Author Topic: wolf ammo (Read 1595 times)

kevin.303 · « **on:** December 04, 2003, 07:35:11 AM »

i know that wolf brand ammo will gum up the working's in semi-auto's, but what about using it in single shots and bolt actions?

His lordship. · « **Reply #1 on:** December 04, 2003, 08:36:12 AM »

I like the cost and general reliability of the Wolf ammo. Sure it is dirty powdered, but I grew up with black powder so I manage. I had read of some varmint hunters having the sealant shellac on the shell case melt and cause the cartridge to fuze into the chamber under hot, repeated shooting with the Wolf ammo using single shot Thompson contenders.

Two Summers ago I was doing extensive shooting of Wolf .223 in my Savage bolt action and ignored the increase in shell resistance to extraction. Then the bolt froze and after a good yank, the shell remained glued into my rifle's chamber. I ruined a good cleaning rod having to hammer out the stuck shell case.

This year I tried some more Wolf .223 in my new CZ 527 rifle. Remembering what happened before I was careful to watch the heat buildup and any resistance with the extraction of the bolt. I noted that the case dimensions for each cartridge were inconsistant as sometimes the case would drag alittle in closing the bolt, and in other instances, upon extraction of the fired case. Other brands of Russian .223 did not have this resistance aspect with my CZ rifle, only Wolf. In both .223 rifles the accuracy of the Wolf brand was inferior to other brands tried.

Even my Romanian AK finds the Wolf to be inferior in accuracy compared to other brands. But in this rifle I think it is marginally acceptable and I buy it for casual shooting as the AK-47 seems to digest it ok and the price is right. My fellow shooters have warned me to keep the chamber clean as the shellac will build up and I risk tearing the shell head off. I plan to purchase a broken shell remover tool soon to be on the safe side.

I think Wolf brand ammo has its place, especially if you find it to be the most accurate brand for your rifle/pistol, etc., but use caution with heat buildup on the bolt and single shot actions. And if used on pistols, do clean them after 150-200 rounds or so:grin:

Kenneth L. Walters · « **Reply #2 on:** December 07, 2003, 06:02:01 PM »

In my AK-47 the first minor problem was a sticking trigger. After 2200 rounds without cleaning it was sticking a bit. Sprayed on some lubricant and the problem went away. 1000 rounds later same thing. Absolutely NO failures to feed, eject or function.

No problem of any sort yet in my AR-15.

In my Steyr M-9 and S&W 952 9mm's I've not cleaned them at all. Maybe three failures to extract. In my Smith SW99 45 ACP just about the same performance. Accuracy wise in the 952 the ammunition was VERY accurate.

In my 7.62x54R bolt action it worked perfectly and was extremely accurate.

Dirty? Yes, a little. But it is cheap and it works.

Robert · « **Reply #3 on:** December 07, 2003, 07:39:27 PM »

All it takes is ONE SHOT to jamb a Contender. A semi-auto pulls it before it can cool. In fact, I think the stuff would work BETTER in a Contender/Encore if the barrel WAS hot, but I havent seen anybody rapid-fire a Contender. Don't get me wrong.....I like Wolf ammo, just not in a Contender.

His lordship. · « **Reply #4 on:** December 15, 2003, 10:24:47 AM »

Kenneth,

Wow, I was surprised to see you shoot Wolf in your AR-15 as some of the contributors to this forum have complained, and I have heard of one AR-15 maker ( I don't remember the name) who said they would void the warranty if you do. Personally, I would not hesitate to at least try a box in my AR-15, (if I owned one) but would clean it good to be on the safe side.

Your success with the AK using it without a cleaning speaks well for the Kalashnikov design, I always clean the barrel on mine to maintain "best" accuracy after 80 rounds or so, and then wipe out the inside chamber, action area too as the Wolf is sooty.

Kenneth L. Walters · « **Reply #5 on:** December 15, 2003, 11:31:42 AM »

I was out shooting my AK-47 one day when one of the local swat guys showed up. I'd seen him there before. This time I went over and asked him about what ammunition he used in his AR-15. He said Wolfe. I pointed out that most people said that it just didn't work well in those guns. I asked him how he cleaned the gas system of the dirt. He never had. He only occasionally took the bolt out, wiped it off and put on some lubricant. He been doing that for longer than he remembered.

Maybe Wolfe is bad on AR-15's. Maybe not.

I've come to the conclusion, however, that if I really want to know that I'm going to have to try it myself. I suspect that there are a lot more firm opinions on web site than facts.

thecowboyace · « **Reply #6 on:** December 19, 2003, 05:57:44 PM »

I have been shooting Wolf for over 12 yrs now and I have not had any trouble with the 123gr JHP in a Russian SKS. I can not say that it has done anything in my gun except it keeps shooting, and shooting 4" day in and day out.

I did reload a few rounds with the Nosler Ballistic Tip but I couldn't tell the difference in the deer or coyotes when they dropped. Gave a few of the Tips away for others to try. Some still using the Tips, some have went to V-Max.

As you said, opinions are on the Net and not facts.

securitysix · « **Reply #7 on:** December 22, 2003, 07:02:55 AM »

A few things on Wolf:

Wolf determined that the red sealant aroudn the bullet/case neck junction was causing jamming in .223s. To an extent, this was true. They have ceased using it on .223 ammunition as of late 2002, supposedly. Any 2003 production ammo should be free of it anyway.

Wolf is no longer using laquer to protect cases from rust, at least in .223 ammo. They are using some sort of polymer coating instead. This coating will not melt, thus will not gum up the chamber.

I have shot 500 rounds of the polymer coated stuff through my Mini-14 with zero ammo related problems.

That said, it is ultimately up to you as to what ammo you put through your gun. If you don't want to shoot cheap steel cased ammo, don't. If you want to save a little money on your blasting ammo, steel cased may be the way to go. Your gun, your money, your ammo. Be safe.

His lordship. · « **Reply #8 on:** January 13, 2004, 07:43:06 AM »

Securitysix,

I am glad that Wolf has seen the light on a few things. I am looking at a box of 7.62 X 39 Wolf that I bought bulk a few weeks ago and I cannot find a date of manufacture to see if it has the polymer or the Shellac coating. Each cartridge does have the red line on the bullet that you had mentioned, and some overspray of the sealant on the case, but no other relevant data.

I have some S & B 7.62 X 39 that I bought 4 years ago that has a different look to the steel case compared to the Russian stuff, perhaps some alternative coating, is that what the polymer looks like?

Thanks

thecowboyace · « **Reply #9 on:** January 13, 2004, 05:30:36 PM »

You have to look at the head stamp. Shows date of mfg & where.

I have a botl action 7.62x39 made up in PA and then I have a Russian SKS. Like I said above I been shooting Wolf long, long time and have not had any problem with it, or the 223 and the 9mm. Worst thing is not being able to reload. But do pull bullet in the 7.62x39 and replace with Nosler bullets when hunting deer and I have 2 magazines of 9mm that I have removed bullets and replace with bullet that will expand beau coup. Be ditty dit baw when hitting chest/gut. It is a lead bullet that have wad cutter slit & the HP made at same time with a copper wrap. Nasty. Had to kill a calf here while back and head was in somewhat bad shape, wasn't no brains left to eat. Should shot in chest, woulda died right and had sweetbreads left over.

His lordship. · « **Reply #10 on:** January 14, 2004, 07:41:32 AM »

The headstamp on my Wolf brand 7.62 X 39 says "7.62X39" and then "Wolf", no other dates, including the box. My Wolf brand 40 S&W also has only "40 S&W" and "Wolf", however there is a lot No. of T40-02 on the box, otherwise I don't know how old the ammo is. Would it be included on a whole case instead of single boxes?

Thanks.

thecowboyace · « **Reply #11 on:** January 14, 2004, 06:08:35 PM »

My 1.62x39 "4" @ 12oclock and "03" @ 6oclock

securitysix · « **Reply #12 on:** January 15, 2004, 05:24:56 AM »

Quote from: Chris D.

Securitysix,

I am glad that Wolf has seen the light on a few things. I am looking at a box of 7.62 X 39 Wolf that I bought bulk a few weeks ago and I cannot find a date of manufacture to see if it has the polymer or the Shellac coating. Each cartridge does have the red line on the bullet that you had mentioned, and some overspray of the sealant on the case, but no other relevant data.

I have some S & B 7.62 X 39 that I bought 4 years ago that has a different look to the steel case compared to the Russian stuff, perhaps some alternative coating, is that what the polymer looks like?

Thanks

What color are the cases? If they are a sort of greenish or brownish color, they have the lacquer coating. If they are gray, black, or have a hint of blue, they are probably the new polymer coat. Also, on the inside of the box flap, there's usually a lot number and sometimes a date stamp.

I haven't seen the steel cased S&B stuff, so I can't speak to it. I'd imagine the S&B ammo is lacquered as well, but probably with a thinner coat. Another way to tell if the case is lacquered or poly coated is to dip it in acetone. That round will probably be unusable, but if the coating comes off, it's lacquer. If it doesn't, it's the polymer coating.

thecowboyace · « **Reply #13 on:** January 16, 2004, 07:14:35 PM »

REPOST:

Mine have in samw 1K box @12oclock "3" @ 6oclock "94" and not '4' but "94" and somw 7.62x39 @ top & bottiom WOLF Red sealer around case mounth/bullet Neiher lquer bt R colored DIRT OD Green This is Lot # 233-03
I have been shooting the Wolf for 12-15 years in a bolt and semi and have not had anytrouble with eject except had put guns away for a couple o fyears and flub the dub and had left a round in SKS, at that tiem did not use strippers, just flipped gun over and dropped rounds into magazine and slapped door shut. Fired round, stuck, popped out with a brass gas welding rod and never failed after that. Carried the danged gun in my box on the truck for that length of time. Was doing some traveling and never really saw the bottom of the box and didn't realize it was there. Alsways slapped a lot of oil on everything I own so it didn't rust. Stock got really beat all ot heck. Bad cause this SKS is a total match in all numbers,no forced no electro.

Tc300mag1 · « **Reply #14 on:** January 16, 2004, 08:13:59 PM »

I pass on it used it once and had a lock up after 50 rounds or so must have got 2 hot was in a semi auto... its cheep but my guns are worth more to me than scrimping and shooting cheep ammo..reloading is how i do it now

spitpatch · « **Reply #15 on:** January 17, 2004, 07:25:23 PM »

Tc300mag1, I fully agree with you, This ammo would never be shot from any gun I cared about. I believe there is a lot better ammo for just a few pennies more. I've never shot the Wolf brand ammo and haven't heard any good about it except the price. The boys around here say it doesn't pattern well, it's dirty, and it does gunk the chamber. I mainly reload myself, but I have shot the Russian hollow points in the brown cardboard wrapper, they pattern very well, and seem to be relatively clean burning for Ruskey ammo. I have never liked the idea of steel cases though, kinda rough on chambers.

thecowboyace · « **Reply #16 on:** January 17, 2004, 07:34:31 PM »

spitpatch,
There is a sporting goods store in a little town in Haskell TX that sells some 7.62x39 ammo 20rd/bx, white box, Russian Hunting Ammo, 148SP and each 5 round layer is seperated by a thin piece of corrugated cardboard. Is this what you are talking about? I have shot this also and have had absolutely no problem with it. I get a 3" out of it as I do the Wolf HP 123gr. I cannot see where the 'dirty'residue is that you are talking about. Could you share some pics or possibly if you know of anyone shooting the ammo that you will not shoot I would like to put them side by side and see if they are the same as what I am getting.
TIA

spitpatch · « **Reply #17 on:** January 17, 2004, 08:53:14 PM »

No, the ammo I am talking about are hollow points in brown boxes, 5 rds. to a layer seperated with brown wrapping type paper. Don't know the make......shoots very accurate, little residue. What I know about Wolf ammo is secondhand, I've never shot it, however the info came from a person who's opinion I value and trust. I am not trying to persuade anyone to not use Wolf ammo, just relating what I've heard and know. I will personally never chamber a Wolf cartridge in my rifles because I can afford better, I usually reload to get the most precise ammo I can......money is not an issue. If the Wolf ammo works for you, more power to ya' Best Regards

thecowboyace · « **Reply #18 on:** January 17, 2004, 09:44:57 PM »

d I can afford what some people say is the best but as said I don't have a problem with the ammo. I have a 'smith bolt 762x39 that is over $560 and then I have the lowly SKS and have not had any trouble out of them. I do pull bullets and put a Ballistic tip in each brass when I had been using it to hunt deer. I will now utilize the Mauser for that and for them thar pigglely wigglelys that M44 with 200gra in 'em. I want them to know that they been hit. Don't want it to fast cause during feeding cattle i winter expecially snow on groune them hogs'll come up and root around and make the cattle move on unless we stick around. I figurd to get out ot the truck an dlet him drive off and then come back when he hears a shot or totwo.

spitpatch · « **Reply #19 on:** January 18, 2004, 03:39:25 AM »

The M44 will definatly let them know they been hit in no uncertain terms, those guns are hand cannons! I use the Nosler Ballistics in my 25-06 and .223's but for varmit sized animals only. I've heard from a couple buddies about the ballistics blowing up on deer and not killing effectively......heard anything like this? They must have hit the shoulders I suppose. For me the old HPBT is my choice for deer.

thecowboyace · « **Reply #20 on:** January 18, 2004, 06:22:18 PM »

Quote from: spitpatch

The M44 will definatly let them know they been hit in no uncertain terms, those guns are hand cannons! I use the Nosler Ballistics in my 25-06 and .223's but for varmit sized animals only. I've heard from a couple buddies about the ballistics blowing up on deer and not killing effectively......heard anything like this? They must have hit the shoulders I suppose. For me the old HPBT is my choice for deer.

sptipatch,
Another fellow I know pulls bullets also in the 7.62x39 and puts V-Max bullets in the place of either HP, SP, FMJ. What we have somehow put together it one loads the V-Max, Ballistic, someone also had mentioned the TNT by Speer that if one loads the max speed out of that bullet weight they will explode/divest the copper and let the lead not peel back the way it should. Somewhere in the, let us make one parameter of the 150gr Sierra, can be loaded from 1800-2200, load up to about 1900+/- and it will go through a shoulder with less deformity that when stroking it on. Also when getting a good lung/heart cavity shot the faster it goes the less tissue damage will be. There is a point where the hydrostatic shock and the tissue damage from the mushroom are max'd out for both. When that line is met, the best 'knock-down' round is made. Too fast too slow will not let them work in tandem. Everything working in tandem will, a straight on thru and thru hip shot will literally fracture the hips and hip joints but the lower legs will still move because of the probability of the complete nerve damage to the lower legs will not occur. If the hips shatter the collateral nerve damage will be almost complete.

I know of a few hunters that try for a neck shot just placed forward of the junctionof the cervical-lumbar junction. Itt seems as if it takes a bit for shock to kill the animal. These hunters are going for head trophy and no meat damage. Myself, if I was trying for the no meat damage I would go for the head, and shot at a reasonable range I don't want something to be killed by shock. I have seen too many people die from shock. It is said that when in shock an animal/human feels no pain. Bull hockey. I have seen the eyes of death that way and they do have pain but the brain doesn't know what to do with it

whitecloud · « **Reply #21 on:** January 22, 2004, 03:04:23 AM »

spitpatch,

that ammo in brown boxes wouldnt be PMP from south africa would it?Just a thought.the only thin in brown that I can remember.

mainehunt · « **Reply #22 on:** January 22, 2004, 04:06:33 AM »

My buddy and I both have AK47's. We frequently "ride the recoil" in full auto. (the guns are semi auto, we are breaking no laws here)

We have each fired at least 2-3000 rounds of ammo through our guns. EACH.

Never had a jam, never had one stick, and the accuracy is actually quite good considering how cheap we get this Wolf ammo.

By the way, we pay $89 for 1000 rounds. We order through CENTERFIRE SYSTEMS, they are in Versailles, KY. FREE SHIPPING, and NO, I don't work there.

spitpatch · « **Reply #23 on:** January 22, 2004, 12:20:10 PM »

No, It's not PiMP ammo from South Africa. That stuff is crap. Tried it once, never do that again. This ammo is made in Russia, although the boxes ARE similar. Centerfire Systems is a good place to get bargins, and I don't work there either, but I've done business with them, good folks.The PiMP ammo didn't feed well through anything I own excepy my single shot, and accuracy was marginal. The only milsurp ammo I buy anymore is the British .308 and Hertenberger .308 ammo, both function extremely well through my FAL Stg-58. I also like Lake City .223 ammo when it can be found. Other than that I reload.......Thats the best!