Author Topic: Finishing my new stock  (Read 781 times)

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Offline mtnman1

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Finishing my new stock
« on: December 09, 2003, 01:14:01 PM »
OK, just ordered a new stock and barrel from Bullberry in 6.5x284 for my Thompson Encore. The stock is semi-finished and I'm going to finish it out. I've ordered the blondest piece of wood they could find in a High Grade English Walnut. I haven't settled yet on what finish I want to go with. I want to maintain as clear a finish as possible to maintain the natural wood color. Will a waxed Tung Oil finish darken the wood? If so, are there better alternatives. I recently read an article about using Automotive clearcoat which seemed pretty interesting. Very tough finish and absolutely clear. Any alternatives or opinions are appreciated...

Offline Ladobe

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« Reply #1 on: December 09, 2003, 01:55:49 PM »
Howdy mtmman1,

Hopefully I can be of some help to you.   I have about 40 years of playing with fine woods as a hobby, and have been making high end custom predator calls for about 30 of them.   So I stock and play with all the best hardwoods from around the world.    That said, I did a lot of experimenting with finishes for my calls, and continually try new things as they are developed.   Still the best for the walnuts IMO is a hand rubbed oil finish, with many thin coats to build the depth and luster to the level you are looking for.   Now there is tung oil, and then there is tung oil (don't use teak oil).   In your case, you'll want one that is clear and pure with no additives or dryers.   Yes, even it will darken the wood a little, but because you are in fact whetting the wood, but not artificially like a stain or dye does.   Nor will it "plug" the grain like they can, so the figure, curl and contrast will be only enhanced and deepened.   The more thin coats you do, the deeper the finish/patina you'll get.   Even for my calls (all exhibition grade woods) I go as many as 20 coats, depending on the species of wood, and 12 is the least.   Once you reach that "level" that you are satisfied with, a couple of three hand rubbed wax coats will seal and protect your finish.   Use 100% white Caranuba for this, dried and buffed between coats.

BTW, don't use a sanding sealer - many of them will color or plug the wood.   Take your sanding through the grits you have decided on, and when you get past the finest, dust the stock with a soft cotton cloth, then rinse it in hot clean water, wring every last drop of water out of it that you can, and "wash" the stock down -going against the grain lightly.    This scant moisture will raise any fibers, and when dry they can easily be sanded off with your finest grit again.   Dust again and check the surface.   If its smoothe enough for you, its oil time.   If not, do the wash/dry/sand as many times as you need to get all the pricklies off.   The better the prep job you do, the better the final finish will be.

When you oil, nothing works better than the good old hand bare to apply it, and go sparenly on the oil, use your hand to spread and work it in until it almost looks dry.   The mechanical action and friction will feel warm to your hand - and that's when its working the best -penetrating.   Let the stock dry completely between oil coats, and hand buff them out (clean soft cotton cloth) before the next coat is applied.

Lastly, don't buy cheap products.   You'll be doing a lot of hard work on the stock and you want it to last as long as the firearm does, so buy the best you can find/afford.

Hope this helps and wasn't just telling you what you already knew.   EW can be very beautiful and arguably one of the best Juglans (walnuts) for stock work (although some of my Paradox rivals it and Turkish surpasses it).

Don't forget to post pictures when its done - we want to see.

BTW, I have several exhibition wood sets from Bullberry - rest assured you will be very pleased whith what Fred sends you.

Ladobe  :bye:
Evolution at work. Over two million years ago the genus Homo had small cranial capacity and thick skin to protect them from their environment. One species has evolved into obese cranial fatheads with thin skin in comparison that whines about anything and everything as their shield against their environment. Meus

Offline Jagdzeit

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Finishing my new stock
« Reply #2 on: December 09, 2003, 03:03:33 PM »
Excellent information Ladobe.
Thanks for sharing and instructing.

Stay Safe,
Franz
Oppose the 2nd Amendment, you're an enemy of the Bill of Rights.
Enemy of the Bill of Rights, you 're an enemy of the Constitution.
Enemy of the Constitution, you're an enemy of The People.
Enemy of The People, you're an enemy of mine.  :blaster:

Offline mtnman1

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Finishing my new stock
« Reply #3 on: December 09, 2003, 05:54:46 PM »
Ladobe,

Wow thanks for all the detail and great info. I worked quite a bit with wood years ago when I was a kid, but haven't done anything in a long time, so it really helps to get a refresher. I'll have to take a trip down to some of my local shops and see what I can find in the way of available high quality Tung oil options. I'm also waiting to see how "Blonde" the wood comes in... For years I've wanted an icy blonde stock set and had originally intended to go with a maple. Fred said that he had some really blonde English Walnut with really good figure and that he was sure I would be happier with it than the maple.  Based on all the great feedback I've been able to read about the quality of his work, I figured it was best to take his advice.  :-)

He was fantastic to deal with on the phone and really went out of his way to understand what I wanted and help me get there. I'm dying to get my hands on the new barrel and stock set, but want to make sure I really take my time and do this right once. If it's half the shooter the bullberry crew seems to always put out, I won't be able to shoot well enough to do it justice, but I definitely want all the advantage I can get.  Also can't wait to try out the 6.5x284. What a fantastic cartridge from everyone's feedback so far.

Thanks again for all the help and insight.

Offline Ladobe

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« Reply #4 on: December 09, 2003, 06:43:53 PM »
Glad to help gents.   I have been lucky to know Fred for about 15 years, and was even luckier to have lived in Utah's Dixie 30 miles from him and run around with him for 8 1/2.   He's a great guy, and really knows his stuff when it comes to TC's, and he's no slouch on custom bolt guns either.   I don't know what grade wood you ordered from him, but I assure you that you will be pleased with it.   Even his utility wood is miles above factory woods from most of the firearms MFG's, and he tends to always give you more than you paid for.   Just so you know, he has his own sawmill and drying sheds (I used to help him cut and stock them for "fun" when he got a big load in).   Buys his woods by the semi load, and most of his walnut is bought as trunk/root stubs.   The man knows how to read wood let me tell you - how to cut it to get the most of the best figure out of it.   The wood scraps he burns in the shop stove as not good enough you'd drool over.   Anyway, you made the right choice on which of the TC custom shops to get your wood and barrel from as a combined order (and I know many of them personally).   Barrels only is a toss between Fred and JD at SSK IMO.

And, you'll love the 6.5-284 too I think.   It will be very precise out of one of Fred's barrels.   Have to admit I don't have one, but several of my friends here do.   My 6.5's are a Super Bower (on a Bullberry barrel blank chambered by Don) and a JDJ from SSK.  

Here's an idea of what Fred does for you when you are a close friend.   Wood was from his own personal stash, bulit to my exact dimensions (an advantage of hanging out at his shop all the time in the early years), palm swell, high comb for target scopes, etc, and made special for the first prototype 17HMR to come out of his shop (he worked with Hornady), and the first Hummer privately owned world-wide he thinks.   Its exhibition spalted curly white oak with rosewood caps (sorry, he may never see a piece of wood like this again).   Yeah, I'm proud of it, and the outside to outside .182 five shot 100 yard group it shot the first time I took it out.   :wink:   (thanks for putting up with me posting it again guys)

Ladobe

(oops - edited to a smaller picture)

Evolution at work. Over two million years ago the genus Homo had small cranial capacity and thick skin to protect them from their environment. One species has evolved into obese cranial fatheads with thin skin in comparison that whines about anything and everything as their shield against their environment. Meus

Offline Jagdzeit

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Finishing my new stock
« Reply #5 on: December 10, 2003, 01:00:26 AM »
Ladobe,
 SWEEEEEEEEET !!!
Is the only word I can think of right now besides AWESOME.
That is a beutiful piece of wood.
Thanks for sharing.

Stay Safe,
Franz
Oppose the 2nd Amendment, you're an enemy of the Bill of Rights.
Enemy of the Bill of Rights, you 're an enemy of the Constitution.
Enemy of the Constitution, you're an enemy of The People.
Enemy of The People, you're an enemy of mine.  :blaster:

Offline mtnman1

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Finishing my new stock
« Reply #6 on: December 10, 2003, 03:24:41 AM »
Labode That's the exact look I'm trying to get to. I wish I'd have had that as an example to give Fred. I'm sure he doesn't have another piece quite as "Strong" in character as that one, but I ordered the High grade so I'm guessing it will come out great. If and when I get this bad boy all together I'll try and get a picture up to show it off. I'm a bit new to TC's only had an a contender and an encore about a year and just starting to get back into shooting so I'm having quite a bit of fun. I've learned more about them from this site and accurate reloading that I could have ever expected. You guys are a great help.

Also just had a guy get in touch with me about a brand new coating that the government is testing. They've got some amazing stuff going on. They're testing some coatings that are so hard and thin that they can actually coat an entire gun inside and out, even the bore. They've got products to do stocks as well as complete guns. Very interesting stuff.

 I'm gonna give them a call today and once I find out more I'll try and put up some more info.

Offline Bullseye

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« Reply #7 on: December 10, 2003, 01:13:22 PM »
You want to use a polyurethane, varnish or epoxy type finish on that stock.  The problem is that they do turn the wood a little more yellow than some of the all oil products.  You do not want to use a pure oil product such as Pure Tung Oil.  Pure tongue oil (or any pure oil finish) never really dries and does very little to protect the surface, especially against moisture.  If you want to use a wipe on finish with an oil base then you should use a tung oil/varnish mixture.  This will provide more protection than the Pure Oil but is probably still not as good as the ones mention at the start.

There is an excellent article about this in Wood Magazine's Sept. 2003 issue.  They also have an article about the epoxy finish is the December 2003 issue.

Offline Ladobe

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« Reply #8 on: December 13, 2003, 07:13:59 AM »
Opinions vary.

Tung oil applied as mentioned does penetrate deep into the wood fibers, and does dry, at least in the sense that another correct finish can then be applied over it with no ill effects.   A few coats of 100% pure Caranuba (dries rock hard) seals in the finish and provides excellent protection to your hard won oil finish - and neither colors the wood.   It also waterproofs the wood very well, and can easily be rejuvinated anytime it needs it (minor scratches, abrasions, etc.) by simply cleaning the complete stock of dirt/grime and doing another wax coat or two.   Deep gouges to raw wood get the oil again to penetrate (match) the wood, then wax to seal and build.   Lost wood is lost wood, but at least it doesn't show as much as a patch or filler would.   Dents can be easily raised and sanded, the now bare wood taken through the process again, and you get a near perfect fix that almost never shows when done right.

I'll stick to what has worked well on my custom wood for a very long time and leave those "plastic" finishes to the stocks on the mass produced guns.

IMO-YMMV,

Ladobe
Evolution at work. Over two million years ago the genus Homo had small cranial capacity and thick skin to protect them from their environment. One species has evolved into obese cranial fatheads with thin skin in comparison that whines about anything and everything as their shield against their environment. Meus

Offline killab

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« Reply #9 on: December 15, 2003, 04:11:28 AM »
For a very detailed procedure on finishing a stock you can go to this web address:       http://riflestocks.tripod.com/
It follows the same basis as Ladobe's suggestions.

I used it on a semi-finished stock and it was the first time for me to do anything with wood.

Offline Biathlonman

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« Reply #10 on: December 15, 2003, 05:19:40 AM »
A very unusual method that I picked up from a great stock maker in alaska includes the use of a good slow set epoxy like Industrial formulators G-1.  His testing and experience in wood is incredible, as well as his knowledge of epoxies.

In a nut shell you heat the wood up in the oven to about 110 degrees to open the poors of the wood and then smear the epoxy on very thin, which the wood will soak up.  As long as the wood is soaking up the epoxy you keep adding it and it will take less in as it cools.  You then sand lightly to remove smears and runs being careful not to break through the epoxy.  You then add the desired finish, such as tung oil or Tru-oil simply for looks.  He has done this finish on a whole bunch of stoks and swears it is the best method for durability and water resistance.  From the one stock I did I have to mirror his statements.

Drop me a note if I can be of any help to you!