.223 handi experience so far

[torybird]

I purchased a .223 ultra Handi-rifle a few months ago.  I have shot over 7 different loads/brands with it.  I can get 1 inch groups at 100 yards with it using Black hills 52gr. match loads with it, however, after about 15 shots, my accuracy goes bad due to a fouled barrel.  Once I clean it, the first fouling shot is about 8 inches from the bullseye and it requires about 12 shots to get it good back to my original 1 inch groups. It does this with about all the loads/brands I have tried.  45gr., 75 gr, 55gr., just to list a few.  I polished the bore and even had a gunsmith look at it.  He exclaimed that the throat is alittle long and may be misaligned by a small margin based on his inspection with a borescope and seeing where the copper is collecting at the throat area.  I sent the whole gun back to H&R and all they did was recrown it and showed me they could hit 1.5 inch group at 100 yards using remington 55gr. SPS with 5 rounds.  I went to the range and I am getting the same results as described above. The bore is spotless after shooting but the throat area is full of copper.  Should I send it back again? I wrote in a letter to them in the gun box and told them the gunsmith's report. They did not replace the barrel but just recrown it.  I pondered shooting some firerlaping rounds thru the gun to smooth out the throat, but my gunsmith said it it's misaligned, this would not make a change in accuracy. I have fired about 100 rounds thru this gun and seems like my wallet is getting thin over buying ammo to test it and get it right. I also tried 2 different scopes to rule out error but each got the same results.  I even tried a lead sled to rule out human error but with the same results.  I even offered H&R in the letter to replace the barrel with a bull nonfluted barrel if no fluted barrels were available. Your thoughts?

[bikerbeans]

Welcome,

I am sure that one of the more seasoned GBO vets will post soon regarding dealing with H&R, I have no experience myself.  I did buy a NIB 2005 model year 223 Ultra about 5 months ago and it was giving me fits.  I never shot factory ammo, only my handloads, and the patterns looked more like a shotgun than a rifle.  Same handloads worked great in an AR15 and a couple M4s.  Long story short I fire polished (lapped) the barrel one time, polished the muzzle crown and relieved the forestock spacer and I now have a gun that can shot MOA @ 100 yards if I do my part.  I usually shoot between 3 & 5 shots at a time and I haven't tried to shoot 10 or 15 round rapidily (since I fire polished the barrel) to check for heat induced stringing.  I did not have a gunsmith look at my barrel with a bore scope so no help regarding the throat.  If the throat is misaligned it might be possible to fix that with a throat reamer but that would be a question for a competent gunsmith to anwser.  I would suggest that you look through all the information in the FAQs sticky for this forum regarding improving your accuracy.  Good luck with your gun.

BB

[LaOtto222]

Your barrel is with in the accuracy limits that are expected from H&R, so I doubt if you can get a replacement barrel based on accuracy. bikerbeans has some good ideas as to fix the problem. Generally, I do not like bore polishing bullets, period. In this case, it may be your only cost effective hope. Re-cutting the throat is another possibility, but may not fix your problem. Like advised, consult a competent gunsmith as to if this can be done. Either way you are going to lengthen the throat, but it maybe a better than getting fouled bore after 15 shots. This sort of thing can happen to any manufactured gun. You did not say how far the throat is off of center, but more than likely within factory standards, other wise you could not get a group out of it no matter what. Good Luck and Good Shooting

[gcrank1]

FWIW, recutting an off-center chamber/throat with a properly piloted reamer will only make the throat wider on the now narrow side, thus way out of spec for total outside dia. and neck expansion when fired will be excessive. When you resize, and keep working the brass up&down thru use, you will lose cases pretty quickly.
It 'may' help it to better center and launch the bullet (emphasis on the 'may') and improve accuracy, but if it dosent, what do you do?
Tell H&R again about the problem. If they say no, fire lap and try it again. If it is still no good it may be time to cut your loses and frustration and consider it a donor for a re-bore/rechamber to something else.

[quickdtoo]

Welcome torybird!  If it were mine, I'd lap the heck out of the throat area using a tight mop and flitz, possibly having it throat reamed and lapped might remove the bad spot as a last resort. I'd be very reluctant to fire lap with very coarse abrasive, one member tried Tubbs in his 223 hoping for better accuracy and it got worse, the shallow rifling just doesn't have a lot room for error, you may end of with the effectiveness of a smooth bore!!   223 Rem H&Rs have always had notoriously long throats, so that's nothing surprising, loading to SAAMI recommended COL always works best, trying to reach the lands usually is futile with any bullet that will stabilize, specially in the 1:12" barrels, 1:9" may be more likely which it sounds like yours is since it shoots 75gr. Since it's within spec for H&R's standard of accuracy, there's not much help there, may be worth another try, they do have an excellent track record for bending over backwards to make things right.

Hope this helps,

Tim

[torybird]

Thanks guys for the advice.......My gunsmith did not tell how far it the throat was off. However, he did say that the copper was collecting on side more than the other......I will the flitz polish with the tight mop. If all fails, I could try to send back to the factory and see if they would replace the barrel.  What type of O-ring do you fellow use when you free float the hand guard?  I have read this in some of your blogs but I am puzzled to what device you fellows use....... I think of a o-ring as a black rubber ring used in plumbing fixtures. A friend of mine calls the rifle "schizophrenic"......in other words, she shoots great for some time then decides to rebel and have a massive mood swing and spit bullets all over especially when she gets her barrel clean.......LOL

[necchi]

I think of a o-ring as a black rubber ring used in plumbing fixtures.

Yup, that's the idea, 9/16 x 3/8 x 3/32 will get ya started, about 79 cents at the hardware store,,keep reading the FAQ's, there's ALOT of tips there,