THE FIRED GENERAL

[IOWA DON]

I guess I have not read what is going on for a few days. Now Obama has fired a General and I have listened to several hours of news reports and stil don't know what the General said that so pissed off Obama. Can someone tell me in a page or less?

[Cohort]

Well DON ,it goes something like this .
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/06/23/AR2010062305371.html

To me it isn't what the General said ,Obama has YET to prove he is in any position to relieve this American General of his Post !
How dare this upstart Kenyan ,to make a travesty of this Mans entire  Military career !
You Sir Obama ,are an upstart Liar ,and a Cad !
Now you have the unmitigated Gaul ,to bring our beloved General Petraeus up before your court of Thieves ,Pigs and Dogs !
And to force a man of his stature ,To succumb to your perverted agenda ,Of Whoopty Doo ,How can i Screw You !
Is totally absurd, SIR !

If i were there ,i would throw down the gauntlet ! But in your case a used condom would suffice nicely .
Reguards : Baron Von Hockanspit

[Cohort]

So what he voted for Obama ! A lot of people did who regret that decision now. The people i know who did ,tell me they did NOT vote for this crap.
All water under the bridge now ,i voted twice for GW ,and i listened to him talk about fighting the war on terror over there. So we didn't have to fight them here at home. It was a Liberal at the funeral of my cousin who opened my eyes ,when she said ( If what Bush is saying is true ,why hasn't he closed our southern border ? And if he had been telling the truth , this funeral would not be happening and we would still have Virginia alive and well . )
Good Point ,and it changed my way of thinking from that day on ,Govern by substance ,and not with lies.




This man to me is still a Four Star General in good standing.  I could care less what his politics are ,he showed his honor by what he said and that cost him his career. He said it because he did not feel that Obama was where he was at  ,legally according to the Constitution this General swore to uphold and defend.

Chain of Command ? How about the rule of Law ? The UCMJ  clearly states that this General has every right, in fact order's him to disobey a direct order if that order is in direct conflict with the Constitution of the United States of America.
In fact ,in doing so he obeyed the order's set forth by the supreme law of this land ,The Constitution.

P.S. Taking down a General like this is a VERY serious advance for our enemy's  . When Hitler took down Rommel ,the war did NOT go well for him from that point on. How rude ,and how incompetent is Obama ?
Perhaps the media should show ,what i heard on the short wave last night . The cheers in Iran ,the joy in Pakistan , the laughter in the Liberal parts of Europe.
The tears in Israel , the concern in Russia , the disgust in Germany , the i told you so in France. And the loss of hope in country's that were praying that America would survive .
Its the act people that's symbolic here , to see it any other way only add's credence to the Obama agenda.

[mrussel]

Well DON ,it goes something like this .
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/06/23/AR2010062305371.html

To me it isn't what the General said ,Obama has YET to prove he is in any position to relieve this American General of his Post !
How dare this upstart Kenyan ,to make a travesty of this Mans entire  Military career !
You Sir Obama ,are an upstart Liar ,and a Cad !
Now you have the unmitigated Gaul ,to bring our beloved General Petraeus up before your court of Thieves ,Pigs and Dogs !
And to force a man of his stature ,To succumb to your perverted agenda ,Of Whoopty Doo ,How can i Screw You !
Is totally absurd, SIR !

If i were there ,i would throw down the gauntlet ! But in your case a used condom would suffice nicely .
Reguards : Baron Von Hockanspit

 What do you think would happen to one of the generals subordinates who publicly ridiculed the general and his staff? It of course would be dealt with and the person who did it would soon come to regret his insubordinate behavior. Now what do you think would happen if he did it again? Thats exactly what happened. The general made insubordinate remarks to the press last year. He was called to task for it and was well aware of the fact that he was given a quite a pass as his skills and services were needed in Afganistan. Then he did it again,but even worse. The first time he publically said he could not support a particular policy that was being discussed. (His entire job is to support ANY policy he is ordered to to the best of his ability.) Rather than get the hint,he publicly mocked and ridiculed the president,vice president and their staff. Regardless of WHAT he thinks of their policies,or competencies,his job is to support and enact the policies and obey the orders he is given. Failure to do so undermines the civilian authority of the military,which is one of the pillars that support our democracy.

 If he disagreed with what the president was doing,he certainly could have told him. He had met with the president several times and if the man Obama had put in charge of the war had sent him a email saying "I need to discuss some very important issues regarding our direction in the war" my guess is that he would have gotten a call from Obama. He would have been free to say "I think that our direction is a mistake and that the people in your cabinet fundamentally misunderstand  the situation and are an impediment to getting the job done over here". Obama would of course have been free to ignore him. If Obama had fired him for such a private statement,I think we would definatly be justified in calling him the lesser of the two men. However,that's not what happened. He mouthed off the a news reporter,mocking and ridiculing his superiors. If I did that,or you did that,or any of his people did that,we would all be out of a job (actually,the generals subordinates would probably spend some time in the stockade)

   It sounds to me like a lot of people that hate Obama are just looking for an excuse to rant. I would say there is an easy test to see if your being irrational. Ask yourself,what has Obama done that is good and that worked out well. If you cant answer anything,your being irrational. For instance,I really didnt like Bush. Warantless wiretapping ,torturing prisoners,and a massive grab for power by the executive branch just didnt sit well with me. I also felt that the Iraq war was "taking our eye off the ball" so to speak,and was just a personal vendetta against Hussein (a very evil man who certainly deserved what he got though) for an attemp to kill his father. (which itself would have been justification for war AT THE TIME,but not 10 years later,and not while he had Afganistan to deal with) Still,the war in Afganistan was the right thing to do. Pakistan was convinced to help,and to let us move troops and fly air strikes across its territory. That was quite a feat,and while I felt that the "tough talk" like "your with us or against us" could have been moderated as time went on,it was certainly appropriate in the months after 911. If you dont think that the handling (which Obama was certainly in the loop of) those sailers that were captured by pirates turned out pretty good (hostages rescued,one pirate captured and others dead seems pretty good to me) then I think your just putting on the political blinders.

 Im not saying to LIKE Obama. Im saying you should DISLIKE him for concrete reasons that are based on some sort of rational logic. If a general had ridiculed Ronald Reagan do you really think he would have put up with it? If a general had called Bush Sr a "Clown",do you really think he wouldn't have asked for his resignation? Get real!

[mrussel]

So what he voted for Obama ! A lot of people did who regret that decision now. The people i know who did ,tell me they did NOT vote for this crap.
All water under the bridge now ,i voted twice for GW ,and i listened to him talk about fighting the war on terror over there. So we didn't have to fight them here at home. It was a Liberal at the funeral of my cousin who opened my eyes ,when she said ( If what Bush is saying is true ,why hasn't he closed our southern border ? And if he had been telling the truth , this funeral would not be happening and we would still have Virginia alive and well . )
Good Point ,and it changed my way of thinking from that day on ,Govern by substance ,and not with lies.




This man to me is still a Four Star General in good standing.  I could care less what his politics are ,he showed his honor by what he said and that cost him his career. He said it because he did not feel that Obama was where he was at  ,legally according to the Constitution this General swore to uphold and defend.

Chain of Command ? How about the rule of Law ? The UCMJ  clearly states that this General has every right, in fact order's him to disobey a direct order if that order is in direct conflict with the Constitution of the United States of America.
In fact ,in doing so he obeyed the order's set forth by the supreme law of this land ,The Constitution.

P.S. Taking down a General like this is a VERY serious advance for our enemy's  . When Hitler took down Rommel ,the war did NOT go well for him from that point on. How rude ,and how incompetent is Obama ?
Perhaps the media should show ,what i heard on the short wave last night . The cheers in Iran ,the joy in Pakistan , the laughter in the Liberal parts of Europe.
The tears in Israel , the concern in Russia , the disgust in Germany , the i told you so in France. And the loss of hope in country's that were praying that America would survive .
Its the act people that's symbolic here , to see it any other way only add's credence to the Obama agenda.

 What was the order that Obama gave to him that was unconstitutional? What exactly did he tell him to do?

 What I saw was something very different. It was a general that disagreed with his commanding officer. He tried to play politics. In fact,he might well have been in violation of the Hatch Act,although it would be difficult to prove as you can only prove actions not intentions. Politicians play politics,Generals follow orders and fight wars. Thats how it works. If he didn't like it,he could have decided to be a ordinary citizen instead of a general. He would then be free of the restrictions on partisan politicking. He could then,as he can now,(since he was FORCED to make the choice he was not WILLING to make before) play the political game all he wants. Now that he is no longer a general,he can try to sway public opinion,or even run for office himself. If he thinks the war is being run so badly,he could run for president,and if he can convince enough people that he is the man for the job,then he can make the decisions. (I guarantee that he will not accept being ridiculed by his generals) As a general though,he cannot try to undermine the authority of a duly elected president. (and the election was pretty damn uneventful, Obama won by wide margin,you may not like the outcome and may think the people who voted for him were deluded,but he won,and here in America,we accept the result of that,rather than having a coup like they do in some places) Do you honestly want to live in a country where the military does not answer to an elected representative of the people? (If you do,I would suggest moving to one of those places where the guy who runs the country calls himself "General" and see how far you get speaking your mind when he does something you disagree with)

[Gary G]

He got a "get out of jail free card"!

[briarpatch]

With his vote of ooh, it shows me he didnot have the ability to lead or prosecute a war on anything much less a country. (look at his rules of engagement).
A man in his position should know a goon when he sees or hears one. If not, he would not know a terrorist or enemy.
What we have seen with this firing is a bunch of idiots falling out of favor with each other because they are all incompetent. The smaller idiots crying and whining about the bigger idiots. The bigger idiots now look the fools they are, get mad and dump the smaller idiots.   Very simple when you look.

[Dee]

With his vote of ooh, it shows me he didnot have the ability to lead or prosecute a war on anything much less a country. (look at his rules of engagement).
A man in his position should know a goon when he sees or hears one. If not, he would not know a terrorist or enemy.
What we have seen with this firing is a bunch of idiots falling out of favor with each other because they are all incompetent. The smaller idiots crying and whining about the bigger idiots. The bigger idiots now look the fools they are, get mad and dump the smaller idiots.   Very simple when you look.

EXCELLENT!