Bug out vehicle?

[Dixie Dude]

If you have to bug out, it may be best using back roads instead of the interstate system.  Know where you are going, get good maps between where you are and where you are going, and find back US or state highways, and maybe even county roads.  Most county roads are paved these days.  A good map will tell you which ones are paved.  Hurricanes are the main reason people are evacuated these days.  If you build your home on higher ground, and build it hurricane proof, you might be better off hunkering down.  Have plenty of stores and a generator.  Underground or semi-underground home on high ground or a hillside will avoid the high winds.  Or have a low pitched roof well supported with a concrete outer shell is another.  I had a friend who bought a home in Jacksonville, Fl that was built in the 1950's.  It was concrete block and brick, with a low tar & gravel roof with real useable shutters.  He said it was built to withstand 200 mph winds.  It was also built on higher ground, not right on the beach. 

[don heath]

Of course, my Honda XL 125 trail bike gives me 112 miles per US gallon if I hold the speed down to 35 MPH. Have solid (no puncture tires) tires on it anyway which limits top speed to 50 MPH. Perminately mounted on the back carrier are two 'pannier' (square flat 'boxes' 2" thick) with 5 quarts of spare fuel and 5 quarts of water (ln the desert survival usually comes down to availability of water). There is also my tool box (for fixing water pumps, mending fenses...cutting fences ) etc. You may not be able to carry that much on a small trail bike but you can carry at least trebble what you can walking and do so at 35 mph. If I needed to get out of a city I would want a trail bike . NB- not a road bike- You cannot get off the road and ridfe down the ditch etc for a short distance if you need to get around a road block- even ramping a curb isn't fun on a road bike and a riding down a bad dirt road on one is hell. 

[v-man]

But where are you going?

[SHOOTALL]

If you have ever found yourself in a roit you would realize that getting out of the area is the goal

[gypsyman]

Have to go along with GB and cbl51. Roads will be packed, people will be panicky. But, for the sake of arguement, lets say Lake Erie is going to have a tsunami, and being a mile inland, I'm afraid of all the Walleye,Perch and catfish that will end up on my doorstep!(come to think of it, why not have a big fish fry,sorry, back to subject). I guess my Ford E-150 van would have to do. Wife,kids, couple coolers, filled with fish, guns,ammo, beer batter for the fish,even the dogs can fit.
Converter to plug in the coffee maker, almost 600 miles on a tank of gas. Big mirrors to see behind me in case somebody is trying to sneak up on me to steal the fish. Yep, guess it'll be my van. Just follow the fish smell coming out of a white van. gypsyman

[Graybeard]

If you have ever found yourself in a riot you would realize that getting out of the area is the goal

Again this is a matter of being proactively wise in the first place. If ya don't live in the type areas prone to riots and don't visit them regularly there isn't much chance of that happening. I know a few areas of local cities I'd not go thru unless it was absolutely necessary to do so and I just don't go to larger cities unless I'm taking a trip.

Avoiding places one knows are likely trouble spots and chosing to live in an area not prone to natural disasters goes a long way toward preventing the need to be leaving home in a rush.

[cbl51]

If you have ever found yourself in a riot you would realize that getting out of the area is the goal

Again this is a matter of being proactively wise in the first place. If ya don't live in the type areas prone to riots and don't visit them regularly there isn't much chance of that happening. I know a few areas of local cities I'd not go thru unless it was absolutely necessary to do so and I just don't go to larger cities unless I'm taking a trip.

Avoiding places one knows are likely trouble spots and chosing to live in an area not prone to natural disasters goes a long way toward preventing the need to be leaving home in a rush.

The only flaw in the is that in a disaster, nuclear or biolic, or natural, the peole from the areas where you don't live, are going to be swarming into the areas outside of the affected zone. That means that whatever nice little acre of heaven you have, will be invaded over time by less than desirable refuges.  They will be ariving by any means including on foot, and most will be desparate because they are ill prepared and scared. They will be willing to take whatever you have.

That's why I find it a bit amusing the posts about the bugout vehicle. The have-nots are going to see that big 4X4 truck stuffed with goods that they need badly, and it's going to be a huge target. If it's a true large scale disaster, I'd think it best to keep as low a profile as possable.

Unless it is a nuclear or biologic event, I just can't see the bugging out thing. If I have to, I think the backpack or bicycle is the way to go. Don't be anchored by the exsess of stuff most people build up. If you have more guns and gear than you can carry, sell them off and have a great time with the money.

[KeepTryin]

A person can't forsee everything, but reading this I realized that even though I live in a very rural area, there's a frequently used train track not all that far from me. I suppose it's possible for a derailment involving nasty chemicals and wind direction that could mean 'getting gone' quickly... unlikely, but still, makes you think...

KT

[Dixie Dude]

We had a safety meeting one time at work about the railroads.  The police said they would evacuate everyone within a mile of a dangerous chemical accident.  Hope you are at least a mile from the tracks, or get you some gas masks.  They carry amonia, sulfuric acid, propane, etc. 

[SHOOTALL]

If you have ever found yourself in a riot you would realize that getting out of the area is the goal

Again this is a matter of being proactively wise in the first place. If ya don't live in the type areas prone to riots and don't visit them regularly there isn't much chance of that happening. I know a few areas of local cities I'd not go thru unless it was absolutely necessary to do so and I just don't go to larger cities unless I'm taking a trip.

Avoiding places one knows are likely trouble spots and chosing to live in an area not prone to natural disasters goes a long way toward preventing the need to be leaving home in a rush.

That is good advice for those with enough money to move and are willing to leave family and friends .I got to witness the white flight and saw many who could not afford to move be the only white family left in a neighberhood.  It also does not take into account the areas that are safe have been safe for years but erupt into a riot without warning . We have had some big riots at schools in the area where what many would consider upper class kids go , cars near by destoried people attacked . One just never knows really.

[KeepTryin]

Railroad tracks are probably 1/2 mile away at their closest, and to the east which should be downwind MOST of the time around here...(knocking on wood) and as far as the gasmasks go, how about a gas alarm? Dunno if those are commercially available, if they are I bet they ain't cheap... great more stuff to worry about! My hometown had a derailment some years ago, my Dad got confronted by a masked National Guardsman which caught him a little off-guard! I don't recall if there were any casualties or not.

I may feel all clever about living in a rural area, but I am currently employed (and always have been) by private industry, if the job goes poof, then it's off to where the work is and that could be a built-up area, in fact it would be more likely than the situation I have going now out in the sticks. Just the way it is.

KT

[v-man]

I'm still a little confused about what we are running from. If a riot in my city, I think I hunker down and protect what is mine. If a natural disaster like hurricane or chemical/biological issue, a tank of gas in most any vehicle will get you to safety. I have already experienced that a few times here in Florida. If we are talking about all out war, whether enemy invasion or even our own govt taking us out, again I ask, where are you going to go? And if you aren't there before it hits the fan aren't you probably too late?   

[SHOOTALL]

If you have pulled out due to a storm then you know the traffic jams etc. I have done so 3 times . I was lucky it was leaving a vacation spot to return home . A 3.5 hr trip became a 9 hr trip in the middle of the night. As far as a riot , depends on the riot if they are burning entire blocks and hundreds are involved you may have no choice but to leave. Like you say a tank of gas will get you out of the way . But if you have nothing to return to do you want to be placed in a shelter weapons taken ? Do you want to try to pick up the pieces with no important papers ? If your home is gone and all insurance paper work is missing you will have a long hard time getting your money to rebuild . I guess most as you say are getting out the way . After the event they will decide on a course of action . Having survived intact with important papers , cash, transportation , food , medical needs and weapons could be comforting

[v-man]

Shootall, I don't disagree with anything you are saying. I do have a plan for evac with the necesary papers, supplies and weapons as you described. My confusion is based on the leading question of this thread, which is what vehicle would you use and that just doesn't seem too relevant to me. Even the answers have proven that. Some are thinkng in terms of small cars that may go a long way on a tank but can't carry much. Others are looking at large 4x4's to carry stuff and get off the beaten path. Others are counting on bicycles. Based on my history of investments it's for sure whichever type of event I prepare for will not be the event I expereince. So with the exception of a isolated disaster that requires spending a few days in a hotel 6 hours up the road, I still wonder where are we going to go to be safe from a widespread invasion, war or upheaval of society. Additionally, I wonder if, in the case of such a catastrophic EOTW event, would I be better staying back to help others, even if for a short time, or go into hiding to delay my demise for a few days or weeks with a quality of life that none would want. I do think some people have watched way too many Mad Max movies.

[myronman3]

  a person needs only look at recent history to see examples of reasons a person might want to leave an area.   hurricanes, flooding, and other natural disasters.   i tend to agree with g.b. in that not being in the kill zone to begin with is the best line of defense.  but, things happens sometimes, and being prepared never hurt anyone.
   what would you do if the nuclear power plant upwind had a accident?   a chemical spill, civil unrest in a city, and many other events could make leaving a better option than staying.   
   the great thing about discussions like this is there is more than one valid point and alot of great ideas and insight.  you never know what is around the next corner; life can come at you quick. 

[v-man]

That's sort of what frustrates me on this subject. No matter what I prepare for I can't prepare for everything. And when I do think I have thought of everything, something else comes up and I realize I'm not as prepared as I thought. There may be only a handful of events to prepare for but within each of those events are a thousand variables that one might never foresee. I've may have the best bug-out vehicle in the world but if it's in the shop when the event comes, oops. I may have all my stuff ready to go in minutes but I happen to be taking my Grandson to Disney World the day of the "big one"; and so forth. It's great to say just live in places that won't be affected by any calamity. No offence GB but where are those places and how many people can live there? I respect and even envy that you have found such a place but most people have to live where the work is. And then . . . even if I prepare right and guess right and have my foot on the gas the moment before that moment arrives, still, where do I go that I know the bad guys won't or the wind won't change and carry the cloud or the rest of the prepared ones didn't also plan to go?

[myronman3]

  those are what are called variables, and they can throw the best laid plans under the bus.  circumstance can blindside anyone.  it is impossible to be prepared for every little scenario, but many one can be prepared for.   your concerns show you have put some thought into it, but dont let this stuff drive you nuts. 

[v-man]

It can certainly do that! Remember the old song, "They're coming to take me away Ha Ha, Ho Ho, He He"?

[TX Devil Doc]

I agree with GB... first, prepare your home like a base camp. If you can't get back to it or it is no longer useful, then leave.
I have a HUMMER H3T with a cargo rack for the top of the cab and a small off-road trailer to pull behind. I can also put our two mt. bikes in the bed with other gear and gear in the cargo trailer. This is set up to go back country hunting. No, the pix are not of my vehicle and bike/cart. I copied them off the web because I don't have any handy. Can't find one of my trailer. But, I can take some of all if anyone requires authenticity...
Another benefit, I have learned how to make a gas pump work when the electricity is out...

 

[RON17T]

Hummers really are great vehicles arn't they? I've had 3 total an H2,and 2 H3's.I just bought a 2010 H3 so I could have one last new one before Hummer closed. I really tried to like the H3T but I really need a full size truck. They should have made a Hummer pickup with a full sized bed.

[TX Devil Doc]

Considering I drive far more without a load, this size truck is perfect for me.
You would be very surprised how much gear I can get in the bed and on the rack.
Plus I have the trailer that follows right along into all but the roughest areas.
Also, having a 5.3L V8 and the Off-road Pkg w/ locking front and rear differentials makes it a breeze to pull the load most anywhere.

[SHOOTALL]

Shootall, I don't disagree with anything you are saying. I do have a plan for evac with the necesary papers, supplies and weapons as you described. My confusion is based on the leading question of this thread, which is what vehicle would you use and that just doesn't seem too relevant to me. Even the answers have proven that. Some are thinkng in terms of small cars that may go a long way on a tank but can't carry much. Others are looking at large 4x4's to carry stuff and get off the beaten path. Others are counting on bicycles. Based on my history of investments it's for sure whichever type of event I prepare for will not be the event I expereince. So with the exception of a isolated disaster that requires spending a few days in a hotel 6 hours up the road, I still wonder where are we going to go to be safe from a widespread invasion, war or upheaval of society. Additionally, I wonder if, in the case of such a catastrophic EOTW event, would I be better staying back to help others, even if for a short time, or go into hiding to delay my demise for a few days or weeks with a quality of life that none would want. I do think some people have watched way too many Mad Max movies.

The reality is like the weapon choice it should be big enough to get any job done from transporting you and your needs to moving downed trees or other road blocks out the way to providing shelter. Many choose a small 4banger and a 22 LR . I would feel more comfortable with a 3/4 ton truck and an M1-A but that's just me.

[no guns here]

I think the key is getting out EARLY.  The one time I had to send my family out due to a hurricane, I had to stay on duty.  They packed up and were gone in about 2 hours with no warning.  My wife is good like that.  A full tank of gas got them well out of the way and close to the in-laws.  A 4x4 Suburban, each kid had a backpack with 3-4 changes of clothes and extra shoes.  Wife packed the basic camping gear, tent, stove bottles of fuel, pans, etc.  Two cases of bottled water that we normally keep in the garage.  I sent a 1911 and a Remington 1187 with them.  She and the daughter knew how to use both.  They were gone the night before the crowds left... no traffic and no problems.  The next day the traffic was horrible but my family was in KY by then, safe and sound.

Road become parking lots... the people then fan out over the land looking for water, food, shelter, etc.  Best bet would be to be two to three miles or more off of the major roads. 

I think my in-laws have a good place in OK.  NO major towns for about 30 miles.  Smaller towns are ten miles in each direction.  They are 1.25 miles off a highway but are on a dead end road so no passersby.  Can't see their house from the highway.  They are at the tip of a fairly large lake with a natural small boat ramp on public land just 200 yds from their gate.  Wildlife Refuge touches their land on two sides.  They have a solar powered water pump on one of their wells.  Doesn't pump much but it would be enough to live on.  If I could get them to put in solar panels it would be good.

I definitely have my ideas about getting setup and getting off the grid and out of site from all but the most determined.  If you can survive the first month... everyone else will be out of gas and stuck where they are.  After two months folks will have started dying off.  Stored food will be gone for most of the population.  They will be out of food, good water, and transportation.  I think that would be my objective.  Going somewhere AWAY and staying for 60-90 days then possibly trying to make my way back to our farm.  Bicycles and or our horses would be the best best then I think.  Maybe an electric buggy of some kind if I had enough solar/wind to charge it.


NGH

[GrassLakeRon]

M38A2.  Not much will stop a deuce and a half when it gets moving.  A 5 ton would be better.  Extra 500 gallons of gas in the back.  3-5 thousands and you have a good one.


Ron

[don heath]

Shootall...you are just too 'American'.  Bigger is better...whent he fact prove otherwise. In Africa the debate on trucks comes down to toyota landcruiser vs land rover defender. We tried F250's and they were a very disnal failure. Two years ago one of the new operators got 6 new F250's and a F350...I see his Pro hunters are driving Toyota's again....

Points to ponder..1) The load space in a full sized ford /Chev is about 25% more than a cruiser, but the load capacity is 25% less- The load bed on a 2008 F 250 is double the size on my landrover which has double the effective load capacity. ..ie you are driving a big truck that doesn't fit on forest roads, gets boged down easily and yet has a very poor payload.
2) They have overly powerful engine. A petrol engine in particular needs to be gutless unless you have a good winch. The deisels are better but not much
3) they often lack the accessories to make proper use of the power- center diff lock and front and read diff lock - if your truck doesn't have that than any engine over 75hp is just a more impresive way of getting stuck.
4) If you pack to carry all esentials on a dirt bike and end up walking, you can carry most of what you packed...
just keeping the mind thinking...try jumping off the highway and driving over a plouged field with a full load...have a friend on standby

[SHOOTALL]

Don Not sure what you are driving but a 3/4 ton or 1 ton truck has alot of ablity to carry a load , We run Dodge , Ford , Chevy and Toyota's for work trucks . The Toyota's don't hold up to construction work very well . The metal in the bed alone is weaker and beds split under loads. To be honest some Chevy's do also. Not to mention they have a shollow bed as compared to the other three. They just plain don't carry as much. As for roads in America Forest roads are not so slim here most are the result of logging . Most are made with a dozer and will pass simi trucks and log skidders . Skidders leave ruts that would eat a yoda . I understand your needs in your part of the world please realize America is not a mirror of your home but a place with its own needs . To be honest One Ford i had had locking diffs front and rear and never ever got stuck and it saw some bad places . It busted thru. snow that ranged from 18 inches to 30 inches once for over 100 miles on a trip comming back from Texas to Va. and run much mud and snow on power lines and logging roads not to mention alot of time in the sand at the Outer Banks of NC. As far as a plowed field we do that every hunting season here , unless it is after a heavy rain we seldon need 4WD so what's your point ? My sons truck is a 3/4 ton dodge with a 6 inch lift and 39's on it . Locking diffs front and back never seen him stuck . He seldom uses the 4wd as the size of the tires make up for alot i believe. Keep in mind different land different needs .

[don heath]

Shootall...we break toyota hilux 4x4's for free- the chasis tear in half on the corregated roads. And what kills American trucks in Africa is that they get overloaded. eg...my landrover can only carry two 55 gal fule drums . My cruiser could carry 7 (ie 1,5 tones) until I cut the load bed down to reduce the over handg and improve cross country performance. The Ford F250's generally get 2tones loaded in and then break....

Also, there is a world of difference between bad dirt road driving and off road. Almost all inexperienced drivers try to use engine power to get through thick mud or soft sand....when, unless you have diff lock, anything above idle speed just makes sure you stick. The standard vehicle jokes here are - why are landrovers so easy to fix...cause they need to be. Why do Cruisers come factory fitted with a big winch? ...Becuase you need it.

What I was driving at is that vehicle power is often a hinderence if you have to pull off the freeway and drive up the ditch, or bounce across a farmers freshly plouged land. Also, small load area makes you think about what you are carrying. A 2009 Ford F250 is rated to carry full fuel, 2 adults and just 14 1000rnd cases of 7,62 ball.. or two drums of fuel and 5 cases of ball...It gives you a feeling of safty without actually providing it

[SHOOTALL]

I agree the use of power can effect traction and increase damage if the driver has no clue. I like a big inline six cyl. ( 300 or 292 CI ) or a diesel engine myself for work truck. If one uses the transmission correctly though then the power can infact be a help. We carry up to 4 55 gal barrels full of water along with tools , generator etc. on our 3/4 ton trucks often. The only problem is a wheel bearing seal will fail but thats on trucks over 125000 miles or more .
 We call the roads wash board and they can shake your teeth out at times.
 Don take a good look your part of the world is waste deep in yotas and you have learned to deal with that . Here were are up to our necks in Dodges , fords and Chevy's and we have learned to deal with that. In both cases it was a learning curve and parts aval. thing . In the long run its what you can keep running with parts along the way and not so great fuel. 

[no guns here]

Yep, DH has most of it right I think.  Look at the old UNIMOG's.  Low power, good torque, front, rear and center diff locks.  Low gearing for good power to the ground.  Loads of ground clearance but won't break 60 downhill with the wind.   But the things go anywhere and haul more than an F250 doing it.  And they seem to last forever...


NGH

[SHOOTALL]

Bet parts were easy to find in LA. after the storm !