Author Topic: Chicago, The GOA, & The Johnny Come Lately "NRA" (Read 1807 times)

Dee · « **on:** June 29, 2010, 12:53:50 AM »

This morning I watched Wayne LaPierre act indignant and defiant on Fox News (the fair and balance one

) after the Supreme Court decision on Chicago and the 2nd Amendment. The Fox News Channel NEVER MENTIONED THE FOLKS THAT ACTUALLY DONE THE FIGHTING, but instead trotted out the NRA's Wayne LaPierre to take credit for the defeat of Chicago, and do the tough talking.

Last Friday an NRA telemarketer called me trying to get me to renew my membership.
I asked him WHY was the NRA not in that fight? Answer: I don't know sir. I asked him WHY did the NRA step in and take part of the GOA's time in front of the Supreme Court when they had done NOTHING to deserve to be there? Answer: I don't know sir, BUT GET THIS. THE CLOWN ACTUALLY AGREED THAT IT WASN'T RIGHT, HE JUST HAD NO EXPLANATION.

I also asked several other questions pertaining to their constant sending out letters wanting more money from it's membership, and constantly trying to sell them stuff, and got basically NOTHING BUT APOLOGIES with no answers.
The NRA is nothing more than PART OF THE WASHINGTON MACHINE. They solicit monies from their LOYAL MEMBERSHIP, and spend it on huge salaries, huge banquet dinners, exotic hunting trips, and COMPROMISING IT'S MEMBERSHIP'S RIGHTS AWAY. What a bunch of hypocrites, liars, and now OPENLY BLANTANT PRESS THIEVES, the NRA has become.
All you NRA boys just flame away, if your ok with them STEALING CREDIT FOR A WIN, then that says it all. The NRA IS A SELL OUT, AND AN OPENLY ARROGANT PRESS THIEF.

Land_Owner · « **Reply #1 on:** June 29, 2010, 01:55:36 AM »

Dee, realize that the telemarketer may NOT have been an NRA member, sponsor, or affiliate at all. He may have only been a hired body to make cold calls. Crucifying him when he was just doing a job didn't help either of you (particularly you when he couldn't answer any of your direct questions). Soliciting donations, memberships, etc. does not make the telemarketer the Historian/Defender of the Sponsor activity.

GOA (established 1975) has not attained the clout of the NRA (est. 1871). GOA has not achieved the membership (300,000 according to Wikipedia; NRA-nearly 4 million). GOA is, to their credit, non-compromising on 2nd Amendment issues while the NRA Lobby appears to be erodable and compromising as you describe.

I do not understand the rant about a clear 2nd Amendment win for EVERYONE? As you appear to be knowledgable about this and are setting the record straight, then I believe you. I don't listen to the "Talking Head" news much anyway. I am quite pleased that the 2nd Amendment prevailed - again, as it should.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #2 on:** June 29, 2010, 02:23:44 AM »

Dammed if they do, dammed if they don't..
The GOA has also bashed the NRA on many occasions, yet the NRA has NEVER bashed another pro-gun group.

Even when the NRA does good things, all the NRA basher come out and say, well they did OK this time "But" You NRA bashers will never be happy.. Kind of reminds me of the Liberals I deal with at legislative hall. Just a nasty bunch.

kshock · « **Reply #3 on:** June 29, 2010, 02:52:25 AM »

Yea, the Brady Campaign couldn't have said it better! I have a question though. If the NRA wasn't involved until time to go in front of the camera's, how did they steal time from another group in the courtroom?

Graybeard · « **Reply #4 on:** June 29, 2010, 03:22:41 AM »

They made a last minute petition to the court to be allowed to make a presentation and the court granted it to them. Total time is strictly limited so their time came from GOA who had footed the bill and done all the work.

Why were they granted the time? Only DC insiders know the answer to that one but it was some back room deal no doubt. The NRA should go back to what they know firearms training and registering competition matches and leave the Second Amendment stuff to folks who don't compromise away the rights of others so they can get rich.

From a report someone posted the other day with proper credit to the source the salaries of a few top officers of the NRA far exceeds the entire membership dues each year.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #5 on:** June 29, 2010, 03:36:03 AM »

Membership dues only cover the gun rags, nothing more. It is the Donations from supporters that pay everything else. If you don't contribute to the NRA or support them, why do you care?

If indeed the GOA was such a great group, why don't they have 4 Million members? Well it is because they stab other pro-gun rights group in the back and bash them.

I find it funny how people bash the NRA every chance they get, yet they don't bash there representatives and legislators, the ones that a going after our rights on a daily basis. I guess some people just have to have a reason to complain. Then there are some of us that actually do more then whine.

subdjoe · « **Reply #6 on:** June 29, 2010, 03:44:24 AM »

What does the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese have to do with the NRA? What? Not the GOA? Gun Owners of America? What is that?

Go out on the street, ask around about how many people know what the GOA is, like as not you will get a "I doanknow" or wild guesses. Ask the same people about the NRA and most will say National Rifle Association. Just by being there the NRA can take heat that would destroy other groups. Is the NRA perfect? No. No group is. But the name recognition and political ties alone give it power beyond its numbers, unlike the johnny come latelys like GOA (isn't that a city in India?). One huge difference between the two is that the NRA tries to pick the fights it is pretty sure it can win and devotes resources to those. GOA seems to plunge headlong into every fight. That might work, if you have the resources. But if you don't, it could cost you big time.

But, more importantly, time to STOP the stupid, self-destructive infighting, bickering, and name calling that is tearing apart the shooting community. The sporting clays people don't like IDPA who doesn't support CAS who think that ....and on it goes (just examples of groups as they come into my head, but you get the idea). Get rid of the factionalism!

ADDED - if the NRA did indeed muscle out the GOA, that sucks. But, did it happen that way? Or did the GOA step aside to let the one with more political clout carry the ball? Or did maybe SCOTUS allow the NRA but not the GOA?

hornady · « **Reply #7 on:** June 29, 2010, 03:51:21 AM »

Greed is a way of life, is the NRA perfect no, but then what is, I worked union jobs for 40 years, you want to talk about dirty deals and back stabbing, most unions have it down pat, look at politics today, most of them fools will sell you down the river in a heart beat once in office, as with unions and politics you don’t just give up, get involved, I worked in several Union positions over the years, and tried to make a difference, did I, probable not, but like with the NRA, sure there are other smaller groups like GOA, that do a better job, but the NRA is the largest, and Washington only understands money and power, yes over the years there have been several time I was ready to walk away from the NRA, but the fact remains, without the NRA, the gun situation in America would be very different.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #8 on:** June 29, 2010, 07:56:10 AM »

Quote from: subdjoe on June 29, 2010, 03:44:24 AM

ADDED - if the NRA did indeed muscle out the GOA, that sucks. But, did it happen that way? Or did the GOA step aside to let the one with more political clout carry the ball? Or did maybe SCOTUS allow the NRA but not the GOA?

The NRA did not just step in. This is from the NRA.

As a party to the case, the NRA participated in oral arguments before the Court in March. The NRA persuasively argued that the Second Amendment applies to state and local governments through the Fourteenth Amendment and that handgun bans, like those in the City of Chicago and the Village of Oak Park, are unconstitutional under any standard of judicial review. This same view was shared in friend of the court briefs by a bipartisan group of 309 members of Congress from both chambers, 38 state attorneys general, and hundreds of state legislators. Public opinion polls show that it is also shared by the overwhelming majority of the American people.

Dee · « **Reply #9 on:** June 29, 2010, 03:45:23 PM »

Quote from: Land_Owner on June 29, 2010, 01:55:36 AM

Dee, realize that the telemarketer may NOT have been an NRA member, sponsor, or affiliate at all. He may have only been a hired body to make cold calls. Crucifying him when he was just doing a job didn't help either of you (particularly you when he couldn't answer any of your direct questions). Soliciting donations, memberships, etc. does not make the telemarketer the Historian/Defender of the Sponsor activity.

GOA (established 1975) has not attained the clout of the NRA (est. 1871). GOA has not achieved the membership (300,000 according to Wikipedia; NRA-nearly 4 million). GOA is, to their credit, non-compromising on 2nd Amendment issues while the NRA Lobby appears to be erodable and compromising as you describe.

I do not understand the rant about a clear 2nd Amendment win for EVERYONE? As you appear to be knowledgable about this and are setting the record straight, then I believe you. I don't listen to the "Talking Head" news much anyway. I am quite pleased that the 2nd Amendment prevailed - again, as it should.

Land_Owner, I used the term telemarketer out of context. It was an NRA agent that called and represented himself as so. It wasn't a rant and was not directed at the "win for the 2nd Amendment" it was, as anyone should have noticed at the NRA stealing time from the folks that actually did the fighting and footed the bill.

myronman3 · « **Reply #10 on:** June 29, 2010, 04:19:42 PM »

i totally agree with ya dee. after witnessing first hand the nra endorsing democrat ron kind over the other guy (who i know personally-totally pro gun), i realized the fix was in with that bunch.

Quote

If you don't contribute to the NRA or support them, why do you care?

when i see the NRA helping to help destroy MY GOD GIVEN RIGHTS, i care. they are a farce, and there isnt a thing anyone can say or do to change than. stick your head in the sand all ya want, the FACT is the nra stepping in on this case proves that they are nothing more than a bunch of glory whores. the sad thing is they are preying upon people who have the very best of intentions, and those people are devoted until the very end and get angry with anyone who doesnt agree with them.
take redhawk....there is no doubt in my mind that he has the very best of intentions and devotes a ton of his time and effort into his endeavors....and then you have this crew of snakes vamping off of his efforts. it makes me sad.

LONGTOM · « **Reply #11 on:** June 29, 2010, 05:51:39 PM »

I am a member of both organizations along with several others.
I joined the NRA when I was a kid in my early teens.
I became a life member in my late teens.
That's over 30 years ago before many of these groups were ever formed.
I don't agree with some of the things the NRA or many of the other groups does but they are the ones doing the fighting for my rights at the levels that I could never attain.
I do agree that it was GOA that did the work and paid the bill on this case.
The NRA did step in at a later date after they had the chance to be included in the original suit.
They should give credit to GOA for a job well done.
That being said I don't feel it is enough to make me leave the NRA.
There will be fights further down the road and I would like to have as many as possible doing what has to be done on my behalf when the time comes.
If and when any of the organizations I belong to cease to represent my beliefs concerning the US CONSTITUTION I will sever my ties with them.
The NRA has done a lot of good in the past for the 2nd. amendment and they have done some damage as well along the way.
It is up to us to make sure that they know and understand what we the members want, just as we must do the same with our representatives in congress.
No group is perfect, but as a whole they all have and are doing a good job.
The vast number of members in each organization is enough to get anyone's attention.
The main thing is to make sure we all stand together.
Collectively we are a force to recon with!!!

LONGTOM

bronco73401 · « **Reply #12 on:** June 29, 2010, 05:56:44 PM »

Quote from: Redhawk1 on June 29, 2010, 03:36:03 AM

Membership dues only cover the gun rags, nothing more. It is the Donations from supporters that pay everything else. If you don't contribute to the NRA or support them, why do you care?

If indeed the GOA was such a great group, why don't they have 4 Million members? Well it is because they stab other pro-gun rights group in the back and bash them.

I find it funny how people bash the NRA every chance they get, yet they don't bash there representatives and legislators, the ones that a going after our rights on a daily basis. I guess some people just have to have a reason to complain. Then there are some of us that actually do more then whine.

+1 Redhawk

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #13 on:** June 30, 2010, 01:51:23 AM »

Quote from: myronman3 on June 29, 2010, 04:19:42 PM

i totally agree with ya dee. after witnessing first hand the nra endorsing democrat ron kind over the other guy (who i know personally-totally pro gun), i realized the fix was in with that bunch.

Quote
If you don't contribute to the NRA or support them, why do you care?

when i see the NRA helping to help destroy MY GOD GIVEN RIGHTS, i care. they are a farce, and there isnt a thing anyone can say or do to change than. stick your head in the sand all ya want, the FACT is the nra stepping in on this case proves that they are nothing more than a bunch of glory whores. the sad thing is they are preying upon people who have the very best of intentions, and those people are devoted until the very end and get angry with anyone who doesnt agree with them.
take redhawk....there is no doubt in my mind that he has the very best of intentions and devotes a ton of his time and effort into his endeavors....and then you have this crew of snakes vamping off of his efforts. it makes me sad.

I think you may of misread or misunderstood my intent of your quote there.

Quote

If you don't contribute to the NRA or support them, why do you care?

I said that when people were saying how much the executive board members make.. If people don't contribute what do they care how much those people make. Membership dues don't pay for there salaries, it is the donations from big donors that do.

Yes I do care about or second amendment right, as I see it. Our founding fathers said it plain as day. The right (Given by God) of the people to keep (These are mine and you can't have them) and bear (Carry and own) Arms , shall not be infringed.

I look at the over all picture, if the NRA did not step in as it has for so many years, you can bet we would be just like all the other Countries that have lost there gun rights. The Legislators are after guns everyday, not all are big steps, they whittle away at them. Sure the NRA has given up something's, but the alterative was even worse. Do I want to loose any rights at all, Hell no I don't.

As for the NRA stepping in on the Chicago case, why not. You would think everyone would want that. I know when I meet with my legislatures, I feel good knowing I represent 2400 of our 9-12 members. But I would not be upset if another group thought it would help, and joined in to support the fight. Politicians only understand numbers.

billy_56081 · « **Reply #14 on:** June 30, 2010, 02:42:29 AM »

Let's just relish in the win.

With supporters like some here the 2nd amendment is surley doomed.

Old Fart · « **Reply #15 on:** June 30, 2010, 03:34:33 AM »

Quote from: billy_56081 on June 30, 2010, 02:42:29 AM

Let's just relish in the win.

This.

myronman3 · « **Reply #16 on:** June 30, 2010, 03:53:23 AM »

Quote from: billy_56081 on June 30, 2010, 02:42:29 AM

With supporters like some here the 2nd amendment is surley doomed.

i agree with ya, but i think we probably disagree on which members are REALLY supporting the second amendment. some think sending a check to God-knows-who pretending to be supporting the 2nd, when i see it as lining the pockets of the hidden enemy. others do things like introduce new people to guns, educate them and let them shoot them, turning potential anti's into people who have REAL information, not propaganda, to base decisions off of. and i can tell you everyone i have intro-ed ended up with a more pro gun outlook.
so, be careful which side you are on and what accusations you throw out.

myronman3 · « **Reply #17 on:** June 30, 2010, 04:03:44 AM »

and, a 5-4 win isnt something i think you should be sitting back and being proud of. you can dislike liberals all you want to, but i do envy them in that they never stop, they never quit, they find new and constant ways to push their agenda. if the right had that kind of mentality think of the difference it would make. you all enjoy sitting back, relishing your "victory". while you do that, know the opposition is working feverishly against you.

nw_hunter · « **Reply #18 on:** June 30, 2010, 05:15:07 AM »

Quote from: Dee on June 29, 2010, 12:53:50 AM

What a bunch of hypocrites, liars, and now OPENLY BLANTANT PRESS THIEVES, the NRA has become.
All you NRA boys just flame away, if your ok with them STEALING CREDIT FOR A WIN, then that says it all. The NRA IS A SELL OUT, AND AN OPENLY ARROGANT PRESS THIEF.

Right on Dee!

Listen to this interview with Dana Loesch and NRA spokesperson Rachel Parsons.Listen as she double talks her way through the interview.
Dana is soft on her with the questions, but you can still get the picture.

http://biggovernment.com/dloesch/2010/06/29/interview-with-the-nra-on-the-disclose-act/

She sounds like a female version of Wayne La-Pew.
NRA members need to wake up! These people running things at the NRA, are not friends of the Second A.

People like Dee, Myself and others didn't quit the NRA because we turned our backs on our fellow gun owners.......Just the opposite! I saw where they were going, and shifted my support to other groups, that were still in the fight without compromising our rights away.

Land_Owner · « **Reply #19 on:** June 30, 2010, 06:00:58 AM »

My decision to go-Life with an NRA Membership happened, as did LongTom's, MANY YEARS prior to the current bickering. That money is spent but not forgotten.

Today I stand for the 2nd Amendment, gun rights, hunting and fishing...long may they live in America. My NRA membership is ONE TOOL in my toolbox for confronting the Anti's, Leftists, and Liberals.

My toolbox contains an arsenal too, which according to the framers of the Constitution may have to be bloodied against Tyrants before all is said and done.

It is sure that when the shooting starts, those of us with different opinions about the way of the world we knew before it collapsed into anarchy will lock arms in the common defense of our lives and cherrished beliefs - you can have my gun when it is pried from my cold dead hand.

Then and only then will this bickering stop - for a while.

subdjoe · « **Reply #20 on:** June 30, 2010, 06:19:05 AM »

Quote from: myronman3 on June 30, 2010, 03:53:23 AM

Quote from: billy_56081 on June 30, 2010, 02:42:29 AM
With supporters like some here the 2nd amendment is surley doomed.

i agree with ya, but i think we probably disagree on which members are REALLY supporting the second amendment. some think sending a check to God-knows-who pretending to be supporting the 2nd, when i see it as lining the pockets of the hidden enemy. others do things like introduce new people to guns, educate them and let them shoot them, turning potential anti's into people who have REAL information, not propaganda, to base decisions off of. and i can tell you everyone i have intro-ed ended up with a more pro gun outlook.
so, be careful which side you are on and what accusations you throw out.

Good points about introducing people to guns, educating them, letting them see that we are all just ordinary folks. On the political side of things, here is a rant that I put in some local gun stores a few years back. i think there were 5 or 6 anti-gun bills in the CA legislature at that time.

Quote

GET OFF YOUR COMPLACENCY AND DO YOUR PART!
In California there are at least 6,000,000 firearms owners, yet we
have some of the most draconian and Byzantine firearms laws in the
country. Why? Because too many of us are content to sit and complain
but are unwilling to take half an hour a week to do anything about it.
Most of us would rather stand around at the range or in a gun shop
and spend a couple of hours debating the merits of .300 Magnum over
the latest .270 super short ultra mag. Can you find five minutes a
day to support your civil rights? That is all it takes. If you can't
give that little amount of time, you deserve to have your guns
legislated away from you. Imagine if in your assembly district EVERY
gun owner called his or her assembly member once a week to complain
about restrictive firearms legislation. Say there are only 15,000 gun
owners in your district (with 80 districts that comes to 1.2 million,
a far cry from all the legal gun owners in the state) and each one
makes a call once a week which takes 3 minutes of staff time. It
would take 750 man-hours per WEEK just to listen to gun owners
complain about restrictive gun laws. That would mean that every
member of the Assembly would need almost 19 full time staff members to
do nothing but pay attention to our calls. Think they might hear us?
After all, politicians are concerned with numbers.

There are five calls you need to make each week – to one assembly
member, one state senator, one member of the House of Representatives,
and two members of the US Senate. That is what it will take, each of
us calling once a week to make our views known.

Yes, you may belong to the NRA or Gun Owners of America, or the
California Rifle and Pistol Association, but so what? Do you think
that absolves you from taking personal responsibility for what
happens? YOU are responsible for protecting your rights. No one else
can do it for you.

(deleted list of various politicians along with contact information)

By the way, feel free to copy that, use it as a base for your own rants, distribute it. Whatever to help the cause.

Ruskin · « **Reply #21 on:** June 30, 2010, 06:36:09 AM »

I thought the 2nd Amendment Foundation did the legal arguments in front of the court.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #22 on:** June 30, 2010, 07:35:27 AM »

Quote from: nw_hunter on June 30, 2010, 05:15:07 AM

Quote from: Dee on June 29, 2010, 12:53:50 AM
What a bunch of hypocrites, liars, and now OPENLY BLANTANT PRESS THIEVES, the NRA has become.
All you NRA boys just flame away, if your ok with them STEALING CREDIT FOR A WIN, then that says it all. The NRA IS A SELL OUT, AND AN OPENLY ARROGANT PRESS THIEF.

Right on Dee!

Listen to this interview with Dana Loesch and NRA spokesperson Rachel Parsons.Listen as she double talks her way through the interview.
Dana is soft on her with the questions, but you can still get the picture.

http://biggovernment.com/dloesch/2010/06/29/interview-with-the-nra-on-the-disclose-act/

She sounds like a female version of Wayne La-Pew.
NRA members need to wake up! These people running things at the NRA, are not friends of the Second A.

People like Dee, Myself and others didn't quit the NRA because we turned our backs on our fellow gun owners.......Just the opposite! I saw where they were going, and shifted my support to other groups, that were still in the fight without compromising our rights away.

You don't get it.. I am not going to waste any more time on you. Go ahead and keep bashing the NRA. That is what the Liberals do. So keep showing the side you support.

Dee · « **Reply #23 on:** June 30, 2010, 03:46:19 PM »

Quote from: Redhawk1 on June 30, 2010, 07:35:27 AM

Quote from: nw_hunter on June 30, 2010, 05:15:07 AM
Quote from: Dee on June 29, 2010, 12:53:50 AM
What a bunch of hypocrites, liars, and now OPENLY BLANTANT PRESS THIEVES, the NRA has become.
All you NRA boys just flame away, if your ok with them STEALING CREDIT FOR A WIN, then that says it all. The NRA IS A SELL OUT, AND AN OPENLY ARROGANT PRESS THIEF.

Right on Dee!

Listen to this interview with Dana Loesch and NRA spokesperson Rachel Parsons.Listen as she double talks her way through the interview.
Dana is soft on her with the questions, but you can still get the picture.

http://biggovernment.com/dloesch/2010/06/29/interview-with-the-nra-on-the-disclose-act/

She sounds like a female version of Wayne La-Pew.
NRA members need to wake up! These people running things at the NRA, are not friends of the Second A.

People like Dee, Myself and others didn't quit the NRA because we turned our backs on our fellow gun owners.......Just the opposite! I saw where they were going, and shifted my support to other groups, that were still in the fight without compromising our rights away.

You don't get it.. I am not going to waste any more time on you. Go ahead and keep bashing the NRA. That is what the Liberals do. So keep showing the side you support.

Good idea nw_hunter. Lets' keep doin it.

davestewart38 · « **Reply #24 on:** July 01, 2010, 10:52:46 AM »

While the NRA may not be perfect,they have done more to protect your 2nd ammendment rights than all the other groups put together.They are large enough to make a difference.The fringe pro gun groups have too few members for politicians to care what they think.People who join the fringe pro gun groups because the NRA doesn't always do the right thing remind me of the people who vote for third party candidates for President because the Republican party doesn't always do the right thing.You have to be realistic.Teddy Roosevelt couldn't get elected as a third party candidate.A third party candidate will not win the next presidential election.The next president will have a D or an R by his name.People who failed to realize this helped to elect the Kenyan Messiah.

Dee · « **Reply #25 on:** July 01, 2010, 03:56:49 PM »

One of those "fringe pro gun groups"

is the one that got this one to the Supreme Court, and won the damn case. The NRA jumped on THEIR (fringe pro gun groups

) band wagon and tried to steal the credit after doing NOTHING to help.

S.S. · « **Reply #26 on:** July 01, 2010, 04:08:32 PM »

I am just glad that enough justices understand the constitution to have saved it!
I just hope that the remaining patriotic justices outlast the liberal onslaught.
I give the genious founding fathers the credit for using "The People" in multiple
amendments.

nw_hunter · « **Reply #27 on:** July 01, 2010, 05:33:00 PM »

Quote from: davestewart38 on July 01, 2010, 10:52:46 AM

While the NRA may not be perfect,they have done more to protect your 2nd ammendment rights than all the other groups put together.They are large enough to make a difference.The fringe pro gun groups have too few members for politicians to care what they think.People who join the fringe pro gun groups because the NRA doesn't always do the right thing remind me of the people who vote for third party candidates for President because the Republican party doesn't always do the right thing.You have to be realistic.Teddy Roosevelt couldn't get elected as a third party candidate.A third party candidate will not win the next presidential election.The next president will have a D or an R by his name.People who failed to realize this helped to elect the Kenyan Messiah.

It's not that the NRA doesn't always do the right thing.......As of late, they NEVER do the right thing.

You are very wrong about the so called fringe pro gun groups. They have an impact, and the NRA is taking advantage of it. It's obvious, you are an R, and a party R, and will vote for the party, just like you will side with the NRA even if you KNOW they are wrong. Some of us, even though we are an R will not vote for a candidate if they are bad for for the country (Jaun McCain).

The third party voters didn't help elect Obama. (3%) didn't swing it! True conservative Republicans that looked at the Bush Adm for eight years, and saw the mess he help create, and looked at the liberal McCain, either stayed at home on election day, or a few like my neighbor (a life long Republican) voted for Obama.

What you should be doing is..........screaming at your NRA leaders and demanding they get with the other pro gun groups and fight for our rights, instead of making excuses for them. I tried it for a while, but gave up because there was not enough of us to make them listen, so I decided to put my resources and time to work with a group that would. One of those FRINGE groups you speak of

davestewart38 · « **Reply #28 on:** July 01, 2010, 09:38:13 PM »

I don't vote a straight Republican ticket.I voted for our current pro gun governor Ted Strickland(D) in the last election.However,I do prefer to vote for candidates that have some chance of getting elected.Ron Paul has about as much chance of getting elected President as RuPaul does.Those of you who voted for third party candidates in the last election could have voted for him(her?it?) and had the same impact on the election.I don't like John McCain either but do you honestly believe that we are not worse off with Obama?Since getting elected Obama has managed to make George Bush look fiscally responsible.He could potentially destroy your 2nd ammendment rights with just 2 Supreme Court nominations.Any "lifelong Republicans" who voted for Obama really cut off their nose to spite their face.As for as the NRA not doing anything right how about firearms training?The NRA is actively involved in firearms training for police.This helps win us friends among law enforcement.The NRA also supports youth firearms training programs.I help coach one of these programs.We teach safe gun handling and basic marksmanship skills.NRA helps to promote gun safety through the Eddie Eagle program and hunter safety programs.For those of us who value our American heritage of hunting and shooting these programs are vitally important because they encourage participation in the shooting sports.Most people who don't own or use firearms probably don't care about your right to do so.I suspect that Handgun Control Inc. would probably not have much luck trying to convince any of my junior shooters that firearms are evil and should be banned.

Dee · « **Reply #29 on:** July 02, 2010, 12:59:10 AM »

In all these posts I am one of the few that has actually addressed the "FACT" that the NRA didn't do a damn thing in this Chicago case until AFTER the GOA did all the work, and then STOLE 15 minutes of the show they did not help to produce. All you guys have done is defend the NRA about what a great bunch of guys they are.
Don't any of you NRA WORSHIPERS want to comment on the THIEVERY they committed, and the LACK OF SUPPORT for the case, or is that ok with you.