Author Topic: Lub for 1911 (Read 1700 times)

bugdust · « **on:** May 30, 2010, 03:02:19 PM »

I purchased a Taurus PT1911 to be used for concealed carry. This is my first auto. The instruction manual says to field strip and clean the gun after use. I follow these instructions and clean the gun after every use. It does not mention that any lubrication be used only that the gun be clean. I use 230 gr cast round nose bullets with 5 grs Unique and ww primers. I use FT-10 to clean the gun. The directions on the bottle are to be sure to rub the oil into the metal and then wipe away any excess oil. I follow these instructions. The slides are dry when I assemble the gun. I fired the gun about 1200 rounds without any malfuctions. It went bang every time.

Then I happened to shoot with an oldtimer that was a Bullseye shooter. He advised me that this was all wrong. That I should be keeping the slides well oiled. He kept a small can handy and kept squirting oil into the slides of his gun and working the slides to distribute the oil.The next time I cleaned the gun I left a few drops of oil on the slides. My next shooting session I fired 100 rounds. The gun jammed four times. The bullet would jam into the barrel and it was a bitch to break it loose. When I cleaned the gun it was really dirty. It looked as if the excess oil caked with the powder which would have caused the jams. I cleaned it and left it dry. No problems with the next hundred rounds. I do not see any wear and the gun is working fine. What am I missing here.

Bigeasy · « **Reply #1 on:** May 30, 2010, 03:34:55 PM »

There should be a light film of oil between moving parts such as the slide rails. Not a lot, just a few drops. Don't soak it in oil, and don't run it dry...common sense amount, as they say. To much, or not enough lube would have no bearing on "bullets jamming into the barrel". Are you saying fired bullets are firing, but sticking in the barrel? Are loaded, unfired rounds sticking in the chamber? Those are reloading related issues. If your rounds are loaded way to long, the lead bullets could be sticking against the rifling, causing the bullets to pull free from the case, dumping raw powder when you eject the unfired round.

If you made no changes other then "lubing" the gun, then you must be soaking it in oil. just A FEW DROPS on major metal to metal surfaces, like the slide rails. Use a gun type lubricant, not motor oil, or whatever..

Larry

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #2 on:** June 01, 2010, 02:56:55 AM »

I like to run my 1911s and ars wet. Not dripping with oil but close to it.

Mikey · « **Reply #3 on:** June 01, 2010, 03:31:00 PM »

bugdust: you're not missing anything. You may find that some bullseye pistols neee a lot of lube if the round count is high but other wise, I don't run anything wet, especially anything used for concealed carry and personal defense. I lubricate the moving parts, wipe off the excess and carry it dry on the outside. The 1911 system needs very little lubricant to run properly. If you are competing you may need to use some additional lube somewhere along the line, if you are shooting a lot of rounds like bullseye shooters.

If you are running tight tolerances, too much lube may gum up your works; if you are running it in the cold weather, too much lube may gum up the works. You just have to work it out with your own particular 1911, but I would not over lubricate the piece.

I carry mine dry and each will outlast my immediate access ammo supply; when I take one of my 1911s out to the range I usually bring along a couple of hundred rounds plus every thing I have loaded in every additional loaded magazine I own and just shoot it up about as fast as I can and have a ball. It doesn't jam and it's nto a loose as a goose and since I carry it in my belt I don't want it to leave grease stains on my clothing (I'm such a wuzz). You should be able to shoot a couple of hundred rounds without malfunction, wipe the slide and muzzle off, reload yor supply and holster yoru piece. jmtcw.

bikerbeans · « **Reply #4 on:** June 02, 2010, 12:16:12 PM »

I have a Taurus 1911 that I shoot a lot. I started using white lithium grease, in a spray can, and it seems to me that this lubrication stays on the slide/frame a lot longer than any of the gun oils I tried. I have had no problems with feeding since switching to this grease. I also started using it on an M-4 and with the same positive results.

I am not a Bullseye shooter, but I load for a friend and his son who compete in Bullseye. The folks they shoot with are all firm believers in the "wet" 45. All attend matches with a little squirt bottle of lube.

BB

skarke · « **Reply #5 on:** June 03, 2010, 03:55:39 AM »

I've started using Super Moly on the slide. It stays put, as it is a grease, and will last through many hundreds of rounds. I use quality gun oil elsewhere, but not much. It is common that I'll send 3 to 400 rounds downrange, and I still have lube on the slide at the end of that.

This seems to work for me, and I see no signs of wear on my PT 1911, which now has over 20K through it.

BTW, use a little heavier recoil spring on that PT, say 18 lbs, if you are shooting 230s. My bumpers were taking a pounding with the stock spring, meaning the slide was slamming against the frame.

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #6 on:** June 04, 2010, 01:20:43 AM »

i quit using grease and went back to oil. Ive had 1911s malfunction in really cold temps because of the grease.

shot1 · « **Reply #7 on:** June 04, 2010, 03:20:56 AM »

I have a SS AMT Hardballer 1911 that had function problems all the time. I could run it dry or wet and still have problems until I found RIG grease for SS. Put a little on the slide rails and it will run like a sewing machine all day long. I keep everything inside with a little Breakfree on it.

shvlhead.45 · « **Reply #8 on:** June 04, 2010, 06:05:52 AM »

I'm with Mickey on this one. If my carry pistols or M Forgery need much lube I'm looking to fix the why. After cleaning and after preventative maintenance when in a combat zone for M16 series issue weapons (and my personal M Forgery), I put a drop of CLP on either side of the key, a drop on the cam, and about 6 drops of CLP in the the key after wiping down the inside of the upper receiver and the bolt and carrier assembly with a silicone cloth inpregnated with CLP. Never had a malfunction due to dirt or lack of lube.

For my pistols it's pretty much the same thing.

The only thing that I do different now is I have been substituting Royal Purple Maxifilm and Assembly Lube and it's kind of like drinking moon shine, a little bit will do ya.

http://www.royalpurple.com/protect-parts.html
http://www.royalpurple.com/assembly-lube.html

Mikey · « **Reply #9 on:** June 05, 2010, 01:53:34 AM »

Shvlhead.45: welcome aboard. There is a new product out there about ready to hit the shelves that out lubes and protects better'n CLP Breakfreee or Remoil or any of the others; called Bestline. It's patented, which means the gov't can verify its claims and I've been using it for over a year. I have seen this stuff tested and it is incredible. The folks who make it test it in a ball bearing tester or torque tester or whatever you want to call it but this stuff keeps working long after others have started smokin' up and the wheels are squealin' or grinding to a halt.....

The automotive application of this stuff was tested down in Alligator Alley in Florida, where they took a 'cash for clunkers' car, added the silica glass to the engine they use to kill them before going into the crusher, pulled the radiator and dropped the oil pan, then added the Bestline product and drove the car across Florida and back and then back again - the car was followed by a bit of a entourage and a tow truck, which started to overheat on the way back, until they added this product to it and then it and the test vehicle kept on going until they were shut off and the test was over.

A buddy and I attended a Appleseed shoot recently and used this product -the day was wet, windy and sandy; the rifles got dirty, the ammo and shooters got wet, there was a stretch that took me back to being on the perimeter 40 years ago, but this oil just kept working better than anything else others used. It smells good, too (lolol)....................

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #10 on:** June 05, 2010, 02:43:09 AM »

been shooting 1911s for nie on 30 years and about 75 percent of the malfunctions ive whitnessed with them have been because of light or no lubrication. If im going to trust my life to one its going to be lubed! If i get a tiny spot of oil on my holster or pants i can go to walmart and buy another pair. Bottom line is i probably dont have a pair in the closset without a stain anyway. It is a pretty easy task to put a 1000 rounds through a well lubed 1911 thats a decent gun with decent ammo without any malfuntion. Do the same with a lightly oiled gun and you will eventually have stopages. Im not taking a chance on stopages. A clean wet gun will run all the time. this ive proved to myself over and over through the years. Oil is cheap and i see no down side to using a bit of it.

ButlerFord45 · « **Reply #11 on:** June 05, 2010, 05:07:51 AM »

Mikey, I did a Google for this and still can't find any reference except it's patent information. More info requested!

Quote from: Mikey on June 05, 2010, 01:53:34 AM

... called Bestline. It's patented, which means the gov't can verify its claims and I've been using it for over a year. I have seen this stuff tested and it is incredible. The folks who make it test it in a ball bearing tester or torque tester or whatever you want to call it but this stuff keeps working long after others have started smokin' up and the wheels are squealin' or grinding to a halt.....
It smells good, too (lolol)....................

1911crazy · « **Reply #12 on:** June 05, 2010, 06:43:49 AM »

I had a buddy who worked for Dow Corning back in the 70's who told me and gave me some of this "Moly Lube" to try out. He told me they tested it in a new jeep by adding a high amount of moly to the engine and ran it around a test track. They then drained the oil and removed the oil pan and ran it around the track again. They then put the oil pan back on and added oil and the engine still ran like new with no knocks or noises. He also put it in a gear box which was over heating under load. The gear box ran cooler right away. I been using and testing moly in every application I could put it in where there are metal to metal contact ever since with no failures but only with improvements. I use in in drag race engines with high lift cams with extreme pressure from tripple valve springs and the cam shafts/lifters lasted much longer than before. I tried it in a gravely tractor that had a spun bearing which i didn't know about and by my third garden while tilling it sputtered and when i got it home i found the spun bearing and the cylinder/piston was saved because of the moly. I then tried it my new ruger '76 security six GF32 357mag snubbie which had an God awefull 4lbs trigger pull and found it lessened the trigger pull by up to 50% right away we had only 2lbs. And after all these years its even less now and smoother ever since too.

www.tsmoly.com (TS-70 moly)

MOLY;

1. Eliminates all wear
2. Reduces friction
3. Prevents galling
4. stays wet and were you put it.
5. Doesn't attract dirt
6. Fights corrosion

1911crazy · « **Reply #13 on:** June 05, 2010, 07:00:54 AM »

I need to add more info on how to use and apply moly. (screen is jumping)

I take my 1911 apart and clean it. I apply moly to the bare slide and run it by hand to burnish the moly into the frame rails first. The moly needs to be burnished into the pores of the metal so there is no more metal to metal contact. Its moly against moly. Then i put the slide together with moly on the barrel, barrel bushing and recoil spring. You can add moly to the sear too at this time. I put more moly on the hammer face and on the bottom of the slide were the hammer resets. Then cycle the 1911 by hand. It will feel tight at first but it will loosen up after 50 to 100 cycles. If it doesn't you have too much moly in it. If its not functioning at the range you have too much moly in it. We need to learn how much moly to use in every application too.

In a cold weather application were moly was used in a warmer temp and burnished in you can actually wipe some excess moly off and not need about seeing any wear because the moly is still in the pores of the metal. We shot my new saiga at the range and i wiped it out when i got home and forgot to remoly it because my can of moly was "MIA" somewhere. The next time at the range the four of us hammered it and i remembered i didn't relube it with moly. When i got home i expected the worst and i found no wear and no galling at all. The finish was still on the frame rails with no signs of wear. My orginal sks still has the bluing on the frame rails.

In my 1911 norinco I added moly and it cycles much faster/smoother too. With the full length guide rod and the #18 recoil spring its not as fast as a race 1911 but pretty close to it.

I put moly in my new saiga's and there a whole different gun after. They cycle much faster and smoother besides the trigger being a whole lot smoother too. You will think its a more expensive gun rather than an ak/akm design because its so smooth.

Oil is for the bores and to prevent rust. If your seeing any wear your present lube isn't working. I don't think there is any lube out there that can prevent wear like moly does. You have to try this stuff for yourself. You have to witness the improvement yourself.

Moly my guns never leave home without it.

1911crazy · « **Reply #14 on:** June 05, 2010, 07:06:12 AM »

Even after long term storage the gun is ready to rock n roll at anytime using moly, just take it out and shoot it.

Remember to put a tad of moly on all the springs too. I cry when i see so many guns in the used section with wear and worn springs when i can be prevented by using moly.

I say use what you want but i'll never have to replace any of my guns do to wear and they will be passed down to the future generations of my family too still in new condition even though i can hammer them and still not see any wear. The guns actually look like they have never been shot because of there is no wear on the frame rails and the bluing is still present just like they were new.

Even the Swiss with there K31 recommend a moly on there straight bolts as a lube too. So whats that tell us?

Just try a little in any semi auto and you will be hooked too.

skarke · « **Reply #15 on:** June 05, 2010, 11:37:12 AM »

Moybdenum Disulfide is the slickest substance available. Though nowhere as experienced as Lloyd, I totally agree that a well lubed machine will work better.

I like thicker lubes, because they stay put. I like Moly. I like oil on the finer machine parts, again, moly.

Metal on metal surfaces need lube.

shvlhead.45 · « **Reply #16 on:** June 06, 2010, 04:21:53 AM »

ButlerFord45: found a link to a Bestline Lubrication web site: http://bestlinelubricants.com/index.html

Mickey, which product are you using?

After several deployments to the sandbox and several rotations through the US Army"s Combat Manuever Training Center (Hohenfelds, Germany) under very cold or wet conditions and finding that my method of maintaining my combat equipment works under such extreme conditions I'll stay with what has kept my equipment working everytime. My system works good for magazine maintenance too (all mags tested during pre-deployment training, cleaned after training, cleaned at mid-tour, no failures to feed/fire).

We all have developed technics and practises that work for us individually and have found products that work for us through trial and error. My main goal was to provide the OP with information that will enable him to make educated decisions. If his pistol will shoot reliably without malfunction after cleaning and wiping dry in accordance with the products instructions, I'd say he's gtg.

v/r
Shvlhead.45

Mikey · « **Reply #17 on:** June 06, 2010, 03:16:11 PM »

ButlerFord45 and Shvlhead: the product I have and use is the Bestline Gun Cleaner and Lubricant. One of the first things I noticed about the product was how clean it kept my guns and those I tried and tested. I was testing my personal Mini-14 and was pretty surprised as to how clean it ran and how clean it stayed after a couple of hundred rounds of old 70s mil-surp; all I cleaned out of it was burnt powder fouling and that took 1 patch. This stuff does not build up residue. I used my Kalashnikov for a Appleseed shoot and after the first day just field stripped it, wiped off the parts, patched the barrel and put it back together. The lub remained after I wiped off the and I did not relubricate; next day it was 400 rounds, a lot of elbow padding and Ibuprophin and the Kalashnikov ran cool (never started smoking off or sizzle raindrops) and without problem - field strip it, wipe off the parts, patch the barrel and put it back together - it still felt well lubed to my touch. Ran a couple of hundred mixed factory and cast 30-30 through a older Marlin with a micro-groove bbl and it was amazingly clean. All my handguns run fine on it and I can appreciate my handguns running clean. HTH.

shvlhead.45 · « **Reply #18 on:** June 07, 2010, 12:07:04 PM »

Mickey,

Always willing to try a new product but can't find what you are talking about using the internet search engines. Do you have a link or pic of it?

v/r
Shvlhead.45

ButlerFord45 · « **Reply #19 on:** June 07, 2010, 01:35:09 PM »

Yeah, me too. I found golf club head oil, knife edge oil but no gun cleaner/lubricant.

Curtis · « **Reply #20 on:** June 07, 2010, 03:59:33 PM »

Anybody have any experience with "militec-1"? A buddy gave me a bottle but I haven't tried it yet. http://www.militec1.com/ Could be real or could be snake-oil I'm not sure. Or could be no better or worse than other lubes out there.

Curtis

shvlhead.45 · « **Reply #21 on:** June 07, 2010, 08:55:34 PM »

I used the Miltech 1. Didn't think it was all that great by it's self but when mixed with CLP it seemed to work pretty well. Mixed with CLP it kept my M240 Machine Gun running even when used sparingly due to sandy (read sand storm) conditions in and around Baghdad.

v/r
Shvlhead.45

Mikey · « **Reply #22 on:** June 08, 2010, 01:26:52 AM »

Guys - I e-mailed the company, Bestline, and their response was that the gun oil I have/used was in trial sized containers and is not yet for sale as the gun oil application is not yet patented - everything else in their lineup is patented except their gun oil which has just not yet been submitted for patent office testing but that it will happen soon; when that happens they will sell it as 'patent pending' until the patent is approved and then they will change the language on the label.

Geez, if the patent office will give me a m16 and about 10k rounds I would be glad to test it for them...... but it should be out this summer.

JeffG · « **Reply #23 on:** June 14, 2010, 04:43:26 PM »

Try LPS, run 'em wet.

skarke · « **Reply #24 on:** June 15, 2010, 04:54:41 AM »

One other thing, bugdust. Re-reading your original post, you might be looking at a seating depth issue. I had a similar problem. Maybe as the gun fouls, you are losing what little margin and clearance that you had, and that is jamming you up.

If your problem persists, maybe a half turn on your seater die will fix you up.

I've only had a few jams with my PT over several thousand rounds, and all were caused by extraction problems from a really filthy extractor (over 250 rounds between cleaning the extractor)

kansas45 · « **Reply #25 on:** June 25, 2010, 04:05:38 PM »

A old IDPA shooter told me that if I don't have oil dripping from my wrist by the end of a match then I don't have enough oil on my 1911.
A little exaggerated I supose, but he made the point. I've tried several gun oils, all with success, but I like Mobil 1 5/30 synthetic oil the best. I suppose any brand of synthetic would work just as well, though. The stuff stays on good, & isn't dirty at all.

Mikey · « **Reply #26 on:** June 26, 2010, 05:43:07 AM »

Kansas - if you are using Mobil1, then get yourself a small container of the Bestline automobile engine oil additive, or just use the Bestline - the stuff is incredible.

rawhidekid · « **Reply #27 on:** July 01, 2010, 03:29:05 AM »

Many years ago I was having a problem with lithium greace melting in the hot Az days(hundred + days). I called Ruger and the Tech rep recommended switching to automobile bearing greace. A three dollar can has lasted ten years. I apply to the rails with a pipe cleaner.