I've got an itch to scratch -> 308 WIN to 30 Gibbs rifle rechamber

[pvtschultz]

Several years ago I built a 308 WIN rifle on a Czech 98/22 Mauser action.  I used an Adams & Bennett heavy weight barrel and Fajen Varminter stock.  The ol' girl tips the scales at a hefty 13 lbs in full battle mode and it easily shoots sub 1/2 MOA off the bi-pods using hand loads.  

While I love the finished product, and would never consider selling it, I have been wanting something more over the last year or so.  I've read and read, and discovered the 30 Gibbs and 30-06 JDJ cartriges.  I'm leary of the JDJ not chambering well with the sharp shoulder, but I've been really wanting to go the Gibbs route.  I kicked around the 30-06 AI as well, but the Gibbs is just different and that I like.  My magazine will hold a 3.25" OAL round.

I'm not looking to be talked out of the decision, I can make that one on my own.  I'm looking for experiences with doing a 30 Gibbs rechamber and tips on fire-forming '06 brass to 30 Gibbs.  Any words of wisdom is appreciated.  

[FW Conch]

  pvt , I've got that itch to.  The "Rocky" creates the ultimate '06 & takes it to near magnum status.  Hopefully someone with experience will jump in & enlighten ! 

[Coyote Hunter]

I wouldn't want to talk you out of doing something you want to do, but...

... at the same time, I've found opportunity cost issues to be a big deterrent to many projects.  Simply put, I like more rifles rather than fewer and every time I think about spending money on modifications it seems an opportunity to buy another good, used rifle comes along, often for similar $$$.

Rarely does the idea of spending $$$ to seriously modify an existing rifle win out over buying another one, especially when there is really nothing wrong with the firearm to which mods are being considered.  (If I had a rifle that didn't shoot welol, that would be a different story.)

While the .30 Gibbs is a nice cartridge, I couldn't justify the expense based on the performance difference over a .30-06.  Instead I'd jump on a new/used .300 Win Mag or maybe a .300 RCM.  They can be downloaded to Gibbs performance levels if desired...

[john keyes]

pretty interesting.

If it were me I would do something  overbore, like a 6mm/06

OR, if you really want to step up go all out and work the Tim Allen factor, go buy a .30/378, that would be fun.  KABOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM...........

[crash87]

but the Gibbs is just different and that I like.  

I'm not looking to be talked out of the decision, I can make that one on my own.  I'm looking for experiences with doing a 30 Gibbs rechamber and tips on fire-forming '06 brass to 30 Gibbs.  Any words of wisdom is appreciated.  

Looks like you've got your mind made up. The best way to obtain what your looking for is to go back into your own experience and work from there. When you have it all figured out come on back and let us know how you did. If you need tips on fireforming brass to 30 Gibbs, It would be best to go with P.O's version.
                                        Crash87

[pvtschultz]

Looks like you've got your mind made up. The best way to obtain what your looking for is to go back into your own experience and work from there. When you have it all figured out come on back and let us know how you did. If you need tips on fireforming brass to 30 Gibbs, It would be best to go with P.O's version.
                                        Crash87

I'll respectfully disagree.  The same could have been said when I made my first set of grips for my Ruger Blackhawk, just buy a set instead.  Nearly 500 sets later I'm making decent money doing it and still enjoy making each and every one of them.  Fire-forming is no different.  Everyone needs to do it for the first time if they are going to do it.  I know that a lot of people like to stick with factory rifles.  Fine, but there's nothing special about them and for the same money I can make one and call it my own.  I don't need a safe full of guns.  Well, a large safe full of guns.  I would hate to own a gun and not shoot it.  While there are a few more that I want to add to have one gun for every purpose, I really don't see dropping $400 right now for another rifle when I already own one.  For $100, I can rechamber this 308 Win to 30 Gibbs and have something different, just like the grips on my almost Super Blackhawk.

Any real experiences out there?

www.privatescustomgrips.com

[yooper77]

I'm looking for experiences with doing a 30 Gibbs rechamber and tips on fire-forming '06 brass to 30 Gibbs.  Any words of wisdom is appreciated. 

When you size 30-06 Springfield brass in a 30 Gibbs die, you should use a medium load and seat the bullet longer out of the case for soft seating.  Now when you chamber the cartridge the bullet is pushed into the case as it engages the rifling creating head spacing for fire forming.

Additionally you could make the 30-06 Springfield neck larger then sized with the 30 Gibbs dies to create the false shoulder on the case.  The 338-06 dies would work for this, but I prefer soft seating bullets.

yooper77

[crash87]

So when your done finding out "how" to fireform a case, with by the way, from a wildcat that is on the extreme end of of the parent case as far as headspace, are you going to ask about loading data for a cartridge that, from the begining ran the gamut from hot to excessivley dangerous?
  Fireforming cases is not difficult at all, but you need to tread lightly, and not take any advise lightly. There are alot of ways to get to the end result. yooper77 has given you 2 methods, In my "experience" one good and one not so good. You will have to decide what works for you. By the way, I have had complete case separation with one of the methods, which doesn't mean it won't work for you, just didn't in my case. (no pun intended). FYI, Rocky Gibbs and the wildcatters of the day, used a hydraulic case forming die mfg.ed by RCBS for his 30 Gibbs. Don't expect to find one in the catalog.
 As far as loading data, I have pressure tested, loading data for the 30 gibbs and 30/06AI. In my world, there is not much velocity increase over the parent case, and no, that does not mean you should not persue your dreams. But when you finally get around to asking for any "real experiences out there" understand that a 300 win mag it will never be, and not even be close. Although I'm sure some have gotten 300 Pegasus velocities with there 22" barrels. If this is your 1st wildcat?, you picked a fine one for sure. Just don't get tunnel visioned into thinking its something it's not.
Good luck on your quest, alot of us have made the trip. CRASH87

[yooper77]

I agree with you crash87.  I have tried both methods successfully, but some folks might and do have different results.

As with wildcatting the 30-06 Springfield into an Ackley Improved or Gibbs, don’t expect magnum performance.  All I have achieved is longer time between trimmings, since the case doesn’t grow with the sharp shoulder.

Never exceed maximum load data and always start at the minimum load and slowly work your way to the best accuracy and not focused on just velocity.  With anything hand loading is nothing to take lightly, safety is the first and foremost.

yooper77

[pvtschultz]

I'm not expecting magnum performance.  I might be an engineer but I'm not ignorant.  This is starting as a 308 WIN so moving to the much larger case of the 30 Gibbs is a big plus.  I'd do a 300 WIN mag (actually I was going to do the 308 Norma), but then I'd have to modify the bolt face, the feed ramps, ets.  The Gibbs should feed well with minimal relief work. 

I've read a lot about short seating the bullet (some even recommend using cast bullets) for forming and that does seem like a lot less work than expanding and then neck forming just to fire-form.  I guess this'll be just as much of a learning experience as building the rifle was in my apartment...

[Mac11700]

I'm not expecting magnum performance.  I might be an engineer but I'm not ignorant.  This is starting as a 308 WIN so moving to the much larger case of the 30 Gibbs is a big plus.  I'd do a 300 WIN mag (actually I was going to do the 308 Norma), but then I'd have to modify the bolt face, the feed ramps, ets.  The Gibbs should feed well with minimal relief work. 

I've read a lot about short seating the bullet (some even recommend using cast bullets) for forming and that does seem like a lot less work than expanding and then neck forming just to fire-form.  I guess this'll be just as much of a learning experience as building the rifle was in my apartment...

Call Lonnie Hummel at Hornady..They have a great hydraulic case forming die that will eliminate these issues when doing a case like the Gibbs. I got one from him in 6mm AI for doing a break action back in 8-07 and the die works like a champ.

Mac