.357 Max problem

[Goatwhiskers]

I say go to the experienced people when you have a problem.  A while back I said I was going to convert my 357Mag cadet Martini to Max.  Well, I done it, shot it today, and got a problem.  1st load was 158gr Hornady HPXTP,21gr IMR 4227, CCI 400 primer.  Shot well, no sign of trouble.  2nd load was 180gr Hornady HPXTP, 18.5gr IMR 4227, CCI 400.  Two of the three cartridges had punctured primers.  1st mistake was that my book said Hodgdon, not IMR, altho the Hodgdon is only supposed to be slightly slower.  I am wide open to ideas and suggestions.  I'm thinking maybe something slightly slower?  There were no pressure signs on the other cases.  Over 40 years reloading and never had something like this happen.  Goatwhiskers the Elder

[cwlongshot]

I don't have a book in front of me, but where do these loads fall? I mean are they starting loads? (Al-tho I'm sure the cadet action is stout enough for any sane load.)

Just gonna throw a couple things out and see what sticks: How did it shoot as a Mag? Is the FP nice and round? Are you applying a firm crimp? If crimping, where are you crimping the 180's, long or short?

I would look first at the load, then the FP itself and go from there.

Simple answer is just try different primers.

CW

[Goatwhiskers]

FP is OK.  Shot 3/4" with factory magnums before rechambering.  Seated to the first groove, no crimp.  Goatwhiskers

[mrcoolid]

G W elder

This an article and info that might help you...

http://www.jamescalhoon.com/primers_and_pressure.php

Mike

[aromakr]

Goatwiskers:
I have a martini cadet in the 218 Mashburn Bee. This rifle was converted by P.O. Ackley in the early 1960's never could approach max loads without either pierced primers or the primer would flow back into the firing pin hole and lockup the action. Finally a friend suggested I switch to CCI #41 primers, no more problem. the 41 is the primer the Feds use much harder cup.
 Also you might check how much the firing pin protrudes from the breach block.
Has the firing pin size been reduced, it was originally intended for Berdan primers and is too large diameter for small boxer primers.  
Bob

[Goatwhiskers]

Worked on this all day today and hope the info helps someone.  First off, the firing pin had been bushed, but was way too long.  Combine that with the fact that I found that my scale had a problem and was weighing 5gr over.  18.5gr plus the overage equals 23.5gr of 4227, definitely over the maximum in my book of 19.5gr.  A little bit of a fast burning powder goes a long way.  Trimmed the FP and fixed my scale, loaded 3 more 180's with the 18.5gr load and everything is as it should be.  Think I'll start working on an accurate load tomorrow, but I'll be MUCH more careful.  Next time I buy a gun built by someone else I'll check it better too.  Goatwhiskers the Elder

[cwlongshot]

I'm glad you found it GW!!!

 Just goes to prove that when all else fails, go back and check the basics and take nothing for granted.

When you finished your orig. post with the 40 years of experience. I didn't want to "tell" your your load was too hot or you had some kind of a FP issue. So I just kinda nudged and pointed ya at it.  I had faith you would come across the problems!!  GOOD JOB!!
 
 Now how about some pics of your Cadet?

CW

[gcrank1]

Fortunately the cadet action is considered by many to be as strong as the big Martini, just cant chamber it for the large calibers because of the smaller barrel shank dia.
Even so, this underscores exactly why one should always properly -0- the scale before a reloading session.
I have made mistakes, and when I do I make a new methodology to prevent it in the future. If it happens once, it can happen again unless you change the program.
I say this not to admonish you, but to make a point especially to the newer reloaders who should be aware of what dangers lurk out there.
sermon over.....

[cwlongshot]

Fortunately the cadet action is considered by many to be as strong as the big Martini, just cant chamber it for the large calibers because of the smaller barrel shank dia.
Even so, this underscores exactly why one should always properly -0- the scale before a reloading session.
I have made mistakes, and when I do I make a new methodology to prevent it in the future. If it happens once, it can happen again unless you change the program.
I say this not to admonish you, but to make a point especially to the newer re loaders who should be aware of what dangers lurk out there.
sermon over.....

 I too have made a few.

I have a 25ACP shell that became lodged inside a 308 and caused me fits until I found it. FIRMLY attached to my expander ball!!! Now I look close at all cases that come out of the tumbler!!

I have a couple 25-20 & 32-20's crumpled because I was too hasty resizing them.

There is also a couple badly dimpled cases form dirty dies and too much lube.

I keep them lined up near the powder scale to remind me to go slow and pay attention!!

Mistakes are things that happen all the time. We are human. SAFE handling of firearms keeps them from becoming  TRAGEDIES!!

Reminds me of the recent story about the REMINGTON 700 safety problems and the woman who shot her son. THAT was a tragedy!! BUT was completely avoidable. Whats one of the very first things we teach new shooters? Point the firearm in a safe direction, right? What is something else taught? "A safety is a mechanical device that CAN and WILL fail"!!! Now I'm not going top get into Rems fault in all this. All I am saying is if those two things where adhered to, it would merely be a mistake or a ACCIDENTAL DISCHARGE not a TRAGEDY!!!

CW

[blind ear]

+ 1 CW, all of this is the reason for the sternness and strictness of the range masters. Sorry to hijack. eddiegjr