Author Topic: decriminalize Marijuana? (Read 4669 times)

nw_hunter · « **on:** July 29, 2010, 05:52:06 AM »

On California's November 2010 ballot there will be an initiative to decriminalize the use, limited possession, and limited growing of marijuana.

I'm just curious as to what other members of the forum think about this proposal!

Even though I don't use the stuff or alcohol for that matter, after seeing first hand what alcohol can do to a person and family, I think Marijuana is the least destructive of the two drugs, and since it can not be controlled anymore than alcohol could, why not.

The war on drugs has been a miserable failure, and the incarceration of people who use drugs is just a drain the already over taxed citizens, not to mention the harm to the family structure. "IMO"

What's your thoughts?

bobg · « **Reply #1 on:** July 29, 2010, 06:11:25 AM »

I tried it once years ago. It did strange things to me Maybe that is because i was drinking at the time. Never tried it again. My son in law and my grandson both smoke it. It doesn't bother my son in law but my grandson gets weird when he smokes it. Might as well make it legal they don't have any trouble buying it.

subdjoe · « **Reply #2 on:** July 29, 2010, 06:16:51 AM »

Legalize it. Sell it through state run stores, and tax the hell out of it. Budget problems taken care of by increased revenue from sales, and from the billions spent on programs like CAMP, which maybe get 5% of the crop. Also, by having it legal, and sold through state stores, the price can be controlled to undercut the thugs and "disincentiveize" the illegal pot farms. Make it safe to go hiking or riding in the boondocks again.

myronman3 · « **Reply #3 on:** July 29, 2010, 06:20:49 AM »

Quote

Even though I don't use the stuff or alcohol for that matter, after seeing first hand what alcohol can do to a person and family, I think Marijuana is the least destructive of the two drugs, and since it can not be controlled anymore than alcohol could, why not.

ya hit the nail on the head. the only thing i would add is that if under the influence while driving, mandatory 6 months in jail.

blind ear · « **Reply #4 on:** July 29, 2010, 06:22:30 AM »

The pressure on the legal system might not be decreased because of the new users that are of an addictive nature that wouldn't have tried it before.

It doesn't sound very good to me. Remove prision time for use or posession but be careful about makeing manufacture and sale legal unless guidelines similar to alcohol levels in the body are put into practice for people that move about in public in cars.

The resteraunt/food industry has had a long standing closed eyes approach to dealing with drugs because of the high pressure involved in that industry. I don't know the effects it has had.

Kids that start young with drug use often have bad ends. it can lead to mental illness it seems to me from what I have seen in mental health work as a nurse. Adults often do end up in trouble also form playing with drugs. Addiction is horrible to have to fight for a lifetime.

Growing up in the 60s I don't have enough fingers and toes to count all the people that I knew well or casually that ended up dead because of thier drug use habbits. Car wrecks, overdoses, heppatitus, liver or kidney failure and of course the homicides and suicides.

It scares me without more knowledge than has been presented so far.

eddiegjr

Matt · « **Reply #5 on:** July 29, 2010, 07:10:37 AM »

Quote from: subdjoe on July 29, 2010, 06:16:51 AM

Legalize it. Sell it through state run stores, and tax the hell out of it. Budget problems taken care of by increased revenue from sales, and from the billions spent on programs like CAMP, which maybe get 5% of the crop. Also, by having it legal, and sold through state stores, the price can be controlled to undercut the thugs and "disincentiveize" the illegal pot farms. Make it safe to go hiking or riding in the boondocks again.

+1

jimster · « **Reply #6 on:** July 29, 2010, 07:24:34 AM »

Might as well legalize it.

Quote

Kids that start young with drug use often have bad ends.

They do anyway. Won't matter, won't be any easier to get than it is now.

Everyone that uses this now will still use it, no matter if the laws change or not. Everyone that wants to try it will try it no matter what the laws are. Might as well make it like booze, and tax and regulate it.

It won't matter to me one way or the other, but there is a lot of money wasted putting people in jail for pot, and letting the pushers make all the money.

Quote

Make it safe to go hiking or riding in the boondocks again.

Yep...no worries about stepping on the toes of someone's BIG money while hunting, there is another plus.

Might even have a whole lot less border activity too if they grew more of it right here.

gstewart44 · « **Reply #7 on:** July 29, 2010, 07:27:41 AM »

Quote from: myronman3 on July 29, 2010, 06:20:49 AM

Quote
Even though I don't use the stuff or alcohol for that matter, after seeing first hand what alcohol can do to a person and family, I think Marijuana is the least destructive of the two drugs, and since it can not be controlled anymore than alcohol could, why not.
ya hit the nail on the head. the only thing i would add is that if under the influence while driving, mandatory 6 months in jail.

+1 MM - in the 40 years since high school I have lost many friends, classmates, and my father to alcohol; either in drunk driving accidents, liver failure or alcohol toxicity. I know what it has done to our society first hand.

Another observance I have had through the years comes from playing in a band in bars and on college campuses. Crowds amped up on alcohol have a greater propensity for fighting than a bunch of stoners sitting around listening to Pink Floyd. Conclusion: Booze makes you think you are Superman, Pot makes you not care.

Tax the weed like we do alcohol and tobacco and raise some revenues. This would hit the gangs in their wallets too.

myronman3 · « **Reply #8 on:** July 29, 2010, 08:05:26 AM »

Quote

Crowds amped up on alcohol have a greater propensity for fighting than a bunch of stoners sitting around listening to Pink Floyd. Conclusion: Booze makes you think you are Superman, Pot makes you not care.

i have often times asked people against maryj "how many times have you seen drunks get into fights?" followed by "how many times have you seen stoners pass the pipe, then start fighting?"

Swampman · « **Reply #9 on:** July 29, 2010, 08:13:07 AM »

The war on drugs cannot be won. It's a waste of the taxpayers money.

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #10 on:** July 29, 2010, 08:34:34 AM »

Being in CA I will vote NO.
Not to legalize it.
It is not making it like beer or wine and taxing it it is just going to tell the state and local police to not arrest people for possing it, smoking, or growing it.
The ATF and Narcotics squads will still be after the growers,drug importers (smugglers) and sellers. The durg gangs will still try to protect thier field and distribution.
If this bill were to make it legal like beer, wine, Booze and tabaco products, sell it, tax it and tax the profits of the producers then I see no problem with it.
But all this does is ship $ south to the durg cartels, this will not make our hills, parks, or private property safe, Not one dime of moeny will be collected for taxes. You still can not put on you 1040 as occupation - Pot {grower, packager, wholesale, or retailer} and not be prosicuted on the federal level.

Pat/Rick · « **Reply #11 on:** July 29, 2010, 09:22:16 AM »

Is there a field test that LEO can do to indicate/proove under the influence of,shy of a U.A.? Not that I am aware of. That is probably the biggest reason I am not in favor of its legalization or decriminalization.Too many drunks on the road, do we need stoners out there with them? I know there will always be irresponsible people out there but why add it to the mix? I am kinda mixed on it as it is, I don't really care if it is legalized if the users stay out from behind the wheel. I have thought about it, I deal with middlin to severe chronic pain everyday.

Spirithawk · « **Reply #12 on:** July 29, 2010, 09:48:33 AM »

What a lot of people don't realise is that marijuana is, in one form or another, in many prescription meds. I know that with folks, such as those with cancer and glaucoma, it can work miricles in easing their grief. To be honest I wonder if it would help with pain as i've heard that it can? I flat refuse to take oxycodone and, though I take it from necesity, I don't much like morphine either. Marijuana would be far less adictive with way fewer side effects. I think if it were legalised, you needed a license to grow x amount for personal use, and over the counter was taxed just like cigarettes or alcohol then it might be a good thing all around. As for those that would grow it illegally, pushers and drug cartels, they are already here but who will buy from them if you can grow it yourself? As for driving under the influence, nothing will change. You have idiots doing it a already. In that matter, driving under the influence of any drug, including alcohol, should be heavily punished. I've got a useless nephew, by marriage, that is an alcoholic. I've lost count of how many DUI's he's had. Yet he's never been in jail one day, nor done anything worse than pay a fine and comunity service. In my book thats bull! And yes he's still driving! Punish those breaking the law, not those trying to abide by it. There's an old saying;

" Man made alcohol. God made Marijuana. Who do you trust? "

Norm1057 · « **Reply #13 on:** July 29, 2010, 10:46:31 AM »

Legalize!

An individual's choice to ingest anything belongs only to the individual!

Graybeard · « **Reply #14 on:** July 29, 2010, 11:15:44 AM »

There is no war on drugs anymore than there is a war on terrorism. The folks in DC and in the state capitals and big cities that are running things are the REAL terrorists and they fund a lot of it with drug money. So they have no incentive to end illegal drug sale just like they have no incentive to end the constant fighting and killing to fund the war industry.

The supposed terrorist are just an arm of the CIA so if we fight them that means we're fighting our own folks. If folks ever figure this whole scheme out maybe they will stand up and stop it. I'm too old and feeble to do anything anymore other than tell you folks what I see happening. It's up to folks younger and/or in better health than me to bring it to an end. But that's not gonna happen as there are too many with their hands in the till and they don't really want it to end. See the thread on catching wild hogs. It really is exactly what has happened to this country and we're already inside the fence and the gate is closing fast.

nw_hunter · « **Reply #15 on:** July 29, 2010, 11:37:23 AM »

Quote from: Pat/Rick on July 29, 2010, 09:22:16 AM

Too many drunks on the road, do we need stoners out there with them? I know there will always be irresponsible people out there but why add it to the mix? I am kinda mixed on it as it is, I don't really care if it is legalized if the users stay out from behind the wheel. I have thought about it, I deal with middlin to severe chronic pain everyday.

They are out there with them already!
There will always be people impaired driving on our highways.This world is growing in leaps and bounds....More folks, more irresponsible people.

I've worked along side of Alcoholic's and pot smokers, and believe me I'll take the pot smoker any day of the week. Not that I want to work with anyone taking a mind altering drug.

Taxing it? How do you control a plant that is as easy to grow as a cucumber or any other garden vegetable?

Just stop arresting people for smoking the stuff.If they commit a crime while on it...........Punish the crime!
The sale of prescription pain killers would prob. drop, and the Pharmaceutical Mafia would just hate that!

Imagine the nerve of some people fighting cancer pain with a drug free for the growing.

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #16 on:** July 29, 2010, 12:29:56 PM »

Quote from: Spirithawk on July 29, 2010, 09:48:33 AM

What a lot of people don't realise is that marijuana is, in one form or another, in many prescription meds. I know that with folks, such as those with cancer and glaucoma, it can work miricles in easing their grief. To be honest I wonder if it would help with pain as i've heard that it can? I flat refuse to take oxycodone and, though I take it from necesity, I don't much like morphine either. Marijuana would be far less adictive with way fewer side effects. I think if it were legalised, you needed a license to grow x amount for personal use, and over the counter was taxed just like cigarettes or alcohol then it might be a good thing all around. As for those that would grow it illegally, pushers and drug cartels, they are already here but who will buy from them if you can grow it yourself? As for driving under the influence, nothing will change. You have idiots doing it a already. In that matter, driving under the influence of any drug, including alcohol, should be heavily punished. I've got a useless nephew, by marriage, that is an alcoholic. I've lost count of how many DUI's he's had. Yet he's never been in jail one day, nor done anything worse than pay a fine and comunity service. In my book thats bull! And yes he's still driving! Punish those breaking the law, not those trying to abide by it. There's an old saying;

" Man made alcohol. God made Marijuana. Who do you trust? "

Two things wrong with your argument.
1) the drugs that contain dirivitives of Pot are legally perscribed. Cocane is perscribed on accasion.
2) this is not to legalize it all it does is not criminalize it. SO the people that are growing it, selling it and defending it are still in the mix.
if this were to make cigarettes filled with pot legal and able to sell it in the store to 18 or 21 and older I would be for it.
All this does is make it so criminals can still sell it to children in grade school, jr. High and High School.
The police will not prosocute the case for having or smoking it.
If you want to allow there to be Malborro 420's great. Let the farmers grow it, let the companies make it, and make it safe and standard, and let the city, state and federal government collect taxes on it.
Other than that I don't get how we can allow some groups to just ignore some laws. I think income taxes should be 7% and no more than fair. If others are allowed to ignore federal law can I ignore the ones I don't agree with?

blind ear · « **Reply #17 on:** July 29, 2010, 01:04:05 PM »

Come to think of it the masses seem to be living in a fog already. How much more would it change the way society thinks and acts?

The prospect is Still sacrey.

eddiegjr

GH1 · « **Reply #18 on:** July 29, 2010, 01:38:23 PM »

Legalize it, regulate it, and tax the hell out of it.
GH1

billy_56081 · « **Reply #19 on:** July 29, 2010, 02:01:51 PM »

The feds need to legalise it or the state laws are worthless. Sure maybe one administration may not enforce the federal laws, but when the winds of change blow your little pot field may be you little felony field.

crustylicious · « **Reply #20 on:** July 29, 2010, 02:37:50 PM »

Legalize it and all the Mexicans can go home and grow a cash crop!

torpedoman · « **Reply #21 on:** July 29, 2010, 02:49:50 PM »

we have now proved beyond any doubt that prohibition does not work, not once but twice

davestewart38 · « **Reply #22 on:** July 29, 2010, 03:31:46 PM »

Quote from: torpedoman on July 29, 2010, 02:49:50 PM

we have now proved beyond any doubt that prohibition does not work, not once but twice

+1

DDZ · « **Reply #23 on:** July 29, 2010, 03:38:21 PM »

Quote from: eddiegjr on July 29, 2010, 01:04:05 PM

Come to think of it the masses seem to be living in a fog already. How much more would it change the way society thinks and acts?

The prospect is Still sacrey.

eddiegjr

Ain't that the truth.

wreckhog · « **Reply #24 on:** July 29, 2010, 04:22:35 PM »

Quote from: nw_hunter on July 29, 2010, 05:52:06 AM

On California's November 2010 ballot there will be an initiative to decriminalize the use, limited possession, and limited growing of marijuana.

I'm just curious as to what other members of the forum think about this proposal!

Even though I don't use the stuff or alcohol for that matter, after seeing first hand what alcohol can do to a person and family, I think Marijuana is the least destructive of the two drugs, and since it can not be controlled anymore than alcohol could, why not.

The war on drugs has been a miserable failure, and the incarceration of people who use drugs is just a drain the already over taxed citizens, not to mention the harm to the family structure. "IMO"

What's your thoughts?

Alcohol is far more destructive

wreckhog · « **Reply #25 on:** July 29, 2010, 04:27:38 PM »

Quote from: eddiegjr on July 29, 2010, 06:22:30 AM

The pressure on the legal system might not be decreased because of the new users that are of an addictive nature that wouldn't have tried it before.

It doesn't sound very good to me. Remove prision time for use or posession but be careful about makeing manufacture and sale legal unless guidelines similar to alcohol levels in the body are put into practice for people that move about in public in cars.

The resteraunt/food industry has had a long standing closed eyes approach to dealing with drugs because of the high pressure involved in that industry. I don't know the effects it has had.

Kids that start young with drug use often have bad ends. it can lead to mental illness it seems to me from what I have seen in mental health work as a nurse. Adults often do end up in trouble also form playing with drugs. Addiction is horrible to have to fight for a lifetime.

Growing up in the 60s I don't have enough fingers and toes to count all the people that I knew well or casually that ended up dead because of thier drug use habbits. Car wrecks, overdoses, heppatitus, liver or kidney failure and of course the homicides and suicides.

It scares me without more knowledge than has been presented so far.

eddiegjr

Growing up Irish, alcoholism was considered a given and not a serious problem. To the degree, that being dead drunk 25% of the time was an acceptable state to be a cop, run a business, raise a family, etc. Consequently, I have known many more folks that have let alcohol destroy their lives.

Ruskin · « **Reply #26 on:** July 29, 2010, 04:37:33 PM »

I hunted with a guy for a couple of years who was crippled from waist down. He told me he lived in a drug stupor from Rx drugs. He did research and found marijuana would possibly help. He obtained permsiion to legally use marijuana for his condition. It controlled the spasms the Rx drugs would not. As far as I know he is the only one in Flrida able to legally used marijuana. His source, the federal government, quit doing it under Bush 41.

He also helped two young girls obtain the privilege to use marijuan during their cancer treatments. On marijuana, they gained weight and were making progress. When Bush 41 left office he closed the program down. The girls have since passed. Maybe it would have been different if the program was still going.

They could get their marijuana through the federal government until the program was killed.

Check the internet for Chris Woderski. I believe his story is still there.

I could not deny a person needing marijuana for medical reasons. Drugs have a place; however, there is more to alternative treatments which are not patentable by Big Pharma.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #27 on:** July 30, 2010, 05:15:00 AM »

Make it legal. People are doing it anyway's and our jails are filled with guys that got caught up in the 3 strikes BS. What people do in there own home is there business.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #28 on:** July 30, 2010, 06:15:03 AM »

If legal what will they use the jails for ? what will the police on drug enforcement do ? Gee what will we do with the money save by not fighting it and the new tax money comming in .

gstewart44 · « **Reply #29 on:** July 30, 2010, 06:24:16 AM »

Quote from: SHOOTALL on July 30, 2010, 06:15:03 AM

If legal what will they use the jails for ? what will the police on drug enforcement do ? Gee what will we do with the money save by not fighting it and the new tax money comming in .

I think a good start would be for the local, county and state jails to contract with ICE and provide "housing" for all the ILLEGALS until their speedy deportation. Get some money coming into the local and state level.