Author Topic: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts  (Read 8898 times)

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Offline skinman

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Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« on: October 08, 2010, 12:05:15 PM »
I have been a very happy Marlin owner for years. I have several in my gunsafe and all were made at the New Haven, CT plant. All have a very nice fit/finish and are both bolt/lever action rifles. My newest Marlin is the .44 mag manufactured in 2005. That said, a local gunshop owner/friend of mine has 6 lever action Marlin's in his shop of various calibers. Each one has either finish/fit problems or worse, there are two that the lever action will not fully open. He is sending all 6 back to Marlin.

My question is this. How in the heck did these rifles pass final inspection? I have posted here on another sight the same thing with a new H&R Ultra Slugster that I just bought. I don't know if anyone else has noticed this or are having the same problems? I hope it is not the intention of seeing these firearms going out of business, or worse....being made in China. I'm already saddened by H&R making some of their guns there :'(

Gents, if we continue to stay silent about all of this, it will continue. That's just not acceptable for me.
"Hunting and Fishing"....a deadly disease that I thank God they will never find a cure for..

Offline Spanky

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Re: What's going on with the newer Marlin's?
« Reply #1 on: October 10, 2010, 04:01:38 PM »
Interesting... problems with new H&R's and Marlins. ::)
Hard to believe the story about the levers not functioning properly... the guns are test fired before shipping. ;)
What exactly are the other problems?
My local shop has about 20 or so Marlins on the racks and they are all nicely finished. :)
Same with the H&R's... he's got quite a few new ones on the rack and they're all perfect too... I just put a deposit on a new 243 ultra the other day. ;D
Like I said.... interesting.



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Offline jcn59

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Re: What's going on with the newer Marlin's?
« Reply #2 on: October 10, 2010, 04:33:33 PM »
Is the old plant closed down yet?  Maybe a bunch of disgruntled employees, angry about losing their jobs?  Or are these guns from the new plant?  Does anybody know what is going on?
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Offline skinman

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Re: What's going on with the newer Marlin's?
« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2010, 11:37:25 AM »
Spanky,
In regards to "interesting", I can tell you first hand that I am not out to downgrade a gun company. I'm just saddened by the fact that these firearms that I have had myself or have seen from my friend who owns a gunshop is not the quality that they used to be. For instance, a fella just bought a new Marlin .44 from my friends shop. He was back in the door within the hour from the range. The lever would not go down after shooting some shells. Also a new Marlin in stainless that came in to his store....the lever will only drop from the reciever at about 15 degrees. Don't tell me they test fire every gun that goes out, how can that be when you get guns in to a gunshop that are already having problems? Another thing to look at in the fit/finish of a Marlin lever is to look at the inletting where the stock/reciever match.....if you see a darker color where the metal meets the wood, that's covering up a bad inletting. I have other lever guns that I will not mention by name, they are not like that at all. And just on a note, my 2005 Marlin .44 is inletted perfectly.
If you would like to call my gundealer, he will gladly let you know that what I have said is true to fact. Give me a P.M. and I will gladly give you his business number.
Regards:
 
Skinman
"Hunting and Fishing"....a deadly disease that I thank God they will never find a cure for..

Offline skinman

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Re: What's going on with the newer Marlin's?
« Reply #4 on: October 11, 2010, 11:53:43 AM »
Spanky,

I had a new 91 serial number (last year for the New Haven plant) Marlin original golden 39A that I wasn't happy with. The lever action was very, very stiff. I spent hours of an evening just watching t.v. and moving the lever back/forth to try to loosen it up a bit. Still the same. Also the inletting wasn't very good. I ended up selling it for a steal to a fella who didn't care so much about the things that I do. I couldn't justify selling him a rifle for top price when it was in that condition. If you want, just take the topic off the list in the Marlin section. If folks don't want to talk about problems like this, then so be it. I'm just a fella that believes that regardless of circumstance, right is right and wrong is wrong. If you build something, what ever happened to pride in workmanship? Why do gunshops sell some guns that have been stamped "remanufactured?" BINGO!
"Hunting and Fishing"....a deadly disease that I thank God they will never find a cure for..

Offline Spanky

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Re: What's going on with the newer Marlin's?
« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2010, 12:43:38 PM »
Maybe you're unlucky. :-\



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Offline skinman

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Re: What's going on with the newer Marlin's?
« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2010, 03:33:28 PM »
Just to let everyone know, I am sending a letter to Marlin to express my concerns on this subject. I am but a speck, but sometimes the squeaky wheel finally gets the grease. How else can we keep manufacturing standards high? I fully support any American gun company, as well as any other manufacturing business that is here. They have a responsibility to keep the customer first; that means making a product that the consumer can rely on without hesitation or question. We should not have to send a product back due to a companies lack of responsibility on their end. That's just bad business practice.

My only exception to this is if a product is damaged during shipment.

My letter will go out tommorrow :)
"Hunting and Fishing"....a deadly disease that I thank God they will never find a cure for..

Offline jcn59

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Re: What's going on with the newer Marlin's?
« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2010, 03:46:45 PM »
An American gun company owned by ? from ?  ??
Vote them all out, EVERY election!
 
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Offline GH1

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #8 on: October 17, 2010, 02:23:41 PM »
I think sending a letter is a good idea.  Nobody can fix a problem if they don't know it's there.
GH1 :)
I owe my life to an organ donor

Offline Spanky

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #9 on: October 17, 2010, 06:45:49 PM »
Maybe your friend should send the letter since the "faulty" rifles are in his shop.



Spanky

Offline Keith L

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #10 on: October 18, 2010, 12:48:00 AM »
I there are indeed six defective rifles it will do far more good to send them back for replacement than any number of letters.  Letters can be ignored, but bad product has to be repaired or replaced, and the reasons for the problems can be rectified.
"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy."  Benjamin Franklin

Offline skinman

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #11 on: October 18, 2010, 07:34:37 AM »
Spanky, I sent the letter as a "consumer." It's to their regret that they have poor Quality Control. That's something they need to seriously take a look at.

Keith, my local gunshop dealer is shipping them back, along with a letter that expresses not ownly his dissatisfaction of recieving firearms in that manner, but to also tell them that he has LOST sales due to this problem. Hurt's when you get into a businessman's pocket in these slow times.
"Hunting and Fishing"....a deadly disease that I thank God they will never find a cure for..

Offline Spanky

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2010, 10:36:58 AM »
This thread has probably done more to hurt sales than the 6 guns in his shop. Without even a shred of evidence to back up the claims. ;)



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Offline peps123

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #13 on: October 22, 2010, 07:15:58 PM »
I have had the same problem recently. I received a new in box 1895 STBL with poor workmanship issues: buttstock is poorly fitted  at the receiver; tool marks/scratches at several screws; action incredibly rough, to name a few. This is my first Marlin and I am very disappointed, as was my FFL. I do not have pictures because that thing went straight back to Marlin. I have since learned of many STBL QC issues over at the Marlin Owners site. I only hope they correct these issues. Marlin wont need help from others in ruining a good brand if they continue to allow poor QC.

-J.S.

Offline Savage .250

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #14 on: October 23, 2010, 02:35:04 AM »
A lot of really nice used ones out there.  :)
" The best part of the hunt is not the harvest but in the experience."

Offline pastorp

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #15 on: October 25, 2010, 03:33:04 AM »
Well spunky, I bought a new marlin 1895 in 45/70 about 6 months ago. Stainless& wood. A dealer friend ordered it for me and I took delivery a couple months later. When I took it out to shoot the rounds would not load into the tube magazine. The action was very stiff. But I single loaded three rounds and the gun fired each one.
The problem was in the loading gate. I just took it to my gunsmith and he refit the loading gate and replaced the screw that holds it since it was broken. It was cheeper for me to pay him than shipping. I oiled the action and cycled it until it smoothed up.
Make your snide remarks if you want, but the Remington/ marlins are not up to par IMO.

Regards,
Byron

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Offline jcn59

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #16 on: October 25, 2010, 06:51:45 AM »
Made by people who where angry because their job ended??
Vote them all out, EVERY election!
 
Does anyone remember the scene from "Quigley Down Under" showing the aborigines lined up on the skyline as far as you could see?   That needs to be US!
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Offline pastorp

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #17 on: October 25, 2010, 05:48:57 PM »
Jcn59, just out of curiosity how would you know that is what happened to my gun?

Regards,
Byron

Christian by choice, American by the grace of God.

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Offline jcn59

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #18 on: October 25, 2010, 07:14:25 PM »
I have a swarm of Marlin rifles made over the past 55 years and all have worked flawlessly.  I asked myself "What's different today?"

No, I was never a Marlin employee.   My work is psychology.
Vote them all out, EVERY election!
 
Does anyone remember the scene from "Quigley Down Under" showing the aborigines lined up on the skyline as far as you could see?   That needs to be US!
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Offline Eli Chaps

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #19 on: October 28, 2010, 07:54:37 AM »
Hello All.  My first post here and I hope it isn't an inappropriate one but I thought maybe I could help shed some light on things.

First, no I am not affiliated with Marlin in any way other than being a devoted fan.  I have however, conferred a good bit with a couple now-former employees and have gleaned a lot of information.  You can call it one sided information and that would be fair.  I'll try to leave the opinions out and just state what I believe is accurate...

1.  91 is not the last serial number to come out of North Haven.  The last lever action came out of North Haven on I believe August 4th this year.  Remington took over production responsibilities in 2008.  The entire production, assembly, and service center is now located at their Ilion plant.

2.  BATFE granted Remington permission to continue using the North Haven stamp on Ilion produced guns until proper tooling is accomplished there.  Remington will be putting a Remington proof mark on the right side of the barrel, however, it is possible that some barrels that were made in North Haven were sent to Ilion complete with a JM mark on the left.  In short, a NH roll mark or JM stamp is not concrete evidence of a NH gun.

3.  The rimfire line went to Kentucky.  I believe the 39 being a lever action is the exception and went to NY.

4.  Remington under the Cerberus banner has instituted manufacturing processes deeply rooted in what is known as the "Toyota Way."  If, like me, you currently work in manufacturing for any moderately sized or larger company, that will be a very familiar term.  In the most general sense, it places a high emphasis on process efficiency and product volume.  The expectation was to assemble a rifle in 135 seconds or less.

5.  Not a single manufacturing or service employee transferred to NY.  NY employees (production, assembly, and service) were brought to the NH plant and given two-three weeks of training.

6.  Poor wood fit and finish has been a very common complaint lately.  The butt stock on my 2009 1895CB was terrible.  Bad enough, and combined with the other issues it had, I would not have purchased that particular rifle.  My wife got for me as a gift.  I have handled a number of recent production Marlins, some have been very good, some not so much.  Plastic shims and epoxy have been found on more than few stocks.

7.  Remington originally said they had no intention of closing the NH plant.  Then at the beginning of this year they announced they would indeed close the plant by 2011.  Within about six months, the facility became more or less idle.

8.  Remington took pretty much everything from the NH plant to Ilion, including equipment, shelves, tools, etc.

In the spirit of fairness and honesty, I will tell you that I don't like anything about the sell out or move.  But, as I said, I'm not trying to vent my opinions but rather share some of the information I've gleaned so that others can make of it what they will.

Offline Pat/Rick

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #20 on: October 28, 2010, 12:30:42 PM »
Hi Eli!!, I agree, the "toyota way" has replaced the unreliable "just in time"  in manufacturing speak. Both IMO are folly.I have experienced them both. I have spent alot of time in manufacturing as well, I have seen evidence of employees angry about job loss. On the other side of that coin are the employees that puposfully mess about at the introduction of a new product line simply because they don't want to mess with it. Both can lead to failure. NOT ALL employees attempt this behavior! AND there are the problems of introducing new products to an assembly crew. Sadly, our arms manufacturers are just getting too big to give that personal service we have enjoyed in the past of American craftsmanship. As stated there are lots of nice used guns on the market, I rarely buy new anyway. Hopefully the folks on the new marlin line will figure it out and do a good job.

Offline JPShelton

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #21 on: November 02, 2010, 02:59:12 AM »
The reason I do not currently own a 308 MX is because I haven't found one yet that appeared to be put together with the same care and skill that went in to building my 34 year old 336.  The differences in fit and finish are glaring and obvious -at least with the examples of the 308 MX that I've been able to get my hands on.

Count me in as one who doesn't believe that they still "make 'em like they used to."   I'm at the point where I'm thinking I'd probably be happier with a vintage 336 SC reamed out to .30-30 AI (or even an old Savage M-99 in .300 Sav.) than I would be with a new 308 MX.   

JP

Offline Frank Lee Scarlett

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #22 on: November 06, 2010, 11:02:29 AM »
Eli Chaps stated in #2.  BATFE granted Remington permission to continue using the North Haven stamp on Ilion produced guns until proper tooling is accomplished there.  Remington will be putting a Remington proof mark on the left side of the barrel, however, it is possible that some barrels that were made in North Haven were sent to Ilion complete with a JM mark on the right.  In short, a NH roll mark or JM stamp is not concrete evidence of a NH gun.

Checked my Marlin 1894CB 45Colt with starting serial number 02, produced in 1998, and my 1894CB in 357mag with starting serial number 01, produced in 1999.  Also in my latest purchase in October of this year an 1895CB with starting serial number 98, produced in 2002.  All have the North Haven stamp on the barrel and JM on the left side of the barrel.

I have to believe that my rifles were produced in the New Haven shop as they were produced before Marlin moved to NY this year, if this is incorrect let me know.

Offline Eli Chaps

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #23 on: November 07, 2010, 03:08:12 AM »
Eli Chaps stated in #2.  BATFE granted Remington permission to continue using the North Haven stamp on Ilion produced guns until proper tooling is accomplished there.  Remington will be putting a Remington proof mark on the left side of the barrel, however, it is possible that some barrels that were made in North Haven were sent to Ilion complete with a JM mark on the right.  In short, a NH roll mark or JM stamp is not concrete evidence of a NH gun.

Checked my Marlin 1894CB 45Colt with starting serial number 02, produced in 1998, and my 1894CB in 357mag with starting serial number 01, produced in 1999.  Also in my latest purchase in October of this year an 1895CB with starting serial number 98, produced in 2002.  All have the North Haven stamp on the barrel and JM on the left side of the barrel.

I have to believe that my rifles were produced in the New Haven shop as they were produced before Marlin moved to NY this year, if this is incorrect let me know.

Sorry, I had that backwards in my post (left/right).  It's fixed now.   :)

Yes, your rifles are pure Marlin.

Offline 30-30man

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #24 on: November 26, 2010, 04:05:23 PM »
It's obvious what happened...Typical Remington quality control..They could couldn't care less about quality just punch out as many as they can and live off the name of Marlin until the customer gets wise....I will only buy pre Remington Marlins.

Offline Spanky

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #25 on: November 26, 2010, 05:53:57 PM »
My dealer just got a few new marlins in a couple weeks ago. they are all perfect... I like the short barreled 45-70's with straight grip stocks. ;D
All the badmouthing is nonsense.
Byron... how is your new Remington bolt gun working out for you? You seem to be pretty happy with it so far.



Spanky

Offline pastorp

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #26 on: November 29, 2010, 04:18:26 AM »
Thanks for asking spunky, the rem 700 I just bought seams fine but I haven't gotten in my ring mounts yet so not able to shoot it. To be honest I'm not a big Remington bolt action fan except for the older ones.

Most of my marlins are older ones as well. Haven't bought a new marlin in years but I wanted a stainless guide gun in 45/70 for bear protection so I ordered one. My gunsmith straightened it out for less than all the shipping would a Cost but I was disappointed in the quality control. I'm sure Remington will get it all sorted out, but to deney there is a current problem is not logical either.  ::)

Regards, 
Byron

Christian by choice, American by the grace of God.

NRA LIFE

Offline Spanky

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #27 on: November 29, 2010, 11:23:35 AM »
Nice to hear that you're happy with the bolt gun pastwerp. Remington's and Marlin's are both quality products. ;)



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Offline Richard P

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #28 on: November 30, 2010, 05:59:05 AM »
Have you posted this same information at MarlinOwners.com and what responses were given there ? 

Offline Eli Chaps

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Re: Sent letter to Marlin to express the facts
« Reply #29 on: December 05, 2010, 09:08:17 AM »
My dealer just got a few new marlins in a couple weeks ago. they are all perfect... I like the short barreled 45-70's with straight grip stocks. ;D
All the badmouthing is nonsense.
Byron... how is your new Remington bolt gun working out for you? You seem to be pretty happy with it so far.



Spanky

No, it is not nonsense.