New England deer numbers...

[bigbore442001]

Last year we had a really snowy winter in New England. We had what you would call an old fashioned winter. Both dad and I saw plenty of sign as well as a number of deer.

This year we are seeing fewer deer as well as sign. We were wondering if anyone else cares to comment on this issue. Today was the opening day of Massachusetts' shotgun season. We didn't hear a shot! Dad drove by the checking station at 10:30 AM . As a rule, you'ld see a number of people with deer checked in. Not one this time.

Anyone care to comment on this? Has anyone else noticed the same thing?

[John Y Cannuck]

Had a very similar season up here. Lots of hunters around, saw six deer myself, but success, and shots fired was way down. Weather for the period was miserable. There were a number of days when most hunters stayed in camp. The local buck and doe contest had the fewest entries I have ever seen.
Phase of the moon was such that the deer could feed at night, and sleep all day, maybe that played a part.

[Ron T.]

The weather in Pennslyvania during the Opening Week of Rifle Deer Season was fairly good... a light skim of snow (we could have used another 3 to 5 inches) and temperatures in the mid-20's to low 30's during the day... low 20's at night... but NO DEER!

Six of us, hunting out of my huntin' buddy's cozy cabin in the Moshannon State Forest saw exactly ONE deer... the smallish 8-pointer my huntin' buddy got on Opening Day.

None of the rest of us even saw a doe during Opening Week.

I thought that Dr. Gary Alt's idea of limiting shootable bucks to having at least 3 points on one side plus expanding the number of doe permits was the right way to go to increase bigger racks on more bucks, but now... I'm starting to wonder because I've hunting out of my buddy's huntin' cabin for the past many years and this is the first year I didn't see ANY live deer during Opening Week with a reasonable amount of hunting.

I still hope Dr. Alt's methods work to improve the quality and quanity of bucks with bigger racks, but... at this point, the lack of deer... both doe and buck... causes one to have "reservations" about the current policies.

We didn't see nearly as many hunters on Opening Day this year as we had seen in the past... and there were a LOT fewer shots heard on Opening Day and almost NO SHOTS heard thereafter for the rest of Opening Week.

That's how it was in the area in which I hunt... north-central Pennsylvania... just north of DuBois and Clearfield in Clearfield County in the Moshannon State Forest near Parker Dam.

[woodseye]

VERY poor season up here in Maine with the F&W admitting to at least a 20% drop in the deer kill. Of course they are blaming weather and low hunter numbers while the truth also lies in a lower deer density due to cutting wintering and mast areas, coyote predation, and less than perfect weather following a rather high deer mortality winter.

    woods

[bigbore442001]

I agree with what you said Woodseye. I have a feeling Massachusetts F&G will say the same thing. But the issues of predator control as well as timber harvest are PC topics.

I tend to disagree with the lack of hunters. Both dad and I were quite shocked at how mant guys are hunting this year. We'll see what they have to say.

[woodseye]

Thats my feelings exactly.........I ran into more hunters than I have seen in all my years of hunting. There also was more hunters hunting towards the latter part of season as so many didn't get a deer like they usually do early. Low hunter numbers seems to be the latest excuse the F&W gang uses up here to explain off kills rather than admitting deer numbers are steady dropping in north west and central Maine. They're afraid to admit this as license sales pays a large part of their operating expences and they don't want to scare any buyers away. If they don't soon ease off on the doe permits the herd will plummet the first really bad killer winter we have, the herd has never recovered from the winter of 2000-2001 yet.

     woods

[Dezertyote]

Hi,
Here in vermont we had a very poor deer season. Last winters high snow fall and the prolonged sub-zero weather took its toll. This falls deer season was wet and miserable with very few deer being taken. The deer that were harvested were fairly nice ones, being the more healthy and stronger ones that servived the winter. I myself was not able to hunt the first week of the season, ( only 2 weeks of general season) due to being to busy with work. I talked with many freinds and other hunters that went out and saw no deer and very little sign, many of them stayed out of the woods most of the season. Vermont has a doe season during the muzzleloading season. ( we are deer poor as it is ) most of my freinds put in for the doe tags and burn them so as to help the herd rebuild.
  Between the hard winters, the poor deer management that the vermont fish & game practices, and to top it all off Yes you guessed it :cry: we had a board member thats on the Vermont Fish & Game Board Commision caught poaching :eek: UNBELEAVABLE... Mismanagement right down to the rotten core............... :evil:  




[/b]

[gerry@fundy.net]

I spent the last week of November hunting in Maine near Baxter State Park.  I was surprised at how much less deer sign there was than the previous year.   It was much the same at home in New Brunswick this year, for Moose as well as deer, at least where I hunt.  We had a great time anyway.

[Sgt Mike]

I have hunted the first week of the Maine Deer season the last 4 seasons. This was the first year that I didn't see a deer. I usually see at least 6 during the week. Moose and coyote sign seem to be greater than previous years. That is depressing.....
Mike

I will be back next year...

[bigbore442001]

Yeah. It doesn't look too promising. I have heard that moose will push deer out of their range. Also, Maine suspended their coyote snaring program for the year due to an incidental catch of a Canadian lynx somewhere in far northern Maine.

So much for controlling the coyote problem.

[Cruiser]

This winter has the potential to give our deer pop the boost it needs.If Mother Nature is kind to us the next 8 weeks our herd will surely benefit from the lack of deep snow.Seein lots of deer feedin in fields already.Folks with 8000$ snowmobiles aint happy tho. :-) The way December started out was lookin like the deer were goin to take a beatin,but its been mild as far as snowfall.Lets hope it stays that way for another couple mths.

Nice place here with lots of informative sections.Look forward to gainin knowledge here and meetin new folks.

[1911crazy]

I have hunted in Vermont since '73 and when I bought my camp thats on the edge of the national forest the tracks going thru my land looked like I91.  Many of the locals told me my place is in the middle of the best deer hunting in the area. And from what I seen of all the tracks/sign in the beginning it was. About 6 years ago I noticed  behind every deer track was a coyote track in the snow that was following it.  The summers I did spend time up there at night i can hear the coyotes run from one end of the valley to the other. And now with mountainlions being seen more and more in my area of Vermont also along with cold winters I think houston we have a problem.  I think the hunters who hunt the fall season should hunt coyotes during the summer to thin them out a little I'm sure it will give the deer more of a chance to make a comeback.  I plan on spending a lot of time up there hunting coyotes this summer but one person can't make a difference more have to help out too.        BigBill

Between the coyotes, mountainlions, man and the extreme cold the deer don't stand a chance.  We have to put something back to thius sport so it will continue for many years to come for all who come after us can still enjoy it.   Its not a matter of going somewhere else to hunt and take and run all over again we need to give back too!!!!!  Or it will only get worse!!

[Dezertyote]

Your right Bill about the coyotes, I took these picture in a deer yard about a 1/2 mile from my house this past january. I have 4-5 deer yards within 1/2- 3/4 of a mile from my front door.

My belief is that the coyotes key in on the deer as a main stay through the winter months. Not all deer that are found such as the one in the picture below are taken down by predators. Disease, exposer and just plain lack of a good nutrition base diet during the hard winter months take its toll.

The coyotes clean up what mother nature deals out, and like any other animal the coyote will conserve its energy by scavenging in the deer yards.


This one happened to be taken by coyotes, as I could see in the snow how they ran it down in the yard.

 
Heres a well used deer run in the middle of a deer yard

I feel its not just coyote predation on the herd, but also the compatition for food. Our mast crop is on a ( about )3 yr. cycle and the huge numbers of turkey's that have reastablished in the east are eating the crap out of mast crops. EVER SEEN BIRD THAT WASN'T EATING they are constantly eating and they'll pick and scratch a hillside in know time flat.
my photo's got mixed up but here they are.

[John Y Cannuck]

I've noticed that the deer are not yarding as much the last few years, I think snow depth may be the main factor, but could predation be another?