"The World After Oil" A tree hugger's pipe dream

[bilmac]

Another one of these mega disaster shows on the tube last night, this one took the cake. Theme of the production was that we will eventually run out of oil on planet earth and what a disaster that will be. The theme was flawed from the beginning because the hippies that put it together have no idea of how free markets work. They presumed that oil will disappear all over the earth overnight. Bullroar!!  Yup we will probably pretty much run out of oil eventually, but it won't happen overnight, as supplies dwindle, prices will rise gradually. As prices rise other sources of energy will become economically feasible alternatives.

What a childish, ignorant view of the world these people have.

[magooch]

How about all the believers (environmentalist extremists, hippies, tree huggers and such) simply refuse to use oil, or any of its by-products?  They need to show the way by example--not just empty words.

[gypsyman]

When they start showing up at protests in conastoga wagons, I'll give them more credit. Until then, just a bunch of blow hards!! gypsyman

[Swampman]

I try to use as little gas as I can.  I've been driving 40mpg cars for 40 years.  If I could afford a 50+ mpg car I'd have one.

[Dixie Dude]

One can make oil out of algae, soybeans, rapeseed (Canola), and synthetically from coal (800 year supply).  

Alcohol out of corn, switchgrass, and sugar cane.  

Natural gas can run vehicles.  We have a 200 year supply already tapped.  It can also be made from cow manure from feedstalls and dairy farms (1/3 of the nations supply).  It can also be captured from sewage treatment plants. 

Trouble is right now, all the alternatives costs about double what drilling costs and/or importing.  

IF the feds would take all the taxes off the alternatives until they get well established, then we could wean ourselves off foreign oil.  For instance, it costs $2.00 a gallon to produce algae oil, BEFORE the excise taxes.  

Natural gas costs $1.37-$2.00 a gallon at refueling stations.  However, there is no encouragement by the feds to convert vehicles, nor do the oil companies want to install the compressor stations.  

Alcohol is the least efficient because it takes more farmland out of production.  Algae oil can be produced by sea algae in shallow underwater areas or in greenhouses on land and is the most efficient to produce.  

[Swampman]

None of the subs can be produced without huge taxpayers support.  I don't want to support them.

[Sourdough]

Swampman: I agree, we do not need to support the alternatives with tax dollers.  Let the free market work.  When it is economically feasiable it will happen.

As for Bio-mass, Alaska has millions of acres of Black Spruce just sitting there growing and burning every year.  No one wants to do anythign with it.  The OSB you buy at Home Depot is made from Black Spruce.  An awful lot of paper that you use is also made from Black Spruce.  Again the Canadians are ahead of us.  They harvest it instead of letting it burn.  They chip it and take it to market.  OSB and paper are made then most shipped to the US.  Another case of the US transfering wealth.

That Bio-Mass can also be used to make fuel.  Once it is economically feasiable the Canadians will be ready to sell it to us.  Seems we can not get our stuff togeather and do it on our own.  Too many EPA regulations.   

[Dixie Dude]

I am an engineer with a natural gas utility.  It takes 36 pages of paperwork to get an environmental permit to install a pipeline within an existing highway ROW.  The area was already disturbed when they built the highway and cut the ROW's.  However, they don't want any mud to run off and get in streams if it rains.  We are required to keep daily records with rain gauges, and after every rain, survey the area being excavated for a main.  We must spread hay and seed along the ROW we disturb.  We have to keep GPS readings at the begining and end of the project.  We now bore under streams and rivers to avoid getting water samples constantly.  I have been waiting for a permit to install 7,000' of 6" steel high pressure main for 9 months.  (500 psig max operating pressure). I also have to get a permit from the state highway department which usually takes from 1-6 months depending on the size pipe and the area excavated and this requires additonal 4 pages of paperwork plus complete maps.  We also have to be inspected by the public service commission for operating safety regulations based on the US Department of Transportation, Office of Pipeline Safety.  Welders have to be certified every year.  Inspectors have to be certified every year.  These are written tests, and welding samples.  When I started this job 35 years ago, we had our own rules and regulations, now we have all the government regulations so we operate at the lowest common denominator, which are the government regulations.  (So much for socialism).  Most of our original regulations were more extensive, but our paperwork was much less, and we didn't have to wait.  

[magooch]

How would ya like to be in the dam building business now days?