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Offline briarpatch

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He voted for o
« on: June 22, 2010, 11:58:07 AM »

McChrystal's Rolling Stone Interview Draws Fire on Capitol Hill
Published June 22, 2010 | FOXNews.com
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Gen. Stanley McChrystal, the top U.S. war commander in Afghanistan, is under fire in Washington for his comments in this week's issue of Rolling Stone, in which he and his staff slammed President Obama and Obama's national security team.

McChrystal has issued an apology, but he has been called to the White House Situation Room on Wednesday to explain his comments to the magazine directly to the president. White House spokesman Robert Gibbs repeatedly refused to say Tuesday whether McChrystal's job is safe, only allowing that "all options are on the table."

Rep. Dave Obey, D-Wis., chairman of the House Appropriations Committee, demanded that McChrystal be removed, calling him "bull-headed."

"It isn't even the first time we've seen this general be contemptuous," Obey said in a written statement. "Anybody, including a U.S. Army general, is entitled to making a damn fool of themselves once. But Gen. McChrystal hasn't appeared to learn from his mistakes."

Obey accused McChrystal of "repeated contempt for the civilian chain of command."


"That is damn dangerous in somebody whose decisions determine life and death for American troops and others in the region," he said.

But Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, echoing several other lawmakers, said McChrystal's future is for the president to decide, adding that it's "very important" for the commander in chief to have confidence in his general.



Defense Secretary Robert Gates said McChrystal "made a significant mistake and exercised poor judgment in this case."

"We are fighting a war against Al Qaeda and its extremist allies, who directly threaten the United States, Afghanistan and our friends and allies around the world," he said in a written statement. "Going forward, we must pursue this mission with a unity of purpose. Our troops and coalition partners are making extraordinary sacrifices on behalf of our security, and our singular focus must be on supporting them and succeeding in Afghanistan without such distractions."

Gates said McChrystal has apologized to him and is reaching out to others named in the article to apologize to them, too.

In the article, McChrystal's staff described the president as unprepared for their first one-on-one encounter, and McChrystal said he felt betrayed and blind-sided by his diplomatic partner, U.S. Ambassador Karl Eikenberry.

When asked whether Obama should fire McChrystal, many lawmakers were noncommittal, saying that would be the president's decision.

"It's clearly bad judgment, and the rest of it's up to him and his commander-in-chief," Sen. Jim Webb, D-Va., a Vietnam War combat veteran, told Fox News. Webb said McChrystal has had three bites at the apple, citing his role in the controversy over Pat Tillman's death, his "60 Minutes" interview in which he revealed he hadn't spoken to Obama in three months, and a speech in London in which he criticized Vice President Biden's proposed slimmed-down strategy for the Afghan war.   

"I think it's a pretty serious matter," Webb said.

Sen. Joe Lieberman, I-Conn., called McChrystal's comments "inappropriate," adding that happens next is up to the president.

"It's his decision and a tough one," he said, adding that he will respect whatever decision the president makes.

In a written statement, Lieberman and Sens. John McCain, R-Ariz., and Lindsey Graham, R-S.C., said McChrystal's comments were "inappropriate and inconsistent with the traditional relationship between commander-in-chief and the military."

"The decision concerning Gen. McChrystal's future is a decision to be made by the president of the United State," they said.

Rep. Buck McKeon, R-Calif., the ranking member of the House Armed Services Committee, said it is "appropriate" that McChrystal issued an apology but added that the article is "unfortunate."

"But it should not detract us from our real goal of working together to defeat Al Qaeda and the Taliban," he said in a written statement.

Sen. John Kerry, D-Mass., chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, said during a hearing Tuesday that he spoke with McChrystal and emphasized to him that he will have to answer for those comments to Obama and his national security team.

"I have enormous respect for Gen. McChrystal -- I think he's a terrific soldier -- and this is a critical moment in Afghanistan," he said. "And as far as I am concerned personally, the top priority is our mission in Afghanistan and our ability to proceed forward competently."

Sen. Roland Burris, D-Ill., told Fox News that it's the president's decision as to whether McChrystal should resign. But he added that  if he had to vote on McChrystal's confirmation again, "I would be a little worried."

 

Offline Dee

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2010, 12:13:57 PM »
He may have voted for O, but apparently that "change" ain't working for him.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline powderman

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2010, 12:18:56 PM »
Heaven forbid that we have a General speak the truth. Osama and the dumcraps can't abide the truth, it scares them, something they aren't used to.The General should not have backed down and apologized.  POWDERMAN.  >:( >:(
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

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Offline wreckhog

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2010, 12:28:45 PM »
It happens. Remember that black general under Dubya. Colin Powell. Who nailed it. And got pushed aside. Ultimately history will prove someone right. Probably the general.

Offline Dee

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2010, 12:43:07 PM »
I suspect the general knows what he's talking about. I would find it hard, and at times did find it hard serving someone I had no respect for.
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Online Graybeard

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2010, 01:12:43 PM »
I've not seen the General's comments so am not sure what he might have said.

I will say however that only a fool wants his subordinates to always agree with him and to always either be quiet or tow the party line. It is encumbent on all in any chain of command to speak their mind and tell the folks higher up the chain what they feel is best. I see no reason it can't be done both openly and in private.

In the military once an order is given it needs to be obeyed SO LONG AS it is legal. Once an order is given to go a certain way the time for talk is over and time for action is at hand. But to not say what one thinks is right is to shirk one's duty.

When I was a division chief at Anniston Army Depot I made it abundantly clear to all my subordinates whether worker bees or supervisors that I wanted to hear from them when they thought I was in error so we could make sure the right thing was done. For them to let me blindly blunder ahead with bad info and make a bad decision was wrong and I made sure they understood that.

They understood it was ultimately my decision to make but that I needed all the info they had available to include their opinions so as to make wise decisions. No one was ever chastised for disagreeing with me or even telling me I was just flat wrong. But once the discussion was over and my decision was rendered I expected it to be carried out.

I gave the same to my supervisor as well and once they made a decision so long as it was legal I moved out. Only once did I have to do otherwise when I was given a direct order to do something that was illegal. I was really in a catch 22 situation. If I disobeyed I could have been fired and if I did it I also could have been fired as it was illegal to do what I was ordered to do.

I asked the legal office how to proceed and was told to put it in writing to him that what I was directed to do was to my best knowledge illegal but since he was my superior I was going to obey what I felt an illegal order based on him having knowledge I was not privy to but that I was doing so under the strongest of protests.

Legal called him and let him know what was coming. I was ordered to his office before I could put it in writing and specifically ordered NOT to put it in writing. He was only an acting director that day and my actual boss who was on leave had told me not to do what I was at that time being ordered to do.

The depot commander and all appropriate directors were involved in a conference call and my actual director was pulled in off leave to get involved. In the end he came out and told me to disregard the order I had been given by the acting director and to do what was legal.

To not speak when you think your superiors are wrong is to me a worse mistake than staying quiet. Whether the General in this case should have done what he did and said what he did to the press I dunno. But if he disagrees and based on his on site knowledge feels things aren't being done correctly and legally then it's his obligation to speak out.

Then if/when he is told what to do he must then do it with no hesitation so long as it is legal but his oath requires him to obey only legal orders and to not obey illegal ones.

We are NOT in Afganistan to fight enemies of this nation. We are there to further the interests of who ever the super rich cabal are who are really the shadow government behind our government faces. It's wrong, we have no business being their or in Iraq at this time and we need to pull back, secure our borders and fight the real enemy flooding our country and bringing it down.


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Offline powderman

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2010, 01:40:32 PM »
News just said Mccrystal was retiring from service. A darned shame, a real American, unlike the illegal in the Whitehouse.
Colin Powell resigned when klinton was elected, NOT Bush. POWDERMAN.  :o :o
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

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Offline dukkillr

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2010, 01:47:58 PM »
News just said Mccrystal was retiring from service. A darned shame, a real American, unlike the illegal in the Whitehouse.
Colin Powell resigned when klinton was elected, NOT Bush. POWDERMAN.  :o :o
Powell resigned as Secretary of State about midway through Bush's time as president.  Most reports suggest that he was constantly at odds with Cheney and Rumsfeld over foreign policy.  I think that is what wreckhog was referring to.

Offline Dee

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2010, 02:49:25 PM »
Yes Powell did resign part way thru the Bush dynasty, and I am sure Cheney and especially Rumsfeld were real pleasures to deal with.
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Offline beerbelly

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #9 on: June 22, 2010, 04:52:44 PM »
Powell was a show dog, nothing more. Never did any thing worth while. A guy named Norman fought the war Powell got credit for.
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Offline Cabin4

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2010, 05:00:33 PM »
Historically, when a general/commander at the level of McChrystal is at odds with the president, they let the president know in private. McChrystal was put in the job by obama, so obama put his confidance in him. He has an obligation to tell the president whats on his mind and his honest opinions. A general owes his loyalty to the chain of command regardless of anything, less of course being asked to do things that are illegal. I think it was a mistake for the general to make this public. If he was truely at a huge impass with obama, he should have resigned or asked to be reassigned.

Yes, obama is an idiot but we do have a chain of command in this country. McChrystal could have resigned and spilled his guts as a civilian. That would have been a better way to go from my perspective.
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Offline billy_56081

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #11 on: June 22, 2010, 05:04:57 PM »
Powell was a show dog, nothing more. Never did any thing worth while. A guy named Norman fought the war Powell got credit for.
                          Beerbelly

As one of Stormin Normans solidiers I have to say I agree with you beerbelly.
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Offline Dee

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #12 on: June 22, 2010, 06:00:59 PM »
Well I guess since OBAMA IS IN CHARGE, and since McChrystal should not have openly criticized him for being a traitor, then I guess we shouldn't either, since he's our leader too. On second thought however, I have had idiots for leaders, and I openly acknoledged that they were idiots. Sometimes at my own peril, but officers were being placed in danger by the moron, so it had to be made known.
Obama is mishandling this war in Afghanistan, and will not listen to McChrystal, so McChrystal simply brought it to the world's attention, since Obama is clueless and in charge. McChrystal will no doubt pay the price, but it wouldn't bother me, if everyone walked off because of Obama, and if it were possible to do so, I personally would stand with McChrystal publicly, although I doubt anyone would care.
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Offline wreckhog

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #13 on: June 22, 2010, 06:20:32 PM »
Any chance that McChrystal is gunning for the 2012 GOP nom? I give him and Nikki Haley good odds.

Offline Cabin4

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #14 on: June 22, 2010, 06:39:16 PM »
I agree. Powell was a bi-stander while Norman prosecuted the war.

I think both the general and obama need to go but a good subordinate should make his demands like a man in the face of his superiors first, not at the water cooler. Spewing his mouth off like some disgruntled security guard who's unhappy with his supervisor is ridiculous. Yes, we know this is a war and lives are at stake. But he has an obligation to the job he was given and the chain. A real man does his job or finds a new line of work if the situation gets to the point he feels the need to spew his thoughts to a crummy magazine instead of his boss or appropriate forum.

BTW: We have no business in the M.E. wars anyway. The real enemies of this country are right here.
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Offline powderman

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #15 on: June 22, 2010, 06:41:12 PM »
Well, 2 of you said the same thing but I'd swear Powell resigned on klintons watch. I specifically remember them having words on national tv at a meeting of the joint chiefs. Klinton was talking about dropping the ban on gays in the military and Colin was mumbling. Klinton said, you got a problem with that Colin??? He said, yes sir I do, I have a very big problem with a man who refused to serve in the military telling me how to run it. I thought he resigned shortly after, guess I dreamed it.  POWDERMAN.  ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ???
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

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Offline Cabin4

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #16 on: June 22, 2010, 06:47:00 PM »
From October 1, 1989 to September 30, 1993, was as the 12th Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. Appointed to the job by Bush 1 and he resigned under klinton.
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Offline Dee

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #17 on: June 22, 2010, 07:02:35 PM »
Powell was Secretary of State, and after Bush's first four years resigned after the election and was replaced by Condoleezza Rice. Clinton was president from 1993 to 2001.
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Offline magooch

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #18 on: June 23, 2010, 04:18:05 AM »
If it's true that Gen. McChrystal voted for Osama, then I would seriously question his judgement.  If his judgement is that flawed, then maybe he should step down.  Of course that would mean he would be replaced by another Osama choice.  That can't be good.
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Offline powderman

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #19 on: June 23, 2010, 04:25:10 AM »
Any bets here????? Will he appoint a woman, mexican, black, or a muslim to run the war?????? Maybe a combination of all. Whoever it is it will not be good for America. POWDERMAN.  >:( >:(
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

Only half the people leave an abortion clinic alive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAiOEV0v2RM
What part of ILLEGAL is so hard to understand???
I learned everything about islam I need to know on 9-11-01.
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDqmy1cSqgo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_u9kieqGppE&feature=related
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Offline nw_hunter

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #20 on: June 23, 2010, 04:41:43 AM »
Powell was Secretary of State, and after Bush's first four years resigned after the election and was replaced by Condoleezza Rice. Clinton was president from 1993 to 2001.



Yep!

n January, 2001, General Powell was selected by President George W. Bush to serve as his Secretary of State. He was the first African-American to hold this high office in the United States Government. Powell stepped down from the position after President Bush's reelection to a second term. His four year tenure as Secretary of State was marked by disagreements with other Administration officials over policy. Regardless of these disagreements, Secretary Powell remained a loyal servant of the Bush Administration and an eloquent spokesman for the Administration in international affairs.


Even tho Powell disagreed with Bush  on his war policy's, and resigned, he was a smart politician and kept his opinions to himself in public.

He made his political mark and left quietly.
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Offline crustylicious

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #21 on: June 23, 2010, 04:54:19 AM »
He hasn't quit or been fired yet. I think that time has passed. They are both intelligent professionals  8) ???  Look for them to resolve their differences.
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Offline ironglow

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #22 on: June 23, 2010, 06:04:12 AM »
He hasn't quit or been fired yet. I think that time has passed. They are both intelligent professionals  8) ???  Look for them to resolve their differences.

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Offline Cabin4

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #23 on: June 23, 2010, 06:22:53 AM »
He hasn't quit or been fired yet. I think that time has passed. They are both intelligent professionals  8) ???  Look for them to resolve their differences.

  One a professional soldier..the other a professional Fabian Socialist !

A professional soldier with major flaws in judgement. Agree on the Fabian Socialist.
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Offline powderman

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #24 on: June 23, 2010, 06:34:02 AM »
He hasn't quit or been fired yet. I think that time has passed. They are both intelligent professionals  8) ???  Look for them to resolve their differences.

  One a professional soldier..the other a professional Fabian Socialist !

YUP. Among other things osama is. POWDERMAN.  >:( >:(
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

Only half the people leave an abortion clinic alive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAiOEV0v2RM
What part of ILLEGAL is so hard to understand???
I learned everything about islam I need to know on 9-11-01.
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDqmy1cSqgo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_u9kieqGppE&feature=related
http://www.illinois.gov/gov/contactthegovernor.cfm

Offline beerbelly

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #25 on: June 23, 2010, 07:05:31 AM »

Obama and his crowd changed the rules of engagement on him. The troops are rarely allowed to call in Air strikes or Artillery and it is getting troops killed. Obama has said he is doing away with don't ask ,don't tell and let the queers serve openly. I have read that a great many of the NCOs’ are getting out. Saying let the fags fight for Obama.
   All of this has played hell with the troops morale. I think the general wants to get the hell out and not be in charge when we lose!
                                    Beerbelly

Offline blind ear

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #26 on: June 23, 2010, 07:22:51 AM »
WRECKHOG, wildcard nomination, I thought the same thing. eddie
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Offline Cabin4

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #27 on: June 23, 2010, 08:41:02 AM »

Obama and his crowd changed the rules of engagement on him. The troops are rarely allowed to call in Air strikes or Artillery and it is getting troops killed. Obama has said he is doing away with don't ask ,don't tell and let the queers serve openly. I have read that a great many of the NCOs’ are getting out. Saying let the fags fight for Obama.
   All of this has played hell with the troops morale. I think the general wants to get the hell out and not be in charge when we lose!
                                    Beerbelly

McChrystal voted for obama and agreed to accept the job as his general on the ground. He knew what obama's position was on the issues. That should tell you something about McChrystal's judgement. He should shut his mouth to the public, tell the president waht he thinks, do his job or resign.
Avery Hayden Wallace
Obama Administration: A corrupt criminal enterprise of bold face liars.
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GET US OUT OF THE UN. NO ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT!
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Offline powderman

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #28 on: June 23, 2010, 08:56:34 AM »
Just announced. Mccrystal out, Petraes in. I believe Beerbelly has pretty well pegged it. Osama changed the rules. He doesn't want a real military General, he wants a yes man. I'd love to have Stormin Norman back. POWDERMAN.  >:( >:(
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

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Offline ironglow

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Re: He voted for o
« Reply #29 on: June 23, 2010, 09:23:29 AM »
He may have voted for O, but apparently that "change" ain't working for him.

   Kinda looks like the "hopey" thing isn't doing so well either !  ;) :D ;D
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)