know which one I prefer to shoot. The single action and the unbrake, unscoped S-16. The braked 14" barrel hits me in the hand harder than the 16". I intentionally let my arms rotate at the shoulder more and the elbows slightly which let's the gun and my arms rotate upward considerably, with the muzzle winding up well above my head. I'd not be surprised, if someone standing back and to my side would think that the 16" barrel is recoiling much more than the 14", but to me, the shooter, it's just the opposite.
There, I should have the water good and muddy by now.

Walt

Bullseye · « **Reply #17 on:** February 23, 2010, 08:37:37 AM »

Mine is a 14" without ports and no scope. I shoot trap door loads in it and never thought it was that terrible. Don't get me wrong, it does kick but does not hurt and my gun has the standard wood competitior factory grips.

Hopalong7 · « **Reply #18 on:** February 24, 2010, 02:49:22 AM »

I recall the first time I fired my 45-70 Contender. It was the 16" barrel and I had also just gotten my first carbine stock. Well for some reason I figured it would be better to shoot that monster in carbine configuration. I had loaded some 300gr mid-range trap door loads. I fired three rounds and decided that was as much fun as I needed for a while and laid it aside. At the end of my range session, I was packing up to go home, and there lay the 45-70........well, I told myself that I had to just try it one time. So I bolted on the pistol grip and loaded her up. Bang......Hey..that wasn't so bad!! This IS the way to shoot this thing. At the time I was shooting some fairly warm 300gr 45colt rounds out of a 10" tube and there really wasn't much difference. That was about 1990 +/- and I'm still shootin' that same barrel.
Walt

Blackhawker · « **Reply #19 on:** February 24, 2010, 03:30:35 AM »

I have a 12 inch with no muzzle break. Yes, it's got recoil but it's not like the end of the world or something. Personally, I think a Freedom Arms 454 is worse, but that might just have to do with the style of the grip etc. I have shot both 300 and 410 grain bullets from my Contender and really like it. It's a blast to shoot and accurate! Keep in mind however, that you MUST NOT load above trap door loads in your 45-70 Contender. Anything above these pressures will damage the gun and possibly YOU eventually.

I think that the recoil is a little less than everyone would expect due to the low pressure loads. That's my thought anyway.

alan in ga · « **Reply #20 on:** February 24, 2010, 03:44:00 AM »

I know a bunch of .451-2" bores are available, but I'd like a smaller powder capacity rimmed .458" bore for my paper patching bullets.
Here is a 45/70 x 1.5" I made up. Sure would like a Contender barrel in this.

I guess it would be a .45/50 [or there abouts?]. Not sure how much black powder the 1 1/2" case would hold.....I'll measure it later.

Hopalong7 · « **Reply #21 on:** February 24, 2010, 03:46:30 AM »

FWIF, I also shoot 45-70 in an NEF rifle and shoot about the same loads. I increased the load to the upper range of trap door loadings(large variation in what is trap door loads depending on what manual your reading) and the recoil was increasing SIGNIFICANTLY. I was verging on Marlin loads possiblly, but I would not have wanted to shoot these loads in my Contender pistol even if they were safe. I didn't shoot very many of them in the little NEF either. I do shoot similiar loads(close to Marlin level) in an Encore Kathdin carbine with a Flex-Tech stock fairly comfortably.

Walt

doc-and · « **Reply #22 on:** February 28, 2010, 12:52:25 AM »

I'm waiting on a 8 inch 45-70 barrel myself

Unported/unbraked with fiberoptic sights

Should be loads of fun

docand

yorketransport · « **Reply #23 on:** February 28, 2010, 08:11:38 AM »

I always thought that the 10" 44mag was worse out of a Contender than any 45-70 load. I've had a 12" Hunter barrel and a 15.5" custom shop barrel in 45-70 and they were both fun to shoot. In the TC I stayed in the mid to low trapdoor load levels for hunting. My goal was just to duplicate 454 ballistics from a Contender. The recoil is just a big push, not a sharp jab. I'd still have one of those barrels but I moved up to a 10" BFR in 45-70 and didn't want to keep two different levels of ammunition. Some of the BFR loads are unquestionably out of safe Contender load range.

Andrew

delt167502 · « **Reply #24 on:** March 02, 2010, 03:00:14 PM »

I found another contender with a 45 70 14" barrel . loaded 10 rounds ( 350 cast ) using RL 7 it shoots well I didn't have time to get a good group test. the recoil is heavy but with a comp.there is very little upward movement.if someone has loads in the 12- 1500 range for plinking ,i'd appreciate the loading. i thing i will probally use this to hog hunt thanks all. del

alan in ga · « **Reply #25 on:** March 07, 2010, 02:55:46 AM »

I've found a stainless 14" barrel w/muzzle brake in a local shop. Price is $225 but I would/will not pay that. IF I can get it down under $200 then it may become mine. I plan on cutting the brake off which should leave it just over 12"[?].
Light paper patched 250 grain pistol bullets is what I plan on shooting, but there are some other 300 gr jacketed bullets hiding somewhere in my reload bench shelves.
I'll shoot it before brake removal and after for the comparison. Might screw it up by removing the brake but it won't be the first time I've done such.

~Have Lathe, Won't Travel~

alan in ga · « **Reply #26 on:** March 18, 2010, 08:11:27 PM »

Oh boy...struck a 'deal' and brought the SS 45/70 barrel home. I don't care for the increased muzzle blast of muzzle breaks although I'll probably shoot this 14" as is first. Then it will probably become a 12 1/2" barrel by cutting the brake off.
I was glad to find I still have dies in the 'stack of stuff', now to just find some cases. I had a Handi Rifle in 45/70 but it got sold years ago.
Looking forward to the 'first shot' : ()

delt167502 · « **Reply #27 on:** March 20, 2010, 04:40:16 PM »

finaly had time to load a few rounds of cast ( 230gr.paper patched using unique, 270gr. using h4227 &.340gr.using h4227) the 230gr. about 21/2"@ 25yd. the 270gr. about 2" in @ 25yd.the 340gr.seemed to do best with groups of 5 shots at 25yd.of 3/4". All shooting off a rest. no heavy loads.

Groo · « **Reply #28 on:** April 01, 2010, 04:52:25 PM »

Groo here
SSK barrels in 45-70 may have a longer chamber than TC's.
My 14 in magnaported [4 port] will accept hornidy 458 500gr bullets crimped at the same place
as a 458 win... at about 1300fps.
These are biggest game loads and require the correct setup,, rubber grips-porting [magna or SSK breaks]
Scope and T-sob mount... but if you don't try to fight it is shootable and accurate,[3 shots benched at
50yds all touching!!!!]

delt167502 · « **Reply #29 on:** April 02, 2010, 05:02:41 PM »

groo: have went to the range with mine 3 times and have shot several diff. powders .the most accurate seems to be RL-7 with unique a close 2nd. it has turned into a fun gun, with a lot of diff loads. the 340gr. seems to be the most accurate with light loads (unique) while the RL- can be loaded up and still be accurate. i haven't found the load to under 1 1/2" at 50 yards.( off rest) .you are right about going with the recoil,took me about 40 rds to try that it works.