Author Topic: Home made scope?  (Read 1087 times)

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Offline dangerranger

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Home made scope?
« on: July 31, 2010, 07:41:10 PM »
 I want to try to make a scope for my Bufalo Classic. Ive made a tube sight for it and want to try a vintage looking scope. Has anyone else tryed this? I have a few broken, inexpencive scopes for parts. the easiest and most promising is a 4x15 tasco that came on a marlin 22 I bought in the 70s. I could just cut it in two and fasten both ends into a 30" piece of brass pipe. what will that do to the magnafication? or is that controled in the first half?  and if it doesnt cause magnafication problems will I still be able to focus? any thoughts would be apreciated. DR

Offline Luckyducker

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Re: Home made scope?
« Reply #1 on: August 01, 2010, 06:35:52 AM »
The only suggestion I will proffer is for you to quit huffing the model airplane glue or whatever it is you're doing.  You can buy a replica scope such as you have described and it might actually work.  There is a lot more to a scope than just a tube with a lense on each end of it.

Offline dangerranger

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Re: Home made scope?
« Reply #2 on: August 01, 2010, 11:15:44 AM »
Thats actually all this scope ever was . a tube with one lense at each end and some kind of prisim in the middle to flip the image. Im shure early scopes werent much more than that either. Ill see how this works and then may try again with some better glass. DR

Offline PowPow

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Re: Home made scope?
« Reply #3 on: August 01, 2010, 12:24:11 PM »
Use a plumber's tube cutter for a nice clean cut, if you hadn't already thought of that.
I say go for it; you are cutting into a $9 scope; not an EOTWAWKI event.
Post some pics for us wannabes.
The difference between people who do stuff and people who don't do stuff is that the people who do stuff do stuff.

Offline Graybeard

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Re: Home made scope?
« Reply #4 on: August 01, 2010, 01:53:11 PM »
He's right it's NOT that simple. You must concern yourself with focal length of the lens used and if they are now in a shorter tube it ain't gonna work. You must match the proper focal length of lens when building any optica device or it doesn't work.

Just buy one already made. Lens taken from shorter scopes are NOT gonna work in the longer one unless you can some how place them with fair precision at the same distance they are apart now in the new tube of your home made scope. Some things are really not DIY projects.


Bill aka the Graybeard
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Offline Kmrere42

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Re: Home made scope?
« Reply #5 on: August 02, 2010, 04:04:15 AM »
Hi,


Surely, There must be info, plans, directions, etc....  on making optical devices around.  Projects like this would be far more than just making a simple scope.  The real fun is in the learning of new skills and being able to say "I built it."




Paul

Offline Graybeard

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Re: Home made scope?
« Reply #6 on: August 02, 2010, 09:45:43 AM »
The comments posted by the OP make it obvious (to me at least) that the OP doesn't have a firm grasp of what's involved in the making of an optical instrument especially a rifle scope. Because it is to be a rifle scope that automatically adds additional complications.

The most simple optical instrument is an astronomical telescope or a set of field glasses (NOT binoculars but field glasses).

The absolute minimum you can get by with for a terrestrial telescope is an objective lens or most likely a doublet. You must then have an eye lens of course. But you must also have a erector system so the image is upright not unside down as it is in astronomical scopes. Now the complication of adding a cross hair and making it adjustable must also be over come to make a useable rifle scope.

Impossible no not really but far from simple tho. Optical companies use computers to design optics of all sorts these days and the computer design program tells them the focal length needed in all the various lens and/or prisms involved. They then have the optics ground specifically to their design specs.

The chances of you just happening to pull from existing scopes the correct size and focal length of lens to make a useable long scope of the sort the OP is interested in is somewhere between slim and none. The erector system and adjustment for cross hair which ain't an easy task in and of itself are bascially insurmountable for a home made job of this sort.

If the requisite skill set, tools and fixtures were in place and useable by the OP he's not have needed to ask.

I have extensive school time and practical experience in optics repair and manufacture having spent about four years working on optical instruments of numerous types as a way of making a living. I'd not even begin to take on such a task. I understand what's involved quite well but doing it from scratch at home? Not a chance.


Bill aka the Graybeard
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I am not a lawyer and do not give legal advice.

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life anyone who believes in Him will have everlasting life!

Offline rdb

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Re: Home made scope?
« Reply #7 on: October 01, 2010, 07:21:33 PM »
Galileo ground lenses with sand and rolled them up in a leather tube. Good thing there wasn't the internet full of naysayers back then. We wouldn't even know about Jupiter.  ;)

On Topic: Go for it and let us know how you do.  ;D

Offline Graybeard

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Re: Home made scope?
« Reply #8 on: October 02, 2010, 08:30:09 AM »
He also had a celestial NOT a rifle scope. Image was upside down and he didn't need a cross hair or adjustments to sight it in. I'm amazed at the lack of understanding of what's involved in a rifle scope from folks here.


Bill aka the Graybeard
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I am not a lawyer and do not give legal advice.

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life anyone who believes in Him will have everlasting life!

Offline bluebayou

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Re: Home made scope?
« Reply #9 on: October 02, 2010, 06:20:55 PM »
Galileo ground lenses with sand and rolled them up in a leather tube. Good thing there wasn't the internet full of naysayers back then. We wouldn't even know about Jupiter.  ;)

On Topic: Go for it and let us know how you do.  ;D

This is going to sound bad, but are you really comparing one of the geniuses of the Western world to the OP?  Honestly?  Is the OP a scientist? 

Offline DalesCarpentry

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Re: Home made scope?
« Reply #10 on: October 02, 2010, 07:45:53 PM »
Damn!!!! I was just starting to think about building my own Space Shuttle program seeing as the old one is out the door. I even had some solid steel 55 gallon drums all lined up for the solid rocket bosters. My buddy was going to weld them all together as long as I keep feeding him Budweiser's. :o ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D I have even been searching the Internet on ways to build rockets. :o ;D I figure I have a leg up on rocket building now that I have close to 6 months of reloading under my belt. After all is that not building a rocket. ;D ;) I am just funning you. ;D ;D :D To each his own. Who knows you might own the next great rifle scope company out there. That is the American way and I am all for it. Look at the Wright Brothers if their family could have collected money rights on their invention they would have blown away Bill gates and Microsoft in money thats for sure. Good luck and take care Dale
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Offline mrussel

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Re: Home made scope?
« Reply #11 on: October 02, 2010, 10:48:37 PM »
Hi,


Surely, There must be info, plans, directions, etc....  on making optical devices around.  Projects like this would be far more than just making a simple scope.  The real fun is in the learning of new skills and being able to say "I built it."




Paul

If your trying to save money,then the answer is no,you really cant. If you think it would be a cool project,then by all means do it. To start,your going to have to learn how optics work. Try a physics book from the library. Im going to assume you need a very basic one,becuase if you didnt,you would have something of an idea of what was involved. Your going to have to understand how systems of lenses work. I would suggest playing around with the lenses from the scopes you have to understand how it works,but not actually building anything permentant out of them. In other words,play around with cardboard tubes and masking tape. You will have to figure out the focal lengths of the lenses you have for instance to do anything with them. This is the sort of thing we did back in basic physics classes. (the professor would give us a box of lenses and we would proceed to figure out things like the focal lengths of the lenses,the refractive index of the glass etc.)

 Once you understand how it works and can take some random lenses you DONT know anything about,figure out what they are,then figure out the distances you need to make a working scope in a cardboard tube,you can make a real scope in a nice metal housing. Your dealing with cylindrical parts so to do a decent job you will need a lathe. If your putting that much work into it,you probobally want to get some decent lenses from a vendor that has a good selection. There are several of them out there. (and they can range from cheap to expensive just like scopes,for the same reasons) One of the big issues is coatings. The higher end optics have prorietary coatings that the vendors have developed just for their scopes and other optics. Im guessing similar coatings ,or in some cases even the same coatings will be available,but probobally on a custom basis for ludicrious amounts of money. In other words,a physicist doing an experiment that requires that,is willing to pay a thousand dollars for a lense (or even 10,000) ,but you have to stick with the stuff out of the catalog,and its still going to be on the pricey side.

 There are sources of surplus optics,some of it quite good quality. The problem is,you have to take what they have,which means designing around what is available.

 Finally,while I have not looked at whats inside rifle scopes,I have conisdered the idea of makign a custom camera lense. What I found when I looked at that idea,was that a cheap camera lense has few lenses inside the housing. A expensive one has many. The magnification may be the same but those lenses are used to reduce various forms of distortion. Those,and the coatings are what differentiate a cheap lense from an expensive one. The same I suspect goes for scopes.

If you want somethign similar to a old fasioned scope,one place to look for ideas might be old patents. The problem of course is,such things will be highly technical and not much use without a good understanding of how optics work. They probobally wont give you dimensions and will use a very technical,and for older ones,archaic language.

  If your the sort of person that watches the discover channel all the time,and likes to play around with magnets (or lenses) then you might like to do it. If you dont really think learning a field of physics (optics) is fun,then your not going to get through it. Start by googling things like "optics" "lenses","ray optics","virtual image","real image","refractive index" and read through the stuff you find. If it all seems like that boring physics class that you had to sit through in high school then you should just buy a nice scope. For that matter,just buy a nice scope anyway,because if you want to do somehting like that,its a long term project,and you will need something to shoot in the mean time. Im not saying dont do it,becuase it could be an interesting project for someone who likes those sorts of things. Its just not for everyone. (The people who it IS for often become engineers or physicists actually,where they do that sort of thing for a living)

Offline mrussel

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Re: Home made scope?
« Reply #12 on: October 02, 2010, 11:00:26 PM »
The comments posted by the OP make it obvious (to me at least) that the OP doesn't have a firm grasp of what's involved in the making of an optical instrument especially a rifle scope. Because it is to be a rifle scope that automatically adds additional complications.

The most simple optical instrument is an astronomical telescope or a set of field glasses (NOT binoculars but field glasses).

The absolute minimum you can get by with for a terrestrial telescope is an objective lens or most likely a doublet. You must then have an eye lens of course. But you must also have a erector system so the image is upright not unside down as it is in astronomical scopes. Now the complication of adding a cross hair and making it adjustable must also be over come to make a useable rifle scope.

Impossible no not really but far from simple tho. Optical companies use computers to design optics of all sorts these days and the computer design program tells them the focal length needed in all the various lens and/or prisms involved. They then have the optics ground specifically to their design specs.

The chances of you just happening to pull from existing scopes the correct size and focal length of lens to make a useable long scope of the sort the OP is interested in is somewhere between slim and none. The erector system and adjustment for cross hair which ain't an easy task in and of itself are bascially insurmountable for a home made job of this sort.

If the requisite skill set, tools and fixtures were in place and useable by the OP he's not have needed to ask.

I have extensive school time and practical experience in optics repair and manufacture having spent about four years working on optical instruments of numerous types as a way of making a living. I'd not even begin to take on such a task. I understand what's involved quite well but doing it from scratch at home? Not a chance.

I dont think we should discourage him,but rather make him aware of whats required and what hes likely to come up with at the end. I have no doubt that if he wanted to,he could build a scope. Its going to take a great deal of effort,and a great deal of learning and the results will not be as good as even a relativly inexpensive scope you could buy,and he will spend not just more than a good scope,but more than a really really really good scope.