Author Topic: Long Distance with the .50 cals? (Read 5165 times)

propredator · « **Reply #60 on:** November 20, 2003, 11:15:11 AM »

Deputy id be askin the DNR here if it legally a muzzle loader,the .458 priming cartridge may not be allowed,dont know for sure.
The regs they hand out which is not a complete run down on every thing says inline and disk ignition is allowed,but i dont think they were considering a .458 cartridge as a primer.you may not be able to use it here,unless your into shooting yotes.

rollingb · « **Reply #61 on:** November 20, 2003, 11:16:18 AM »

Well here's a bit of innerest'n "NEWS"!!!!!

Alberta Canada game officials consider the modern "in-line" rifle,...... the "same as",....... a "single-shot" cartridge rifle, and are "NOT ALLOWED" dur'n "muzzleloader" season. hummmmmmm!!

:agree:

Winter Hawk · « **Reply #62 on:** November 20, 2003, 12:30:00 PM »

Randy Wakeman said: "They aren't anywhere near 7mm RemMag / .300 WinMag performance levels, that's just ad-copy bluster."

You know that, and I know that, but to the uninitiated the inline looks like a centerfire rifle, and the ad-copy equates it to the centerfire. The fear is that enough people will ask why have a muzzleloader season if the inlines are as efficient as centerfire firearms. That is all I was trying to establish as to being the major cause of friction between the traditional shooters vs the inline crowd. Hope folks don't think I believe the inline is equal to the magnum centerfires. 'Course Deputy's gun may change my thinking on that!

Deputy, How does that rifle of yours work? The specs say it has a new removable breach plug, and one of these posts made it sound like it is using a .45 case with primer for ignition, so I'm confused which is easy to do (besides, it doesn't use a rock to make a spark to touch off the primer charge and make it go boom). Inquiring minds need to know!

-Kees-

rollingb · « **Reply #63 on:** November 21, 2003, 03:34:31 AM »

"ANYBUDDY",....... thet "CLAIMS" thet the "modified centerfires" (in-lines) and certain bullets,.... are fully capable of take'n game at long-range (200+ yards),................ ARE THE ONE'S DIRECTLY "RESPONSIBLE" FOR THE PUBLIC'S OPINION THET SUCH RIFLES, AND HIGHPOWER-CENTERFIRES,.... "ARE EQUAL" IN PERFORMANCE!!
and "THET", is the "BOTTOM LINE"!!!!

If the "regs" do change to prohibit the "wannbe muzzleloaders" from special muzzleloader-seasons,........ you will all know "WHO" to thank!!!!

RandyWakeman · « **Reply #64 on:** November 21, 2003, 12:15:21 PM »

Quote

Randy Wakeman,.... Yore gonna have to "stay after school" on this one, 'cause you only "scored" 50%.
Now write on the blackboard 100 times,...... "The 30-30 was "NEVER" a blackpowder cartridge"!!

The .30-30 was originally known as the .30 WCF, and the original load was blackpowder. The original cartridge was 30/30/160 at 1970 fps, a 30 grain BLACKPOWDER load. While it accepted as the first successful smokeless round (semi-smokeless, actually-- it was not progressive burning modern smokeless) -- it was originally a BP load.

School's out.

RandyWakeman · « **Reply #65 on:** November 21, 2003, 12:19:29 PM »

Quote from: rollingb

Well here's a bit of innerest'n "NEWS"!!!!!

Alberta Canada game officials consider the modern "in-line" rifle,...... the "same as",....... a "single-shot" cartridge rifle, and are "NOT ALLOWED" dur'n "muzzleloader" season. hummmmmmm!! :agree:

That would indeed be interesting news, as Alberta has no muzzleloader season.

Both adult air rifles and black powder arms are considered "firearms" in Canada.

rollingb · « **Reply #66 on:** November 21, 2003, 12:35:57 PM »

RandyWakeman,....My "MISTAKE",.... I got caught up in tha "moment" and misread what tha fella from Alberta was say'n in his post!!

Yore absolutely correct!!
Alberta has NO "special muzzleloader season"!!

agdexter1 · « **Reply #67 on:** November 21, 2003, 12:37:19 PM »

Is this the equivalent of a verbal paintball game. Maybe a tall tales contest. Or even a mine's bigger than your's. Crow-feather you started it, but I have to admit I fell out of my chair with your 40mm deck gun response.

For my two cents, I don't care what your shooting bp or centerfire when you start stretching out to the distances some folks are talking about it gets a little iffy. On a benchrest, with a dead calm and the sun at your back shooting at a piece of stapled paper it is hard enough. In the real world where I hunt, shooting offhand or leaning on a branch, where my eyes squint, my heart beats, my hand shakes, the wind blows, the sun glints and the damn thing your shooting at has the audacity to move, it just flat takes all the percentage out of it. The animal is the one who pays for our overestimation of the situation.

rollingb · « **Reply #68 on:** November 21, 2003, 02:05:09 PM »

RandyWakeman,.... "TERMINOLOGY" my son,... a simple "play of words".

Yes, the 30 WCF was loaded with 160 gr. bullet, and 30 grs. of BP.

No, the 30-30 Win. (even tho its the same cartridge as the 30 WCF) was NEVER loaded with BP.

DEPUTY · « **Reply #69 on:** November 21, 2003, 02:38:23 PM »

The web sight needs updating the breech plug does not have to be removed at all! it is even said by the maker not to! the primer system is a 45 win mag case used as kind of a disk if you would it has a special breech pulg that is so well sealed it never need cleaning! i do check each state before i hunt most only require no scopes! by the way last deer i killed with it was at 47yds i dont always shoot it at those long distances but it nice ot beable too over wheat fields and cut corn when i have too

rollingb · « **Reply #70 on:** November 21, 2003, 03:13:39 PM »

RandyWakeman,.... <" An inline is no .270/ .243/ .30-06/ .308 either.">

<"They (I guess yore still talk'n 'bout the same inline, as above) can compare well with the .45-70, or the .30-30.">

Let's asume thet yore talk'n,.... "smokeless loads",... in the two catridges mentioned above ('cause of the ."30-30" designation), thet doesn't speak well in regards to use'n a modified-centerfire (in-line) at "long-range" (250-300 yards),..... does it??

I've never considered, the 45-70, or the 30-30,... "long-range" hunt'n cartridges!

Now,.... "IF" the modified-centerfire can compare well, with the .270/ .30-06/ .308,.... "THEN", you'd be enter'n the "realm" of long-range capability!!..... but, you've already said "such" is not the case!!

DEPUTY · « **Reply #71 on:** November 21, 2003, 03:52:18 PM »

i also use a pair of shooting sticks or a harris bi-pod in certian stands i have a swing-shot moutned to my tree which it is the best peice of gear i have ever used next ot a range finder http://www.eaoutdoors.com/swingshot.html

RandyWakeman · « **Reply #72 on:** November 22, 2003, 04:23:22 AM »

Quote from: rollingb

RandyWakeman,.... <" An inline is no .270/ .243/ .30-06/ .308 either.">

<"They (I guess yore still talk'n 'bout the same inline, as above) can compare well with the .45-70, or the .30-30.">

Let's asume thet yore talk'n,.... "smokeless loads",... in the two catridges mentioned above ('cause of the ."30-30" designation), thet doesn't speak well in regards to use'n a modified-centerfire (in-line) at "long-range" (250-300 yards),..... does it??

I've never considered, the 45-70, or the 30-30,... "long-range" hunt'n cartridges!

Now,.... "IF" the modified-centerfire can compare well, with the .270/ .30-06/ .308,.... "THEN", you'd be enter'n the "realm" of long-range capability!!..... but, you've already said "such" is not the case!!

Huh?

crow_feather · « **Reply #73 on:** November 22, 2003, 04:43:23 AM »

Randy,

I keep looking at your picture - that doesn't look like pyrodex or 777 smoke comming from that rifle your shooting. Are you a closet traditionalist? If so, come on out - have no fear - you won't be shunned.
Stop hiding those editions of Traditionalist's Digest, - you know - the ones that come in the brown paper wrapper. There is no shame!

May this find you and yours healthy and happy
C F

rollingb · « **Reply #74 on:** November 22, 2003, 08:14:04 AM »

RandyWakeman,.... I fully intended to say,......

<"Now,.... "IF" the modified-centerfire "COULD" compare well, with the .270/ .30-06/ .308,.... "THEN", you'd be you'd be enter'n the "realm" of long-range capability!!.... but, you've already said "such" is not the case!!">

Does thet make it any easyer to unnerstand?

?

TCAS · « **Reply #75 on:** November 22, 2003, 02:39:35 PM »

Answer the original post OR start your your own thread, perhaps you could calll it..."I hate in-lines" or maybe "I like round balls and so should you" or "I only shoot 50 yards and under and damit you better to..."

I'm going hunting with my muzzle loader inline during the regular rifle season and if I get a shot 200 yards or under... it's going down. And yes I'm a responsible ethical hunter thank you.

TCaswell

crow_feather · « **Reply #76 on:** November 22, 2003, 03:18:24 PM »

No you aren't or you wouldn't make a flat statement like that. You sound more like a person that doesn't like what has been written and can't make an intellegent comment.

My mama can beat up your mama with her little finger.

C F

rollingb · « **Reply #77 on:** November 22, 2003, 07:58:15 PM »

TCAS,.... The "traditionalists' comments" have nuthin to do with "hate".

In fact here's how I would sum this subject up "EACH TIME" it appears on a web-site .......

MR. Inline Shooter, says ..... "my inline-rifle will preform great on big game at 250-300 yards and maybe even further".

MR. I'ma Traditionalist, says ..... "WOW, jest like a regular centerfire-rifle HUH"??

Mr. Inline Shooter, says ..... "OH NO!!.. ther ain't NO DIFFERENCE 'tween my inline rifle and yore traditional rifle,...... thet's why ther BOTH legal dur'n the SPECIAL muzzleloader-seasons",... even "IF" yore's is "only" adequate out to 125 yards. Besides,... us REAL hunters like shoot'n long-range with our inline rifles ever chance we git, jest like we do with our regular centerfire-rifles" :sniper: !!

By this time, Mr. I'ma Tradionalist, is a "mite confused", and trys to "pin" the other fella down in order to make some "sense" out of the "senseless-babble",..... and Mr. Inline Shooter, SCREAMS .... "You hate me and my inline-rifle, and yore also STUPID and you DRESS FUNNY"!!

Good time Charlie · « **Reply #78 on:** November 23, 2003, 12:13:25 PM »

In my state it says primitive weapons season, not black powder. There fore it would seem Inline should be treated as modern weapons.

crow_feather · « **Reply #79 on:** November 23, 2003, 03:59:17 PM »

I do not dress funny........................................most of the time

KING · « **Reply #80 on:** November 26, 2003, 01:41:58 PM »

:-D I am sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo glad that you guys have managed so far to keep things civil....relatively speaking. Please manage to keep it that way. Actually this is about the fourth comparison argument that I have seen in the last year. Stay safe ............King

rollingb · « **Reply #81 on:** November 26, 2003, 01:54:20 PM »

HERE'S WISH'N EVERBUDDY A "GREAT THANKSGIVE'N"!!

HAVE A GOOD, AND SAFE, WEEKEND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

DEPUTY · « **Reply #82 on:** November 26, 2003, 05:41:16 PM »

King, OH yeah well my gun is better looking than yours and my sig is better than your glock and ,,,,,, have a good one brother :lol:

crow_feather · « **Reply #83 on:** November 26, 2003, 07:48:31 PM »

Well Deputy,
As you know, I am a person that avoids confrontation - but lookin at yer picter -you is a ugly motha. Yer rifle-gun may be pretty but yer face could use a little scrapin and some glass bedden.

Have a great Thanksgiving

C F

crow_feather · « **Reply #84 on:** November 26, 2003, 07:51:27 PM »

King,

May those in-lines stay around forever - what else besides Rollingb "standin nekid ina winder" is there to laugh about.

C F

KING · « **Reply #85 on:** November 27, 2003, 03:15:59 AM »

:-D I understand completely my friends. Of course I have also looked into the riflegun that Deputy is playing with. I would not use it for hunting here during the mzl season,but would use it in the normal rifle season. My problem is, simply...............lotsa toys,and lotsa time. I have the ability to work on a lot of firearms,styles,makes,and just about anything that I want and I use this to gain more knowledge about what is out there and what the guns can do for power and accuracy. Of course I also got a nice buck last year with My Tryon,but I was dressed in my buckskins with a orange hat from the 1820s with a hot pink tassel on it. Not sure if the deer died from laughter,shock,or the projectile. To all,have a safe Turkey day.............and Deputy.............stay safe son,it is the start of the silly season and we both know what that means. stay safe........King :-D

DEPUTY · « **Reply #86 on:** November 27, 2003, 05:43:29 AM »

Roger that, :twisted:

dakotashooter2 · « **Reply #87 on:** November 28, 2003, 07:02:51 AM »

I think we all can agree that the modern in line muzzleloader have clouded the linebetween what we have always considered to be a muzzleloader and the cartridge rifle. One might even argue that the modern muzzle loaders may be or are the next step in the evolution of the modern rifle. essentially the fodder for many of the modern muzzleloaders very similar to the modern caseless ammo being developed. I forsee the next step to be a method of attaching th pellets together and to the bullet/sabbot as a single unit, to be followed by adaptation of an electronic ignition to eliminate the priming system. At that point you basically have a front loading single shot cartridge rifle.

I don't have a problem with the modern muzzle loaders as I see them as a single shot rifle no different than my TC Encore I do think we will see some limitations established by our fish and wildlife agencies. Specifically those which will remove the modern muzzle loader from the muzzle loader/shotgun seasons. Especially in states where the inherited range limitations of shotguns and muzzleloader (before the modern amunition) was utilized as a safety cushion for developed areas. Time will tell. I don't think traditionalists are as against the guns as the fact that their hunting method, instilled with solitude and hardship is suddenly becoming more crowded. It's kind of hard reliving history when there is an orange army around you. I can't say I blame them.

crow_feather · « **Reply #88 on:** November 28, 2003, 11:37:29 AM »

Dakotashooter2,

A nice way of saying that some people will use any cheat possible to get to do something they don't have the desire to learn the right way.

spitpatch · « **Reply #89 on:** December 02, 2003, 04:16:45 PM »

Hey Crow-Feather Your earlier post WAS Funny!! I've been laughing so long my cheeks are hurting! I Think Rollingb is correct about the sneaking/stalking thing. Thats what Muzzleloaders are all about. The old ways with the old guns. Using your senses and skills to get to a respectable distance from your prey. I also believe in a way in-lines are cheating the intent of the season. How good can a person feel using esentially a modern gun during a primative season. It might load from the muzzle, but it's a shame to call it a muzzleloader. Should be renamed "CITY BOY MUZZLELOADER" Crow-Feather...Rollingb.......My kinda' guys......Patched Round Balls Forever