Author Topic: Legal rifle?? (Read 1897 times)

Dinny · « **on:** November 03, 2010, 04:12:38 PM »

Someone sent me this pic recently. I was told he's shooting a 15" 45-70 Encore rifle. As you can see there's a buttstock attached. Is that legal to do with a 15" barrel? I thought it had to be at least 16" long.

Thanks, Dinny

Flynmoose · « **Reply #1 on:** November 03, 2010, 04:17:51 PM »

From everything I have read and the answers I got from LE people,
barrels are supposed to be 16 inches or more to have a buttstock.

Dinny · « **Reply #2 on:** November 03, 2010, 04:25:58 PM »

Quote from: Flynmoose on November 03, 2010, 04:17:51 PM

From everything I have read and the answers I got from LE people,
barrels are supposed to be 16 inches or more to have a buttstock.

That's what I was thinking too.

Thanks, Dinny

Grumpy · « **Reply #3 on:** November 03, 2010, 05:19:10 PM »

It is not legal. Besides the 16" minimum barrel length the overall length must be 25 or 26". I couldn't find my books or I would recite chapter and verse.

DEACONLLB · « **Reply #4 on:** November 04, 2010, 08:12:40 AM »

If you will look on the recoil pad of the TC rifle stock it has a stamped in message, warning federal law prohibits use of any barrel shorter than 16 inches, that is why you see a lot of barrels 16 1/4 inch so you are on the safe side, but I do know hunters who ride around with short barrels for use as a truck gun which is also breaking the law, called road hunting

Deaconllb

Elwood · « **Reply #5 on:** November 04, 2010, 09:25:19 AM »

A rifle can legally have a barrel shorter than 16".
But........

Unless it is registered and licensed with the BATF as a "Short Barreled Rifle" it must have a barrel 16 inches or longer.
I am unable to look at this picture and ascertain whether it is a licensed short barreled rifle or not, can you?

Keith L · « **Reply #6 on:** November 04, 2010, 01:55:15 PM »

No, but the LEO that takes offense at that can confiscate it and hold it until he checks it out.

Dinny · « **Reply #7 on:** November 04, 2010, 02:10:35 PM »

I just got a reply back from that Canuck; he said in Canada it is registered and legal. And now we know....

Thanks, Dinny

wareagleguy · « **Reply #8 on:** November 04, 2010, 02:31:00 PM »

So, we just think Canada has more gun law restrictions.

Curtis · « **Reply #9 on:** November 04, 2010, 03:01:41 PM »

............and from what I understand Great Britain allows and even encourages suppressors on hunting rifles. Our laws make no sense.

Curtis

45-70.gov · « **Reply #10 on:** November 04, 2010, 03:12:19 PM »

i have a 9mm with 6 inch barrel
it also has a shoulder stock
and a selector switch for full auto

i paid $200 dollars to the feds to get permission to have it
shoulder stock and under 16 inch barrel requires
the $200 bribe and the paper work in the USA

can't tell from the picture......
if he has paper work
or in the USA

i carry my paper work [copies]
with my gun to the range

i was shooting my 9 inch o/u 12gage once
a deputy approached me and........
told me not to get caught with that

Keith L · « **Reply #11 on:** November 04, 2010, 03:35:59 PM »

Quote from: Dinny on November 04, 2010, 02:10:35 PM

I just got a reply back from that Canuck; he said in Canada it is registered and legal. And now we know....

Thanks, Dinny

That is another piece of the puzzle. I have no clue what other countries allow. I am focused on staying out of the crowbar hotel in
America. Thanks for the clarification.

wareagleguy · « **Reply #12 on:** November 04, 2010, 04:44:42 PM »

I was in a gun shop a few weeks ago and talking to a deputy that was buying a barrel threaded for a suppressor. I asked how I could get one and he said I had to have a Class III to get one. I asked why suppressors were not allowed for everyone and his words were on the line that people would use it to kill. I asked one last question on what his opinion was on how effective the current law was working to stop killing. He didn't have much to say about that.

45-70.gov · « **Reply #13 on:** November 04, 2010, 05:52:00 PM »

Quote from: wareagleguy on November 04, 2010, 04:44:42 PM

I was in a gun shop a few weeks ago and talking to a deputy that was buying a barrel threaded for a suppressor. I asked how I could get one and he said I had to have a Class III to get one. I asked why suppressors were not allowed for everyone and his words were on the line that people would use it to kill. I asked one last question on what his opinion was on how effective the current law was working to stop killing. He didn't have much to say about that.

should have ask....
why a deputy had to KILL silently

he is incorrect also....you don't need a class3....unless you are ''in business''
you only need the transfer document stamp from the atf
you spoke with an idiot

my H&R 45-70 has a barrel only one inch longer
cheaper....no special paper work....and might get more velocity and less blast
also with SBR [short barreled rifle] you can't just cross state lines
me class 3 toys can't leave the state...without writen permission from the ATF

every thing is a compromise

sdb777 · « **Reply #14 on:** November 14, 2010, 02:57:33 PM »

Isn't a Form 4 required for a supressor?

Scott

BBF · « **Reply #15 on:** November 14, 2010, 05:09:39 PM »

Now that is weird. Two days ago I had a talk with a Technician in the Firearms Centre for Canada. My question was how short of a barrel can I have on a rifle that is a modification. The answer was 18 1/2" unless it has a special exempt status like the Ruger Scout Rifles that come with those 16+ in barrels. There is an overall minimum as well.

That shorty rifle in the pix would be at best a restricted Firearm and treated as a handgun. A No No for hunting for sure.

wreckhog · « **Reply #16 on:** November 16, 2010, 05:02:10 PM »

Quote from: scatterbrain on November 14, 2010, 05:09:39 PM

Now that is weird. Two days ago I had a talk with a Technician in the Firearms Centre for Canada. My question was how short of a barrel can I have on a rifle that is a modification. The answer was 18 1/2" unless it has a special exempt status like the Ruger Scout Rifles that come with those 16+ in barrels. There is an overall minimum as well.

That shorty rifle in the pix would be at best a restricted Firearm and treated as a handgun. A No No for hunting for sure.

or not?

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,212839.msg1099139782.html#msg1099139782

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,215205.0.html

BBF · « **Reply #17 on:** November 18, 2010, 03:33:46 AM »

Wreckdog:
Honestly I don't see how that firearm would be considered Non-Restricted. I threw out the notes I took when I called the Firearms Centre and do not recall the Overall lenght requirements for a modified firearms.

FurFinandFeather · « **Reply #18 on:** November 19, 2010, 11:46:29 AM »

Quote from: scatterbrain on November 18, 2010, 03:33:46 AM

Wreckdog:
Honestly I don't see how that firearm would be considerd Non-Restricted. I threw out the notes I took when I called the Firearms Centre and do not recall the Overall lenght requirements for a modified firearms.

Another Canuck posting in here.

Scaterbrain, its no different than putting a Dlask (a canadian manufacturer of firearm parts) 14", 12.5", or even shorter barrel on an Remington 870. It stays non restricted even though the barrel is less than 18" for a manual repeater. Our laws, like most, are full of items that don't make sense.

In Canada, you can put on short barrels and keep the firearm non-restricted as long as the overall length of the firearm is 26" or greater AND the barrel was manufactureed that way. You can not cut the barrel shorter than 18" otherwise you have created a prohibited firearm.

I'm just in the process of looking for my first TC and plan on building it to match my friends. It is a rifle with a 14" 22lr barrel that is kept broken down in a pack while hunting. Its taken out to pot grouse using 22CBs as not to spook game.

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #19 on:** November 19, 2010, 11:53:37 AM »

When i was in VA the big thing then was the scatter gun tech entry guns with the 14" barrel on an 870.
You just paid $50 or $200 for a tax stamp to get a short barreled rifle or shotgun

luckydawg13 · « **Reply #20 on:** November 19, 2010, 01:20:48 PM »

Quote from: Dinny on November 03, 2010, 04:12:38 PM

Someone sent me this pic recently. I was told he's shooting a 15" 45-70 Encore rifle. As you can see there's a buttstock attached. Is that legal to do with a 15" barrel? I thought it had to be at least 16" long.

Thanks, Dinny

i wont tell if you dont

44 Man · « **Reply #21 on:** November 19, 2010, 01:57:02 PM »

I had a contender a while back and with 14" pistol barrel that I wanted to use for a carbine. I simply had a 2 1/2" muzzle brake permanently attached, no problem. With a youth stock attached it was a sweet little package! 44 Man

BBF · « **Reply #22 on:** November 20, 2010, 03:24:26 AM »

Trade Man:
That may be legal in your jurisdiction, I asked whether or not a muzzle brake would be counted towards the min. barrel lenght in Canada and was informed NO. The barrel itself must be the min. lenght, regardless how the brake is attached.

FFF
Do I understand you correctly that a replacement factory barrel that is less then 18 1/2 long will be legal but not one that has been cut to that size?
My understanding was, which could be mistaken, that the entire original firearm would need a special exemption status.

FurFinandFeather · « **Reply #23 on:** November 22, 2010, 12:41:29 PM »

Quote from: scatterbrain on November 20, 2010, 03:24:26 AM

FFF
Do I understand you correctly that a replacement factory barrel that is less then 18 1/2 long will be legal but not one that has been cut to that size?
My understanding was, which could be mistaken, that the entire original firearm would need a special exemption status.

The key for us in Canada is the barrel has to be manufactured that way - we can not cut it shorter than 18 1/2". If you plan on keeping a barrel less than 470mm on the gun then you should call the Canadian Firearms Center and inform them of the change so you registration certificate would reflect a short barrel but as long as the length is kept over 26", it stays non-restricted.

If you plan on using a short barrel for hunting, check your provincial regulations. In BC, the barrel must be 12" or longer. The guys with the 8 1/2" barreled 870's can not use them to hunt, only for protection from animals and starting small forest fires with the muzzle blast! Again, this is in BC but other provinces have different regulations on firearms for protection from animals.

Clear as mud!