Author Topic: Recyling yard visit-the retired guys wal-mart (Read 1094 times)

Double D · « **on:** April 02, 2010, 11:16:02 AM »

Any body here work with Oilfield drilling rigs?

Southpaw and I went scrap yard crawling yesterday and found a bunch of 4" to 5" linch pins for pining to together drill rigs or maybe crane booms. They are TGP pins and have a latch link on the end for an opposing pin. The latch plate appears pressed or threaded in place. Even at 35 cents a pound, if they are HT 4140 I don't thing they are really worth the time for us to mess with them.

Anybody have any thoughts on what these pins are made from.

We a also saw hydraulic cylinders and hydraulic cylinder rams. Any body have any idea what kind of steel is used in the these things.

GGaskill · « **Reply #1 on:** April 02, 2010, 12:39:33 PM »

Not sure about the cylinders but I think the rams are 1045.

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #2 on:** April 02, 2010, 04:10:38 PM »

With the lack of much oil drilling in the last several decades there are not many of the businesses around that support the trade. Otherwise I'd recommend looking in the vendors' catalogs for similar new products.

Double D · « **Reply #3 on:** April 02, 2010, 05:21:06 PM »

Quote from: Cat Whisperer on April 02, 2010, 04:10:38 PM

With the lack of much oil drilling in the last several decades there are not many of the businesses around that support the trade. Otherwise I'd recommend looking in the vendors' catalogs for similar new products.

There drilling all over the place out here and putting windmills in between pump jacks

mechanic · « **Reply #4 on:** April 02, 2010, 05:26:59 PM »

I think you will find the pins have manganese in the mix. The hydraulic cylinders are just mild steel, low carbon content.

Those pins would make some great punches, etc., if you can get them to temper.
Ben

daninwyoming · « **Reply #5 on:** April 02, 2010, 05:36:24 PM »

When any steel used in any manufacturing process is purchased that is going into any product that could have any liability exposure, that steel must be traceable as to its source. The steel is furnished with documentation called mill certifications (mill certs). These mill certs will have a chemical analysis , metallurgical properties and a heat number. The steel is marked and inventoried and any time it goes to the shear, saw or cutting table the remnants must be marked to keep track of its origin. If the markings are lost anywhere in the process the steel becomes scrap to the owner. It is to expensive to identify the steel with laboratory analysis, so it will have to be scrapped. Trying to identify a steel in a scrap yard would be a SWAG (scientific wild ass guess)

mechanic · « **Reply #6 on:** April 02, 2010, 05:45:05 PM »

You are correct daninwyoming . But thats half the fun of backyard blacksmithing. Sorta' like Forest Gump's chocolates....you never know what your gonna' get.

smokemjoe · « **Reply #7 on:** April 02, 2010, 05:52:19 PM »

I worked the oil rigs and machince shops in the pandhandle. A piece of steel may look good from the fields and rigs, but when you machince it you can find cracks in it. I was always looking for drill stem or collars that came in,It would be 4 in. dia. 2 in hole and most of the time cracked,be carefull with used oil field steel, There has been alot of stress put on it. Joe

Double D · « **Reply #8 on:** April 02, 2010, 06:14:35 PM »

Dan you are correct for quality control in production work those type things are critical.

For a couple of retired guys building model cannons in our home work shop we can be satisfied with knowing that the steel commonly used to make what ever we are looking at is 1018 and 4140 or what ever. 1018 typeswe can weld ourselves. 4140 type we have to use money from our social security checks to pay someone who knows how to properly preheat and weld 4140, and that takes money from the powder fund.

Drill stem stuff and sucker rods according to the manufacturers I contacted are in the 4140 class; high carbon special welding required.

The pins we located are used to hold two section of booms or towers together.

daninwyoming · « **Reply #9 on:** April 02, 2010, 06:46:40 PM »

Be careful!!!!!!!! Building a cannon is also a "critical" use of steel. You would not want to hurt anyone. There are ways to check for cracks that won't break the budget. (chemical crack detection with ultraviolet light and ultrasound come to mind). You should be able to find some inspection company in your area that inspects tubulars in the oilfield. They might help you and be reasonably priced. Smokem Joe mentioned cracks in steel.
Steel can also get chemical treatments that make it unusable. I have seen racks and racks of drilling tubulars for sale that have been in wells that have hydrogen sulfide. Hydrogen Sulfide (rotten eggs) will turn the steel brittle and cause it to snap. It is usually sold cut up so that it can not be used in drilling. It is used for fence post or building feed lot corrals. Not a high liability use.

Double D · « **Reply #10 on:** April 03, 2010, 01:44:37 AM »

That would probably explain why the drill stem was all over in the recycling section of the yard and not in the salvage section.

Any similar warning for hydraulic rams?

KABAR2 · « **Reply #11 on:** April 03, 2010, 03:44:29 AM »

Because of thin wall construction I have never been a fan of their use......... I am not certain on this
but one of the news articles on home made cannon exploding some time back may have been made out
of one of these cylinders.... if one was to be built it would have to be a chambered piece.

Allen <><

Double D · « **Reply #12 on:** April 03, 2010, 06:05:58 AM »

Quote from: KABAR2 on April 03, 2010, 03:44:29 AM

Because of thin wall construction I have never been a fan of their use......... I am not certain on this
but one of the news articles on home made cannon exploding some time back may have been made out
of one of these cylinders.... if one was to be built it would have to be a chambered piece.

Allen <><

Not the cylinder, the ram! It's solid isn't?

dirtdobber1919a4 · « **Reply #13 on:** April 03, 2010, 11:34:01 AM »

im not sure what the hydraulic rams are made of, but i can tell your from experience that the chrome on the outside is hard as the hubs of Hades. it will take you FOREVER to contour a barrel if it has chrome on it. plus as the chrome comes off, it will burn the crap out of you. personally, if your wanting to build a replica of something, seek other material.

Double D · « **Reply #14 on:** April 03, 2010, 12:10:41 PM »

Are rams chromed or TGP? There was some 1018 and 1144 in small diameter round and full length flat stock and some 1018 shorts in larger rounds. Mostly mortar lengths.

Soot · « **Reply #15 on:** April 03, 2010, 02:43:36 PM »

Quote

Any similar warning for hydraulic rams?

Hydraulic cylinders should be seamless tubing bit I've seen 1 manufacturer state that their DOM was of good enough quality for it.
There should be specs on it somewhere, maybe ANSI. I would think it would make a good liner but anything you find may be a bomb.

mechanic · « **Reply #16 on:** April 03, 2010, 04:10:53 PM »

Hydraulic rams are as different as their uses. After more than 40 years, I can say I have never seen a ram made of hardened steel, most are chromed but not all, some are thin wall, some are very thick walled.

If you are seeking a thick walled cylinder, look for an old forklift with a multistage cylinder. Usually these are of thicker construction.

Newer cylinders are designed to minimise material, and to clear the view through the mast, so most are single stage, with a short primary in the center of the mast and two secondaries to either side.

The chrome on the cylinders varies in thickness, but is usually " vat chromium" electroplating that is then polished to final size.

It would scare me to try and make a cannon out of modern thin walled cylinders, even though they are usually seamless, but some of the older ones were quite substantial.

Several years ago, I gave a friend a ram from a cylinder that measured 3.5" OD, and 1.5" ID. He used it to make a mailbox post from as kids had been "running down" his mailbox. Two nights later he caught them literally, as the post just pushed up out of the ground and the truck ran over and got hung on it. It did not bend at all.

Double D · « **Reply #17 on:** April 03, 2010, 04:21:45 PM »

Rams-pistons, you know the thing inside the cylinders! Not the hollow tube on the outside! Are hydraulic rams- pistons solid!!

mechanic · « **Reply #18 on:** April 03, 2010, 05:47:27 PM »

Some rams are solid, some are not. Smaller ones, with rams up to about 2" are likely to be solid. Larger ones are pieces of pipe. Remember, not only must the cylinder contain hydraulic pressure, but it also must maintain mechanical pressure. On larger cylinders, tubing is sufficient.

Most modern forklift lift cylinders are hollow tubing. Most tilt cylinders, with smaller rams are a piece of chromed cold roll steel.

The barrel of the cylinder, which contains the ram, is a piece of hollow seamless tubing.

The older multistage cylinders on forklifts, had a ram, inside a ram, inside a ram, etc. Obviously all were hollow. the stationary ram, the one upon which all the others worked, was usually a very heavy made hollow tube.

Modern hydraulic cylinders are only better than standard pipe in that they are seamless.

Some of the cyl's on heavy equipment, may have up to 3" or so solid rams, but even then, larger cyl.s have hollow rams.

Double D · « **Reply #19 on:** April 03, 2010, 05:53:22 PM »

The rams are hollow also, good to know. Probably would have figure it out as soon as we tried to pick it up.

armorer77 · « **Reply #20 on:** April 09, 2010, 02:50:41 AM »

I have made several mortars out of hydraulic ram stock , I occasionally get one in that has been bent . The 70mm rod makes good GB bores with a reduced powder chamber . Armorer77

BoomLover · « **Reply #21 on:** April 09, 2010, 10:07:58 AM »

Depends on the ram piston...I used the ram from the jack I took apart for my Soup Can Mortar as the Trunnion...it was solid, 1 1/8" dia...works perfectly. BoomLover