Republicans don't want BP to pay?

[ironglow]

Why would Obama and congress make moves to hurry the cleanup of extracting the oil out of the water, where its easier to remove. They need pictures of oil soaked beaches, and pictures of oil soaked turtles and birds to further their agenda. 

I was fishing today and talking to an 86 year old WW2 vet who felt that this oil spill was really no big deal. He said (never heard this before) that after WW2, the US destroyed and dumped alot of military equipment right off our beaches. Vehicles filled with oil. Didn't think that was a big deal either. In his words, it is organic!

   There is some truth to that, considereing the tankers sunk during WW2 and my brother, examimng Prince William Sound a couple years after the Exxon Valdez event, concluded that the arera the eco workers got to was still in bad shape, while the areas not "scrubbed" recovered much better.  The natural environment was created wiith certain safeguards of it's own.
    Of course, this spill is probably much greater in magnatude than the whole spillage of WW2..we should still do our best to cap it and clean up....something neither BPO nor the administration seems to "have a handle on".

[Cabin4]

The Obama administrations MMS division issued the deep water permit to BP. Obama said he was going make changes to protect the environment when he got into office. He said Bush was in the "pocket" of big oil. If he really believed this, what’s the first place you go to make changes??? MMS. He did nothing. He is a liar. The Jones act is still being enforced that’s preventing skinner ships from other counties to come here and help. But don't worry, the Obama administration has everything under control. They’re going to file a law suit against the state of Arizona for enforcing immigration law. And now they are going to make a big push for "Climate Change" and "Cap & Trade" legislation

Everything is going to be just fine. As soon as the oil slick hit the Gulp stream, the eastern seaboard can get a taste of the oil. They will like it as well and the entire country will want climate change legislation because we see that as a way to put a stop to the oil leak.

[Swampman]

BP should pay until they are broke, and those in charge of BP should get life in jail.

[DDZ]

BP should pay until they are broke, and those in charge of BP should get life in jail.

This should help matters at hand. Just as much as the "O" administration having their boot on BP's neck. If our government that can't do anything right, would have assembled all available resources from the get go. Like all the skimmers available, or the super tankers that were used in the large spill off Kuwait, that can suck up water and oil, separate it, then dump the water back into the ocean. Every available resource was summoned in the Kuwait spill and 900,000 barrels of oil were taken out of the water. 
Some of the best clean up ships are from Belgian, Dutch and Norwegian firms, but we are not using them. Could the rumors be true that if Obama waves the Jones Act so these ships can be used, that it would tick off Obama's union buddies. Instead lets just keep the boot on BP's neck, make them pay until they go under, then throw the whole clan in jail. Sounds like a good plan for getting the oil cleaned up before all of it hits the beaches. Maybe line them all up for a firing squad, and save tax payers money from having to support them in jail. That will fix everything!

[mechanic]

I have no problem with BP paying all that the law allows...I do have a problem with a president and congress that think they are above the due process of law, and can just make an edict against a public corporation and it should be followed.

The correct method would involve investigation, discovery, then charges in a court, with a court to award said judgement.

What happens if the government decides to levy against YOU without due process, and in violation of the constitution?

Yes BP should pay and pay dearly, but they have the cart before the horse...innocent until proven guilty?

[Swampman]

Having spent many years in the field I can tell you when it comes to environmental issues it doesn't work that way.  Gross carelessness needs to be punished.  I'm a Republican but this has gone too far.

[mechanic]

Having spent many years in the field I can tell you when it comes to environmental issues it doesn't work that way.  Gross carelessness needs to be punished.  I'm a Republican but this has gone too far.

Yep, lets just be like everyone else and forget about that Constitution thing......no need to waste time with legalities...

[DDZ]

Yes, I agree. If BP is guilty of gross negligence than by all means they should pay. Right now don't we think that it would be in everyone's best interest if all efforts were focused on getting as much oil out of the water as possible.
 Obama needs a big scapegoat and right now and BP is it. All he needs is pictures of oil all over the beaches, and BP is toast.  Court or no court.

Yes Mechanic, lets use some common sense and get the horse in front of the cart.

[Swampman]

BP's well blew up.  The trial will tale 20 years.

They aren't a scapegoat.  They destroyed a way of life and entire ecosystem due to gross negligence and intentional misconduct.

[wreckhog]

BP should pay until they are broke, and those in charge of BP should get life in jail.

This should help matters at hand. Just as much as the "O" administration having their boot on BP's neck. If our government that can't do anything right, would have assembled all available resources from the get go. Like all the skimmers available, or the super tankers that were used in the large spill off Kuwait, that can suck up water and oil, separate it, then dump the water back into the ocean. Every available resource was summoned in the Kuwait spill and 900,000 barrels of oil were taken out of the water. 
Some of the best clean up ships are from Belgian, Dutch and Norwegian firms, but we are not using them. Could the rumors be true that if Obama waves the Jones Act so these ships can be used, that it would tick off Obama's union buddies. Instead lets just keep the boot on BP's neck, make them pay until they go under, then throw the whole clan in jail. Sounds like a good plan for getting the oil cleaned up before all of it hits the beaches. Maybe line them all up for a firing squad, and save tax payers money from having to support them in jail. That will fix everything!

Why didn't BP just obtain all these things?

[-Shaggy-]

BP should pay until they are broke, and those in charge of BP should get life in jail.

This should help matters at hand. Just as much as the "O" administration having their boot on BP's neck. If our government that can't do anything right, would have assembled all available resources from the get go. Like all the skimmers available, or the super tankers that were used in the large spill off Kuwait, that can suck up water and oil, separate it, then dump the water back into the ocean. Every available resource was summoned in the Kuwait spill and 900,000 barrels of oil were taken out of the water. 
Some of the best clean up ships are from Belgian, Dutch and Norwegian firms, but we are not using them. Could the rumors be true that if Obama waves the Jones Act so these ships can be used, that it would tick off Obama's union buddies. Instead lets just keep the boot on BP's neck, make them pay until they go under, then throw the whole clan in jail. Sounds like a good plan for getting the oil cleaned up before all of it hits the beaches. Maybe line them all up for a firing squad, and save tax payers money from having to support them in jail. That will fix everything!

Why didn't BP just obtain all these things?

Because the Jones Act says they can't do that.

[wreckhog]

BP should pay until they are broke, and those in charge of BP should get life in jail.

This should help matters at hand. Just as much as the "O" administration having their boot on BP's neck. If our government that can't do anything right, would have assembled all available resources from the get go. Like all the skimmers available, or the super tankers that were used in the large spill off Kuwait, that can suck up water and oil, separate it, then dump the water back into the ocean. Every available resource was summoned in the Kuwait spill and 900,000 barrels of oil were taken out of the water.  
Some of the best clean up ships are from Belgian, Dutch and Norwegian firms, but we are not using them. Could the rumors be true that if Obama waves the Jones Act so these ships can be used, that it would tick off Obama's union buddies. Instead lets just keep the boot on BP's neck, make them pay until they go under, then throw the whole clan in jail. Sounds like a good plan for getting the oil cleaned up before all of it hits the beaches. Maybe line them all up for a firing squad, and save tax payers money from having to support them in jail. That will fix everything!

Why didn't BP just obtain all these things?

Because the Jones Act says they can't do that.

You mean this Jones Act?

http://www.deepwaterhorizonresponse.com/go/doc/2931/660195/


Generally, federal law prohibits a foreign-flagged vessel from transporting merchandise between points in the United States encompassed by the Coastwise laws. CBP makes determinations as to whether or not the Jones Act applies to the activities of a foreign-flagged vessel operating within U.S. waters.

Even if the Jones Act applies, a foreign flagged vessel can still conduct certain planned operations as part of the BP oil spill response if the vessel is an oil spill response vessel and meets the requirements of 46 USC § 55113.




When the truth does not serve you, you just pull stuff out of the air.

[ironglow]

  Wreckhog asks;

  "Why didn't BP just obtain all these things "?
    
 1) As Shaggy says, BP can't waive the Jones act..but the president can, just as a REAL president did when the Exxon Valdez spill occurred.

 2) BP is not the defacto leader of the eco-freaks.

 3) It is the president's Constitutional duty to defend our shores..not BP's.

 4) I know it's painful to admit it, but obviously this prez doesn't concern himself with what is good for America, so much as what's good for his  progressive agenda.

 5) He wants to cripple our offshore drilling..and send some of our borrowed money to a Brazilian offshore drilling co. Does that sound puzzling ? Not really, when we find that Brazilian company is owned by George Soros..the same guy who owns B. Hussein Obama.

  6) Talk about biting the hand that fed you, B. Hussein is the biggest recipient of funds from BP in the last 20 years.
             http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0510/36783.html   

[scootrd]

Ok I am sooooo confused . First we don't want Govt involvement, Then Govt get blamed for not being involved.


Bauchman is actually defending BP and calling for even more deregulation of drilling.  
Palin, criticizes the president's response to the spill
Barton and King describes Govt ensuring BP sets aside at min 20 mil as a shakdown?  
Barton actually apologises to Hayward ?? for what .. where is BP's sincere apology to us, to the gulf coast , to the thousands who have lost they're was of life? Are you kidding me.


Now republican leadership is even more divided, with some republicans angry at  others for coming to BP's defense.

Are there not any good men Dem or Rep left in Washington who are willing to set personal gains , lobbyist money , quid pro quo's, oil and other company  campain contributions etc.. and work for the people as they were voted in to do.

is there not even 1 honest person left in Washington.
Just one ? ... anyone? a single individual? Hello Washington you listening?

I am disgusted with the whole lot of 'em regardless of party.
Stop playing election year politics ,America is getting sick of all of ya.

I say vote out all incumbents and lets start over. clean slate.

[ironglow]

Scoot;
  The Republicans are a disgrace...
  Democrats are a disaster..and would be "suicide bombers" of our nation & Constitution! Support the T Party candidates !
   

[scootrd]

Scoot;
  The Republicans are a disgrace...
  Democrats are a disaster..and would be "suicide bombers" of our nation & Constitution! Support the T Party candidates !
   

T party candidates are no Better , Rand Paul is one of the folks actually defending BP.
They are all corrupt, every last one of 'em.

The only person I have even half belived is actually trying to work for America  -  Paul Ryan of Wisconsin
I have no doubt will eventually become corrupted by the system, and I will be disappointed once again. .

it's a just so Darn depressing.  I wonder what kind of world my sisters children will inherit.

[-Shaggy-]

BP should pay until they are broke, and those in charge of BP should get life in jail.

This should help matters at hand. Just as much as the "O" administration having their boot on BP's neck. If our government that can't do anything right, would have assembled all available resources from the get go. Like all the skimmers available, or the super tankers that were used in the large spill off Kuwait, that can suck up water and oil, separate it, then dump the water back into the ocean. Every available resource was summoned in the Kuwait spill and 900,000 barrels of oil were taken out of the water.  
Some of the best clean up ships are from Belgian, Dutch and Norwegian firms, but we are not using them. Could the rumors be true that if Obama waves the Jones Act so these ships can be used, that it would tick off Obama's union buddies. Instead lets just keep the boot on BP's neck, make them pay until they go under, then throw the whole clan in jail. Sounds like a good plan for getting the oil cleaned up before all of it hits the beaches. Maybe line them all up for a firing squad, and save tax payers money from having to support them in jail. That will fix everything!

Why didn't BP just obtain all these things?

Because the Jones Act says they can't do that.

You mean this Jones Act?

http://www.deepwaterhorizonresponse.com/go/doc/2931/660195/


Generally, federal law prohibits a foreign-flagged vessel from transporting merchandise between points in the United States encompassed by the Coastwise laws. CBP makes determinations as to whether or not the Jones Act applies to the activities of a foreign-flagged vessel operating within U.S. waters.

Even if the Jones Act applies, a foreign flagged vessel can still conduct certain planned operations as part of the BP oil spill response if the vessel is an oil spill response vessel and meets the requirements of 46 USC § 55113.




When the truth does not serve you, you just pull stuff out of the air.

Yep, that's the one. BP cannot just go hire ships, the government has to approve. And the government hasn't  approved any waivers of the Jones Act.  Have you read 46 USC § 55113?

[scootrd]

The thread starts with a lying premise, prehaps not intentional, but false regardless.

Barton is reponsible for Barton.
Like everyone I know, Republicans & Independents alike, I believe that BP should pay, but anyone but a Moron would understand that when a Gov. can dictate how much & give to anyone they wish just might be a problem & daa, could est. a dangerous precedent!

What is Barton's job? Does he perhaps represent a group of people? What was he commenting on? Something of a purely personal nature? Or something else? He is not a rabid talk show host or someone with a book to sell.

He is a public official commenting on an issue that is in the public eye. He represents people and a political party.

BP had a choice, they could have paid nothing. After all, their CEO seemed to think that these issues were below his paygrade.  Perhaps the rig workers should be the ones we are talking to.

Barton does not speak for all Republicans no more than Barny Frank speaks for all Dems, & as I said the thread starts as a false statement, there is no evidence or logical reason to think Republicans don't want BP to pay, purely false.

Barton is the senior-ranking Republican on the House Energy and Commerce Committee -  he sets a tone even when prefacing his comments I speak only for me. He is so in bed with the oil companies its disgusting and immoral.  
They are all corrupt , every single one in Washington. I'm disgusted with 'em all.

[ironglow]

The thread starts with a lying premise, prehaps not intentional, but false regardless.

Barton is reponsible for Barton.
Like everyone I know, Republicans & Independents alike, I believe that BP should pay, but anyone but a Moron would understand that when a Gov. can dictate how much & give to anyone they wish just might be a problem & daa, could est. a dangerous precedent!

What is Barton's job? Does he perhaps represent a group of people? What was he commenting on? Something of a purely personal nature? Or something else? He is not a rabid talk show host or someone with a book to sell.

He is a public official commenting on an issue that is in the public eye. He represents people and a political party.

BP had a choice, they could have paid nothing. After all, their CEO seemed to think that these issues were below his paygrade.  Perhaps the rig workers should be the ones we are talking to.

Barton does not speak for all Republicans no more than Barny Frank speaks for all Dems, & as I said the thread starts as a false statement, there is no evidence or logical reason to think Republicans don't want BP to pay, purely false.

Barton is the senior-ranking Republican on the House Energy and Commerce Committee -  he sets a tone even when prefacing his comments I speak only for me. He is so in bed with the oil companies its disgusting and immoral.  
They are all corrupt , every single one in Washington. I'm disgusted with 'em all.

  Hey Scott;
  Guess you didn't read the link above..Here it is; TRY AGAIN;

  http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0510/36783.html

[scootrd]

IG ..I'm missing your point ,
I said they were all corrupt and as the article you pointed us all to states

"In 2008 alone, BP gave $37,000 to members of the House Energy Committee (Where Barton is senior ) and $106,501 to members of the Senate Homeland Security Committee, which deals with security issues facing the nation’s oil supply."

Wonder how much dinero other oil companies contributed to members of the house Energy Committee.
I'm sure the oil in the gulf carries a foul smell .. but I'm sure as bad as it is ...It is not as foul as the smell coming out of Washington nowadays.

[DDZ]

Shaggy that is correct, the Jones act has to be waived for other country's ships to come into the gulf. Bush waived the Jones act during Katrina. Its something this administration should have done weeks ago. If it was, there would be a lot less oil in the gulf right now.   

[ironglow]

DDZ;
  Doesn't make much sense , does it..that our prez should refuse help offered by other nations ! Just suppose the leaders Haiti, Chile and others had refused such help after the earthquakes ! Suppose the Indonesian prez had refused aid from other nations after the tsunami struck ! What would the world think of such leaders..too proud to help their own people when they are suffering..
   Some time ago, the boss man in Myanmar (Burma) refused help when his people desperately needed it after a cyclone killed 20,000 and made millions homeless..but he's a recognized dictator..and now a laughing stock among the nations.
     But we must remember, when the unions, the radical left and George Soros have some poor dude zippered up firmly into their collective pocket, that person may well do some illogical things.