FBI: Mexican soldiers used rifles to chase off U.S. Border Patrol

[teamnelson]

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2010/06/09/mexico-tensions-heightened-border-patrol-agent-kills-mexican-teen-near-el-paso/

The killing of the Mexican by U.S. authorities — the second in less than two weeks — has exposed the distrust between the two countries that lies just below the surface, and has enraged Mexicans who see the death of the boy on Mexican soil as an act of murder.

So Mexico uses their military to patrol their border and defend it against what? Drunk college kids on spring break?

[The Hermit]

I'm afraid we haven't seen anything yet. We have had ranchers killed on their own land, and lawmen shot in the US, Where was the outrage to this?
Obama does nothing but condemn Arizona's actions to uphold the law.

As sad as it is to have to take a human life, maybe some good will come of it. On Drudge, it was reported that illegals were leaving Arizona at a faster rate. Also, maybe this will slow down the rate of drugs entering the US.
Maybe I am getting senile in my old age, but what stops folks from being here legally, if their intentions are to work? This is only going to get uglier.

   The Hermit

[Dee]

TN this is nothing new. I have talked to many BPs that have had run ins with Federales. They're as corrupt as the drug cartels. They have ran interference for the cartels in jeeps with 50 cals mounted on the back, had have fired many a shot into the U.S. at our border agents, and sheriff's deputies.
 About 2 years ago some Texas deputies chased a couple of suburban suvs into the Rio Grand. One made it across the border into Mexico, and the other got stuck in the middle. A couple of jeeps as described showed up on cue and threatened the deputies with opening up on them, and helped the suv out of the river into Mexico. The U.S. government has ignored these things for years down here in Texas.

[Spanky]

The U.S. government has ignored these things for years down here in Texas.

Money talks.



Spanky

[teamnelson]

Sounds like somethings brewing though ... I worry about my stepmom in El Paso down by the river area. Don't get me wrong, shell take a few with her but she's not as fast in her 70s. My inlaws down in Hereford AZ also in their 70s, under a mile from the border in the moson valley which is like an illegal superhighway and no guns in their house.

[blind ear]

TN this is nothing new. I have talked to many BPs that have had run ins with Federales. They're as corrupt as the drug cartels. They have ran interference for the cartels in jeeps with 50 cals mounted on the back, had have fired many a shot into the U.S. at our border agents, and sheriff's deputies.
 About 2 years ago some Texas deputies chased a couple of suburban suvs into the Rio Grand. One made it across the border into Mexico, and the other got stuck in the middle. A couple of jeeps as described showed up on cue and threatened the deputies with opening up on them, and helped the suv out of the river into Mexico. The U.S. government has ignored these things for years down here in Texas.

If the US government has "ignored these things" does it mean that the officers involved have been instructed/ordered not to return fire in such situations? Would that be federal officers or state officers or both? What would stop state officers from returning defensive fire if they are fired on if state law/instructions/orders allowed it? Manpower? Firepower? Federal Government restrictions?

Arizona or any other state could change protocol for state personel and respond with lethal force when fiired on but if/when the US/Federal forces get involved what would be the likely outcome? Might this change in protocol be likely?

eddiegjr

[Dee]

I don't think anything like that has been said here, as far as the two Sheriff's Deputies, I think they showed good judgement by not takin on 2 fifty cal tripod mounted machine guns. BUT! If you guys dig into your memory archives you will recall the two BORDER PATROL AGENTS that shot a Mexican drug dealer in the butt were put into prison and Bush would not pardon them when he was pardoning drug dealers. That has been less than three years ago.

[SHOOTALL]

Dee is 100% on this one . A few RPG's in the right hands would send a strong message !

[myronman3]

....A few RPG's in the right hands would send a strong message !

baloney.    this calls for some fast movers on standby, along with a few attack helicopters.   it is an absolute crime that our law enforcement is confronted on our soil by mexico's army.  yeah, i know the drug cartels own them.    as much as mexico wizzes me off, the fact is it is our own government that allows this crap to happen.  it makes my blood boil.  

[powderman]

What you want to bet  that the officer that shot this punk gets charged with murder??? I bet osama will approve it. POWDERMAN. 

[blind ear]

I was asking if any US party, law enforcement, guard, reserve will likely prepare to cross the line of "no return fire"?

[jlchucker]

Dee is 100% on this one . A few RPG's in the right hands would send a strong message !

Not as strong a message as an airstrike, though.  We need for once a President with some interest in preserving, protecting, and defending the UNITED STATES.  Just like the oath he took says.  As I remember, this one even blundered when reciting the oath when he took it.

[oldandslow]

I lay the blame for the whole mess on the federal government. The people running the government are a bunch of------ ,Ok, I'll use wimps as a description, not just now but for many, many years. All the laws needed to prevent the mess we are in now have been on the books for along, long time. No one in a position to prevent what has happened has had the guts to stand up and enforce these laws and it goes back long before Bush. There are a lot of reasons why. Businesses wanted the cheap labor and still do. It costs money to enforce the law and the government would rather spend it somewhere else, mainly to buy votes. That is just two examples but big ones. Will we get a backbone, clean up the illegal problem and stand up to a third world country? I'm not holding my breath.

[streak]

Oldandslow
That is a big 10-4 on your analyses!!!
Things are coming to a head and the present administration will be no help!
This country is going down the tube fast unless we start kicking all of the wimps out of office and stop this mess!!!

[powderman]

As I remember, this one even blundered when reciting the oath when he took it.


YEP.  Osama even said he visited all 57 states. DUUUUHHHH. POWDERMAN. 

[Dee]

Dee is 100% on this one . A few RPG's in the right hands would send a strong message !

  Did I suggest RPGs? Indiscriminate Predator drones would have been my suggestion.

[SHOOTALL]

No Dee that's why two sentences one for you and one for me.
Why do I keep thing Bill Jordon and his "On the Border Patrol " ?

MAYBE THEY NEED TO INSITUTE THE THREE S's ON THE BORDER THESE DAYS ?   

[Dee]

That much shovelin would polute the ground water.

[SHOOTALL]

Or make alot of bio fuel

[billy_56081]

I'll be danged if old TM didn't link his hatred of Jews into this. Dude you are a knee slapper.

I feel we need to close the border and do it now.

[myronman3]

I'll be danged if old TM didn't link his hatred of Jews into this.

you know, you are right!   even if i dont agree with him, sometimes you have to hand it to him.   

[SHOOTALL]

 If TM is correct we should lie down at the feet of the Jews as they have caused every thing that ever happened in this world !

[powderman]

If TM is correct we should lie down at the feet of the Jews as they have caused every thing that ever happened in this world !

SHOOTALL. The Jews only caused ALL the bad things. They are the bad guys ya know. POWDERMAN. 

[gstewart44]

Mexico has a few things to learn and so do we. Mexico thinks the South West was bequeathed to them by the God of Atlan so they and original tribes inhabited it for 4000 years...then the region was taken from them and invaders have inhabited it for around only 220 years.  By their God and point of view is they should have it back; and are doing quite well by the looks of things. They are ready to weather any attack from the racist invaders....

Now where have I heard this story before....God as a real estate agent..??

..TM7
.

 

TM for a well spokenwritten individual your above statement doesn't hold much sense.    The only "Mexicans" that inhabited the Americas for 4000 yrs by their god are the indigenous peoples who have been persecuted by the Spaniard conquistadors and their "Mexican" descendants.    If Cortez were around to hear you intimate that his god was the god of a native tribe he would have you executed for heresy.    The Mexicans as we know are descended from the Spanish conquerors and their God, for the greatest part is the God of the Catholic Church.

You refer to "invaders" of Mexico from 220 years ago but that is false.   the true "invaders" were soldiers and priests from Spain in the 15th and 16th centuries.    The modern Mexican state and its army were defeated in battle by hardy Texans in 1836 in the War for Texas Independance (Texas wasn't a state until 1845).

Mexico wasn't satisfied getting their army beat and general captured by the Texans so they tried it ten years later against the United States and got whooped again.    Ever since then they have been envious of what we, the USA, have been able to accomplish.     Look at border town comparisons:   El Paso-Juarez, San Diego-Tijuana.  It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see the vastly different standards of living on each side of the border.  Mexican government has been corrupt and inefficient for centuries. 

As far as your babbling about the Mexicans believing their "god" has bequeathed the SW USA to them, that isn't the God of Catholicism.    And as far as doing well and ready to stand up to "racist invaders"  the only "invading" is coming from illegal Mexicans heading north inviolate of Federal law.    Your "spin" tactics are getting weaker to the point of humor.  Thanks for the laughs. 

[jimster]

All the laws needed to prevent the mess we are in now have been on the books for along, long time.

Yep, the government gets to choose which laws and regulations they will enforce.  Laws mean nothing unless they say it does. A whole bunch of presidents and different congresses let it happen over many years.  We no longer have the guts to enforce our laws and regulations, and we don't have the guts to even change the laws we don't enforce, and to top that off, we keep passing more laws that never get enforced over the top of laws already in place, just to make people think somebody in congress did something.  As it stands now, the citizens on the border states have more power to shoot and defend themselves than the state officals or feds.  Now that is pretty silly isn't it? Maybe if the border patrol or the NG need some help, a group of citizens can shoot for them while they stay in the background.  

Jim

[Dee]

As far as "Mexicans" are concerned, until the Spaniards showed up, and started breeding with the locals, there weren't any. Just Indians. As far as Mexico owning Texas, they "CLAIMED" Texas for over 400 years, not 4,000 years. As far as them actually inhabiting Texas as "OWNERS". In that 400 years they were able to establish less than 3,000 colonist in the whole State of Texas. They were terrified of the Apache, and the Comanche, and were kept driven out, as the Mexican had no taste for fighting.
When Santa Anna made a deal with a white boy by the name of Austin, Austin and company established almost 5,000 colonists in the first 3 years, and it continued to grow. All Mexico wanted was the taxes they could rob the settlers of. They themselves offered NOTHING in return. Just as they now offer. They only take. But then again so does our government. Maybe we should send them to Mexico, before they make us into Mexico.
The "Macho Mexican Army" of Santa Anna mustered around 5,600 men, to defeat the men at the Alamo. It took 13 days for them to whip 185 volunteers. Pretty impressive huh?
About the only thing Abraham Lincoln ever said that I agreed with, was when he refered to them as "mongrels". For those of you that didn't know that Lincoln was a RACIST'S RACIST.

[powderman]

Be careful guys, ya don't want to confuse tm with too many facts all at once. POWDERMAN. 

[gypsyman]

We'll have an open border war here shortly. "O, might be able to stall it, but he won't. He'll probably bend over and kiss the president's shoes, tell him we're not worthy. Too many good men and women in the border state's will tell him to put it where the sun don't shine, and send him packing back to the beltway. gypsyman

[bigMikeA]

TM for a well spokenwritten individual your above statement doesn't hold much sense.    The only "Mexicans" that inhabited the Americas for 4000 yrs by their god are the indigenous peoples who have been persecuted by the Spaniard conquistadors and their "Mexican" descendants.    If Cortez were around to hear you intimate that his god was the god of a native tribe he would have you executed for heresy.    The Mexicans as we know are descended from the Spanish conquerors and their God, for the greatest part is the God of the Catholic Church.

You refer to "invaders" of Mexico from 220 years ago but that is false.   the true "invaders" were soldiers and priests from Spain in the 15th and 16th centuries.    The modern Mexican state and its army were defeated in battle by hardy Texans in 1836 in the War for Texas Independance (Texas wasn't a state until 1845).

Mexico wasn't satisfied getting their army beat and general captured by the Texans so they tried it ten years later against the United States and got whooped again.    Ever since then they have been envious of what we, the USA, have been able to accomplish.     Look at border town comparisons:   El Paso-Juarez, San Diego-Tijuana.  It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see the vastly different standards of living on each side of the border.  Mexican government has been corrupt and inefficient for centuries.

As far as your babbling about the Mexicans believing their "god" has bequeathed the SW USA to them, that isn't the God of Catholicism.    And as far as doing well and ready to stand up to "racist invaders"  the only "invading" is coming from illegal Mexicans heading north inviolate of Federal law.    Your "spin" tactics are getting weaker to the point of humor.  Thanks for the laughs. 

Best post I have seen on this issue;  right on!

[scootrd]

I don't think anything like that has been said here, as far as the two Sheriff's Deputies, I think they showed good judgment by not takin on 2 fifty cal tripod mounted machine guns. BUT! If you guys dig into your memory archives you will recall the two BORDER PATROL AGENTS that shot a Mexican drug dealer in the butt were put into prison and Bush would not pardon them when he was pardoning drug dealers. That has been less than three years ago.

I do remember , As a matter of Fact I have never forgotten. Do we have an update on these Brave agents that put their life on the line only to have their own Government turn their backs on them. If I was a Border Agent today after this incident , I would never even try to stop the flow knowing the Government only talks the talk but doesn't walk the walk and in the end would leave you hanging out to dry.

If these agents are still in Jail , my next question is why are they still not pardoned under this new administration(with apologies).  This would have been my very first number 1 action 2 minutes after I took office. and damn the politics.
I don't give a rat's A@#$ what Mexico says on the subject. And no I don't care about the "we need to be politically sensitive to Mexico here" That's just dung. It's a Border , We hired people to protect it. You cross Illegally you get shot. If more would get shot perhaps it would stem the flow knowing we are done pussy footin around and have untied the agents hands and allowed them to do what we hired them to do in the first place. / Protect our boders!!!!!! /

What part of Illegal Aliens do people not get ? I don't care if your just coming across the border and get shot or you have been here 30 years , your still Illegal if you didn't enter the country properly and there fore you have no rights. period.


And second these border agents shouldn't even need to be pardoned , just release them , no pardon necessary , they did nothing wrong to begin with. If I had been the warden where they were to be incarcerated  I would have refused to incarcerate them(and no I am not just saying that , I would have refused. . They were doing their Job and made a split second decision in the field. Who the Heck were we to question their actions to begin with.

I was very disgusted (and still am ) with what we all allowed our government to do to these Agents. I for one will never forget.

Sorry , my rant is done .This just angers me so darn much.