new plastic revolvers ?

[SHOOTALL]

Well after looking at several plastic revolvers ( I admit to not shooting) I see nothing to cause me to buy one . They all look well not so good IMO. I guess I feel like there should be some pride in ownership. The gun should have some "looks" . When you pull it out your pocket it should be plesent to see, even after carry has taken its toll. Plastic just looks cold right out the box to me. And the huge half flutes on some are just to odd looking for me. I tried the plastic auto and found them not to my taste for the same reason . Guess I'm just old fashoned.
 So what am I missing ?

[drdougrx]

Sometimes I think we lose our appreciation for asthetics and crafsmanship.  I just saw a new SW classic m40 centenial that was in 38spec and had a case hardened frame.  It was really nice....for $720 plus 6.25% sales tax.   

There aren't many guys who can or will spend $600-700 for a gun if they don't have to.

[Spirithawk]

Well, for one thing, I'll give you an example. My son carries out of necesity. He is a Certified Executive Bodyguard and runs a security firm. He has had extensive training by the same fellow that invented the SWAT Team and still trains SWAT, FBI, CIA, Secret Service agents, Police, and military. My son owns and carries a Springfield XD .45, an XD compact 9mm and a Para Ordanance compact .45, 24 x 7. All very good guns and in no way cheap. The Para books for $1,300. Know what his main complaints are? They all feel like you're carrying a brick around in no time at all and they are not always easy to conceal. He carries Kel Tecs when the others just aren't practical. I've a friend that owns a Glock and the Glock stays home more than it gets carried. Same reasons, too heavy and hard to conceal. I carry both a Kel Tec P-32 and a Kel Tec PF-9. The 9 weighs a whopping 18 ounces fully loaded 7 + 1, the P-32 half that! I carry both in holsters on my belt and they are impossible to see with just a t-shirt pulled over them. It's so thin I can even carry it in my pocket easily. They are so light you hardly feel they are there. I'll put the accuracy of the $300 PF-9 up against any more expensive semi-auto made and my son and I have shot a bunch. The PF-9 handles any brand ammo you put through it with no problems, unlike many more expensive guns that are ammo picky. THe P-32 is a great little backup to the 9. They aren't made to be pretty, though I like the looks of my 9.  They are made for conceal carry by law enforcement and CCW holders. They have no edges or parts to catch on clothing when drawn. Want pretty, buy pretty, but some have a need for practical. Thats where Kel Tecs come in, they fit a need and do so very very well.

[SHOOTALL]

That's true , me included . But for about 350-380 you can get a nice airweight around here with good looks.

[Spirithawk]

That may be but I'll bet I can carry the Kel Tec at times you can't simply because they are so much easier to conceal and looks don't equal performance.

[SHOOTALL]

sprithawk, that said my 340PD empty is 12 ozs and shoots 357 mag ammo. Mine is very accurate at SD range. I can carry 2 in summer in my pockets un-noticed . But what does that have to do with the lack of nice looks in a revolver ? Other than ,IMHO the 340 PD with the wooden SS grips I added looks better than any plactic revolver or pistol I have seen to date.
 There is little doubt the plastic guns will work for a while , maybe the plastic will get brittle maybe it won't . But most lack "look" to me. And with the prices of the Airweight 442 so low what do they offer ? Some will note sweat won't hurt finish maybe true . Maybe over years of use something will come to light not known today. At least with metal it can be refinished . But the heart of the weapon is springs and over time most will rust or corode and wear so moisture will effect the plastic gun about like it will the alum, scal, and steel gun as far as working.

[SHOOTALL]

That may be but I'll bet I can carry the Kel Tec at times you can't simply because they are so much easier to conceal and looks don't equal performance.

Well that depends on how I dress . I don't wear speedos myself and dress to allow the carrying of my gun so the Idea that in certian cloths you are better equiped is a moot point as I don't dress that light. But note I had a keltec 32 and found it lacking in every way other than being small when compared to the 340. I also have no problem carrying my 340 on the beach or any other legal place. On the beach or fishing I place the gun in a zip lock bag and it never gets wet or sandy and is always near if not on me.

[Spirithawk]

Cool, I know they are making a lot of guns more concealable and easy to carry. It was the Kel Tec that showed them that there was both a need and a market for such weapons.  I also like a .357 but being disabled recoil is a very big factor. I can shoot my PF-9 both comfortably and very accurately plus 9mm's are cheaper to buy. What I also like about my PF-9 is it's just a hair over 3/4" thick and holds 8 rounds and is quite accurate well out past average self defense range. Another thing too. My eyesight isn't the best and I simply can't focus on the sights of most handguns. I have no trouble at all seeing the sights on the PF-9 even without my glasses. I also wanted a conceal carry that I can hit with at a distance if need be and it fits the bill. I have a friend that can hit 2'x3' steel plates with his at 50 yards pretty consistently. Not bad for a $300 handgun. I wish we lived close to each other. I'd be willing to bet that I can get more shots off faster, and more accurately so, with my PF-9 than you can with your 340. I say that good naturedly bud. Just think it would be fun to see.   Plus it's very easy to mount a Crimson Trace laser sight or a tac light on. I want a tac light on mine for night time at home use. I look at the Kel Tecs as tactical self defense weapons. AR 15's aren't as pretty as a Remington 700 BDL either but both have their place in the world. Also we seem to be comparing semi autos to revolvers. For pretty I'll always choose a revolver, just personal taste, though a Wilson Combat is extremely beautiful in my eyes too!  Just can't afford one dang it life aint fair!   Some of these new aged polymers are a lot stronger than you might think. To think " plastic guns" don't have a place is like saying everyone should drive a certain car because only it fits everyones needs and it's prettier than the others. Basicly, if you're happy with what you've got and it does what you need it to do is all that really matters.  

[SHOOTALL]

You are right 357 ammo is out of sight . I have been looking for a lighter load myself since the wife might need to use it . And my arms are getting short and the sight thing is showing up. So I understand. Good point about the AR's , but they are anything but pretty  except when you really need one !
 yep on the pistol vs revolver , I figure a big pistol works fine and a small revolver works best . Just my thinking . And yea in the back of my mind is the ? about 5 shots being enough .

[Spirithawk]

My theory on self defense is very simple. All weapons fail at times. Soooo, with that in mind, I carry more than one weapon! I have my P-32 for up close and personal and as a back up for the PF-9. With the PF-9 I can reach out and touch someone. Plus I may add another PF-9. Faster to grab another weapon than reload. You're at your most vulnerable point while reloading. Plus, if you carry more than one weapon and one fails, you can grab another rather than standing there looking shocked as you realise you're defenseless. Also, if reloading is practical depending on the situation, with a semi auto I can carry as many extra magazines fully loaded and ready to go as my pockets, or magazine carriers, can hold. Even were you using a speed loader I can still drop an empty magazine and insert another much faster than you can reload. On the plus side, your revolver is less prone to malfunctions such as jamming, but it can still happen. One thing I like about the PF-9 is that I've read a ton of reviews and they very rarely jam if properly maintained. My son is getting me a tac light like he uses. It is designed not only to illuminate your target but to blind him as well. It will make a neat, and very practical, addition to my PF-9.   My PF-9 is quite potent in the 9mm Luger but yet recoil is tame enough that my wife has no problem shooting it and the small grips fit her hand no problem. I like that as well as she may need to use it at times.

[SHOOTALL]

I carry a very bright lite . It works spoting critters well over 100 yards across fields .

[drdougrx]

I still think this thread is about asthetics...not practicality.  Most plastic guns are made to be practical and not necessarily asthetic or pretty....satisfies rule #1...have a gun.  I think that some of the scandium or alu guns are as lite as the plastics....I think there's more choices today of plastics for all kinds of reasons that have nothing to do with asthetics.  I also think you both make great points......so....the answer is....thank GOD we have choices!!!!

[SHOOTALL]

You are right , I was just seeing what I was missing. The same went on with the Judge , for the life of me I don't see the benifit of one . We have all heard the story that FL. judges swear by them can you imagine a judge of all people fireing in the direction of a full court room with a gun that increases the spread of pellets with its rifling almost insuring at leas one buck shot will miss 

[Spirithawk]

I too agree. I think plastic guns, though not pretty, have their places. In a practical sense, and from a tactical view, I see my PF-9 as at least sharp if not pretty.  As to the Judge, my son's partner in his security firm carries one and likes it. The benifit of the .410 shell is two fold. 1) if there's time to discuss the point, the bad guy don't much like being faced with a shotgun shell and 2) when you have to make a very fast shot you've better odds of hitting your target. You also don't have over penetration with the shot shell. Not best in all situations, but it can have it's place. I'm not real impressed with the judge myself. I'd carry my son's Para or XD any day over the Judge. As to pretty guns, pretty is in the eye of the beholder. I think an old Colt single action is beautiful. But, as a self defense gun, I love a Wilson Combat which has it's own kind of beauty. I see my T/C Encore as beautiful. I simply love that rifle. Some think it's ugly. I think their rifles are ugly.   Beauty can be seen as simply a weapon that fits your needs perfectly or as an object to look at. Sometimes, when we are lucky, it can be both.

[SHOOTALL]

your sons buddy better track down the test that showed the judge had a habit of letting primers back out. It was by a guy in his line of work.
Para yes a comforting gun to have , the LDA all the better.

[Spirithawk]

your sons buddy better track down the test that showed the judge had a habit of letting primers back out. It was by a guy in his line of work.
Para yes a comforting gun to have , the LDA all the better.

I'll certainly bring that up with him. thanks bud. I sometimes carry my son's Para. He wants to sell it because it's the double stack. He wants the single stack Para. The double is too blocky for his hands. In Body Guard training, he fired 2,000 rounds through his XD Compact 9mm in just two days, in a wide variety of conditions and including shooting with either hand, without cleaning, and without a single missfeed at all. Now that's a well made gun! The man who taught him developed the very first SWAT Team, wish I could recall his name but he owns and opertates APT. He told everyone in my son's class, FBI agents, CIA, Private Bodyguards, ect., who weren't carrying XD's that their guns would jam. The very first day proved him right. He told everyone that he carries 24/7 and trusts his life to his sidearm. That he could have any handgun made, custom jobs included, and he trusts his life to the XD. So why does my son also have a Para? Because it's a good gun but mostly because he likes the "looks" of a 1911 type frame. 

[SHOOTALL]

I took PPI classes with a glock 19 not one failure . I just don't like glocks that much. The class also had 1911's HP's and a few others . One enhanced 1911 failed . The Browning passed with flying colors and was  most accurate . Our round cound was way up on a couple sessions maybe 500 or a few more. We had one revolver shooter also . Slow but very sure.

[DDZ]

I have one plastic gun, and most likely won't buy another. The one I have is an XD .45. It functions well, and chambers everything I have fed it, and I think it is a very good gun for what I paid for it. The problem I have with it, is that it is ugly, and it just doesn't feel right in my hand. I just prefer the feel and looks of iron. I have not seen a plastic gun, that I have said "boy that is a nice looking gun", but then, beauty is in the eye of the beholder.   

[Spirithawk]

I have one plastic gun, and most likely won't buy another. The one I have is an XD .45. It functions well, and chambers everything I have fed it, and I think it is a very good gun for what I paid for it. The problem I have with it, is that it is ugly, and it just doesn't feel right in my hand. I just prefer the feel and looks of iron. I have not seen a plastic gun, that I have said "boy that is a nice looking gun", but then, beauty is in the eye of the beholder.   

When carrying for self defense, funtion beats pretty every time!  I'll take an ugly gun that gets the job done over a pretty one that don't. Of course if you're willing to shell out the bucks you can have both. Pretty semi auto's come with pretty prices.

[DDZ]

I agree 100% that function-ability beats looks every time. If we are talking reliability and function-ability for carry, A steel wheel gun is more so. I can buy a 357 revolver for less than what an XD costs, and is more reliable and nicer looking. I'm not beating up the XD or any plastic gun for that matter. They are very well made and are a good value for the money, its that I personally just don't like them all that much. I'm glad that everybody does not like the same firearm. If they did it would be kind of boring. 

[mcwoodduck]

A guy was buying a Glock in my local store 10 years ago or so.
He said "these things are as pretty as orthapedic shoes, but like orthapedic shoes they work"
I am sure the plastic revolvers are the same way.
Light  and reliable.

[Savage]

I've got a lot more steel and aluminum pistols than plastic, for that matter, a lot more 1911s than anything else. Were I choosing a pistol based on looks and feel, it'd be a contest between my
1911s, Highpowers, and CZs. If I had to choose one pistol platform to fight with under any and all conditions, it'd be an ugly Glock. The plastic guns are not much to look at, their beauty lies in their proven reliability and durability. Now, in a 5 shot revolver, with the alloy ones weighing in about the same as the plastic, I'll go with the metal. It's for sure more pleasing to the eye, and performance should be a wash.
Savage

[Spirithawk]

Now this is towards long guns rather than hanguns but it still relates. All of my son's rifles and shotguns stay here at my house. We hunt together so it's just more convenient. Between mine and his we have 18 long guns in the cabinet. Three, two shotguns and a custom target .22 , have wood stocks. The other 15 synthetic. Over time we've both owned some truly beautiful, and expensive, rifles and shotguns. All but three of them, the three still in the cabinet, have ended up traded or sold. Why? Because they were just too pretty, too fancy, and too expensive to be practical. You sure don't want to carry an expensive beautiful one on an ATV, through brush nor over muddy or rocky terrain.  Just my opinion but firearms fall into two categories. Those you invest in that are works of art  and those you intend to use. The one stays at home safe and sound while the other goes with you to get the job done. Sometimes you can find a ballance between the two but the hard working ones tend to be plain and fuctional and that's fine by me. To some pretty is a well blued barrel, beautifuly case hardened frame, and select grips or stock. To others it's a well designed functional weapon. Not eye candy to anyone but someone familiar with the work that went into making it reliable and accurate. There in lies the real beauty. That is what I look for in a weapon. I think that many hear the term "plastic" and that imediately turns them off because they think it's cheap and poorly made, but think of the technology that goes into making modern plastics. Modern "plastic" guns are far from toys. Need an example of durability? Stop to think how many rifles and shotguns now have synthetic, yes "plastic" stocks. Now why do you suppose that is? Because they are rugged. I took my beautiful walnut stock off my T/C Encore and replaced it with a synthetic one. Why? Because I can now carry it on my ATV,  in bad weather, and over rough terrain, and not worry about making that beautiful walnut stock into an ugly broken walnut stock. Plastic aint pretty but is is darn tough.

[GH1]

 While some guns are certainly more visually pleasing than others, much of our opinions on looks are built around what we've been exposed to during our formative years. It's very similar to artistic and culinary likes & dislikes.
 I prefer the looks of a levergun over a tactical rifle, but I grew up watching "The Rifleman", along with various other westerns. I also lean towards revolvers, probably for the same reason.
 As far as the long term reliability of polymer arms, only time will tell.  I think they'll hold up just fine, but we'll have to wait and see.  Another point to consider is how long do they have to last? I'm sure someone could build a gun that would last for 50,000 rounds, but is it needed ? Probably not. So why spend the additional money to build something that's completely over-engineered? It's all about application.
GH1

[jimster]

Guess I'm just old fashoned.
 So what am I missing ?

You only miss what you like. Plastic guns work and there is a place for them, but I like steel wood/bone, old fashioned blue or CCH is a nice touch.
Guns are like gals, Gotta get one you like to look at.   

[WD45]

Plastic and guns go together about like ketchup on a banana

[DC]

I have owned several 1911's over the years.  Most recently I sold a Para 16-40 with a custom trigger, mag well extension etc.  After,
arm surgery last December I just can't do the weight of a all metal full sized auto.  I now have two 9mm's that I can deploy quickly and not have arm problems.  I have a Taurus PT 908, while is is metal, it is a mid size auto with a alum. allow frame.  I also just bought a FN FNX-9 with a polymer frame which weighs in at around 21 oz.  It is a joy to carry and with a 17+1 round capacity has enough fire power to get the job done and still is a great paper puncher.  I can carry either of the pistols comfortably. 
Before buying these I was able to heft a half a dozen makes and models side by side.  The FNX was a clear winner in pointability, and according to a lot of reviews, extremely reliable and accurate.

I like you was never wild about polymer framed autos but when I tried one I became sold.  Since most PD's have chosen Glocks, HK's and FN's with poly frames, can they be all that bad?

[DC]

My bad.  I forgot to say that the FN is a good looking piece as well.  However, function is or at least should be the prime consideration
in any firearm purchase.  For example a Walther p-22 is a really cool looking pistol but fails in the reliability department if fed anything other that CCI Mini Mags. 

The thing is, I don't wave my weapons around for all to see and admire.  In fact, not many people know that I own any of them and I plan to keep it that way.

[Spirithawk]

Plastic and guns go together about like ketchup on a banana

Really? Tell that to the military and law enforcement. They might beg to differ. In fact, I know they would.  Weapons fall into categories; Hunting, Law Enforcement, Tactical, Military, Self Defense, Sporting, ect. ect. ect. To choose one type and judge all the others by it alone is just a bit foolish don't ya think? Each has a purpose and is designed accordingly. If you don't like, nor have a need, for one type who are you to criticize someone else who does or the weapon itself? Would you buy an AR-15 to hunt ducks? Of course not. Neither would you by a $3,000 over/under shotgun, or a presentation grade Ruger No. 1 to carry openly on the rack of an ATV over rough terrain and in bad weather. But you sure might a synthetic stocked weapon and think nothing of it because you know it is designed to handle things and still get the job done. What you all that bash the "plastic guns" fail to understand is that the beauty of them is not in the apearance as much as it is in the functionability and design to get the job done. You don't buy a new flashy Mercedes sedan to go mudding nor rock crawling. You buy, or build a rig designed to do those things. Park them side by side and which is the more beautiful? It depends on who you ask. The guy watching the show in his buiseness suit and high dollar Mercedes or the driver trying to take first place in a well designed and built  4 X 4! Same with guns! Pretty is nice but pretty doesn't always get the job done.

[JeffG]

So what am I missing ?

I didn't know the attraction of Glocks till I shot one, and the 24 or so police department's guns kept going without breakdown or malfunction up the neighborhood of 20,000 rounds, each.  They're not pretty, there is no "wow" factor.  They are the fiberglass handled framing hammers of the gun world. The don't break, they are always gonna go "bang", and you see a lot of them on "tool belts", so to speak. 

Not a fan of plastic wheelguns, though. Sorry.