A Lever Action That Outshoots a Bolt Action?

[RIFLE MAN]

There are hunters and marksmen who swear by the fact (at least the
opinion of many so states) that bolt action rifles are inherently more
accurate than lever action rifles. Well, I would like to know if any of
us have ever owned lever rifles that actually were more accurate than
bolt action rifles that you owned? If so, what caliber was it, how long
was the barrel, etc.?

Thanks,
Rifle Man

[Casull]

Nope.

[Swampman]

Most of the Marlins (many calibers) I've owned would shoot MOA or better.  Put a scope on a Marlin that has a nose cap rather than a front barrel band and it will suprise you.

[Canuck Bob]

In heavy kicking hunting rifles there is often little difference and can come down to the rifle.  My 444 will print outstanding 3 shot groups and 10 shot groups are well grouped and consistent for 200 yard hunting.

My rotary bolt 243 BLR was an accurate varmint rifle capable of deadly accuracy at 300 yards on coyotes.  It would shoot with any bolt except heavy barrel bolts that were tuned well.

Generally though you get the best chance at accuracy from a bolt that is handloaded for.  Nothing is as accurate as a bolt benchrest gun.  The average bolt action rifle is not the same gun, it just looks the same.  Many levers suffer from working grade triggers, flat nose bullets that are not as consistent as the best spitzers, and hunting scopes not the best varmint or target/tactical scopes.

[geobru]

This is a group I shot last week through a Japanese BLR, 308, 70's version, at 100 yards.  I think it has a 20" barrel.  Center to center was .62".  The best group I have shot is right at a half inch.  I will say that if you shoot a BLR a whole bunch of times, the groups start to widen out as the barrel heats up.  A good bolt may not be quite as prone to do this as the BLR. 

[Blackhawk44]

A good many out-of the-box BLR's will run with out-of-the-box standard barrel bolt guns, at least for the first three shots.  I would call that fair since I don't recall ever getting more than three shots at any game animal anyway.

[Bigeasy]

Each rifle is different, and I have owned several bolt action centerfires that did not shoot as well as my BLR's, or my Winchester 94 30-30 for that matter.  Big difference between hair splitting accuracy and minute of deer accuracy.  For ultimate accuracy, just look at a serious bench shooting match.  You wont see anything but bolt actions on the line.

Larry

[Siskiyou]

I have posted this before, this is four shots, and top two are factory Remington 150-grain C-L.  Bottoms two are 150-grain Hornady RN handloads.



I believe the group would have been smaller if I had only used one load.

Rifle is a Marlin 336, which was purchased as a K-Mart special back in the early 70’s for less than $100.  The Tasco scope has gone away and replaced with a 2-7X-35MM Burris FFII.

I love the smoothness of the action as it is being open and closed.  A fine piece of machinery.  Bench Rest Rifle, NO, Deer Rifle Yes!

[JPShelton]

Well, my 34 year old Marlin 336 in .30-30 is a solid MOA grouper with factory Federal 170's after having a half-magazine conversion done that eliminated the front barrel band and including releiving the rear one so it doesn't affect POI as the barrel heats up.  That makes it about two times more accurate than the Remington M-700 Mountain Rifle in .280 that I had back in the 80's when that model in that caliber was the gun scribe's latest rage.  It doesn't, however, match what my Savage Model 10 in .243 is capable of doing (sub -MOA).

Up on the mountain where I deer hunt locally, a 75 yard shot is mighty long poke and a 100 yard shot isn't likely.  The last deer I killed there were about 15 and 20 yards away, respectively.  I dont really need the gnat's balls accuracy that my Savage delivers to hit the pie-plate sized vital zone of a deer at 15 to 50 yards.  The dynamic handling of the levergun, however, is mighty useful.

So yeah, I reckon it is possible to have a levergun that will outshoot a sporter-style bolt action intended for general big game hunting -provided that the bolt action in question isn't my Savage Model 10 .

-JP

[IOWA DON]

An old guy asked me to sight in his deer rifle about 30 years ago. It was a scope sighted Browning lever action in .308 Winchester. He gave me some full jacket military ammo for sighting in but he was going to use some soft points for hunting. I was a amazed. It was giving 1/2-inch 3-shot groups at 100 yards! My 7MM Weatherby bolt action with a Shilen barrel was not as accurate.

[kyelkhunter3006]

I've had a couple of bolt actions that were DOGS, so of course the Marlin's I've had (and others I've shot) out shot them.  I'd have to call it about even, really.  I've had many more bolt actions than lever guns, and they've all been decent shooters or better.  I'm not a long range hunter, honestly, so if I'm getting 2" groups, that's enough for my needs.

My four most accurate guns I've had:

CZ527 Carbine in 7.62x39 with 122gr Wolf (Crazy yes, but it was under MOA all day long, hot or cold)
H&R Ultra 25-06 (1/2"-5/8" consistently with 120 gr Remington, untuned out of the box)
Ruger 1A in 7x57 (MOA or better with 140 gr Remington, out of the box)
Winchester Model 70 Ranger 30-06 (3/8" 5 shot groups with 180gr Failsafes)

I've never shot a Marlin in any caliber or model that grouped more than 2" at 100 yds, scoped, with loads it liked.  Most were consistently less than that.  For shots under 200yds, I'd take a Marlin lever gun over a bolt action any time.  Love they way they handle.

[Nakota]

My brother has a Belgian made BLR in .308 that shoots as good as any bolt gun I have.

[darkwing]

Savage 99 in 308. Around 1976 10 shots in a 1.25 '' hole . Not center to center. Traded it in 1978 for a m70 bull barrel in 243 that did better with 5 shot group but not 10

[Mt_Sourdough]

I've already posted this once, but...


This load gives me an average of .75 for 3 shot groups.  Ive fired a total of 5 groups and all are under MOA.  Now, is it more accurate than a bolt rifle?  I dunno but, this is a 444 Marlin and for its intended purpose, it is at least as good as any bolt.  

[Winter Hawk]

I've had a sporterized Springfield, Remington 700, Remington 788, and Savage 110. all in .30-06 or .308.  I traded the Savage off for a used Winchester 88 in .308, 25 years ago and it shoots rings around all the bolt guns I've had.  Now that may be because I have used it more than all of the others combined, but if I do my part it will do its part without fussing about what I feed it.

-WH-

[John Y Cannuck]

Take away the rest, make 'em shoot off hand. Then see how well they do.

[wreckhog]

BLR's can be great shooters. Lock up as good as a bolt. But they have skinny barrels, 2 piece stocks, and can have bad triggers. Great for 1 or 2 shots hunting, but will not be any good for 200 rounds at the bench. At least not as good as a heavy barrel .308 bolt in a McMillan stock.

[John Y Cannuck]

Lever guns were not (in general) designed as bench rifles, or even target rifles for that matter, they were built to shoot game at reasonable distances.
I feel they do that job better than most bolt guns. They may not be as accurate as some bolt guns, but, they're likely more accurate than some too.
We all know that lever gun accuracy is acceptable, and their handling characteristics make up for the rest. 

[T.R.]

I like to think that my Savage 99 was designed for the hunter in mind; not a target shooter.  Yet it shoots amazingly well with factory Black Hills Ammo.  First two holes touching at 100 yards is typical.  My .308 has taken many mulies, couple elk, and a few whitetails for me over the years.

TR

[Hunter6657]

My Marlin 308MXLR and 338MX are both consistent MOA rifles and will usually do 3/4" groups at 100 yards.

[Lloyd Smale]

ive gotten a few 444s 4570s and 3030s under an inch at a 100 yards. The old 336adl that was dads will do it with about any load you put in it. Ive had many bolt guns especially rugers that wouldnt shoot moa with any load.

[sureshot2040]

i had a winchester buffalo bill commemorative with a 26inch barrel in 30-30 that would shoot moa offhand at 100 yards
off the bags it would drop down to between 1/2 moa to 1/4 moa
i put a marbles tang sight on it and at 91 clicks elevation on the sight
it would keep em all on a paper plate at 500 yards all day long
i have had scoped sniper rifles that were hard pressed to do that
but i have always been a leveraction kind of guy 

[Bowjack]

My savage 99 in .300 Savage will easily shoot sub-MOA for 3 shot groups, and will probably outshoot many avg. production bolt guns.  The thin barrel will heat up after 3 shots, but this is more than adequate for me.

I don't need a bench rest rifle, nor do I want one when hunting.  This gun is whitetail poison and is fine just the way it is, light, portable, accurate, feels great, and deadly potent out to 300 yards.

However, I do have some accurate bolt guns and I am not ready to give them up yet. 

[wreckhog]

i had a winchester buffalo bill commemorative with a 26inch barrel in 30-30 that would shoot moa offhand at 100 yards
off the bags it would drop down to between 1/2 moa to 1/4 moa
i put a marbles tang sight on it and at 91 clicks elevation on the sight
it would keep em all on a paper plate at 500 yards all day long
i have had scoped sniper rifles that were hard pressed to do that
but i have always been a leveraction kind of guy 

My 26" Canadian Centennial is more accurate than I am at any range. I'll never know how good it is unless I scope it, but it always surprises me with accuracy.

[Dixie Dude]

I have a Browning 308 lever, that will outshoot some bolt guns probably.  Browning levers are very well made.  Shoots pointy bullets and in magnum calibers. 

[mannyrock]

    I have seen many scoped Marlin 1894s, in .357 Mag, that will group at or under one inch at 100 yards, with factory ammo, and no custom work.  Yes, these outshoot about half of all bolt rifles I see at the range.

    And, I have seen many scoped Marlin 336s, in .30-30, using 170 grain factory ammo, shoot at or under 1.5 inches at 100 yards.  This puts them on par with the majority of bolt guns I see at the range.

    I am sure that many people have seen the same thing.

    If people were honest, they would actually admit that about 25% of all bolt action rifles, especially the carbines and the ones with long thin barrels, will barely group  2 inches.


 

[Blackhawk44]

Found a better bullet for my .257 BLR.  With a pitiful Simmons 2.5x8 it now drops 5 (not 3) rapid rounds into .82" off the sandbags. 

[lakota]

I have a early 50's era 94 Winchester .30/30 that belonged to my grandpa. Its probably not as accurate as a bolt gun but it is by far the most natural pointing rifle I have ever shot. I bring it to shoulder and it almost aims its self. I love that rifle.

[Freezer]

  I have a Savage 99f in 308. It wears a 2x7 leupold VXII  this rifle holds sub moa for the first three shots.  I've never went beyond three because the barrel heats up too fast.  I had the trigger touched and I polished the barrel. Loading 165 gr Sierra Game Kings over Varget with match primers I get 2875fps with no pressure signs.
  I shot a deer at the base of the head with a barrowed Savage 99f in 300 Savage at 281 yrards.  I have full confidence in these guns.
  I own a Rem 700 bdl in 280 Rem.  It's faster and slightly more accurate but heavier.  It's my distance gun.  If I think I will get shots from 100 to 400 yards that's the gun I'll carry.  Anyting from woods to 300 yards the Savage gets the nod.  I don't need MOA accuracy from the Savage but the I have supream confidence in this rifle knowing it does.
  The other lever gun I've seen capible of this is the BLR. A man looked up to as a kid owned it.  It was chambered in 308 and had a Leupold.  I can't remember the magnifacation.  he used factory ammo.

[Swampman]

As long as there is a scope on the rifle, it matters little wheather it's a bolt action or a lever action.