Are factory loads low in powder ?

[fast*eddie]

I sighted in my NEF 25-06 at 100 yards with Remington 120 gr Core-loks and it was fine . I reloaded some 120 gr Hornaday hollow points using 49 , 51 , 53 , & 55grains of powder . 55 grains would be max . The 53 grains were hitting the same as the factory loads and the 55 gr were 4 1/2" high which leads me to believe that the factory loads are mild . Are they ? Is this common ?

[wncchester]

Much more likely you're seeing the effects of differening barrel viberations.

At short ranges (100 yards us short) lower velocity bullets tend to strike high.

[necchi]

They use their own powder,,it may be different then the powder you use, that variable alone will change POI.

They are going to use the best preforming least expensive powders they have experimented with,,and they ain't gonna tell ya what it is,  .
The olde, "I'm gonna replicate a factory load,," is/has been tried and done for decades,,But I started loading so I could get Better Than factory loads,   
I took apart a Win Supreme and found a blended powder, some ball, some flake all mixed together. 

[fast*eddie]

Much more likely you're seeing the effects of differening barrel viberations.

At short ranges (100 yards us short) lower velocity bullets tend to strike high.

Thanks for the replies . I rechecked the Lyman reloading book . 55 grains is Max load and with the 120 grain Hornaday I should be getting in the neighborhood of 2900+ fps . I wouldn't consider that lower velocity or am I misunderstanding your post ? The factory loads are 120 grain core-loks so the bullet weight is the same .

[stimpylu32]

FE

There are other factors that come into play here , just the make-up ( Design ) of the bullet will make a difference as to POI , not all bullets are made the same even though their the same weight , also the bullet shape will effect the POI , RN , HP , SP or Spitzer .

Also the powder charge and burn rate will greatly effect POI , along with the Harmonic's of the barrel based on the load being used .

Its not just as simple as this 120g should shoot the same as that 120g .

stimpy 

[revbc]

Eddie
The general idea is that a low velocity round is in the barrel while recoil is taking place, causing it to strike higher on the target at nominal ranges (100 yd and under).  At least that is my understanding of it.  I also understand that is not your case.

Bobby

[fast*eddie]

Thanks again for the replies . I wasn't trying to disagree . I was trying to understand . I hadn't taken recoil , harmonics , etc into consideration ....

[shot1]

To show you how much point of impact can change all you have to do is change one single thing in a load and most often POI will change. You can load the same bullet, powder in the same case but change the primer make and your POI will change. Seating depth of the bullet can change the POI. That is the reason that you work up a load that suits your needs and you stick with it and verify by shooting if you even change lot numbers of powder or get another box of the same bullets etc. to see if it still shoots the same.

I get tickled when people come into my buddies sporting goods store and say they want, say a box of 150 gr ammo for their 30-06. He will say which brand do you want. They many times will say "It does not matter the rife is sighted in for 150 gr ammo".     By the way these people much of the time are the ones that come into the store about 5 minutes before he closes the night before the opening day of deer season. They have not fired their rifle since the last year when they MISSED the deer they were shooting at. But is was always a limb that they hit and deflected the bullet of something that cause them to miss.

[wncchester]

" The 53 grains were hitting the same as the factory loads and the 55 gr were 4 1/2" high which leads me to believe that the factory loads are mild . "

My comment on slow bullets striking high was in reference to your sentence above, not real sure what you meant.

[fast*eddie]

Shot1 ---- Maybe your friend that owns the store should include a pair of pruning snips with each box of ammo !  ...

[anweis]

By the way these people much of the time are the ones that come into the store about 5 minutes before he closes the night before the opening day of deer season.

I've seen many times people buying deer rifles, inexpensive bubble wrapped scopes, and a case of Bud Light the evening before the opening day.
I've seen people at the shooting range the evening before the opening day sighting in their rifles: 8" patterns at 50 yards were good to go.
The day before the muzzleloader opener I've seen at the range people who brought in new rifles and did not know how to load them and shoot them, many times they did not have everything needed (powder measure or such). There was even a guy who was greasing the plastic sabots and was trying to make the rifle shoot exactly like the dots on the reticle of his scope. By the time i left, he never did hit the paper.
This is why many countries ask hunters to pass an exam where they demonstrate high proficiency in safe handling of firearms and moderate to excellent skills in marksmanship. Not because they don't have idiots, but because they don't want them roaming armed in the countryside and injuring animals.

[fast*eddie]

I may take my chrono to the range after I make up a few more rounds . If my 53 grainers are hitting the same as the factory loads and have good speed , I may leave well enough alone . That way I could shoot either / or without changing anything .

[Retsof]

I really don't know if factory loads in general are loaded mild. I suppose that might be logical, given the fact that a factory load has to work safely in different types of rifles. However, I know for a fact that for my SIL's 270 Win, the Federal Premium load with the 110 gr Barnes TTSX is getting a MV of 3300 fps from a 20" barrel. Federal claims 3400 fps, so that's pretty close.  Now, that MV does not be any means this ammo is "hot" but I don't think it would be considered "mild" either. Of course the next box of this same federal ammo may have a much different MV.  Whether any factory load is hot or not, I am continually amazed at how factory ammo in general is as accurate as it is.

[Retsof]

There's a typo in my previous post. The velocity of the Fed load with the 110 gr TTSX should have been listed as 3330 fps not 3300 fps. Sorry but math wasn't my best subject in school.

[buck460XVR]

I sighted in my NEF 25-06 at 100 yards with Remington 120 gr Core-loks and it was fine . I reloaded some 120 gr Hornaday hollow points using 49 , 51 , 53 , & 55grains of powder . 55 grains would be max . The 53 grains were hitting the same as the factory loads and the 55 gr were 4 1/2" high which leads me to believe that the factory loads are mild . Are they ? Is this common ?

If your factory loads were mild, they would print similar to your 49 and 51 gr loads. Seeing how they were printing close to your 53 gr loads that would put them closer to max than mild. I doubt very much if standard factory ammo is gonna be loaded to max SAAMI pressures unless it's a premium ammo. I've found that in most cases, max loads are not the most accurate outta my guns. The most accurate loads for me  seem to come about 3/4 of the way between min and max, to just under max. I load for accuracy and not for velocity....this may be what Remington is doing.

[mrussel]

Not because they don't have idiots, but because they don't want them roaming armed in the countryside and injuring animals.

I think they require it becuase they DO have idiots and they know it.    You cant stop idiots from being idiots,the best you can hope for is to stop them from being a danger to themselves and others by showing them gory videos of hunting accidents and hope that they get the point.

[oldandslow]

I don't really know what is considered "mild". I am guessing it will have different meanings to different people. Most everything does.  One thing I am certain of is that the ammo companies aren't going to sell anything that is "hot" enough to blow up guns in good condition.

I have been reloading for many years and I have never gotten the best accuracy with the fastest load in any caliber I load for. It's always a midrange load. Never got the best accuracy with starter loads either. It is always something in the midrange, sometimes more to the low side, sometimes more to the high side.

I spent the last three weeks working up a 22-250 load that would be very accurate in my Ruger #1. I used Varget and a variety of different makes of bullets of the same weight over the same charge of powder. I never found any different brands of bullets that would shoot to the same point of aim over the same powder charge. My two most accurate loads were a 45 gr. Hornady spire point and a Remington 45 gr. HP with the same charge of powder. Each powder charge was individually weighed.  Both loadings shot identically to the same height but the Hornady printed 1" to the right of the Remington load. Accuracy was almost identical with the Remington having a slight edge. A coyote will never notice.  Why does this happen? Don't have a clue but it always does. I suspect when the powder charge and bullet weight are the same it is bullet shape. Shoulder length, nose design, whatever. I have never had different brands of factory ammo shoot to the same point of impact either whatever the caliber.